chancejat

iTrader: (2)

0-62 in 7.4 wtf....slowest 8 ever.....i think the 6 port automatics do it in less then 7.4

NaarLeven

maybe rolling start? 5-60? recorded 5.7 or something for the 135i

350zFan

Similarly the 135i should be capable of sub-5's just like the 335i when launched perfectly.

In anycase, if the two cars banged and made babies, that would be choice. Rx-8 looks and some real ***** to back it up (y).

Startl_Respons

I said it's time for you to quit. You have already lost the debate. It's been quite clear.

First you accuse him of over-simplifying his argument when in fact you knew exactly what he means. Then you hedge and purposefully confuse and obfuscate by alluding to all the myriad factors out there and try to over-complicate things.

And the MX5 can handle better than the RX8, especially when rigidity is spruced up. Come on, you knew that, didn't you?

Startl_Respons

It is clear to me that the German reviewers are purposely biased for the German car. Duh.

I will bet they are referring to the RX8's body roll in quick slalom type maneuvering. Mazda tuned that roll into the RX8 on purpose, since it's more of a GT. This is old news talked about here over 4 years ago. All we have to do is put in stiffer sway bars. Give me a ******* break.

I've driven the 335i before; its suspension is pretty taut. The 135i is probably taut too but lighter than the 335i, although still too heavy. Of course I haven't driven the POS 135i, but there's no way it handles better than the RX8. End of story.

playdoh43

The only thing thats quite clear is that you are awfully ignorant calling the 135 a "POS car" when you admitted that you havn't even driven it. I'm simply pointing out that weight isn't the end of be all of factors that contribute to handling. and as for the MX5 vs RX8 comment, I am speaking of stock vs stock.
fyi your assumptions of what I "knew" are wrong.

JB_Rotary

stock vs stock a POS BMW will be better than the 8. Once you start moding thuogh it all comes down to money and setup

Startl_Respons

How did I know you were going to harp on those exact two factors. Oh right, let me guess (assume) again, you're an undergrad? You are a cliche. Get through school first, ok? Can you do that for us? Earn your wings but in the meantime, could you shut the hell up?

Startl_Respons

Any BMW will handle better than an RX8? Name a single BMW that handles better than the RX8.

By modding, do you mean to include taking about 500 lbs out of the 135i?

I don't buy what that German video says. Even stock for stock, the 135i will reach its limits more easily than the RX8. It's carrying a hell of a lot more weight. Slalom type handling is only one aspect of handling. Stock for stock, the RX8 should have superior overall handling.

playdoh43

are you supposed to be making an argument? or just wasting more space?

climacus

Just pop open the hoods of both cars and compare engine location and placement. Even though BMW engineers are insanely good at squeezing every last bit of mechanical grip out of a setup, the driving feel tend to suffer in their quest to produce the ultimate yuppie machines.

bassy

Weight is a car's worst enemy, just like how it is in a space shuttle. If you can cut down weight, you're golden. That's why NASA engineers spend their time trying to trim every single ounce they can. It costs some $100,000 or $1,000,000 (can't remember which figure) to send every pound into space.

If you think that weight actually helps a car (or a space shuttle for that matter), keep smoking that crack.

playdoh43

while weight is not the end all be all factor that affects handling, less weight is usually always a good thing while more weight is usually a bad thing. dosnt mean a lighter car automatically handles better than a heavier car though. I cant say whether the 135 handles better than the rx8 because ive never driven a 135, but a car being lighter certainly dosnt guarentee it handles better.

Startl_Respons

Let me remind you that you don't even have an RX8.

I was actually going to bring up what climacus brought up but I decided I didn't need to. But now I need to. Look into the engine bay of a 335i or an S2000 or a Miata. Whether it's an inline 4 or 6 that's mounted longitudinally, the engine extends quite a bit forwards. In addition, notice how tall all those engines are inside the engine bay. Then compare that to the renesis, which is mounted lower than any car I've ever seen and farther back.

If you've ever even driven a new Miata, you'd see how high the hoodline is from the driver's seat compared to the hoodline of the RX8. The high hoodline of the Miata really bothers me but I guess it's necessary to accommodate the height of the engine inside the engine bay. Still, the Miata can handle because it's so much lighter than the RX8.

The 135i will share the engine placement issues of those other cars plus it's about 400 lbs heavier than the RX8. It is impossible for the 135i to be a better overall handling car than the RX8.

Startl_Respons

Is it usually or is it always, Mr. undergrad walk through mud semantics homer? Which one is it?




And you've driven an RX8 for more than a test drive? You don't even own one. You are now officially an idiot who has lost a debate on a nonissue. Sounds like a self-important undergrad without a brain? You keep winging your responses just like an undergrad tends to do. You actually think that by reacting to what someone else writes, you will always be able to cover your bases and qualify your earlier mistakes. You are WRONG.

playdoh43

I say its usually because there can be a point when getting too light can effect handling too. are you ok? you sound so bitter people tend to resort to insults and name calling when they loose ground in their arguments.

playdoh43

you know the more frustrated you sound with your personal insults, the more dumb you look? all youre doing is showing that I am right by saying that engine position, height and other factors affect handling too, not just weight thanks for making me right.

playdoh43

btw your reading comprehension skills seems to be lacking, i never once said that the 135 handles better than the rx8, I simply dont know without having driven the 135... why are you so frustrated? how old are you? only little kids resort to name calling.




ohh and whats with the hate on people that goes to college? so on top of insulting me, you sound like you've got something against college students. why so much bitterness?

mysql101

Are you sure you're not confusing weight with down force?

playdoh43

im talking about weight, i think theres a certain point where you can get too light . if you dont have the necessary downforce and traction and balance amongst other things, it can get ugly. again, it shows that a lot of things work together to contribute to handling.

I think even if a car weighs less than a gokart, that dosnt mean it handles well if it dosnt have a low center of gravity, traction, balance amongst many other things that contributes to handling...

so back to my original point, saying car A must handle better than car B because car A is lighter seems short sighted. espeically if you havnt driven both cars

mysql101

I am of the opinion you can never go too light.

Even looking at remote controlled cars, there is NO comparison when you put a nitro powered car up against an electric one when going around corners. Weight is always bad and hurts when you turn.

mysql101

case in point, lightweight motorcycles have serious power. Where they can suffer is around corners because there isn't as much traction on 2 wheels, but it's more a matter of surface area touching the ground than weight.

playdoh43

Even for RC cars, lets say we have a lighter smaller SUV RC car with high center of gravity. It dosnt necessarily handle better than a heavier F1 model RC cart that has great downforce, low center of gravity and better traction. so many factors contribute to handling that being lighter is not the end all be all factor. please understand that Im not downplaying the importance of weight either, ive just been saying that lighter weight dosnt guarantee better handling

playdoh43

exactly, my point is that weight is just 1 of the many factors that contribute to handling. a car that weighs less dosn't mean it handles better, theres too many variables that affect handling beside weight.

mysql101

Actually, if we're using the RC car comparison, it wouldn't matter if you're using the SUV body or race car body, it's just thin lexan. Both chassis will be low to the ground. What will matter is power and weight. And even if the nitro RC has twice the power, the lighter electric RC car can always beat the nitro if the track has a lot of curves.

Here's an example: http://youtube.com/watch?v=YdSRoWVEMEM

Those cars would absolutely crush this one:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Im7uq_P9_Ik

It's not due to power advantage or suspension, or down force, it's because of weight.

You're right that other factors will matter, but weight is the biggest factor that outranks everything else assuming you aren't comparing SUVs to F1 race cars.