rotaryfanatic

From http://www.ft86club.com

Maybe this comes as a disappointment to Subaru AWD fans but Subaru just released its first teaser of its "Boxer Sports Car" (its version of the Toyota FT-86) which confirms that it's going to be a RWD. This is the concept car that's going to be revealed at the Geneval autoshow.




Direct post - http://www.ft86club.com/?p=398

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Toyota is stupid enough to let the FT-86 get the Scion Badge, bunch of ricers.

if im gonna get one I get the subbie version anyday.

MattMPS

WakeUp, Mazda!!!!!!

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Mazda is not strong enough.

First they need to push Sky Activ Engines out ASAP, make some $$$.

Beodude

iTrader: (3)

I'm pretty sure that Toyota is going for a brand name now. Like, it's what old people drive. They don't have anything sporty. Lexus is their luxury / performance, and Scion is more tuner based. So I can see why they would go with the Scion badge.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

fixed.

So yea if I'm gonna get one I will get the subbie version

2tone

iTrader: (3)

yeah, i think scion cheapens it, but it can't fit with what toyota has become (bland).

i don't get why the subie is rwd though...weight reduction?? i mean, awd is there thing...why go away from that randomly??

and what is the deal here anyway...they shared...design thoughts?? what was joint about this? toyota is using subaru's 2.0 engine, right? but subie is going with a 2.4 or 2.6 liter i think i read...so really it's subie's car that they're letting scion "use" as a definite "lesser" vehicle?? i'm so confused.


EDIT: just clicked on that link. subie better go w/ the concept and not the spy shots...that thing is nothing to write home about. and what does this mean exactly?? that it will make “Subaru’s legendary on-road performance even more accessible.” huh? what's "more accessible" about rwd over awd? do they just mean a lower price point??

FazdaRX_8

iTrader: (1)

THe problem is these sports cars are not selling well to the masses....

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Because Toyota owns Subaru(Fuji heavy industry)

Toyota is such a *****, be a man like Nissan just release a supposed to be wonderful car under their name. Toyota is becoming a brand that represents boring cars.

Rxnincj

Looks like a 2 door 2011 STI to me but i know its just a test mule so

Feras

iTrader: (1)

sports cars aren't meant for the masses, do you wanna see the dude next to you on the phone eating a sandwich reading a book on the highway with 300hp and agile handling at his grasp.

FazdaRX_8

iTrader: (1)

Yes I do, cuz in two years I can buy it for half the price, and the companys would make better sports cars not better sedans, if more sports cars sold more r and d money would go into that segment, for dealerships sports cars are a dying breed.....masses are in favor for a 350hp sedan...

RufusVonStorm

lol

NotAPreppie

Last I read, Toyota only owns less than 17% of FHI. That's less than Ford's ownership of Mazda at its peak.

My guess is that Subaru is keeping the RWD platform unchanged to keep down weight and cost.

Feras

iTrader: (1)

That has to be one of the most illogical statements i've ever seen. You want companies to market a sports car that the mainstream doesn't want so that you can buy it used in a few years? What impetus does any car company have to cater to the resellers market, you just sound like a kid who can't afford one and attributes the current cost to a lack of r&d not to the fact that sports cars are expensive to make. And you also make the assumption that profits from one line are the only source of funding for research into that line. If a company sells a million sedans and 10000 sports cars the R&D funding for the sports car doesn't just come from the sale of those cars it comes from total sales. So toyota which is i think the #1 in sales in the world can and has spent a ton of money on R&D, has recently become the first japanese manufacturer to compete in nascar, and is releasing the LF-A super car and the FT-86, two cars that are not gonna sell big numbers. They are making something like 200 total LF-As and the FT-86 is probably not going to be a mainstream seller. So i don't see how toyota is treating the sports car like a dying breed, looks like they are resurging into that market. So don't tell me they aren't spending money on performance vehicle research. The masses never have wanted a sports car, and they never will, but the sports car will continue to exist because the niche we belong to does. The more family cars they sell the more likely we see new sports cars plain and simple.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Sports car was never a big seller.

Im talking about a "Real" sports car, not some Civics wannabe who thinks their Sedan is the most 1337 **** 2f2f td y0

Sports car is like a Company's image. If they can do it good, people will have more "trust" into them, at least their car's "performance."

The only car company that sells Sports cars for a living would be Porsche. Thats probably why it almost went bankrupt and took over by VW.

and most of the time the technology in the sports car will be carried over to their Sedans. so its a win win for auto companies.


but STILL, Scion? No thx. Its the subbie version or the next Rotary Engine (I can't afford 5 cars lol)

dmorales

Well if your talking Toyota's ability to make sports car, they are definitley capable. Not to mention they are behind the whole Lexus brand. Even Toyota themselves have quite the track record...Supra, and MR-2 come to mind.
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COLORADO MEDICAL MARIJUANA DISPENSARY

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Supra and MR-2 are history.

I know they can make sports car, if Hyundai can make one, Im sure Toyota can make one.

but their execution is all wrong.

LF-A sure looks/performance is good, but its really just a rich man's toys. 99% of those people won't even be able to drive faster than 70 mph out of it. not to mention even with its 400K price tag I think Toyota still losing money out of it. consider those cars are not selling like hot cakes (most ppl can't afford 400K hot cake anyway)

Its a good way to polish the brand to make it look even more "luxury", but is it worth it ? we will see.

depends on how FT-86 works out it might be able to help Toyota's brand. cuz seriously for the past 10 or 15 years, their cars are so god damn boring. When I think of Toyota I think of old people or people with families. nothing exciting.

Beodude

iTrader: (3)

Supra and MR2... LoL Last one of those rolled off the lot in the mid 90s. Except the MR2.... The new ones looked boring though.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

yesterday I saw a CR-Z Hybrid, it actually looks pretty cool in person. not a sports car by any means but still not bad to have one. if i don't have a car that is.

dmorales

Well, I was just thinking-they have the capability of making GREAT cars. I don't know how the business end works out for these companies, but I do know that minus the runaway car episodes, Toyota was making a killing off of boring cars.
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TrishaXXX cam

viprez586

iTrader: (5)

Lexus' mission was to release an elite supercar, they don't care who can afford it.
They've also learned from Ferrari's mistakes that they will only be leasing the LFA and offer a buy-out and the end of the lease. IF some rich guy can afford it - great. Most will be sitting inside Lexus dealerships though and gain interest in the F/IS product lineup. Will the LFA be selling like crazy? No - it's all marketing/being elite. (IE: I really like the LFA but I can only afford an IS250/IS350/ISF)
It's been a while since Toyota released an amazing performance car(with the exception of the IS-F) so they wanted to go over the top and establish Lexus as a car company that can engineer a car that can compete with other Supercars, yet still drive to the office Monday morning.

Toyota's current lineup is boring, however they target youth with scion, Toyota for families, and Lexus for older people(and mid-upper class) who want the luxury car - wether is comfortable sedan, sports car, or an SUV. They're no different - Toyota is the parent company. The idea here is to capture the owner from their first car (scion being sporty yet affordable), then to when the owner matures and gets a family - where a minivan, commuter, reliable, yet more practical car applies. Finally ending with Lexus where the consumer is "spoiled" per say.

Latest news with T/S/L is that the Lexus CT200H is targeted towards mid to late 20s. The FT-86 is on the back burner as of what I've heard lately. The CT200H isn't ideally performance oriented - but more so a good little car with the Lexus image, good MPG, and cool unique features (like the instant heat via a heating grid fueled by the hybrid battery).

I like you say how Toyota is executing things wrongly. They know the market isn't huge for a sports car when the entire nation is in debt - people are making more and more cuts everyday. Point being - dumping tons of money into a RWD mid 20-30k sports car isn't practical for the current state of economy. Especially since the government is up T/S/L *** looking for every little tiny mistake.
Every car breaks, every car has defects, it creates jobs, it generates cash flow in the economy. I for one am making my winter worth while because of all the recalls through Lexus.


And no, I don't just get all my facts from the internet. I work for Lexus and talk to Regional reps on a regular basis.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

I see what you mean.

Sports cars are not selling because of the public image/idiots/stereotyping --- for example : most parents won't buy them because they think sports car is "dangerous", but then they turn around and got their son/daughter a "sedan" with 300 hp.

Toyota has crap loads of money sure they can create any car they want, everybody knows that the LF-A is a "show off/I can do it" project more than anything else. but for me is it really worth the price ? I dunno.

if its me I will just focus on more bs feature to try to make Lexus cars even more Luxurious to try to get more customers. Cuz now Mercedes got that highest end image, not Lexus. and I think thats exactly what Lexus needs right now.

a Supercar like LF-A on Lexus brand not going to help them to get Ferrari customer's away. but Lexus dealership looks much "nicer" so releasing LF-A under the Lexus dealer network might be the only choice.

viprez586

iTrader: (5)

No, I didn't say the LFA was intent on stealing Ferrari's customers. They respect the history and success of Ferrari - so they took a few tips from them.

The Ferrari Enzo was a hugely sought after car. So much that people were paying nearly double the MSRP.
Problem is - is that the Enzo had many problems - so much that people lemon-lawed them.
Instead of Ferrari buying the Enzo back for MSRP - they had to pay whatever the customer bought them for - so now Ferrari got doublef**ked with a car that they cannot resell and paid twice as much then what it cost them to build.

The whole reason you can only lease the LFA. Lemon- Law it, okay we'll take the car back, kick you out of the lease, and loose barely any(or at least a **** ton less had they owned a 350-400k car) money.