New Civic Si dyno in at just under 190 fwhp?
02-13-2006, 12:44 AM
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well the k20 in the type S is also tuned more than a civic si because it is the sportier of the two id say a legit SAE corrected run would yield 170whp. whatever it is though, its not 190, if that was the case the si would HAVE to be faster than the rx8 because it has a weight and potentially(assuming it actually does make 190 hp) a hp advantage it would need to be faster. thats 28xx vs 31xx in weight and 190 vs 175 in hp, and that should yield a noticable peformance difference.
also i remember supporting the fact that type S's get 15+whp on intakes and you bashing me on that calling bullshit maybe a year ago for some reason... and now because motor trend said "t3h new si r0xx0rz!!11un0" you suddenly are giving hondas the one up?
also i remember supporting the fact that type S's get 15+whp on intakes and you bashing me on that calling bullshit maybe a year ago for some reason... and now because motor trend said "t3h new si r0xx0rz!!11un0" you suddenly are giving hondas the one up?
02-13-2006, 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Captain Amazing
I agree, there is nothing wrong with the vehicles that Honda makes. Take a look at the S2000 and NSX.
02-13-2006, 12:54 AM
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Originally Posted by cLLcLe
Notice how you only referred back to their RWD cars... haha.
seriously though, you'd be suprised how formidable the 2nd gen crx and the EG hatchback can be stripped swapped built and boosted. sub 2000 pounds plus 350hp to the wheels will put down most "sports cars" to shame
the integra GSR/Type R and RSX type S get honorable mention for good performance platforms too IMO for being FWD.
02-13-2006, 12:58 AM
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Our cars can be stripped, swapped, built and boosted too.
Just need some engine bay fabrications here and there to fit the 13B-REW and boost it and we can do the exact same thing. AND our cars will be RWD.
Haha. But, FWD and RWD are totally different. So I'm comparing two totally different animals. >.<
Just need some engine bay fabrications here and there to fit the 13B-REW and boost it and we can do the exact same thing. AND our cars will be RWD.
Haha. But, FWD and RWD are totally different. So I'm comparing two totally different animals. >.<
02-13-2006, 01:04 AM
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Originally Posted by StealthFox
lol xD
seriously though, you'd be suprised how formidable the 2nd gen crx and the EG hatchback can be stripped swapped built and boosted. sub 2000 pounds plus 350hp to the wheels will put down most "sports cars" to shame
the integra GSR/Type R and RSX type S get honorable mention for good performance platforms too IMO for being FWD.
seriously though, you'd be suprised how formidable the 2nd gen crx and the EG hatchback can be stripped swapped built and boosted. sub 2000 pounds plus 350hp to the wheels will put down most "sports cars" to shame
the integra GSR/Type R and RSX type S get honorable mention for good performance platforms too IMO for being FWD.
You just can't recover a fwd car like rwd or awd. Sure they handle great until you pass the limits and then you're in trouble.
02-13-2006, 01:18 AM
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Originally Posted by cLLcLe
Our cars can be stripped, swapped, built and boosted too.
Just need some engine bay fabrications here and there to fit the 13B-REW and boost it and we can do the exact same thing. AND our cars will be RWD.
Haha. But, FWD and RWD are totally different. So I'm comparing two totally different animals. >.<
Just need some engine bay fabrications here and there to fit the 13B-REW and boost it and we can do the exact same thing. AND our cars will be RWD.
Haha. But, FWD and RWD are totally different. So I'm comparing two totally different animals. >.<
point in case, its not practical you'd be set back 30 grand doing that to an rx8, i can strip, swap build and boost you a eg hatch for 7k.
02-13-2006, 01:19 AM
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Originally Posted by DARKMAZ8
very true.
You just can't recover a fwd car like rwd or awd. Sure they handle great until you pass the limits and then you're in trouble.
You just can't recover a fwd car like rwd or awd. Sure they handle great until you pass the limits and then you're in trouble.
RWD is probably overall the best for handling although AWD is good but in a different way and FWD not being bad if you put work into it and have the right car.
02-13-2006, 02:14 AM
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Originally Posted by StealthFox
well the k20 in the type S is also tuned more than a civic si because it is the sportier of the two id say a legit SAE corrected run would yield 170whp. whatever it is though, its not 190, if that was the case the si would HAVE to be faster than the rx8 because it has a weight and potentially(assuming it actually does make 190 hp) a hp advantage it would need to be faster. thats 28xx vs 31xx in weight and 190 vs 175 in hp, and that should yield a noticable peformance difference.
also i remember supporting the fact that type S's get 15+whp on intakes and you bashing me on that calling bullshit maybe a year ago for some reason... and now because motor trend said "t3h new si r0xx0rz!!11un0" you suddenly are giving hondas the one up?
also i remember supporting the fact that type S's get 15+whp on intakes and you bashing me on that calling bullshit maybe a year ago for some reason... and now because motor trend said "t3h new si r0xx0rz!!11un0" you suddenly are giving hondas the one up?
All reports thus far seem to indicate the Civic SI is putting down a little more power than the Type S. Here's a quote from a thread on vtec.net/RSX Club
"The lowest curve, 197.9 hub hp, was recorded in completely stock trim after a few runs. We think this is more representative of what our car will do. The next run, 204 hub hp, was recorded with a little cool down. Note that the biggest difference occurs from 7500 rpm on up. The final run of 209 hp was recorded with the airbox cover off (note the bottom end losses). While the car gets much noisier and loses the refined growl of the stock intake system, the 5+ hp gain indicates that an intake system will probably be able to pick up some noticeable power (do not drive with the cover off, with the hood closed, you'll kill power by ingesting hot air from the engine bay).
Now take a look at the AF ratios. Note how smooth they are. Also note that they are relatively close to the optimal range of 12.5-13:1. Finally, note that on most runs, with the exception of our stock 204 hp run, that the AFR goes very rich after 7000-7500 rpm.
We think there are a couple factors at play here. First of all, either Honda has underrated the new K20Z3, or we have a ringer. On the same dyno, a stock 05 RSX (rated at 210 hp on the old system) will put down around 185 hub hp. The best one we ever did (another preproduction car) put down 190 hub hp. Given how strict the new ratings systems are, we suspect we have a ringer, but we'll wait to see what other gains we get, and what production cars do. If you live in SoCal, we'll do free dynos for the first 3 production Si's that come in (310-518-4966)."
If I gave you **** about the intake before I don't remember doing so, but I'm old and forgetful. Sorry if I was harsh, I just didn't realize until recently that the newer Hondas got those kind of gains from just an intake. I've never been much of a Honda guy, never will be, but the new SI is a pretty cool little car. I'm sure I'll feel differently when pimple faced kids start pulling up to me in their SI with I/H/E thinking they can smoke me.
02-13-2006, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by StealthFox
you just do that and everyone will make bets on how much money you spend on that project. buildling up a motor that literally NO ONE IN THE WORLD has done yet and boosting a new motor that only a handful of people have done. and somehow developing a standalone engine management system, and the fabrication for the subframe for that piece of **** 13b-rew(who the **** would put that in an rx8 anyway besides that idiot rod millen) motor.
point in case, its not practical you'd be set back 30 grand doing that to an rx8, i can strip, swap build and boost you a eg hatch for 7k.
point in case, its not practical you'd be set back 30 grand doing that to an rx8, i can strip, swap build and boost you a eg hatch for 7k.
And I believe that's what they did for the JIC RX-8.
Don't get so defensive when I'm only trying to build up a discussion here. Haha, you'll get haters.
02-13-2006, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Ike
The '05+ RSX Type S has put down around 180whp plenty of times on various dynos. Also, the engines are prettymuch the same so don't let the manufacturers numbers fool you. Just doing a quick search on Club RSX showed a couple threads where the new SI is getting 190+ on dynapacks (pretty generous dynos).
All reports thus far seem to indicate the Civic SI is putting down a little more power than the Type S. Here's a quote from a thread on vtec.net/RSX Club
"The lowest curve, 197.9 hub hp, was recorded in completely stock trim after a few runs. We think this is more representative of what our car will do. The next run, 204 hub hp, was recorded with a little cool down. Note that the biggest difference occurs from 7500 rpm on up. The final run of 209 hp was recorded with the airbox cover off (note the bottom end losses). While the car gets much noisier and loses the refined growl of the stock intake system, the 5+ hp gain indicates that an intake system will probably be able to pick up some noticeable power (do not drive with the cover off, with the hood closed, you'll kill power by ingesting hot air from the engine bay).
Now take a look at the AF ratios. Note how smooth they are. Also note that they are relatively close to the optimal range of 12.5-13:1. Finally, note that on most runs, with the exception of our stock 204 hp run, that the AFR goes very rich after 7000-7500 rpm.
We think there are a couple factors at play here. First of all, either Honda has underrated the new K20Z3, or we have a ringer. On the same dyno, a stock 05 RSX (rated at 210 hp on the old system) will put down around 185 hub hp. The best one we ever did (another preproduction car) put down 190 hub hp. Given how strict the new ratings systems are, we suspect we have a ringer, but we'll wait to see what other gains we get, and what production cars do. If you live in SoCal, we'll do free dynos for the first 3 production Si's that come in (310-518-4966)."
If I gave you **** about the intake before I don't remember doing so, but I'm old and forgetful. Sorry if I was harsh, I just didn't realize until recently that the newer Hondas got those kind of gains from just an intake. I've never been much of a Honda guy, never will be, but the new SI is a pretty cool little car. I'm sure I'll feel differently when pimple faced kids start pulling up to me in their SI with I/H/E thinking they can smoke me.
All reports thus far seem to indicate the Civic SI is putting down a little more power than the Type S. Here's a quote from a thread on vtec.net/RSX Club
"The lowest curve, 197.9 hub hp, was recorded in completely stock trim after a few runs. We think this is more representative of what our car will do. The next run, 204 hub hp, was recorded with a little cool down. Note that the biggest difference occurs from 7500 rpm on up. The final run of 209 hp was recorded with the airbox cover off (note the bottom end losses). While the car gets much noisier and loses the refined growl of the stock intake system, the 5+ hp gain indicates that an intake system will probably be able to pick up some noticeable power (do not drive with the cover off, with the hood closed, you'll kill power by ingesting hot air from the engine bay).
Now take a look at the AF ratios. Note how smooth they are. Also note that they are relatively close to the optimal range of 12.5-13:1. Finally, note that on most runs, with the exception of our stock 204 hp run, that the AFR goes very rich after 7000-7500 rpm.
We think there are a couple factors at play here. First of all, either Honda has underrated the new K20Z3, or we have a ringer. On the same dyno, a stock 05 RSX (rated at 210 hp on the old system) will put down around 185 hub hp. The best one we ever did (another preproduction car) put down 190 hub hp. Given how strict the new ratings systems are, we suspect we have a ringer, but we'll wait to see what other gains we get, and what production cars do. If you live in SoCal, we'll do free dynos for the first 3 production Si's that come in (310-518-4966)."
If I gave you **** about the intake before I don't remember doing so, but I'm old and forgetful. Sorry if I was harsh, I just didn't realize until recently that the newer Hondas got those kind of gains from just an intake. I've never been much of a Honda guy, never will be, but the new SI is a pretty cool little car. I'm sure I'll feel differently when pimple faced kids start pulling up to me in their SI with I/H/E thinking they can smoke me.
02-14-2006, 01:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Ike
The '05+ RSX Type S has put down around 180whp plenty of times on various dynos. Also, the engines are prettymuch the same so don't let the manufacturers numbers fool you. Just doing a quick search on Club RSX showed a couple threads where the new SI is getting 190+ on dynapacks (pretty generous dynos).
All reports thus far seem to indicate the Civic SI is putting down a little more power than the Type S. Here's a quote from a thread on vtec.net/RSX Club
"The lowest curve, 197.9 hub hp, was recorded in completely stock trim after a few runs. We think this is more representative of what our car will do. The next run, 204 hub hp, was recorded with a little cool down. Note that the biggest difference occurs from 7500 rpm on up. The final run of 209 hp was recorded with the airbox cover off (note the bottom end losses). While the car gets much noisier and loses the refined growl of the stock intake system, the 5+ hp gain indicates that an intake system will probably be able to pick up some noticeable power (do not drive with the cover off, with the hood closed, you'll kill power by ingesting hot air from the engine bay).
Now take a look at the AF ratios. Note how smooth they are. Also note that they are relatively close to the optimal range of 12.5-13:1. Finally, note that on most runs, with the exception of our stock 204 hp run, that the AFR goes very rich after 7000-7500 rpm.
We think there are a couple factors at play here. First of all, either Honda has underrated the new K20Z3, or we have a ringer. On the same dyno, a stock 05 RSX (rated at 210 hp on the old system) will put down around 185 hub hp. The best one we ever did (another preproduction car) put down 190 hub hp. Given how strict the new ratings systems are, we suspect we have a ringer, but we'll wait to see what other gains we get, and what production cars do. If you live in SoCal, we'll do free dynos for the first 3 production Si's that come in (310-518-4966)."
If I gave you **** about the intake before I don't remember doing so, but I'm old and forgetful. Sorry if I was harsh, I just didn't realize until recently that the newer Hondas got those kind of gains from just an intake. I've never been much of a Honda guy, never will be, but the new SI is a pretty cool little car. I'm sure I'll feel differently when pimple faced kids start pulling up to me in their SI with I/H/E thinking they can smoke me.
All reports thus far seem to indicate the Civic SI is putting down a little more power than the Type S. Here's a quote from a thread on vtec.net/RSX Club
"The lowest curve, 197.9 hub hp, was recorded in completely stock trim after a few runs. We think this is more representative of what our car will do. The next run, 204 hub hp, was recorded with a little cool down. Note that the biggest difference occurs from 7500 rpm on up. The final run of 209 hp was recorded with the airbox cover off (note the bottom end losses). While the car gets much noisier and loses the refined growl of the stock intake system, the 5+ hp gain indicates that an intake system will probably be able to pick up some noticeable power (do not drive with the cover off, with the hood closed, you'll kill power by ingesting hot air from the engine bay).
Now take a look at the AF ratios. Note how smooth they are. Also note that they are relatively close to the optimal range of 12.5-13:1. Finally, note that on most runs, with the exception of our stock 204 hp run, that the AFR goes very rich after 7000-7500 rpm.
We think there are a couple factors at play here. First of all, either Honda has underrated the new K20Z3, or we have a ringer. On the same dyno, a stock 05 RSX (rated at 210 hp on the old system) will put down around 185 hub hp. The best one we ever did (another preproduction car) put down 190 hub hp. Given how strict the new ratings systems are, we suspect we have a ringer, but we'll wait to see what other gains we get, and what production cars do. If you live in SoCal, we'll do free dynos for the first 3 production Si's that come in (310-518-4966)."
If I gave you **** about the intake before I don't remember doing so, but I'm old and forgetful. Sorry if I was harsh, I just didn't realize until recently that the newer Hondas got those kind of gains from just an intake. I've never been much of a Honda guy, never will be, but the new SI is a pretty cool little car. I'm sure I'll feel differently when pimple faced kids start pulling up to me in their SI with I/H/E thinking they can smoke me.
kidding aside, i cant believe the Si can lay down more than the Type-S!!! i never would have guessed...im a big type S fan and what letdown that is to hear.
anyways its good to hear you're coming to your senses about this, i assume your car is at least lightly modified and an i/h/e Si would be decimated by even a stock gdb in real life no matter how much whp those big headed honda guys claim to put down on overly generous dynometers. the real test is the only one that matters and thats how your car performs on the track and street, and a civic Si wont be eclipsing the performance of the rwd and awd japanese performance cars even if its putting out 190 horsepower.
02-14-2006, 01:09 AM
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Originally Posted by cLLcLe
Hey I was just saying we could do the same. You never said anything about the price so...
And I believe that's what they did for the JIC RX-8.
Don't get so defensive when I'm only trying to build up a discussion here. Haha, you'll get haters.
And I believe that's what they did for the JIC RX-8.
Don't get so defensive when I'm only trying to build up a discussion here. Haha, you'll get haters.
that will chew you up and spit you out into a bloody pulp of matter
Last edited by StealthFox; 02-14-2006 at 01:15 AM.
02-14-2006, 01:16 AM
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Originally Posted by StealthFox
that will chew you up and spit you out into a bloody pulp of matter
02-14-2006, 01:18 AM
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Originally Posted by StealthFox
who the **** is on your screen name because they're too reasonable to be ike
kidding aside, i cant believe the Si can lay down more than the Type-S!!! i never would have guessed...im a big type S fan and what letdown that is to hear.
anyways its good to hear you're coming to your senses about this, i assume your car is at least lightly modified and an i/h/e Si would be decimated by even a stock gdb in real life no matter how much whp those big headed honda guys claim to put down on overly generous dynometers. the real test is the only one that matters and thats how your car performs on the track and street, and a civic Si wont be eclipsing the performance of the rwd and awd japanese performance cars even if its putting out 190 horsepower.
kidding aside, i cant believe the Si can lay down more than the Type-S!!! i never would have guessed...im a big type S fan and what letdown that is to hear.
anyways its good to hear you're coming to your senses about this, i assume your car is at least lightly modified and an i/h/e Si would be decimated by even a stock gdb in real life no matter how much whp those big headed honda guys claim to put down on overly generous dynometers. the real test is the only one that matters and thats how your car performs on the track and street, and a civic Si wont be eclipsing the performance of the rwd and awd japanese performance cars even if its putting out 190 horsepower.
02-14-2006, 01:35 AM
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lol i was, and about half of rx8club who got annoyed with your posting in those threads, haha but whatever it was mildy refreshing to see some of those threads with ike getting owned out of his ***.
02-14-2006, 01:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Stealthfox
haha but whatever it was mildy refreshing to see some of those threads with ike getting owned out of his ***.
Don't get me started again......I feel the itch coming on.
