Give it time, Marie... once the initial pent-up demand wears off, then there will be a supply of cars, and perhaps even room for price negotiating.

Not to mention the first year guys get to find all the bugs!

 

This car imitates the RX-8 in so many ways. They even imitated the RX-8's taillight condensation issues:

http://www.autoblog.com/2012/06/11/s...manual-recall/

:-)

 

Ja, but the RX 8 never had misfit body panels or road noise or uncomfortable seat, or an ugly looking stereo

 

Well guess who drove one tonight? I did! I did!

It's friggin' loud, lol. That's the main impression I came away with.

I did get pretty comfy with it after a minute or two. The clutch was different, very late "catch," but OK once used to it. Light too, kinda like the 8. The shifter IMHO isn't as nice as the 8, but it is very direct and snicks into gears well. But it just feels more awkward, sorta like reaching up to push a lever into gears, where the 8 is more of wrist-flicking it. Still nice though.

And it really does feel like you're sitting on the floor, looking up and out over the gauges. The fender wells are nice to see out there at the corners, just like with the 8.

But it's loud to my aging ears. It'll make anyone smile in amusement the first few times you step on it. After that... I dunno. I think that silly noise maker tube thing ruins it, gives it a resonating, nasal quality it doesn't need.

It goes OK. Feels a bit torquier than the 8 (what doesn't?). Similar to the 8 though overall.

I couldn't really toss it around too much, but yes it reacts quickly.

But... the interior. The switchgear. The plastic around it. The 8 is in a different class there.

So basically it is what it is: a budget-priced, basic sports car that's meant for amusement. It IS fun to drive around the block, making it growl, tossing it around and making your passenger seasick. And twenty years ago that might have been enough for me. But I dunno, these days I kinda want that AND an upscale interior. If it had the RX-8's interior and was a bit quieter/more refined sounding... it'd be a home run with me.

But as it is, I dunno. It's just ashame that after eight years, I still have to think, "It's nice, if only..." when pondering a new car.

 

Wonder if we can get those low resistance tires for the 8...perhaps we could push the mpg to 24-25 hwy.

 

The commercial is cool. Especially the song.

 

http://frschicago.eventbrite.com/

Chicagoans can drive an FRS later this month.

 

I drove this car, and for me, the two things I really liked were the steering and the driver ergos.

I was considering trading in my 8 and getting one, but then I started thinking...

Slow makes me sad. No backseat for real people makes me sad. Lack of 8 suspension quality makes me sad. Expensive on top of said points.... while I wont say the FRS/BRZ are bad cars, the 8 is simply the better sportscar. Which is the better sporty DD? Well that's another conversation entirely.

 

Oh and for those looking to drive one, here's how I did it:

1. Call your local scion/subaru dealer.

2. Tell them you are thinking about trading in your 8 but want to drive the FRS/BRZ before you make your final decision. Assure them that you will make sure they get the sale if you decide to buy.

3. Take the car out, and see what you think.

4. Tell them its too slow, and you'll check out the STi/TRD version in a few years.

There ya go!

 

Well, not letting someone test drive a pre-ordered car is to be expected.

But if the dealer has a unit that hasn't sold sitting on their lot, and they won't let anyone test drive the car because that magical unicorn customer is going to pop in one day and buy it on the spot might take them a long time, if they are a dealer out in the boonies.

The BRZ/FRS forum has a list of seriously scuzzy dealers, though.
Hopefully the ones you are dealing with aren't part of that group.

I have news on the Abarth we test drove, but I'm not allowed to say any more than this right now.

BC.

 

I'd say that this is the entirety of the conversation

As much as I take the opposite position to people that bash the twins, I will never argue that it's a better sports car than the 8. As a very sporty DD though.... I believe that it does indeed take the top spot if the driving distance is great enough that fuel mileage becomes important. 2/3rds of the fuel bill without losing too much of what makes you love the 8?

That's where it's value is.



(Plus creating a new group of people that find the value in "slow" good handling cars.)

 

The reason I made the distinction, is that I am personally willing to spend a lot more money on my "fun car" than my "practical car". So for the twins to be taking the trophy as the fun "practical car" it simply costs too much.

Maybe in 3 or 4 years when the price/hype comes down?

But really, my hope for these cars is, like many have said before, that Mazda will answer this challenge with a new rotor car xD

 

Two local Subaru dealers and one Scion, and they all treated me great, with no markups on the cars. I don't blame them for minimizing the miles on cars for sale by refusing test drives without a deposit, but at the same time it sure makes it difficult to make an informed decision. I'm very grateful that the one Subaru dealer had a demo car.

LOL, as I'm typing this the first FR-S commercial I've ever seen just played. Reminds me of the old RX-8 commercials, sliding sideways, "fun is back" and all that. Guess they won't be doing any "hugging" commercials though, lol.

It's ashame, I really want to want this car. I want an "upgrade" or evolution option to exist for the RX-8. The philosophy is right, it looks great in person, it's just... I dunno. If my RX-8 blew up tomorrow, it'd be the only choice really for something somewhat similar. But it's frankly a cheaper choice, keeping the fun but losing the refinement and practicality of the 8.

EDIT: this commercial
Reminds me of the good 'ol days:

 

How come we never experience Clunk and Thuds?

BRZ MANUAL TRANSMISSION SOUNDS

You may notice, or customers may question, a "thump" or "thunk" sound intermittently when placing the new six-speed manual transmission into first or reverse while stopped. This is a characteristic of the transmission operation which occurs when any remaining input shaft rotation is brought to a quick stop by gear selection. If enough time is given for the shaft to stop turning on its own, then no thump will occur. No wear or damage is occurring as a result of this action. This sound may be more noticeable as the gear oil warms and gear selection is able to be accomplished with greater speed.

 

Are you serious? My transmission will clunk if I put into first quickly after putting the clutch in, really haven't felt anything putting it into reverse. There are a few threads about this on the forums. Subaru's explanation is pretty much the same conclusion that was said on the threads on Rx-8club.

https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-trouble-shooting-95/subtle-clunk-when-shifing-into-1st-gear-213878/

If just sarcasm that cools but it just doesn't carry well over the internet. Its just that a lot of the members on this forum really thinks that the Rx-8's **** doesn't stink compared to the twins.

 

Sounds like bad quality at Toyota.

I know the head quality man over there and you wouldn't believe the problems they have.

Remember sticking gas pedals?

Ok so official word from the Toyota rep is that the VVTR control valve and Cam valve are bad. Unfortunately for me and the rest of you experiencing this problem the parts won't be available until sometime next month so my car will be sitting at the dealership until then. They also advised me that any of you having this issue should not continue to drive your vehicles until taking them into the dealership.

At least we have an answer, to bad it wasn't a simple one.

 

It's gotta suck to be this guy...

http://autoholics.com/2012/06/17/Fir...&utm_term=img2

 

Haha... apparently he drove a front-wheel drive car before and the concept of oversteer was a bit foreign to him.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8821

 

Well I agree with one of the comments, "This is what happens when the general public is forced to drive anemic, FWD compacts for so long." Sad but true.

 

Anyone else following the developing engine problems over on http://www.ft86club.com/forums?

Fluctuating idle, chirping sounds, crickets, ticking, CELs... and now someone's engine seized.

It's kinda scary, it's not just one person, it's quite a few of them. And it seems a progression, as the symptoms only seem to appear after a few hundred miles then get worse.

Just curious what you tech types think is going on... ?

Kinda puts our car's early years into perspective, as aside from the flooding and desert heat problems, I don't remember any scary engine issues, just annoyances like rattles and condensation in lights, etc.

 

Very interesting... Thanks for the update! Would suck if you go to a dealer with this semi-major unidentifiable problem and they say, yeah our demo car and a couple others are doing the same thing.

 

Very much a guess, but I wonder how much testing they did on the car with 10% ethanol gas.

Also, did you notice that it's dynoing at ~160-165 rwhp? Even a tired 4-port auto RX-8 will do that.

 

It's starting to sound like rotary envy...

• The cars don't seem to like having a camshaft, many are getting CEL's about it
• The engines are starting to make a "chirpy" noise when idling
• Many engines develop erratic idle issues

 

 

it doesn't matter how garbage the handling is (it's not bad, just saying), doesn't matter if the body panels are not flush and it's like 2 inch apart, doesn't matter if the tail lights are actually bowl for gold fish, it doesn't matter if the mpg is **** poor when compare to our 8.

our 8 is still inferior according to haters, cuz we have rotary engine.

I think FT-86 is a nice looking car, I want to try one and if I can afford it, get one, But hey I will never part with my 8.