YaXMaNGTO

Dude. Why you keep baggin' on my ride?!?!

Hater.

Steiner

I strongly disagree with this line of thinking. Not to say that a powerful and tossable RWD coupe isn't a blast to drive, but "ultimate driving pleasure" is a lot of things to a lot of different people. For me it's about feedback and less about drivetrain. Ideally I'd like a rear-biased AWD setup (like the ATESSA drivetrain in my Infiniti FX) in a 3000lb compact platform, but it's more about overall ride than the number of axles that move it.

BTW...Saturn I own an '05 Evo VIII

saturn

Thanks for the article. One bit that has me worried is the following comment:

Similarly, even in S-Sport, the most aggressive of TC-SST’s three modes, it refuses to pull as screaming a downshift as you would and won’t hold a gear when you back off to let someone pass.

Seems as though even in S-Sport you don't have full control of the shifts. This is perplexing as most, if not all, tiptronic-style shifters allow you to select a gear and run it all the way up to redline and hold it there, bouncing off the rev-limiter, until something blows up. Maybe since the shifts are so fast it won't matter all that much, but that's still quite a disappointment.

saturn

If it makes you feel any better your car would beat my car in everything including a pumpkin carving content. The GTO is a great car if you want a quasi-luxurious sedan that goes very fast in a straight line. Just not for me.

stickmantijuana

i found evo just too easy to drive. with evo, driver just becomes an on/off switch with steering wheel, gas pedal, and brakes. you'll be one fast driver, but unless i'm paying my bills based on my lap times, i think driving an evo can become quite an empty experience.

YaXMaNGTO

Why I think that's nicest thing I've ever heard about a GTO on this forum (ok, by a non-Rx8-to-GTO-convert). Might go into my sig.

Ike

What they described the SST as doing is more the norm than the exception. Besides the DSG just about every other semi-auto is obtrusive in some way.

dillsrotary

i wonder what fully controls the tc-sst and if a pcm aftermarket flash (if it controls it) would solve the downshift problem, or even program a better launch control feature.

Ike

Since the SST has been delayed I would imagine it's because Mitsubishi is still sorting out bugs. I will never buy an SST Evo, but I imagine the production models will be better than the pre-production cars that have had some issues. Also, I'm sure the ECU controls it and tuners will be tinkering with shift points and controls of the tranny in no time.

saturn

That may be true for the new style semi-manuals (DSG, SMG, and SST), but it's definitely not true for the older style tiptronics (torque converter style w/ paddles). I've driven quite a few cars like this, including the AT RX-8 as well as the one I currently own, and they all will let you stay in a gear forever unless you are going too slow that you'll lug the engine (at that point it will downshift). They will never upshift for you and let you bounce off the rev limiter all you want. The only other "obtrusive" thing they do is not allow you to downshift into a gear that will put you well over redline.

It makes no sense to me at all that they would have three separate modes for the SST and yet one of them isn't "let me do all the work". I don't mind if it keeps me from downshifting well past redline or if it downshifts when I come to a stop or something, but everything else I want to control. From my experience that's how they work currently and it would be disappointing to see that the fancy new DSG/SMG/SST style worked differently.

dozer

iTrader: (3)

more parts more problems....no pistons no valves no problems....

Ike

Yeah... Would you like to buy some land in Florida?

delhi

hahaha.... you of all people should know the amount of alphabet soup of sensors in that Lancer to compensate for a compromised sedan design.

why mimic RWD with various kuldgy drivetrain? If you want a great driving experience get a proper front-engine RWD sports car. If you want a safe car get an AWD that can go on all terrain. Keep it simple.
However I agree that "ultimate driving pleasure" is different amongst people. Hence we have folks who loves nothing but the neck snapping acceleration straightline experience, while some prefers rounding VIR V-Max and yet some prefers how a well balanced car communicates with the driver and then there are the point-n-squirters.

Exactly. Empty experience. These cars are damn efficient in dispatching all manners of road that it exhibits some sort of Playstation experience. In the end, to me driving pleasure has to be a connection with a finely balanced sports car with as little as possible electronic doo-hickey.

Ike

All the electronics in the world won't help a "compromised" design handle well. The Evo handles well because of a great suspension, chassis, and years of improving on an existing design. I defy you to find one credible source that doesn't gush about how well connected the Evo is to the driver or mentions that you can feel any interference from the electronics on the car.

Steiner

It's definitely an interesting debate but would be better discussed in another thread...

https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...hlight=AWD+RWD

delhi

Yes the EVO was built on a fantastic platform.




mmmkay... try again. U're too easy.

MP3Guy

p*wned, but good!! ROFL!

dillsrotary

^ evo actually is a different chassis and floorplan, it just has to be based on a company road carto compete in wrc

delhi

^^ "The Evolution VII was based on the larger Lancer Cedia platform and as a result gained more weight over the Evolution VI, but Mitsubishi made up for this with multiple important chassis tweaks." -- Wikipedia

I am sure with enough tweaks a homely Ford Focus can be used to bitch slap lots of sports cars too. Oh wait! Ford did convert the Focus to be a Rally Car. Hmm.... But this is getting OT. STi vs EVO X.

saturn

This whole argument is utterly useless. People go around exclaiming from the rooftops about how "pure" one car is and how "compromised" another one is to make it seem like they're one of the elect few who truly understands what driving is all about. Driving is what you make of it and everyone is out for something different. Many would look at your RX-8 and say that it has a soft suspension with an LSD that ruins the true experience. It's all relative and going around offering unsolicited criticism of a car only serves to highlight that you're an insecure person.

Go away or stop being useless.

Ike

The similarities between a Lancer and a Lancer Evo are few and far between. However, it's pretty remarkable that Mitsubishi was able to build a car that is widely regarded as one of the best handling and best drivers cars in the world from such humble beginnings isn't it? Too bad your "pure sportscar" doesn't have a chance in hell to keep up with one... But congrats on your pretty interior with all those cool rotary accents and the pureness of your proper front engine RWD car.

dillsrotary

I still don't think you understand, the chassis is different, in addition to the suspension geometry and platform lay out. The major tweaks that mitsu made is extra spot welds to connect the body to the chassis and increase its rigity.

You stated that its the same chassis when it isn't, then quoted wiki incorrectly to defend your original statement.

Ike

Perrin has their new STI and has dynoed it already.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1405260

Looks like the tune may be a big rough and similar to the '07, but for a 5th gear pull on their dyno that's pretty good overall. No where near what an Evo IX makes HP wise, but that is to be expected.

Steiner

Think this compromised sedan design has enough ultimate driving pleasure for ya?

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=x3E3TmJd28c

delhi

Re-read Ford Focus analogy. Given enough money I'm sure Chevy can turn a Cobalt into a super car slayer too.
Oooh... reverting back to default "My car is better than yours" mode. I was just wondering how many posts before this comes out. So that means I spend more time driving around mountain roads instead of filming for youtube at every traffic light.
I left paper racing back in kindergarten.
Get the STi. At least you can still claim that the car's competing effectively in the WRC.