ohlins

the authorities just couldnt care less.....it's a private transaction between 2 parties (PI/AD and customer) .....

with all these bad practices going on....sooner or later, i think must bring a lawyer with you when you book a car.....haha.....

nex100

lol ... good business for lawyers ... they shld advertise for that too

Svper

Hehe... I dun really care... I got Sms proof saved in my handphone and legal documents of sales invoices not recording my cheques. Documents recording who cashed out my cheques when and where. Even got witness to the conversation by the Boss, manager and the salesman. Where i was "forced" to sign the papers. I was left with 2 choices:

1. Pursue the matter, lodge a police report against the salesman for the 8k, company denies anything to do with the salesman claiming that my transaction with the salesman was purely between me and him. (In other words they didnt want to have anything to do with this ****) and company will not give me my car unless i have paid back the 8k which the salesman have taken. If i do not i lose my deposit because i have not collected the car.

2. Sign the damn papers. stand to lose 2.8k and get my car.

So if you were the customer at that point of time. what would you choose? I did ask the boss of the PI. "Now your salesman have cheated me of the money, isnt there any legal actions that you are going to do? compensation?" Boss's reply was simply "you can make a police report all you want. but its between you and him" obviously he was trying to push away the responsibility.

And i have people who know of this matter in and out of the car industry. People whom accompanied me to PI's showroom. But many times we were either told "there is nothing we can do" by the manager or "The salesman is not here, we cant do anything also".

What kind of bullshit is that...

SushiFan

well BS is BS? If not its not called BS. Why dont you take your case to CASE (sorry for the pun) for their recommendation and cc to newpaper or TODAY? no doubt they have no teeth but often than not it is the publicity that CASE generates that normally hurts. Company would have no choice but come out in the open to explain their work practices else silence means guilt. Makimaki has a good point in terms of legal interpretation, the salesman because at that time is under employment of the company represents the company.

morganoh

If this matter has never happen before I do not think that Svper will start this thread.

The only reason that I can think of when u sue some one is that u do not want the Person to continue to said some thing bad about your company and I support u in suing the guy and demand for an apology on to be posted on the papers.

If its really true, u should try your best to settle it privately , u will not be very smart if u sue Svper, cos the Straits Times will be very interested in your story. and the whole Singapore will start to know about it and u will start to lose your business.

So will u do it???

Go for it MAN! sue the person. I support u.... !
Spent $10-20K and demand for a piece of 5 cents paper written apology!
Or if u your lawyer is good enough make him pay for your lawyer and court fee!

morganoh

Svper,

Its useless telling the whole world your story with out any actions.

We can only said that we are sorry that it happen to u but its u that can make things happen. and only your actions will be able to make a difference .

Please go to Case and submit a complain
Call the Straits Time to tell them your storys.

The rest of the future car buyers will thank u, even if they do not know who u are.

Svper

Ok... Understood... Thanks for the advice...

Swerve76

All I can say is BRING IT ON.

I was present at most of the negotiations and will willingly testify if it came down to that.

Ben - Morgan is right dude. Lodge a complaint with CASE and make this official. Call the New Paper, the Straits Times and the goddang Shinmin News as well.

Let me state now that this isnt personal - but I'd hate for them to get away with what they put you through. Between the empty promises and the outright lies, this has gone far enough.

Just as the government has decided to clamp down on drink driving? Lets give them a reason to clamp down on such irresponsible practices as well.

WorldofWheels

Soon after i made my downpayments and cash for accessories like any ordinary person would. I realised that i was actually issuing cheques to the saleman under his name. First initial "Booking Fee" was placed under company.

Don’t mean to be offensive, but how is it possible that you “actually” “realized” you issued cheques to the salesman’s name as an after fact? The difference in a “Personal” name and a “Company” name is pretty clear, as stated by your statement and I quote “First initial "Booking Fee" was placed under company”.

after which was additional payment for the full downpayment sum and money for my body kit which i asked the salesman to order for me……………

Upon your purchase of the said vehicle from us on the 06th Jan 2007, we requested a booking fee of $10,000 which was split into 2 payments. A “First initial Booking Fee” of $5000 that you made by Mastercard on that day(6th Jan 2007), and the balance $5000 payable by cheque which was collected on the 08th Jan 2007, and you apparently knows the difference in “Personal” name & “Company’s” name because cheque was issued in the company’s name. As for the Bodykit, there was no mention of it in the contract, therefore, I would assume that you “asked the salesman to order for me” would be from his own private source that you both have come to an agreement on your own.

The Sales Agreement/Contract is there for a reason, that is to state to all parties who signed it, what is and will be expected of each other. And in the contract, there is no mention of any purchase of Bodykit, therefore, the company after receiving the stated deposit of $10,000 that was paid separately on 2 occasions as stated above, does not expect any other payment till the actual vehicle is in Singapore and is being readied for registration.

I was requested to put the cheque under his name. Yes, i know it was stupid to do so but i was trusting and i did it anyway. Reasons being that his boss required to cash in the cheque immediate and does not want to wait. Amount totalled up to $8000 SGD.

When you claimed that you issued a cheque of $5000 on the 10th Jan 2007 as additional downpayment for your car in the salesman’s name, the question that comes to mind was why would you issued it to the salesman’s name when 2 day before on 8th Jan 2007 you issued your balance deposit that’s stated in the contract in our company’s name? And according to you, this cheque was initially issued in our company’s name, therefore why change the payee’s name after that without confirmation? How do you expect the company to know of any payment when it’s not directed to the company? It is not our practice to collect any additional payments when the said vehicle is not ready for registration and moreover the actual vehicle has not even reached our showroom. All these exceptions are only done when it’s stated in the contract and agreed upon during the signing of the contract. You could and should have called up our company for clarification when you have doubts about anything that you come across. With exception to the Chinese New Year Public Holidays, we are open everyday, 7 days a week from 10am to 7pm.

Only when the salesman took a long break did the thought came to me that what happens if he just suddenly vanishes. Also coincidentally, another sales representative called up to follow up. When i asked the sales rep about my down payment, they could only find half of the amount that i paid in total in their records. Immediately i demanded for their boss and went down to find out what is happening. The salesman who took my down payments was in China and wont be coming back till the middle of the 3rd month.

It’s the combination of your sudden thought (he vanishes), the follow up of the other salesman and the check on your payment details that brought this incident to our notice.

Which is why i requested that the boss of the PI call his staff and find out what is happening and why isnt my other payments recorded down on the sales agreement. Boss plainly said "He is on leave so lets not alarm him as we do not know what is happening now, why not wait for him to get back than we will arrange another meeting and get down to the bottom of things."

The Person-in-charge said that with considerations in mind. One, if we call him (the salesman) and what you (the customer) said is true, he will ready himself for defense as what he did was without the company’s knowledge. Two, if we were to alarm the salesman while he’s in China, he might just decide not to come back and simply as you so appropriately said “suddenly vanishes”? With no actual facts of what was happening and also not wanting to alert the salesman about this discovery, we suggested to wait for his return in order to confront him with you around so that he would not be able to give his side of the “story” without your knowledge or vise versa. Unfortunately, your call to him alerted him to the situation.

Page 1/3

WorldofWheels

Which totally made my trip down useless, and did not give me any assurance that the company is willing to help out or not. Unsatisfied they just said "There is nothing we can do now also."

Please think back to the meeting at that time, didn’t the Person-in-charge assures you that if the salesman acknowledge and admits that he did collect the balance payment of $5000 as indicated in the contract, the company will acknowledge that as a payment on hold until further notice? Help and alternative was given but not looked upon as it is.

So for 3 weeks i had sleepless nights. When i tot it would end when the salesman came back and explain everything and all would go according to plan. But no... sadly salesman came back and told the company that he took the money as a personal loan from me.
Which is crazy, i hardly know that guy. Why would i even lend him $8k. ……………………

When it was nearing my collection date………… Boss of the PI told me straight forward. It was me who was too trusting to issue a cheque to the salesman under his name in the first place, and did not recognise the $8k liable under his company.

The company recognizes what is written on the contract and stand by it. Therefore, when you claim you issued a cheque of $5000 on the 10th Jan 2007, which we didn’t receive because you issued it to the salesman’s name, therefore as a gesture of good faith, we acknowledge that as part of the downpayment for your car. But with regards to the extra sum of $3000 you said “ … money for my body kit which i asked the salesman to order for me”, it can’t be held liable by my company. All our orders for parts or accessories are to be written in the contract so as to minimize any dispute or errors that might appear with wrong product code or colors owner desires. With no records or indication of any Bodykit purchase request, the cheque payment that you made to his name for it would never be known to us if you didn’t mention it. And to further clarify this, the purchase of Bodykit is an agreement between the both of you where the company has no knowledge of and so the liability does not falls on the company.

And also the salesman have claimed that it was a personal loan from me to him.

We don’t just take his word for it, we were give a copy of an IOU letter which according to salesman is what you requested from him. As you were oversea on that weekend, you appointed your friends to pick up the letter from the office.

Furious i told the boss to return me remaining cash back and i will make a police report and i am no longer interested in getting the car.

All this while, the company has never stopped you from making a police report.

The boss showed signs of agitation and decided to come to a agreement. First of all, the $5k for downpayment will be paid for by the company and the salesman have to find someone to guaranty this $5k.

Doesn’t this shows that we do compromise and try to help or take responsibility where it is due?

It was better that i stand to lose $3k rather than the whole $8k

Has anyone given thought that the company is a victim too? What we stand to loose here is not only material, we stand to loose the reputation that we have built over the years, the relationship we develop with the customers, the trust of the public. Risks that my company do not take but is suffering from with this incident.

As for the $3k the company will pay too, but i have to guaranty this amount. Which is ridiculous but i agreed…………… I didnt want to go through the wait at the same time stand to lose 8k.

So i took the car and signed the IOU that the company wrote……………… Lastly, the salesman who cheated me of the money, currently has disconnected his previous handphone, and failed to pay the monthly installment he agreed with the company on the $8k. I was than called up to ask to pay the balance share of $2800 which was agreed on my part.

Let’s clarify this matter of the extra $3000 that you were asked to guarantee and why the amount you were asked to pay has reduced to $2800. In the presence of the friend you bring along on the day this compromise was agreed upon, the company explains that the $3000 will be used as the consideration of premium charged for purchase of the vehicle’s Insurance which is required by law. Therefore this $2800 is the premium payable for Insurance Coverage, unfortunately you informed us about the shortage of funds and we came an agreement of the installment plan. Therefore, I would like to highlight to you and all interested parties that this amounts($2800) that you are a guarantor for, is for the Insurance of your vehicle.

Page 2/3

WorldofWheels

Only later did i made it clear that i was seriously upset with the service, did the sales manager decided to throw it in, but was asked to wait for 2 months as they were going to indent it from japan.

All kinds of efforts were put in to minimize the unpleasant experience you are experiencing and yet, we are now being cast into the role of the villain.

the salesman who cheated me of the money, currently has disconnected his previous handphone, and failed to pay the monthly installment he agreed with the company on the $8k.

The said saleman was no longer in the company even before you collect your car, and as you have so clearly stated, I quote “the salesman who cheated me of the money…” & “i still have prove that the salesman took my cheques wrote it on the sales agreement, but have not updated on the company's copy. And both cheques were cleared by him.” It was he (the salesman) who you issued the cheques to and it was he (the salesman) who cleared the cheques. There is no way for the company to know of these payments without you or him informing us of it.

I am seriously taking up legal actions as i still have prove

Please acknowledge that we did take responsibility of the misrepresenting of the company by this salesman and did our best within our means to search for alternative ways to resolve this unfortunate event. We stand by what we promise as stated in the contract and deliver them. You have every right to pursue with what you deem as appropriate and what you feel is your justified actions but please do not imply or suggest that we are in cahoots with him. We, too holds in good faith that you will honor your words of guarantee with the payment of $2800 for the Insurance Premium when you signed the letter and we delivers the car. What should our view be in this then?


================================================== =================================================



All this while, the management of World of Wheels has always deemed it a complicated way to try explaining issues in forum posting. Everyone is entitled to their own viewpoints and opinions on how they view a situation or an issue when it gets posted as a topic and so, a running thread on the topic is formed. Slowly, along the line, some false implication and “experiences” comes in and views started to get twisted with more post, in the end the whole thing might get even more complicated. So, in short, the more you try to explain, the messier and more complicated it gets trying to resolve an issue.

I am being given the green light to post here by the management in view of the concerns and urging of our customers and friends. They suggested that we clarify the stand of the company’s position in this matter and let the public knows the circumstances involved so as to better judge the outcome of the happenings for themselves. We do not cheat customers, we value the relationships that are built through these sales. Therefore, let me repeat it again, we stand by what is being agreed upon and indicated in the contract of sales and delivers it. It’s public knowledge that some companies don’t.
Before ending this, we would like to give thanks to the “moderator” for putting up this thread in order for us to do the clarification and to all friends and customers who were so concern about the spreading of this incident all over the places, and those who after viewing this would knows that our keeping silence is not to be deemed as being the guilty one as someone has implied.

Once again, thanks to everyone and I hope this will help in clearing up the situation discussed. At the same time, we also wish to highlight that we would not be replying to anymore discussion with regard to this matter.

Page 3/3

Svper

I did remember asking "now that your salesman cheated me of the money, are there any actions taken against him?" answer was no... and when transactions like this happen are there no guidelines that a company have to make sure things like this doesnt happen? I was appoarched by your salesman online through the forum. All i have been speaking to is the salesman. Never to anyone else in the company. And it was my first time buying a car. Was i suppose to know from A to Z how the paper work and transactions should work? Now you come up with a reply it just simply implies a "word against word" suituation. It doesnt clear up anything nor solve anything. It just simply implies: "As i said again you screwed yourself up, we tried to help, so pay up". Thanks for your reply but still if you wish me to make payment. I will. Till the media, till CASE and the general public knows of this. Than i will pay. Like you said everyone is entitled to their own viewpoints. I would really want to know what others think of this matter.

gfoo

kudos to WoW in this post, this is definitely the right step in better transparency and a good show of faith.

winn

Wow,

At least you stood up and let us know the other side of the story.

zoom44

Thank You WOW for coming on and giving your side of the story

DrewMan

have you thought about taking him to court? I dont think that the world of wheels people are 100% responsible for cleaning up the salesmans mess.

I say go for the salesman and ruin him instead of taking down the company as well. Its just that the salesman used the company as a disguise for his actions

mandotcom

svper,

Go Make Police Report.

Bring all The Documents with You To The Police Station.

Mdc

Silver_Z

Svper, clear the 2.8k with them. Since they dun mind hanging out their dirty laundry, so be it. You only have 2.8k to lose, they have more to lose such as reputation and credibility. After such an incident being splashed onto the media, they will probably lose 10 potential customer per mth, which would amount to 30 times of what you lose. I mean... no consumer in the right mind will choose a company that employs crooks. (no defamation here, the employee Jimmy was a crook, the company did hirer him. These are facts)

If I was WoW I will forget that 2.8k and sweep this issue under the carpet, instead of blowing it out of proportion and bring "self-inflicted shame" on my own company. Hahahahaa.... Penny wise, pound foolish!

CoupeM

I totally agree...aniwae the cost of a lawsuit might be more then 2.8k and there is no tellin who will win...do do doo do doo.

But to save everyone from this long drag out battle, just pay them la...and post ur story to stomp, strait times, the media etc. And rem...make a police report...veri impt. we should not condone the behaviour of crooks.

If and only if (I say it without prejudice), WOW close down because of lost of biz due to this 2.8k...very very foolish.

mandotcom

This a very classic case of a car dealing...

Buy a car from a PI and u need to signed a guarantee of $.$K for the crooks, wait.... who is the crooks? No name mention here hor....

Aiya... just make POLICE report.



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nex100

just report to police, if company disclaim responsibility, you can prosecute the salesman anyway. I'm sure he has some sort of way to pay you back because he will not declare bankrupt because of 2.8k. He will have a way to pay you back under the pressure from the law.

Either way you get ur money back. I do not understand what you are waiting for. Your indecisiveness will make the salesman/company think that you are a sucker waiting to be chopped.

ohlins

wont close down.......cos change name and start all over again...........

Silver_Z

Definitely the case, if it comes to that point. There are worst PIs out there. And the number of time they change their name, is as fast as we change our engine oil. hahahahaa...... But they forgot that there are always ppl out there digging information and sharing with the world.

pyro

Change name...maybe MoM?........

mandotcom

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