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Old 01-08-2008, 08:59 PM
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i agree with coupe07. as long as you are on the right most lane and there is someone faster than you coming up from the rear and there is no traffic in front of you, you give way, regardless. its not your duty to police the speed limits.
Old 01-08-2008, 09:00 PM
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Talking Speedlimitology Final Yr Thesis Vol. 1

Speed limits are arbitrary to a certain extent, since no specific research can been done to determine the safest speed along any particular stretch of road. When the authorities have determined the official figure, we are beholden to observe it by law. However, consider that our authorities always build in a safety buffer to that figure, and have already (once) raised that limit in the past for expressways. Why have they done so? Because while there is a relationship between speed and demonstrable safety, driving culture also plays a pivotal role.

High speed in itself reduces the reaction time of the driver, controllability of a car vis sudden lane changes, stopping distance, etc. Now, this is important only in situations which are more specific than you might realise, an example of which could be a tree (or motorcyclist >.<) falling into your path. However, in usual road conditions, the main danger lies in large differences in relative speed between road users, and it is this philosophy that gives rise to road hogging laws and autobahn minimum speed limits. In itself, driving 10kmh faster or slower than a given speed doesn't do much to affect demonstrable safety.

What the authorities try to do is gauge driving culture, and legislate to find a happy medium between drivers who lie near both ends of the velocity-affinity scale (while excluding the extremes from consideration, except when writing traffic summons). What they cannot do is accomodate the majority of sane road-users with a single figure like "90kmh", which is also why they usually do not even bother to send you a letter if you're less than 10kmh over the limit.

Where this leaves us is needing to have the responsibility to use good sense and road courtesy in this grey zone we live (drive) in. Sophistication is as much in filtering off lane 1, if we are able to, in the face of someone behind us wanting to go faster, as it is in acknowledging that clinging to the speed limit in the right lane to a tolerance of 1kmh is being unreasonably pedantic. By the same token, if the car ahead of you in lane 1 is travelling on the limit and you want to go faster, you need to let him know, but don't horn, tailgate and flash him all at the same time. That communicates aggression. If he still doesn't give way, do the drill (mirror, indicate, check blindspot, mirror, filter left and pass him at your chosen zoomage/speedocity/acceleratedness). If unable due to blockage in the immediate left lane, then wait patiently for the opportunity to do said drill.

In the situation that wildchilde found himself in, it appears that he couldn't filter off, or that it didn't make sense to do so. In that situation, I would recommend just ignoring the guy, rather than jamming brake to avoid a vehicle two lengths ahead at the risk of banging poor Ah Seng riding his vespa haplessly in lane 2. As they say in Pamplona, "horn den horn lorr!"

But most importantly, if the guy behind is an rx8 bro, let him pass! Even if it means taking out Ah Seng and his vespa.

Last edited by Rumboo; 01-08-2008 at 09:02 PM. Reason: grammatical and spelling errors. -5 marks.
Old 01-08-2008, 09:01 PM
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Wildchilde: Chill!
Old 01-08-2008, 10:57 PM
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my gosh.. lim beh all along thought the standard of england in this forum is sibei high liao.. then i saw this post...

bro! your england more powerderful then the queen sia! you type out one or you cut and paste from somewhere???


Originally Posted by Rumboo
Speed limits are arbitrary to a certain extent, since no specific research can been done to determine the safest speed along any particular stretch of road. When the authorities have determined the official figure, we are beholden to observe it by law. However, consider that our authorities always build in a safety buffer to that figure, and have already (once) raised that limit in the past for expressways. Why have they done so? Because while there is a relationship between speed and demonstrable safety, driving culture also plays a pivotal role.

High speed in itself reduces the reaction time of the driver, controllability of a car vis sudden lane changes, stopping distance, etc. Now, this is important only in situations which are more specific than you might realise, an example of which could be a tree (or motorcyclist >.<) falling into your path. However, in usual road conditions, the main danger lies in large differences in relative speed between road users, and it is this philosophy that gives rise to road hogging laws and autobahn minimum speed limits. In itself, driving 10kmh faster or slower than a given speed doesn't do much to affect demonstrable safety.

What the authorities try to do is gauge driving culture, and legislate to find a happy medium between drivers who lie near both ends of the velocity-affinity scale (while excluding the extremes from consideration, except when writing traffic summons). What they cannot do is accomodate the majority of sane road-users with a single figure like "90kmh", which is also why they usually do not even bother to send you a letter if you're less than 10kmh over the limit.

Where this leaves us is needing to have the responsibility to use good sense and road courtesy in this grey zone we live (drive) in. Sophistication is as much in filtering off lane 1, if we are able to, in the face of someone behind us wanting to go faster, as it is in acknowledging that clinging to the speed limit in the right lane to a tolerance of 1kmh is being unreasonably pedantic. By the same token, if the car ahead of you in lane 1 is travelling on the limit and you want to go faster, you need to let him know, but don't horn, tailgate and flash him all at the same time. That communicates aggression. If he still doesn't give way, do the drill (mirror, indicate, check blindspot, mirror, filter left and pass him at your chosen zoomage/speedocity/acceleratedness). If unable due to blockage in the immediate left lane, then wait patiently for the opportunity to do said drill.

In the situation that wildchilde found himself in, it appears that he couldn't filter off, or that it didn't make sense to do so. In that situation, I would recommend just ignoring the guy, rather than jamming brake to avoid a vehicle two lengths ahead at the risk of banging poor Ah Seng riding his vespa haplessly in lane 2. As they say in Pamplona, "horn den horn lorr!"

But most importantly, if the guy behind is an rx8 bro, let him pass! Even if it means taking out Ah Seng and his vespa.
Old 01-08-2008, 11:00 PM
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Originally Posted by 8-in-'08
my gosh.. lim beh all along thought the standard of england in this forum is sibei high liao.. then i saw this post...

bro! your england more powerderful then the queen sia! you type out one or you cut and paste from somewhere???
i use dictionary.com just to read it.....chim!
Old 01-08-2008, 11:13 PM
  #31  
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I thought ur keyboard spoil liao..? Bluff me uh..
Old 01-08-2008, 11:37 PM
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wildchilde chill, you always seem worked out whenever you're in the forum, you ask a question, ppl ans you back. dun need to come here and scold ppl. some ppl talk c@#k so wat, if you can't even keep ur cool here, then on the rd its no difference.

anyway jus relax lah, and so wat if the merc tailgate you, IF YOU GOT THE ***** JIO HIM ON!!! WIN OR LOSE DOESN'T MAKE A DIFF, IT'S NOT LIKE YOU'RE GETTING A PRICE AT THE END

If you dun have the guts to take him on, then VERY SIMPLE, GIVE WAY TO THAT MERC.
Old 01-08-2008, 11:45 PM
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actually dudes, wildchilde IS a pretty chill dude. i've exchanged a few 'tok kok' PMs with him and find him far from being the chip-on-the-shoulder sort.

i'm not jumping to his defense as i've never even met this guy before, but the bottom line is, he started this thread to warn our community about a possible menace we may encounter on the roads and maybe also share his frustration.

this just happens to be one of those heavily-opinionated threads that sprout up in forums ever so often. its always interesting to read the responses, especially the smart ones. rumboo's educated post does answer general highway ethics. then some sarcastic or accusatory remark comes along that turn things ugly and heated exchanges occur.

wildchilde, let it pass man... and thanks for the heads-up on mercmoron. sorry to hijack your thread but since we are on the topic, i have a question based on personal experience myself -

i'm on the overtaking lane on SLE doing 70+/80 keeping 2 cars length from the front car, ahead of which i can see an endless no. of cars. then suddenly a heavily stickered lancer starts tailgating me and flashes headlights. there is room for me to switch to left lane. question is, should i?

do note that i'm a new driver, with less than a year's experience and if you have a very 'duh' answer to the above question, you can keep it, thank you.
Old 01-08-2008, 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted by 8-in-'08
bro! your england more powerderful then the queen sia! you type out one or you cut and paste from somewhere???
Haha, no lah, still got mistakes... sorry i give ppl headache to read, but 'philosophy' si ani zuay smoke one wat!

Kaine:
Interesting scenario.. personally, if the left lane is clearer than the overtaking lane (lane1) which I'm on, I would just stick to my lane simply becos it is easier for the lancer to pass on the left.
Old 01-09-2008, 12:00 AM
  #35  
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no lah wildchilde is ok, jus gets worked up at times, anyway we're all still 8 bros, and most of us have encountered wat wildchilde has encountered, no probs bro. just chill lah, let ur anger loose onto that merc..hahaha
Old 01-09-2008, 12:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Kaine
i'm on the overtaking lane on SLE doing 70+/80 keeping 2 cars length from the front car, ahead of which i can see an endless no. of cars. then suddenly a heavily stickered lancer starts tailgating me and flashes headlights. there is room for me to switch to left lane. question is, should i?

do note that i'm a new driver, with less than a year's experience and if you have a very 'duh' answer to the above question, you can keep it, thank you.
if got room to filter left then depends on mood.

- BAD mood, tap brake and slow down (the closer u get, the slower i drive)

- GOOD mood, let him pass

- "Kuai Lan" mood, let him pass then tailgate him back and flash the hell out on him back.

Old 01-09-2008, 07:28 AM
  #37  
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Just keep eggs in the car and toss them upwards when someone is tailgating you.

Would anyone road hog in a 8?
Old 01-09-2008, 08:01 AM
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Hi everyone,

The capitalist work ethos we are bound to in order to afford products of other proles' estranged labour to delude us from our own sorry situation impeded my alacrity in responding to the most recent posts on this socratic circle. OK, england jokes aside, was quite surprised to see how many posts this thread elicited in the past couple of hours. This will be a lenghty response to the many things that many of you have said, kindly bear with me if you are interested, or go read about many much more interesting things about the 8 and the joys of motoring elseway on this forum. Have to say what I am about to say since I begun the thread, and will try my utmost to see it to an amiable conclusion between all parties.

1. Veilside: thank you for the timely reminder to take a step back and reflect on what I said. In the heat of the moment, I acknowledge I was becoming a tad too personal and lost sight of the issue with those rather churlish comments.

2. Rumboo: your eloquent discourse, which drew upon elements of my own scattered ruminations with scintillating wit, has certainly resonated profoundly upon further introspection. Am grateful that you can appreciate where I was coming from, given the situation, and read your subtext loud and clear. Hope you don't find I was becoming a too much of a pedant. Several harrowing personal experiences predicated by my own recklesslessness in times old have made me tend to err on the side of caution these days. Your prose is simply sublime, I genuflect before thy altar of verbosity.

3. Kaine: appreciate you trying to help salvage the situation from devolving into mere mud-slinging and spiralling unnecessarily beyond the original intent of the post. You pre-empted perfectly what I was about to post upon returning home. It's a shame we haven't been able to meet up yet for a drink.

4. Littletonysg, as far as humanly possible, I do not intentionally pick fights with other forumers to get my rocks off. I may come across as excessively emotional or reactionary in the threads I started, but this is often the unfortunate consequence of certain replies that don't easily lend themselves to constructive discussion. In this and perhaps some other cases, several assumptions were made before judgement was quickly passed, so do try to emphatize from my point of view. Ask a question or make a remark, get treated like someone who has scant knowledge. I don't profess to be an expert, but I do try to get my facts right and do my homework first. In this entire thread, only one person attempted to clarify the situaton I was facing during those fateful encounters with the merc. And personally, I don't think its a matter of how big one's gonads are or whether one has gonads or not. I have a responsibility to my loved ones in my car, as well as other road users out there.

5. To everyone else who have offered their 2 cents worth: if I trampled on your toes, it was unintentional. Perhaps, I should have explained the situation(s) more clearly right from the onset like what Kaine did. I think many of us here have strong, assertive personalities, which are not necessarily bad qualities but run the risk of sparking off misunderstanding upon contact. That said, it would really be nice if we could be fair to what people have to say. I believe that what I said, as did the others, had merit, even we diverged on points of view. Seek to understand first leh, then clarify if necessary. Being condescending or patronising from go leaves a sour note over everything and takes away much of the joy of interacting with a community of like-minded people.

Good night, and good luck.

Last edited by wildchilde; 01-09-2008 at 08:05 AM.
Old 01-09-2008, 08:21 AM
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Hahaha, Simply8, time to go dictionary.com again!

This time I also have to join you there...
Old 01-09-2008, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Rumboo
Haha, no lah, still got mistakes... sorry i give ppl headache to read, but 'philosophy' si ani zuay smoke one wat!

Kaine:
Interesting scenario.. personally, if the left lane is clearer than the overtaking lane (lane1) which I'm on, I would just stick to my lane simply becos it is easier for the lancer to pass on the left.
the left lane was clear for me to switch to at times but its traffic wasn't moving any quicker.

i'll tell u guys the rest of the story....so after about what seemed like 2 or 3 mins of tailgating and flashing it finally dawned on him that i wasn't budging. then he moves to the left lane, briefly drives alongside me just to make eye-contact, which was gd cos my wife and in-laws who were with me wanted to get a better look at this ******** as much as i did. after seeing that we were all amused by him, he shifts to the 3rd lane and takes an exit.

so i concluded that this guy wanted to see how many cars he could bulldoze through before he could reach his exit, which was less than 5 mins away. either that or he wanted to take an alternate route by exiting early but looking back, it didn't seem like any of his passengers were terminal or in labour for that kinda hurry.... especially since he had the time to exchange glances.

and wildchilde, join us for one of the meets man. goddamit.
Old 01-09-2008, 11:43 AM
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I couldn't help but keep laughing at the post from Wildchilde

Don't mean to be rude but I thought I was reading a bible! Your "Ang Mo" simply too "powderful" to understand ha ha

Think I should check out my grammer and vocab before posting next time.....

Sorry for hijacking the thread
Old 01-09-2008, 09:17 PM
  #42  
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Why do people think they have the right to road hog? Whats wrong with giving way to people who wants to go faster? Left lane slower so do not want to give way. So aren't you pissing the person behind you who wants to go faster than you and the left lane?

2 things i hate the most on the road is selfish road hoggers and idiots who slow down to look at accidents. Both deserved to be flogged.

Go slow, road hog, go take a bus.
Old 01-09-2008, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Kaine

i'm on the overtaking lane on SLE doing 70+/80 keeping 2 cars length from the front car, ahead of which i can see an endless no. of cars. then suddenly a heavily stickered lancer starts tailgating me and flashes headlights. there is room for me to switch to left lane. question is, should i?

do note that i'm a new driver, with less than a year's experience and if you have a very 'duh' answer to the above question, you can keep it, thank you.
not sure abt you but I would, nvr mine if it was a heavily stickered lancer or a stock looking corolla. in fact, typically if i'm alert, i would have spotted the fast moving car and I would try to move off before he needed to flash me. there would be little chance of him tailgating me.
Old 01-09-2008, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by wildchilde
1. How fast do you usually drive on the CTE? 120-130 km/h on average?

2. Pray tell, how seasoned a driver are you? I'm curious to find out more...

3. Read my post again about context. I can understand why people in the states get shot. But they also have very different traffic conditions and regulations. We do not live or drive in the states.

When I first got my car, my boss told me that the RX8 is a TP beacon. At first, I could not comprehend why, since I believed that 8 owners were a sophisticated, sensible bunch of people. Not ah bengs like Rex or Evo drivers. I think I'm starting to understand why now...
Just to assure your beliefs.

We are sophisticated and sensible. That is why, we give way to faster moving cars, and not block them just cause we are at the max of the speed limit. We are gracious enough to give in and not let our pride and ego take over.
Old 01-09-2008, 10:13 PM
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OR you could try what I did on the North South Highway on one of our Sepang road trips, see the funny side to it and share the story with your mates so they too can have a good laugh.

So I was travelling on the extreme right lane doing about 160km/h when this car pulls up behind me. One look at it and I signalled left and let him through.

Ferrari F430.

I swung back out, whacked it into 3rd gear and floored it.

Of course I kena tia damn badly but thats not the point. There were at least 20 other guys on comms who were laughing their asses off at this stock, black (at the time) RX8 trying to chase after a brand spanking new Ferrari F430.

Priceless.

I even joined in the laughter

Anyway I know this post aint really got any bearing to this thread. But I thought I'd tell a funny story featuring myself as the clown, get you guys chuckling and diffusing the tension here.

If that still dont work? Then I'm gonna have to bust out my trusty guitar and start singing Bob Marley tunes (very badly)
Old 01-09-2008, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Kaine
the left lane was clear for me to switch to at times but its traffic wasn't moving any quicker.
Orrrrh, lai dat then different lah. Becos quite often lane 1 got dam a lot of cars, but lane 2 free... if i filter to lane 2, then he can't even use lane 2 to pass me and all the lane 1 cars, and he now worse, kena boxed in by lane 1 traffic and now me also in lane 2 to the left.

uuuunless you purposely want to box him in? Then he cannot exit?
Old 01-10-2008, 01:35 AM
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Talking

hmmm.....i buay tahan people tailgate me but limpei also buay tahan people road hog.....both not bery smart...u tailgate, clown in front sudden brake u cry cause your RX8 so precious ......aiyoh u will be soooo kek sim, u roadhog, clown behind impatient and kuku driver bang into your karchng, u also cry cause your RX8 so precious....aiyoh so sim tiah.....haiz....

tell u wat happen tis morning along ecp...i overtook a wrx to get to right lane....clown thing i wanna chio him race...so he got ride behind me....so i thought lai lah and floored my accelerator......130 plus, 140 plus....but haiz....still not fast enough for the WRX...he still right behind me....like my **** very nice to smell lidat.....I think i must get those electronic lights on the back which can flash words....people get too close for comfort, can flash words like "u gay si boh???".....

anyway i realised my car cant outrun his or maybe its just cause i kuku driver....so i humbly shift left lane cause i dun wanna road hog this fierce WRX racer,...... when he wheezed past me , wah lau eh...the size of his exhaust, cat also can jump inside and sleep....

anyway real reason why i quickly shift left is cause i know infront got speed cam....I quickly slowed down and got ready to shout "hooray" when the speed cam flash at his backside loving face......but haiz....nowadays the speed cams along ECP like all off lehz....
Old 01-10-2008, 02:07 AM
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Dun race WRX lah, they all very dangerous one... Already seen 2 which become modern art sculpture on the PIE while driving home at 2-3am, one by itself, one with a damaged taxi by the side. Cleanup crew hosing the road down. 4wd lose control means lose control liao.
Old 01-10-2008, 02:42 AM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by metatron303
anyway i realised my car cant outrun his or maybe its just cause i kuku driver....
Both are true.. ha ha ha.. j/k no offence hor.
Old 01-10-2008, 03:36 AM
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No problems about the hijacking of the thread to have a laugh about powderful englands and/or discuss related road etiquette matters. I'm just glad that at the end of the day, that despite the angst that this thread provoked, there was ultimately entertainment, edification, and at least readers got to deliberate about the issue. I never intended to police speed limits on my own, nor hold any giggling mercmorons up...we drive according to our individual conscience yeah? Food for thought: As someone astutely pointed out in this thread...would [and could] anyone road hog in an 8? I'm sure all rotaryheads know that is practically impossible.

Anyways, even 3M (i.e. Mighty MM -- and I ain't talkin about Mazda Motor), who managed to create an air-conditioned nation, recently said that it will take us many many more years to become a civil society, which includes better road manners. Hopefully, even though I will probably be gone by then, we someday will. For our children and theirs...

Cheers


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