Finally it's coming!
03-23-2006, 07:40 PM
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03-24-2006, 05:34 AM
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lowrider - Yeah , i am with you on that one
Team that track with www.d1gp.com.my and we may be having some fun in the yrs to come :D
Team that track with www.d1gp.com.my and we may be having some fun in the yrs to come :D
03-24-2006, 07:15 AM
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Heard about it last year. But really good to heard confirmed news.
Dunno who is the idiot who chose to build a horse racetrack instead of a car racetrack. And in the process lost millions of dollars to our neighbour and deprive our car cravings.
Next they will have to relax car modding a little.
Its so timely; just when the rest of the world is calling us boring people with no life.
Dunno who is the idiot who chose to build a horse racetrack instead of a car racetrack. And in the process lost millions of dollars to our neighbour and deprive our car cravings.
Next they will have to relax car modding a little.
Its so timely; just when the rest of the world is calling us boring people with no life.
03-24-2006, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Emperor
Heard about it last year. But really good to heard confirmed news.
Dunno who is the idiot who chose to build a horse racetrack instead of a car racetrack. And in the process lost millions of dollars to our neighbour and deprive our car cravings.
Next they will have to relax car modding a little.
Its so timely; just when the rest of the world is calling us boring people with no life.
Dunno who is the idiot who chose to build a horse racetrack instead of a car racetrack. And in the process lost millions of dollars to our neighbour and deprive our car cravings.
Next they will have to relax car modding a little.
Its so timely; just when the rest of the world is calling us boring people with no life.
There is an average of 9 race on Friday(singapore race)...and about 10 race (sunday race)....then you add in about 10 race on wed(Hong Kong race)...and another 10 race on sunday (malaysia race)...you have an average of 30 race a week.
Then let's do our math...each ticket costs $5....let's ASSUME everyone bets $5 per race(which is totally such a small amount to bet...the standard bet is 2 tickets). There are approximately about 5000 people at the Kranji T.C for each race day. The rest are scattered around the betting centers(Stadium, Shenton, Little India etc)...we put the amount at 10000 people. For each race, that means MINIMUM $50000 small bets traded. I dun want to add in the big players to complicate things bro but an avg of 5 million is traded for EACH RACE but we leave it at $50000.
So for one race - $50,000. 40 races - $2 million (small bets only....if you want to add in big betting players and syndicates...it would be a totally obscene amount of money). And we have not added in those big events like the SIA cup...queens cup and other trophies that has a lot of cash money involved that will entice big players to throw more money into the race. Gambling rakes in more revenue than any other form of entertainment. F1 make rake in hundreds of millions(maybe) for a single race in Singapore....but horse racing? hell...it does not even need advertising and it can rake millions a week and its always increasing. That is why Singapore finally decided to build the Integrated Resort. Money from Gambling is something that Singapore cannot run away from.
"…Singapore's founding prime minister, Lee Kuan Yew, once described the ethnic Chinese, who drive much of Asia's wealth, as 'congenital gamblers'.
Make a few hundred drivers happy and make about $100 million a year or make tens or hundred of thousands people happy and make a few hundred more million a year? Me think Singapore Govt made the right move man.
at the end of the day...having the race track in singapore could be just to stop illegal race and reckless driving in singapore.
03-24-2006, 10:43 AM
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Wah! You know so much about horse. If i did not know you, i would think your avatar is you.
But then again, like horse racing. People can also bet on car races. Not only the millions which change hands at F1. We can also host local races.
And when you factor in the vulgar ticket prices F1 tickets costs, i am sure they generate more income than a horse race. And how many young people you know actually is interested in horse? Maybe one.... (see above). You can call me a car lover, but its way different when you are a horse lover (read:beastiality)
And i am sure alot of people will go to a race track daily and pay track fees then go to a turf club. Just see how deserted the TC is weekdays.
Not forgeting all the additionals like "race on sunday, sell on monday". Car modding will really take off and maybe we can have home made mod products.
And then there is the increase in tourism when major races takes place. Increase in hotel occupancy, tourist spending and more.
Add the obscene money sponsorship generates. How many car related companys can sponsor races and such. When did you see HKS sponsor a HKS race horse?
Car sales will also increase. People will be more willing to buy off road race cars to race which also results in more revenue for the Gov.
With a local race track, would not the roads be safer when there is an outlet to release the pent up speed craving.
And with a local track, its easier to do motor research and car testing. Rather than transporting everything across the causeway.
How many rich people would be more interested in horses than cars? My guess, they would be more interested in a prancing horse than a live horse. Its not much bragging rights that you own a live horse as compared to a red mechanical one. And moreover, you cannot ride your horse to a fancy dinner. (Maybe you can, but please call me first...)
And talking about LKY, he did admit it was a stupid decision we did not build a racetrack. When he actually realise how much money was lost to our neighbour.
Something Monaco know thats we don't that transform them from the poorest country in Europe to one of the richest. Casinos, cars and carnivals.
But then again, like horse racing. People can also bet on car races. Not only the millions which change hands at F1. We can also host local races.
And when you factor in the vulgar ticket prices F1 tickets costs, i am sure they generate more income than a horse race. And how many young people you know actually is interested in horse? Maybe one.... (see above). You can call me a car lover, but its way different when you are a horse lover (read:beastiality)
And i am sure alot of people will go to a race track daily and pay track fees then go to a turf club. Just see how deserted the TC is weekdays.
Not forgeting all the additionals like "race on sunday, sell on monday". Car modding will really take off and maybe we can have home made mod products.
And then there is the increase in tourism when major races takes place. Increase in hotel occupancy, tourist spending and more.
Add the obscene money sponsorship generates. How many car related companys can sponsor races and such. When did you see HKS sponsor a HKS race horse?
Car sales will also increase. People will be more willing to buy off road race cars to race which also results in more revenue for the Gov.
With a local race track, would not the roads be safer when there is an outlet to release the pent up speed craving.
And with a local track, its easier to do motor research and car testing. Rather than transporting everything across the causeway.
How many rich people would be more interested in horses than cars? My guess, they would be more interested in a prancing horse than a live horse. Its not much bragging rights that you own a live horse as compared to a red mechanical one. And moreover, you cannot ride your horse to a fancy dinner. (Maybe you can, but please call me first...)
And talking about LKY, he did admit it was a stupid decision we did not build a racetrack. When he actually realise how much money was lost to our neighbour.
Something Monaco know thats we don't that transform them from the poorest country in Europe to one of the richest. Casinos, cars and carnivals.
03-24-2006, 12:05 PM
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Emperor....good points man, but ngkenny is right. No matter how much you believe that car racing will take off here, it's not a significant pastime of local interest, just the relative few (yet as you correctly say, the few are intense!). Horse racing is embedded into the Asian culture....car racing, although important, isn't (yet?)...simple math to me.
03-24-2006, 02:56 PM
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I dunno the details, but I agree with ngkenny and Genesis... I'm no congenital gambler! But I bet horse racing wins car racing hands down. Ha ha...
03-24-2006, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Emperor
Wah! You know so much about horse. If i did not know you, i would think your avatar is you.
But then again, like horse racing. People can also bet on car races. Not only the millions which change hands at F1. We can also host local races.
And when you factor in the vulgar ticket prices F1 tickets costs, i am sure they generate more income than a horse race. And how many young people you know actually is interested in horse? Maybe one.... (see above). You can call me a car lover, but its way different when you are a horse lover (read:beastiality)
And i am sure alot of people will go to a race track daily and pay track fees then go to a turf club. Just see how deserted the TC is weekdays.
Not forgeting all the additionals like "race on sunday, sell on monday". Car modding will really take off and maybe we can have home made mod products.
And then there is the increase in tourism when major races takes place. Increase in hotel occupancy, tourist spending and more.
Add the obscene money sponsorship generates. How many car related companys can sponsor races and such. When did you see HKS sponsor a HKS race horse?
Car sales will also increase. People will be more willing to buy off road race cars to race which also results in more revenue for the Gov.
With a local race track, would not the roads be safer when there is an outlet to release the pent up speed craving.
And with a local track, its easier to do motor research and car testing. Rather than transporting everything across the causeway.
How many rich people would be more interested in horses than cars? My guess, they would be more interested in a prancing horse than a live horse. Its not much bragging rights that you own a live horse as compared to a red mechanical one. And moreover, you cannot ride your horse to a fancy dinner. (Maybe you can, but please call me first...)
And talking about LKY, he did admit it was a stupid decision we did not build a racetrack. When he actually realise how much money was lost to our neighbour.
Something Monaco know thats we don't that transform them from the poorest country in Europe to one of the richest. Casinos, cars and carnivals.
But then again, like horse racing. People can also bet on car races. Not only the millions which change hands at F1. We can also host local races.
And when you factor in the vulgar ticket prices F1 tickets costs, i am sure they generate more income than a horse race. And how many young people you know actually is interested in horse? Maybe one.... (see above). You can call me a car lover, but its way different when you are a horse lover (read:beastiality)
And i am sure alot of people will go to a race track daily and pay track fees then go to a turf club. Just see how deserted the TC is weekdays.
Not forgeting all the additionals like "race on sunday, sell on monday". Car modding will really take off and maybe we can have home made mod products.
And then there is the increase in tourism when major races takes place. Increase in hotel occupancy, tourist spending and more.
Add the obscene money sponsorship generates. How many car related companys can sponsor races and such. When did you see HKS sponsor a HKS race horse?
Car sales will also increase. People will be more willing to buy off road race cars to race which also results in more revenue for the Gov.
With a local race track, would not the roads be safer when there is an outlet to release the pent up speed craving.
And with a local track, its easier to do motor research and car testing. Rather than transporting everything across the causeway.
How many rich people would be more interested in horses than cars? My guess, they would be more interested in a prancing horse than a live horse. Its not much bragging rights that you own a live horse as compared to a red mechanical one. And moreover, you cannot ride your horse to a fancy dinner. (Maybe you can, but please call me first...)
And talking about LKY, he did admit it was a stupid decision we did not build a racetrack. When he actually realise how much money was lost to our neighbour.
Something Monaco know thats we don't that transform them from the poorest country in Europe to one of the richest. Casinos, cars and carnivals.
Singaporeans spent $6 billion dollars last year alone on 4D, toto, horse racing and Soccer betting. and 6 billion being legalised amount. Half of it belonging to horse racing.
I want to add in this point. "And i am sure alot of people will go to a race track daily and pay track fees then go to a turf club. Just see how deserted the TC is weekdays." Have you seen the crowd yourself? Track days...let's ASSUME that the new track can have 100 cars a day and its very crowded...but thats it...its just crowd. Those people just push their cars and it is not going to generate anything except to increase their adrenaline rush. But those people at the betting centers are throwing money at the singapore govt and yet getting their adrenaline rush. Its a totally different idea. There is only so much money that can be generated from a race track. Look at our very own Local SMSA race. DO you think it is generating any income from the public? Do you think that people are betting to see if which driver will win? Who will get placing? Who will get trio?
How many rich people would be interested in horses than cars? You are totally mistaken bro....More rich people are interested in horses than cars actually. With horses, its a symbol of prestige. Do you know that most of the horses in singapore are owned by the rich and famous who remain anonymous.Big Lawyers, Famous Doctors, bank owners. Those are the real rich ones...not those who flaunt their cars by bringing it to dinner.
The money that a winning horse brings in is tremendous. Owing horses in singapore is more 'atas' than owning cars. It costs about $5000 a month to maintain a race horse. Buy car in singapore - lose money. Buy horse in singapore - might win lotsa money (Look at the race horse Ouzo. When Ouzo retired, the money won by racing from this horse can buy so many lambos for the owner!)
Let's be realistic. Sponsorship for car events can only be that big. $1-2 million big enough for you? Let's put things into another perspective...when alonso won the last race..1/4 page news report. when there is a horse race day on a normal day...4 page news report.
If we pose a ques to LKY now. ask him which one more important. Car Race track or Horse race track. To remain politically right, he might say car race track so as not to promote gambling. But he will still say Horse Race Track at the end simply because where on earth will you get $6 billion bucks throw at you without doing anything.
Thus bro...which came first? The Integrated resort or car race track? Of cos we build race track now because the I.R has already been approved? Nothing else to build already!
03-25-2006, 01:18 AM
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Maybe you are right. I guess i am quite bias towards a racetrack.
I never get it whats the interest in watching horses race when theres way more depth and knowledge involves in cars. Maybe i am more of a technical and scientific person and more in tune with the western way of life than the asian one.
Yup, its true horses are owned by the rich. Its does makes more sense than a car. But sometimes it not only about making more money when you already have the MONEY.
I never get it whats the interest in watching horses race when theres way more depth and knowledge involves in cars. Maybe i am more of a technical and scientific person and more in tune with the western way of life than the asian one.
Yup, its true horses are owned by the rich. Its does makes more sense than a car. But sometimes it not only about making more money when you already have the MONEY.
03-26-2006, 10:01 AM
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Nope. I backed out a month before i was due to leave (Enrolled and had a house waiting). Glad i turn it down or i might have killed myself racing cars or doing other stupid stuff.
Felt a tinge of regret but somehow i guess my life turn out quite good by not going.
Felt a tinge of regret but somehow i guess my life turn out quite good by not going.
03-26-2006, 11:02 AM
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Too bad the track is good enough for F3 races and below...not good enough for F1...think the owner should think further and buy more land to build bigger to meet F1 standards then got higher chances of making back from F1 races when Singapore becomes one of the F1 race legs....then can make from locals and international visitors too =)
03-27-2006, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by ngkenny
there is also entry fee when you go to the turf club and you times it the number of times they visit the turf club a month.
Singaporeans spent $6 billion dollars last year alone on 4D, toto, horse racing and Soccer betting. and 6 billion being legalised amount. Half of it belonging to horse racing.
I want to add in this point. "And i am sure alot of people will go to a race track daily and pay track fees then go to a turf club. Just see how deserted the TC is weekdays." Have you seen the crowd yourself? Track days...let's ASSUME that the new track can have 100 cars a day and its very crowded...but thats it...its just crowd. Those people just push their cars and it is not going to generate anything except to increase their adrenaline rush. But those people at the betting centers are throwing money at the singapore govt and yet getting their adrenaline rush. Its a totally different idea. There is only so much money that can be generated from a race track. Look at our very own Local SMSA race. DO you think it is generating any income from the public? Do you think that people are betting to see if which driver will win? Who will get placing? Who will get trio?
How many rich people would be interested in horses than cars? You are totally mistaken bro....More rich people are interested in horses than cars actually. With horses, its a symbol of prestige. Do you know that most of the horses in singapore are owned by the rich and famous who remain anonymous.Big Lawyers, Famous Doctors, bank owners. Those are the real rich ones...not those who flaunt their cars by bringing it to dinner.
The money that a winning horse brings in is tremendous. Owing horses in singapore is more 'atas' than owning cars. It costs about $5000 a month to maintain a race horse. Buy car in singapore - lose money. Buy horse in singapore - might win lotsa money (Look at the race horse Ouzo. When Ouzo retired, the money won by racing from this horse can buy so many lambos for the owner!)
Let's be realistic. Sponsorship for car events can only be that big. $1-2 million big enough for you? Let's put things into another perspective...when alonso won the last race..1/4 page news report. when there is a horse race day on a normal day...4 page news report.
If we pose a ques to LKY now. ask him which one more important. Car Race track or Horse race track. To remain politically right, he might say car race track so as not to promote gambling. But he will still say Horse Race Track at the end simply because where on earth will you get $6 billion bucks throw at you without doing anything.
Thus bro...which came first? The Integrated resort or car race track? Of cos we build race track now because the I.R has already been approved? Nothing else to build already!
Singaporeans spent $6 billion dollars last year alone on 4D, toto, horse racing and Soccer betting. and 6 billion being legalised amount. Half of it belonging to horse racing.
I want to add in this point. "And i am sure alot of people will go to a race track daily and pay track fees then go to a turf club. Just see how deserted the TC is weekdays." Have you seen the crowd yourself? Track days...let's ASSUME that the new track can have 100 cars a day and its very crowded...but thats it...its just crowd. Those people just push their cars and it is not going to generate anything except to increase their adrenaline rush. But those people at the betting centers are throwing money at the singapore govt and yet getting their adrenaline rush. Its a totally different idea. There is only so much money that can be generated from a race track. Look at our very own Local SMSA race. DO you think it is generating any income from the public? Do you think that people are betting to see if which driver will win? Who will get placing? Who will get trio?
How many rich people would be interested in horses than cars? You are totally mistaken bro....More rich people are interested in horses than cars actually. With horses, its a symbol of prestige. Do you know that most of the horses in singapore are owned by the rich and famous who remain anonymous.Big Lawyers, Famous Doctors, bank owners. Those are the real rich ones...not those who flaunt their cars by bringing it to dinner.
The money that a winning horse brings in is tremendous. Owing horses in singapore is more 'atas' than owning cars. It costs about $5000 a month to maintain a race horse. Buy car in singapore - lose money. Buy horse in singapore - might win lotsa money (Look at the race horse Ouzo. When Ouzo retired, the money won by racing from this horse can buy so many lambos for the owner!)
Let's be realistic. Sponsorship for car events can only be that big. $1-2 million big enough for you? Let's put things into another perspective...when alonso won the last race..1/4 page news report. when there is a horse race day on a normal day...4 page news report.
If we pose a ques to LKY now. ask him which one more important. Car Race track or Horse race track. To remain politically right, he might say car race track so as not to promote gambling. But he will still say Horse Race Track at the end simply because where on earth will you get $6 billion bucks throw at you without doing anything.
Thus bro...which came first? The Integrated resort or car race track? Of cos we build race track now because the I.R has already been approved? Nothing else to build already!
The horse-racing track is no doubt, and you are right, a revenue spinning entity for the SIN govt. The motor-racing track has always been perceived, and wrongly so, as a dangerous sports for S'poreans. The last S'pore Grand Prix held at the old Upper Thomson 'circuit' killed one of the best S'porean drivers. The govt took that opportunity to stop it altogether ignoring the fact that that was one of the biggest spectacle and sporting event for S'poreans.
Then, of course, the argument was that land was too valuable to be used for a motor-racing track but they built about 20 18-hole golf courses occupying as much as 40-times the land area needed for a decent-sized race track. Sigh! It's now water under the bridge as with the benefit of hindsight our leader had admitted his mistake for turning down the repeated proposals for building a proper F1 track in SIN.
So we are going to have a race track afterall but think again. It's going to be a "Mickey Mouse" circuit, slightly more than 3km (probably shorter than PG) and, as I heard, "uninteresting", "unchallenging", you name it. It could be developed with a "disneyland type" of theme park in mind. I believe that it will still be an inferior alternative to Sepang unless you have a addiction to ferris wheel, pom-pom cars, star-wars rides, etc... and of course karting.
03-27-2006, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Emperor
But sometimes it not only about making more money when you already have the MONEY.
03-28-2006, 04:38 AM
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Lohsk: Maybe alot is still not enough...
I hope our track is challenging and safe but not something too overdone or underdone.
The old SG grand prix took place on a closed public road with no safety barriers, margin, sand barriers, etc. And technology is much more advanced now, so it should in fact be safer.
Yup, i am pissed at the fact why there are so many golf course in SG and they can still say no land. Golf courses are needed as they bring value in another way but i think its a tad too many for SG.
I hope our track is challenging and safe but not something too overdone or underdone.
The old SG grand prix took place on a closed public road with no safety barriers, margin, sand barriers, etc. And technology is much more advanced now, so it should in fact be safer.
Yup, i am pissed at the fact why there are so many golf course in SG and they can still say no land. Golf courses are needed as they bring value in another way but i think its a tad too many for SG.
03-28-2006, 07:52 AM
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Originally Posted by sqflyer
Moral of the story: Rich power brokers play golf instead of racing cars.
03-28-2006, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by ngkenny
Track days...let's ASSUME that the new track can have 100 cars a day and its very crowded...but thats it...its just crowd. Those people just push their cars and it is not going to generate anything except to increase their adrenaline rush. But those people at the betting centers are throwing money at the singapore govt and yet getting their adrenaline rush. Its a totally different idea. There is only so much money that can be generated from a race track.
03-28-2006, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Fab 8
Knowing Singapore, the track will have an ERP gantry...every lap $5...
03-28-2006, 10:01 AM
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That's the issue I mentioned to lohsk... Accident in M'sian track, can blow smoke screen, cover up and try to claim insurance. Accident in S'pore track... ha bes.
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