Jon H

We are Sailing...
Or are we? Any news from you boat-spotters yet, any stirrings in the pacific, is the good ship xxxx steaming this way laden with shiny RX-8's, carefully avoiding icebergs on the way?
I have got a horrible feeling the USA debacle has kept the anchor firmly in the seabed. I want to be wrong, but it would make sense (from Mazda's viewpoint, maybe) if they are consulting their lawyers and testing the cars, or samples of them in order to carefully prepare themselves, before a single one gets to a customer. They need to avoid a total PR disaster - ok its been annoying so far but I wouldnt say the wheels have fallen right off yet. But its almost certain our cars will be down on power, they want to avoid lawsuits as much as possible. That might explain so much silence.

From reading the US board it appears their handing of the power crisis has been quite effective and well received, and they will want to maintain that here, but they really are between an iceberg and a hard place at the moment. If the delay goes on much longer then that itself will blow up in Mazda's face. I really hope to be proven wrong when the first of you guys (and girls, and me...) get letters with shipping info.
I am ready to take a battering on this, so I have got my tin hat on. But any evidence proving me wrong will be welcome, however stupid it makes me look.

Sorry to be so pessimistic, but I smell another delay. I myself am happy to wait until December 1st, and would be happy to have slightly less power and 3 years servicing, but at the end of the day I JUST WANT THE GODDAM CAR! But eventually I will start heading towards the BMW / Audi showrooms again. And by the way my dealer hasnt even got a demo yet for me to drive, so I really am getting desperate.
JH

morganrogers

*sigh*. I hope you are wrong.

Like you , I just want the car.
I dont care about the power (it will be easily enough).
I dont care about what Autocar say (everyone else loves it)
I dont even care that the yanks are getting free servicing (although that would be sweet)

I just want a delivery date - that is all !
Still , as mentioned elsewhere , they do have 4 days left to inform us before the end of August as promised....

A-getting-sad-now,

Morgan.

AndyPearce

Perhaps some of those flying pigs can swoop down and pluck an RX8 for each forum member off the boat!:p

How many times now have Mazda promised us 'a letter at the end of the month' ??

oilman

I'm not sure about the rest of you but I'm getting sick of promises, promises, promises.

I wouldn't have a business if I followed their business model!!

Come on MAZDA, your reputation is at stake here!

Cheers
OILMAN

MarkW

I've just posted it in another thread, but I dont really believe our cars are on a ship at the moment. If they were, I would think that Mazda would want to tell their customers asap

If a ship left on 20/8, this would be here by the end of September and October delivery would be reasonable. As the general feeling is that we will have November deliveries, a boat could leave any time in the next 3 weeks and be here before November.

These containers can carry several thousand cars so they can easily get all the cars on one ship if required.

sixspeed

I can't help feel that the reason the US RX-8s are so low down on power are because they have the same car as us.


-andy-

RobDickinson

Nope, they have the same power as the Auz cars (240ps/238bhp).

We have slower cars again (on paper).

Whats worrying me is the dyno graphs at 7krpm and over, big drop in torqe/power.

Drop at 7200rpm, power doesnt come back to 7200 levels untill 8000 and them not over, torque drops massivly then tails off..

let me link to the graph...

MarkW

Andy,

I have been thinking that as well, however with the poor dyno results in the US equating to power output around 220bhp, I am vainly hoping that our cars may have MORE power than the US.

Mark

c170673

I am getting a horrible sinking feeling (pardon the pun) that the RX-8 isn't going to live up to my or other forum members expectations.

I sincerely hope I am wrong and that all the power issues are red herrings and Mazda wil deliver the cars to us in late October / early November.

But none the less I have a bad feeling building.

Chris

MarkW

I really dont know what to think, a lot of stuff Ive read on here the last week or so is very depressing.

I was getting fed up with the whole thing again last night, so I re-read this months Evo review which made me feel a lot better about the car again.

It sometimes feels like we are talking about two different cars here. One way or the other I'll find out this Saturday.

AndyPearce

I've been looking through this years FHM High Street Honey's to cheer me up. Call me a heretic but sometimes I think of something other than cars.:D

Jon H

How about some scans then to cheer us all up? Would be good to look at something we might stand more chance of getting hold of! sorry, there I go again....

ChrisW

Mazda always seem to have assumed that passing Euro 4 emissions would be more difficult than passing US emissions, hence they have always rated our cars lower. But I suppose it's just possible they had some specific issues with the US test that wouldn't apply to Euro 4.

I think the emission levels are quite close for the two standards, but there are almost certainly differences in testing methodology. So maybe it's possible (I'm not hopeful though).

AndyPearce

If I had a scanner...........

I think we can keep the comparison going though - I really like the look of them, I can't wait to have at least 20 minutes with one but ultimately I think I might be a bit disappointed with the whole experience and decide my current model is better!:p

BlueAdept

I've driven it, you won't be disappointed... or at least, if you are I wonder why!!!

rael

I think perhaps we need to accept that this is not the performance car we maybe thought although the power maybe enough. Only a test drive with a UK spec car will tell.

I think a lot will depend on which car one owns at the moment and if one is going up, down or across the range. For me the 8 really needs to match the TTC in interior quality, speed, acceleration etc, if not I will walk away. Looks alone will not do it.

Mentally I am negative and will therefore be pleasantly surprised if the 8 matches up.

Also, I don't have the 'rotary' experience so don't know what I am missing unlike others for whom this is the main purchase factor ignoring high MPG which I see as a big negative

rael

ChrisW

I wonder if this is in danger of becoming a case of "great car, shame about the engine".

This would be ironic, as clearly the rotary is the raison d'etre of this car - a unique technology that only Mazda possesses that is supposed to act as an advertisement for their innovation and technical prowess.

People had assumed the rotary was dead, and its re-birth was dependent on Mazda solving the problems of emissions and fuel consumption. But these are exactly the problems that seem to have tripped them up again.

I love the idea of the rotary engine and if they really can deliver 228 hp with Euro 4 emissions, then I think Mazda will have just about succeeded even with the poor fuel consumption. But if the power is much less than this, then I think a lot of people will start to wonder just what the point of the rotary engine is anyway.

BlueAdept

Why are people starting roumours about the power output.... Mazda USA have admitted that they had to switch to one of the more emissions friendly ECU settings (probably Euro3) for the US, and hence they got slightly less power than they were expecting...

There is no reason for us to believe that we will have this problem,... The reduction for us was a decision based on the fact that the car would be mostly sold in 2004, not 2003 and hence would need to be Euro4 compliant... NOT on being unable to meet the Euro3 requirements.

Having driven the car, I can assure you that the engine IS the best bit of an excelent package, and it would STILL be so even if the power was reduced further...

c170673

Having read this thread it appears that some of the US power problems are due to the car haing to meet California's stringent emissions regulations (I think they are about the same as Euro 4).

If this is the case we should still be getting 228bhp.

Chris

ChrisW

When did Mazda give any reason for the US power downgrade? Can you show me a letter or press release? All I have seen is the letter posted to the main forum which describes it as a "mistake", whatever that means.

There are many dyno tests and performance figures which indicate that the US cars are not making 238 hp, so Mazda's revised figure is an overstatement. So is our revised figure (228 hp) also an overstatement?

RobDickinson

http://www.rx8forum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9760

rael

BlueAdept,

Interested in what car do you drive now which makes the 8's engine so attractive to you?

rael

ChrisW

Well I'm glad Mazda are letting a little more information leak out, albeit through unattributed comments to third parties. But this really just makes the power rating "mistake" even more mysterious. They had to modify the ECU to get it to pass federal emissions, and they didn't notice that they had also reduced the horsepower in the process? How is that possible?

BlueAdept

Hmmm.

That's more of a question than it sounds... Please tell us what your thoughts are too.

Firstly, I've driven a wide variety of different things, admittedly not generally as powerful as the RX8 should be,... so I am concious that the available power may be colouring my opinion...

My 2 most recent vehicles were an Accord (2.2), and a V8 Defender.

I love the V8 dearly, but I don't think that the low end pull can quite satisfy me as much as extending the Honda to the redline (And somtimes beyond)... The sound however comes close!

I didn't have too long to drive the RX8, but if you kept the revs below the 6000 that you'd expect of a normal (non VTEC) Honda, it felt very much the same... very civilised, but once you extended beyond that there was a quite smooth (compared to VTEC) transition to a more agreesive sound and much more power...

At lower revs, perhaps 3000 RPM it was not a rocket, but pulled well without feeling strained...

I felt that the car would be very pleasant and docile to drive in a relaxed manner, and also very satisfying when you wanted to press on... I don't think you can really ask more of it.

On the chasis side, I drove the car quite gently, and it felt really well planted, but not jittery at all... but the moment you moved the controls sharply or more purposefully it responded instantly... so much so that I found it amazing that it was so docile the rest of the time...

Finally, I AM a card carrying "Engineering Nut"... and I find the concept of the rotary engine really appealing... although I've never owned one before.