wcs

iTrader: (2)

Well,
We have all seen the postings about "Will I pass my eTest? Help I need a CAT? or WTB Catalytic to pass etest", in the Canadian sub forum.

Most of these pleas for help are car owners living in the Province of Ontario, as the rest of the Provinces are not car hating zealots.

At the risk of getting in **** from the Moderators for being political, I was surprised when earlier this year the Liberal government for Ontario decided to change the Drive Clean laws ... and the Universe smiled.

The first of the changes came in to effect September 2011

CTV video
http://www.cp24.com/servlet/an/local...7/?hub=SWOHome

Drive Clean brochre
http://www.ene.gov.on.ca/stdprodcons...rod_086754.pdf

Should fail your drive clean test
http://www.ene.gov.on.ca/stdprodcons...rod_087907.pdf

Drive Clean home page
http://www.ene.gov.on.ca/environment...y/drive_clean/

The heavens opened at the tremble of the universe, giving us a glimpse of this in 2013.

Quoted from the book of knowledge: Wikipedia
"The Future of Drive Clean

On June 7, 2010, the Ministry of Environment posted a request for proposals on MERX Canadian Public Tenders service. The modernized Drive Clean program, which will be fully implemented by January 1, 2013, are intended to provide significant benefits by implementing OBD2 testing. The Ministry of the Environment will work with its stakeholders over the next two and half years to fully implement the new emissions tests for light-duty vehicles (passenger cars, vans, light trucks and sport utility vehicles under 4,500 kilograms). [26] This new system is not without its critics , As vehicles must meet a certain criteria to pass. Problems such as a burnt out dash warning light will result in a vehicle failing the test and require expensive, unnecessary repairs that have zero impact on vehicle emissions. Some argue the testing price should be significantly reduced, as the physical test required in the current set up is replaced with a simple computer read out that can be completed instantly."

Linky >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ontario...an#cite_note-5

I'm posting some other links to the Drive Clean website and various articles covering the Liberal announcement.

Near bottom of article
http://www.wheels.ca/article/799101

The actual Environment Registry of Ontario
http://www.ebr.gov.on.ca/ERS-WEB-Ext...Uw&language=en


Rejoice

TheWulf

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for saving me the trouble of posting this

And yes this is great news for us AP owners. This is actually making me consider keeping the RX-8 longer and going FI.

BlackStealth

iTrader: (3)

Call me an idiot, but how does this help those who are catless? They still test for the pollutants coming from the exhaust...What's even worse is that my car is a 2004, so this doesn't have any effect on me since I have to get it tested again at the end of the year. blah!

scorcherjf

And ontario is one of the only places I know in this continent that has smog patrol driving around lol...

wcs

iTrader: (2)

My understanding of it, and I maybe wrong, is that in 2013 that they are no longer doing a sniff test and going to the CEL (MIL) check only.

Did you find somewhere in the 2013 amendment that said CEL + Sniff?
I may have missed it.

If I did then (that makes baby jesus cry), yes I would agree with you.

Still they are getting rid of the dyno thing.

You're right, I had forgotten about that group.

That whole thing pisses me off because Heavy Trucks and Buses pillowing huge plums of black smoke and soot in to the air is ok, it seems.

Apparently MM says he can tune smell and smoke out of the car. I've got beers on it. Maybe this winter we'll find out.

Just as a thought process:
I can't argue that Catalytics don't work .. they do and I believe they help. Well help clean up our air here where they are used, but lets consider:

A Catalytic converter is made up of platinum a precious metal. Typically mined deep underground. In 2006 the two largest producers of Platinum where South Africa and Russia (both of which I sure are known for their Environmental policies).
http://www.metalseconomics.com/pdf/S...inumSupply.pdf

Note: Palladium and rhodium are also used but I don't have time right now to investigate those guys.

This all takes a tremendous amount of energy just to mine. The power is likely generated by coal or diesel (onsite gen-set).

Remember the location we are mining this stuff. Next is the processing of the raw ore which requires massive crushers consuming massive power to reduce the ore to a size where the precious metal can be extracted, often by the use of nasty chemicals.

Then we transport the raw material to the mill. The mill turns it in to something useful for company looking for that precious metal, in the case of platinum I'm guessing some sort of billet.

Then its transported again to make the manufacture of the catalytic convertor which is then transported to the car manufacture which then transports the car to your dealer.

Note: running short on time I couldn't find a suitable web page showing the Global producers of Catalytic converters. (I bet its not North America)

Then we have to recycle these things. I don't know how that is done.

To bring this back to my point, it seems to me like we have made a device that helps our "air" at the expense of many environmental impacts of other peoples.
(Not in my backyard sort of thing)
If we really want to clean up the planet we just can't say ... hey look at this electric car ... no emissions isn't that GREAT!
Well BULLSHIT the entire carbon foot print has to be considered.

You might say that if you had the option not to buy a catalytic convertor when you purchased your vehicle you maybe causing air pollution but you are saving a planet.

Well peeps ... I'm late for work now.
I find this stuff fascinating to consider and that's just what I'm doing.
So all you tree huggers out there don't get your panties in knot.

If you have some stuff to add or questions great.
And if you just want to flame me and not add any content ... well whatever.

edit: Sorry wanted to add all my references ... I'm really late now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalytic_converter
http://www.wealthdaily.com/articles/...companies/2495
http://www.metalseconomics.com/pdf/S...inumSupply.pdf
http://www.gold-eagle.com/analysis/platinum.html

scorcherjf

Also...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalytic_converter

wcs

iTrader: (2)

Excellent point.
However I think you need the entire section to get the context ... three hundred times! WTF?!?!?

Quoted from the book of knowledge -> wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalytic_converter
/quote
Environmental impact
Catalytic converters have proven to be reliable and effective in reducing noxious tailpipe emissions. However, they may have some adverse environmental impacts in use:
The requirement for an internal combustion engine equipped with a three-way catalyst to run at the stoichiometric point means it is less efficient than if it were operated lean. Thus, there is an increases the amount of fossil fuel consumed and the carbon-dioxide emissions from the vehicle. However, NOx control on lean-burn engines is problematic and requires special lean NOx catalysts to meet U.S. emissions regulations.[citation needed]
Although catalytic converters are effective at removing hydrocarbons and other harmful emissions, they do not solve the fundamental problem created by burning a fossil fuel. In addition to water, the main combustion product in exhaust gas leaving the engine — through a catalytic converter or not — is carbon dioxide (CO2).[16] Carbon dioxide produced from fossil fuels is one of the greenhouse gases indicated by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) to be a "most likely" cause of global warming.[17] Additionally, the U.S. EPA has stated catalytic converters are a significant and growing cause of global warming, because of their release of nitrous oxide (N2O), a greenhouse gas over three hundred times more potent than carbon dioxide.[18]
Catalytic converter production requires palladium or platinum; part of the world supply of these precious metals is produced near Norilsk, Russia, where the industry (among others) has caused Norilsk to be added to Time magazine's list of most-polluted places.
/end quote

Ka Kui

iTrader: (7)

Thanks for the info above ^^