Revolver

We've all read about (and some of us have test-driven) the 6 MPS. Not a bad thing but it has a different appeal to the 8.

Now check out p17 of March Wheels.

We knew the 3 MPS was coming and if you're like me you figured, "Well big deal. It'll give the Golf GTI a scare but it won't touch my 8 for pace, etc and anyways I've left hatchbacks behind."

Well think again. The 3 MPS scores a slightly detuned version of the 6 MPS 2.3l turbo 4 motor but still pumps out 180kw and 380Nm of torque. It doesn't get weighed down with the AWD setup the 6 MPS has and we all know the 3 is nearly 100kg lighter than the 8. So do the math. To quote Wheels, "it's shaping up as the quickest production Mazda to date".

The real kicker - it'll cost about $40K.

Now, I'm real happy the hatchback brigade will have a new toy to consider but where does that leave Mazda's so called flagship model?

You can crap on about torque steer, styling, rotary smoothness, etc all you want but ask yourself how you're going to feel when some palooka who went to the same dealer as you, and spent $15-20K less, dusts you in a straight line, in a hatchback!

I've had the odd spray about Mazda needing to get its finger out about developing more power for the 8. Nissan did for the 350Z. Now we're faced with the ridiculous situation that two more garden variety model derivatives can bloody the 8's nose (or at least give it a fair fight). And don't think that won't hurt resale.

Now I know how all those HSV owners felt when Holden started stuffing LS1's into the SS model.

Mazda has clearly given priority to hotting up its bulk models (and producing the CX7) over developing the 8 further (I don't count hydrogen power as 'development'). No doubt good business for Mazda but unless you think the extra bells and whistles and "limited edition" fluff like the Revelation is worth trading for you really have to ask yourself whether you want a "new" 3 year old car when your warranty runs out.

A lot of you laughed off the Beemer 130i when I raised it as a comparison vehicle. Styling and price made it an easy target. Somehow I reckon the 3 MPS won't be so easy to ignore.

(As usual, I've been a tad passionate but I like to get a debate started. Am I being silly? Forget about defending your purchase and ignore your love for the 8 for the moment. Think like joe punter would for a sec and ask yourself whether you want a 'sportscar' that can be flipped off by a hatchback).

playa78

180kw and 380Nm?? that would give serious run for its money against 350Z, BMW and Porsche that costs 3 times as much...

timbo

Different markets, IMHO

Plenty of sports cars have been overhauled by something else; ask Porka owners about being flummoxed by be-mulleted HSV owners

But I'd hate to be selling the 130i against the 3MPS Imagine the goodies you could add for the savings.

The absolutely key thing I like about the 8 is its individuality: unique engine; unique design and style.

If it was about about straightline power, obviously I would have bought something else. That's one of the reasons I am not all that fussed about FI versions of the 8; for me, personally, that's not the point.

Frankly, I am more concerned Mazda has done bugger all to update the 8 in terms of amenities:- integrated bluetooth, iPod connectivity and control, navigation and better computer.

I have been actively looking at replacements. The hatches (Golf GTI, 130i) are just boringly bland, as far as I am concerned. And the 8 is a great reminder of the virtues of RWD, which (when well done) is vastly preferable to FWD.

You know, I'd probably look at the 350Z again -- especially if it was upgraded to the 450 V8 they are putting in the Infiniti coupé in the US, and had a little more space. But then we're probably talking $90k, and that puts me off.

Definitely worth having a discussion over a beer, this topic

auzoom

yes and you cant even say that the by the order of release the 8 should be coming because it came before the 3. Very dissapointing. Was the 180Kw at the wheels or flywheel?

Andrew

Gomez

Flywheel.....!!

Revolver

If you want to feel a little better, turn to p85 of the same issue. The 8 comes 6th in their handling test, just pipping the 350Z and is only bettered by (in order of 5-1): Lotus Elise 111R, WRX STi, Boxster, M3 and Evo IX.

Revolver

Andrew, if it was 180kw at the wheels I would have dropped a deposit on one already, bugger the torque steer. Hoo boy!

'Mez is correct.

Revolver

Well of course they're different markets and I know that the stringback glove set get dusted by fully sick HSV's.

My real point is that Mazda seems to have basically abandoned the 8. So, why would you buy another one come trade-in time?

And if you're not all that fussed about straight-line power, why care if the Z comes with the V8 or not? Would surely be a noseheavy beast compared to the 8 wouldn't it?

Might be more than one beer...

Gomez

Funny there was no talk of the MPS 3 at the Motor Show. They were taking details of those who were interested in the CX-7 <moi>, but there was no mention of the MPS 3.

I'm with Tim on this though. I don't feel all that concerned about a hot hatch. The Pulsar ET turbo didn't effect 300ZX sales much!!

Revolver

Oh, and Timbo, the Purvis Eureka was unique too...

<that'll stir them up>

Revolver

Now there's a tough choice!

Tim Tam

Dave, the 3 is about 100kg lighter than an 8, and the power you've quoted is pretty line ball. With the better power-down of rear wheel drive, there shouldn't be too much in it in a straight line. I'd still bet on the 8 around a track.

Gomez

I know I could have hosed Taka in my stock RX-8 at Wakefield if only I'd had Vivaldi on rotation in the six stacker....

timbo

There's unique....and then there's UNIQUE

It'll take several beers, and we'll never be any closer to what the the answer is, mainly because the question is very individual. That's what niche carmakers rely on, and the 8 is exactly that...a niche car. A 3 MPS hatch, on the other hand, has a more general aim.

As I have commented to you in another thread, I am personally sceptical about the level of demand for even a factory FI 8. Just looking on the forums, which probably represent 10% or less of owners, I would suggest substantially less then 10% of these (ie, less than 1% of all owners) look like qualified buyers of FI.

Let's do the numbers on that basis: worldwide sales have been what, c50,000 cars for the 8 (someone correct me....like 75% of all good statistics, I just made that up ) So, worldwide Mazda would sell maybe 500 cars. Double it -- 1,000. And these into all the different markets for which it would need to go through emissions testing etc again. Treble it! It's still easy to see why there's no factory version.

I reckon my analysis is borne out by the demand for aftermarket FI. Let's face it, it's just not there (sorry Rotor Master, Hymee, Ciao, GReddy....) and if people are battering at the doors for the gear...well...it's not obvious

None of which is to say, IMO, that the 8 is not a good car; far from it....I love it, and am saying to you that it's bloody hard to find a replacement that offers the particular je ne sais quoi I find with the 8

Now, what was the question again??

playa78

hey I'm sure Hyundai can easily beat RX-8 in the straight, once you spend $10000+ on mods turbo/supercharging it too.. so what's the point? :P

Revolver

Yes but should we be even having this conversation? Should there be any doubt whether the so-called flagship sportscar in the range can get dusted by a hotted up hatchback that's a close relation to Grandma's shopping trolley?

I also agree that the 8 would probably stay in front around most tracks but the 3 is not exactly a slouch when it comes to handling and will no doubt be sharper in MPS guise.

You can all say what you like about individualistic qualities and French feelings but a big feature of the 8 is that it is supposed to be a performance car (unless I'm really missing something in the marketing). Well suddenly this performance car seems to have come back to the field a little.

Revolver

That pretty much says it all about the various ways people see this car.

Tim Tam

Don't worry Dave, when we bolt on our superchargers the 3s won't get near us..........he he he

Revolver

Bugger it, soon as I buy this new house and get things organised I'll have to get on Hymee's hammer or help RotorMaster pay off his mortgage.

Least xxup will be happy.

Revolver

I think we were both just thinking the same thing at the same time - scary.

azzaboynt

It would be interesting to know if there were buyers who were thinking of getting an 8, went elsewhere when they found out 1) Not as much power as they were hoping, and 2) came from turbo rx7 etc and because of no FI option on a Factory 8 went for a WRX or something like that.