Damn it!!! I was already set on getting the RX-8 until I realized what a disappointment it was (for me) that the power is not even close to 200hp and gas mileage is like it's running V8 @ 400hp! Anyways, a thought flashed in while I was flying down to Newport beach from San Jose. Looking at the Salinas area's open grounds I thought about how great it would be to go offroading there. And then... the idea of getting Subaru WRX STi came to me.

Its not that offroading is the only reason to get the STi over the RX-8 but many more. Anyways, aside from the looks (i know RX-8 wins hands down) could you RX-8 fans and owners give me points why I should not get the STi over RX-8? Like say, engine probs, transmission probs, bad ride, etc etc...

The reason I want you to is because at the time I first wanted the RX-8, I was looking for reasons why I should not get it. And then I found them...

HELP

Looks alone are reason enough - those STis are fugly!

i can tell by your post you want the sub so there is no sense in trying to talk you out of it.

Your the guy that wants alot of power. So RX8 is obviously not your car or STi competitor. Totally different cars.

I was thinking about the STi or Evo at one point, but I've changed my mind (yet again). I think the RX-8 looks a whole lot better than either, both inside and out. In the end still have a lot in common with their cheaper econobox versions (like the dimensions of the car in and out, the interior, etc.). There are a lot of lancers trying to be evolutions, as well as imprezas trying to be sti's.

Whereas I think of the rx-8 as being well designed as a unit. You can see a logical sequence in its design. My favorite thing is that it's unique, redefining the definition of what definitive means (sorry, just had to say it :) ). The head-turning capability cannot be denied. You lose a certain amount of performance definitely, but you gain a sense of distinction as well as the satisfaction of having a well-designed vehicle.

If you want all-out performance, then you'll probably want the sti or evo. Still, I say you should just drive them all, and let the width of your grin decide :)

If you like the looks of the STi there are very few reasons to not get it, the engine is proven, the tranny is proven, and the overall performance is as well. For those saying it's no different than the Impreza interior you've obviously never seen one, there's very very little in common between a regular Impreza and an STi. It's going to be tough to find a testdrive though, goodluck with the decision.

Ike

Originally posted by Xyntax
Damn it!!! I was already set on getting the RX-8 until I realized what a disappointment it was (for me) that the power is not even close to 200hp and gas mileage is like it's running V8 @ 400hp!

Anyways, aside from the looks (i know RX-8 wins hands down) could you RX-8 fans and owners give me points why I should not get the STi over RX-8? Like say, engine probs, transmission probs, bad ride, etc etc...

The reason I want you to is because at the time I first wanted the RX-8, I was looking for reasons why I should not get it. And then I found them...

HELP

i too was on the fence about my 8. but i didn't want a performance sedan. i also didn't want to join the WRX crowd - not that there's anything wrong with them. there are definitely more wrx drivers than 8 drivers obviously. you could distinguish yourself in that crowd with the sti. the 8 appeals to me because of it's uniqueness and newness. the power was secondary. if you can get an STi GO FOR IT. (fully equipped and loaded it's the same price as an RX-8: $33K) it's a great vehicle but it doesn't have the same visceral appeal as the 8... in the end it's a sedan...

Originally posted by jimbo_gixxer
i too was on the fence about my 8. but i didn't want a performance sedan. i also didn't want to join the WRX crowd - not that there's anything wrong with them. there are definitely more wrx drivers than 8 drivers obviously. you could distinguish yourself in that crowd with the sti. the 8 appeals to me because of it's uniqueness and newness. the power was secondary. if you can get an STi GO FOR IT. (fully equipped and loaded it's the same price as an RX-8: $33K) it's a great vehicle but it doesn't have the same visceral appeal as the 8... in the end it's a sedan...

You do realize Mazda is sending and hoping to sell 30k RX-8s every year in the US, which is about how many WRXs Subaru sells per year.

well, think about it this way, ITS ROTARY POWERED! That's why I'm getting mines. Rotary powered I'm getting the car, looks-wise it has the build that I want looking in a car----sorta resembles a well defined and cut person yet in a car's sense. The engine performance, I have yet to experience, but with all these talks about how bad it is and all, I don't really mind it as much, because to me, performance is a plus but rather getting looks all over the parking lot or just anywhere you go can do the job. Performance is just usually on the tracks and in races and such. I'm just saying that the RX-8 is a lovely car, that's why I"m getting one soon, and not to mention everything else. May I add, it's rotary!

Well, I've got a unique perception towards this question since our project cars give us first hand experience with all 3 of the mentioned cars. The EVO and the STI anre both solid platforms with awsome power and grip. The best thing about the two is the amount of power you can make with bolt ons. And that they've been around long enough that parts are in abundace.
The RX8 is more of a refined driving experience that tingles the sences via it's very good road mannors. It has a 50/50 balance. This car was made for handling.

Either way, you win.

yeah it handles better than the STi and its only 0.5 seconds slower than the STi if you rev it up and dump the clutch. Plus the looks, interior and exterior. Test drive one and youll be hooked. STi is junk with a turbo. In three years theyll all be in the shop.

test drive buddy

Well my view from over the pond is that I have owned a UK spec STI for 16 months and I am trading for an RX-8 next month.

I love the STi, I have had zero problems with it, and when you are in the mood it is a great car to drive with lots of presence and can outperform 99% of others on the road.

On the downside when Im not in the mood, I find the ride too hard and bouncy, the interior poor quality, the stereo awful, and the powerband is not ideally suited for just cruising around. Also over here, Impreza's have a increasingly boy racer/idiot driver image which I dont like.

I know I will miss it at times, but I am really looking forward to the RX-8. It is a unique car, with gorgeous looks, a unique rotary engine, suicide doors, excellent handling and a much better ride than my STi which will make it more comfortable on long journeys. Also the interior is a very nice place to be, and the spec of the car over here is very high.

All in all two very good, but very different cars, and it is really down to you to decide what it is you want.

Mark

Exactly, MarkW.

I bypassed my choice of color on a new STi for the Mazda. The STi interior, while a *tiny* step up from a WRX interior, is still low rent. Oh forgive me, the cheesy 2 tone plastic treatment on the wheel is "classy." :p

In addition, the Subaru has lost its "cult" following in the US and as a result the quality of Subaru enthusiasts has dropped to the level of Altezza lights and LED's. Thats a crying freakin' shame.

I also tihnk that the new "4 door only" STi happens to be the ugliest STi that Subaru has made. It looks llike a Nissan Sentra with a wings west combat kit or some other bodykit aberration.

I drove both, and made my choice. Don't regret it at all, even when I see the 2 STi's at work.
Faster != better

On the downside when Im not in the mood, I find the ride too hard and bouncy, the interior poor quality, the stereo awful, and the powerband is not ideally suited for just cruising around. Also over here, Impreza's have a increasingly boy racer/idiot driver image which I dont like.

Like Mark W said above...

Another issue is different than what some are saying here. According to the SAME website that issued such high marks to the RX 8 (saw it from this forum) if you look down the page to the bottom Subaru claims on trouble are soaring due to Imprezza problems.

My dad told me about the stories of the high compression engines and mods and how the life of the engine is short-lived (great while it lasts) but they just CANT hold up no matter who build's em. Both Mitsu and the WRX cars really bother me as new car purchases but again that is opnly my opinion and others think they are great. I disagree with the statements that the tranny is proven and the engine is proven, etc because the warranty claims are through the roof. That is a problem - unless the data is incorrect on the site, I wouldn't touch one. For all out performance (acceleration) there is no substitute for cubic inches. That is an old adage I know but it has held true. If ALL you want is top end and acceleration potential, cubic inches is the way to go. The advantage to cars like the RX is handling. Acceleration is acceptable but muscle cars exceed it - if that is what you want. I am old enough to remember the 300ZX twin turbo and how HOT that car was until some age got on it and then oh boy getting rid of them was a challenge. Also, turbo 4 cyl. thunderbirds, mods made to 3rd gens for reliability, etc etc etc.

Rodster is spot-on with the survey article -- I remember that one, too. Also spot-on regarding choices you make WRT your objectives. From my own experience, I relate it to the last car purchase I made -- ten years ago, when I selected a Probe GT over a Camaro. I wanted a car that could perform optimally and provide a great driving experience throguhout a wide range of situations. 180K and ten years later, the PGT is still a great driver. Camaros and Stangs are fast, but that's all -- I've not been able to see much more personality there... They kinda bore me. It occurs to me that the STi would be too strictly aligned for performance than I would tolerate for more than, say, a few months -- then I'd probably get bored...

ok - another two cents...

i thought about the 80/20 rule:

do you plan on driving the STi to it's full potential most of the time? probably not. in that case, does the STi provide enough comfort and ease of use in your 80% of your driving activities? the 8 does this really well! outstanding fit and finish in the interior. the sTi has a MEDIOCRE interior. at $33K i'd be happier in a Lex IS300 or BMW. the sti dash and steering wheel look cheap. the 8 has a dual road personality - keep it below 4-5K rpms and this is a really nice cruising car. rev it up and it's an acceptable performer. the sTI wins in off the line and in acceleration and probably many other categories of performance. in the end, define what you really want in the car. For $33K, there are other choices beyond the STI for pure performance.

so now i'm scheduling a test ride on an sTi at a local dealer just to compare. i hope i don't get the run around...

Originally posted by RodsterinFL
Like Mark W said above...

Another issue is different than what some are saying here. According to the SAME website that issued such high marks to the RX 8 (saw it from this forum) if you look down the page to the bottom Subaru claims on trouble are soaring due to Imprezza problems.

My dad told me about the stories of the high compression engines and mods and how the life of the engine is short-lived (great while it lasts) but they just CANT hold up no matter who build's em. Both Mitsu and the WRX cars really bother me as new car purchases but again that is opnly my opinion and others think they are great. I disagree with the statements that the tranny is proven and the engine is proven, etc because the warranty claims are through the roof. That is a problem - unless the data is incorrect on the site, I wouldn't touch one. For all out performance (acceleration) there is no substitute for cubic inches. That is an old adage I know but it has held true. If ALL you want is top end and acceleration potential, cubic inches is the way to go. The advantage to cars like the RX is handling. Acceleration is acceptable but muscle cars exceed it - if that is what you want. I am old enough to remember the 300ZX twin turbo and how HOT that car was until some age got on it and then oh boy getting rid of them was a challenge. Also, turbo 4 cyl. thunderbirds, mods made to 3rd gens for reliability, etc etc etc.


The boxer engines are very strong and the tranny problem was with mostly the 02 WRXs, the STi has a totally different tranny and is much much stronger. You are also basing this on an article put out by an insurance company in the UK, look at consumer reports and Subaru reliability is almost on par with Honda in many cases. As for the 300Z TT comment, those cars hold their value very very well, and are hard to find, not hard to get rid of.

Mark, I believe there have been some suspension tweaks to the STi to make the ride a little less harsh here in the states, and we also get a higher displacement engine. The STi here also come with no stereo, which some people critisize, but I would much rather put my own in the car rather than pay a premium for a for a mediocre factory unit, which almost every car on the planet has. Though I agree it will still be a little more rough than an RX-8 on the daily drive.

Vivid, as far as I know you only have regular WRXs and does not have an STi as a project car.

Russell, the STi is about a 1.5 secs faster 0-60 than the RX-8 (pre-production) and about 1.5 faster in the 1/4 mile, more if you consider no one has been able to get the Mag numbers on the post production cars. The STi will also destroy a RX-8 around a real race track and on twisty less than perfect backroads. If you look at the old best motoring video that people were getting all upset about, it was a regular WRX that beat the RX-8 around the track handily, not the STi.

You also have no clue about what kind of reliability the STi will have compared the the RX-8. If you go by past history alone Subaru makes more reliable cars than Mazda does. I fully admit the WRX has had problems with theb tranny, however the STi tranny shares nothing in common with the WRX tranny. The oxer engine has a proven track record, the rotary has proven to have problems in the past. Whether or not the renesis will be different only time will tell, and speculation means nothing.

Jimbo, goodluck with the testdrive, they seem to be hard to come by. You always see these people talk about how they've driven an STi, but most of it is not true since it's very very rare that a dealer will have a demo STi since it's such limited production.


Ike

It's easy to get a "test drive" when your old man has 2 of 'em and your best friend has one as well.. ;)

That said, there is nothing wrong with the 6speed Subaru transmission. Actually, there was nothing wrong with their 5speed either; some drag racing squids were just pissed because it couldn't withstand constant clutch dump abuse. Dumbasses don't understand how to drive properly and blame the equipment!

I think the Subaru platform is awesome, but I loathe sedans... and after owning the RX8 I prefer the feel and power delivery of the rotary. However, if you are that hung up on ultimate power output then by all means get something with a turbocharger.. :)

or still get the rx-8 and turbo charge it later. rx-8+turbo = better than STi in every possible way.

Originally posted by RussellP
or still get the rx-8 and turbo charge it later. rx-8+turbo = better than STi in every possible way.


Several thousand dollars later, with no warranty and a engine that has a history of going boom when subjected to FI. Oh and no AWD to help get the power down, and then the STi can spend under 1k in mods and still be faster than you if it isn't already in stock form.

Ike

theres only so many mods left for the STi. RX-8 is a blank canvas.

Can't we just combined the STi and Rx-8 to make a hell of a car?

I agree that both cars offer different driving experiences. The Rx-8 offers some refinement, 9k redlines, and great near-neutral like handling.

The STi, I can imagine, is more like a rally car/German touring race car. More visceral acceleration, stiff ride, great handling with AWD.

Honestly, it boils down to whatever floats your boat.

Though there is a difference between the Golf R32 and STi, they are both AWD platforms with strong torque and similar weight. Try reading the article on this link:

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10561

Ask yourself what is more important. Both bad ass cars. The sti will never look as good as the 8. The 8's interior also has the sti beat. On the other hand, the sti greatly out powers the 8. If the power is more important, than go with the sti. The only thing the car really offers is power/handling. Styling, lasting appeal etc..was not thought of when this car was designed.

Originally posted by RussellP
theres only so many mods left for the STi. RX-8 is a blank canvas.


You know nothing about modding cars, nor anything about modded Subarus. Get back to me when a modded RX-8 with a renesis runs 9s and we'll talk.

how much does it cost anyways to replace a rotary motor?

i was looking at the STi, and i ended up with the Rx-8. With that much raw power the STi has i know ill get hammered every day for speeding. I like my rx-8 its sooo much fun.. and the sound of the rotor is sooo damn sexy :)

They are different cars for people looking for something... well, different in a car. :p Lets just leave it at that and be done.

Originally posted by Pulsr
how much does it cost anyways to replace a rotary motor?

i was looking at the STi, and i ended up with the Rx-8. With that much raw power the STi has i know ill get hammered every day for speeding. I like my rx-8 its sooo much fun.. and the sound of the rotor is sooo damn sexy :)

I think for an FD is was around 5 grand, but I', sure there are others that know better than I.

The looks alone dictate the 8.

Sure you can get power by buying a Subaru, though if you were looking for power why not buy a Corvette? I chose the 8 because it looks great drives great and I love the power it does have, and for the idiots that keep talking about their dumbass WRXs and Evos I'll just pull the bike out of the garage and smoke them....in the corners and in a straight line. And as an owner of the 300ZTT I can tell you they don't hold their value and are very easy to pick up cheap because they break and stay that way.

ive been thinking about this the rx-8 handling better then an STi. The rx-8 probably wont have a problem entering a turn and exiting all quick and all, but if you dont get out of the turn right wouldnt you be harmed horribly by all that missing torque? i mean with my sisters STi she just charges the turn and flys out of there...

as for me im kinda like zoooooom brakeeeeeeeeeee... accelerating zooooooom

my sister is more like zooooooooooooooooooooooooooom brakeeeeeeeeee... turbo lag ZOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM

Originally posted by IkeWRX
You know nothing about modding cars, nor anything about modded Subarus. Get back to me when a modded RX-8 with a renesis runs 9s and we'll talk.

And you know nothing about modded Rx's. When Suby. wins a lemans race with their engine get back to me and we'll talk. The FD's were easy to mod once they were available. And coveted 20b conversion *drool* would spank the puny sti in every catagory.

Originally posted by Tronics
And you know nothing about modded Rx's. When Suby. wins a lemans race with their engine get back to me and we'll talk. The FD's were easy to mod once they were available. And coveted 20b conversion *drool* would spank the puny sti in every catagory.

so... your saying that the rx-8 motor isnt good enough??? that we have to get a new motor to compete... thanks... i feel very good about my car now

Originally posted by Pulsr
so... your saying that the rx-8 motor isnt good enough??? that we have to get a new motor to compete... thanks... i feel very good about my car now

No I'm saying, there are so many possibilities for the RENESIS as was for the 13b. I don't see why the RENESIS couldn't be converted to a 3-rotor.

Originally posted by Bigcat44
Sure you can get power by buying a Subaru, though if you were looking for power why not buy a Corvette? I chose the 8 because it looks great drives great and I love the power it does have, and for the idiots that keep talking about their dumbass WRXs and Evos I'll just pull the bike out of the garage and smoke them....in the corners and in a straight line. And as an owner of the 300ZTT I can tell you they don't hold their value and are very easy to pick up cheap because they break and stay that way.

If a Vette has 4 doors and 4 seats then yes, get that.

Originally posted by Pulsr
ive been thinking about this the rx-8 handling better then an STi. The rx-8 probably wont have a problem entering a turn and exiting all quick and all, but if you dont get out of the turn right wouldnt you be harmed horribly by all that missing torque? i mean with my sisters STi she just charges the turn and flys out of there...

as for me im kinda like zoooooom brakeeeeeeeeeee... accelerating zooooooom

my sister is more like zooooooooooooooooooooooooooom brakeeeeeeeeee... turbo lag ZOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM

RX8 handles well but not as well as a STI or EVO.

Originally posted by Tronics
No I'm saying, there are so many possibilities for the RENESIS as was for the 13b. I don't see why the RENESIS couldn't be converted to a 3-rotor.

I don't think many people are going to do that much mod to their RX8. The RX8 is a great car but you can't really compare the performance with a purpose built machine like STI and Evo. Adding horsepower is not going to improve the performance of a car, it will accelerate quicker however.

Originally posted by Xyntax
Damn it!!! I was already set on getting the RX-8 until I realized what a disappointment it was (for me) that the power is not even close to 200hp and gas mileage is like it's running V8 @ 400hp! Anyways, a thought flashed in while I was flying down to Newport beach from San Jose. Looking at the Salinas area's open grounds I thought about how great it would be to go offroading there. And then... the idea of getting Subaru WRX STi came to me.

Its not that offroading is the only reason to get the STi over the RX-8 but many more. Anyways, aside from the looks (i know RX-8 wins hands down) could you RX-8 fans and owners give me points why I should not get the STi over RX-8? Like say, engine probs, transmission probs, bad ride, etc etc...

The reason I want you to is because at the time I first wanted the RX-8, I was looking for reasons why I should not get it. And then I found them...

HELP

If you don't mind the harsh ride of both Evo and STI and don't care what a car looks like then get Evo or STI.

I do have to say that Mazda built quality is better than at least Evo. STI is a bit better than the Evo as well.

BTW Evo doesn't have cruise control so if you do a lot of long trip I wouldn't get the Evo.

STi is a turbocharged rent-a-car. Its just not a cool car, i dont care how fast it is. Nobody looks at an STi and thinks "wow thats cool" they think "why does that budget rent-a-car have a spoiler and look all retarded?"

I agree it does look like a hmmm..High School car. Bottom line is I love my 8 and wouldn't trade it for any Mitsu and especially not a Subaru, they are junk. And as for racing your sister in her STi through some corners, it's how fast you can get through the corner and the 8 will take it.

You guys are pitiful, I respect and like the 8. Some people like the looks of the WRX and STi, and most other car enthusiasts are rather impressed with what the WRX, STi, and EVO can do. As far as Subarus being junk, throughout the years they have had much better reliability than Mazda. The biggest difference between the two cars is the RX-8 looks fast the STi IS fast, and that bugs the hell out of some of you doesn't it. The STi is pure performance, the RX-8 is looking more and more like it's for people that think looks and cute little rotary accents throughout their interior is neat and is the most important part of a car. I know there are people that will be autoxing their cars, and that bought the car for the things besides it's looks, but there aren't many in this thread. True car enthusiasts respect other performance cars.

Tronics, I was talking about the RX-8 and you bring up the FD and 20b for some reason. Last time I checked the lemans car had a 4 rotor engine in it and Subarus mutiple WRC champ WRX has the same damn engine as the WRX, and the US spec STi has a higher displacement version. Take a look on other car boards, the STi gets oooos and ahhhhs, the RX-8 gets comments about how slow it is and how Mazda screwed up and it's not making the HP it's supposed to.

Ike

wow
you guys are really funny

The sti and evo are great cars
everyone has different thoughts but they are both still nice cars

??

why does this guy post here?.
too funny. Yah ok, the 8 is slow (yeah right). You must have nothing better to do than post on a forum where you don't own the car, and probably never spent alot of time in one. We have seen many 1/4 times in the mid 14's. Is that slow? No
Compared to the STI maybe it is slower, but why such a hard on for that car. And if so, then I am sure there is a place for you talk about it all you want. God your good for a laugh

Originally posted by RussellP
STi is a turbocharged rent-a-car. Its just not a cool car, i dont care how fast it is. Nobody looks at an STi and thinks "wow thats cool" they think "why does that budget rent-a-car have a spoiler and look all retarded?"

Don't you drive a freaking Jetta? Ever been to europe? Nice taxi cab you've got there. I've known several girls with Jettas, and they do have nice interiors, perfect for putting your eyeliner on.

Originally posted by Broker73
??

why does this guy post here?.
too funny. Yah ok, the 8 is slow (yeah right). You must have nothing better to do than post on a forum where you don't own the car, and probably never spent alot of time in one. We have seen many 1/4 times in the mid 14's. Is that slow? No
Compared to the STI maybe it is slower, but why such a hard on for that car. And if so, then I am sure there is a place for you talk about it all you want. God your good for a laugh

Are............you..............going........to ask.................................. why................I.......post.........here...... ..in every.............thread?
You've seen one person come close to the mag times on race gas, and no I don't think it's slow. I'm just relaying what other car forums are saying about the 8. I've also spent more time in an 8 than some of the people so dilligently defending the 8.

Dont forget the STi has a few years of development behind it, including turbocharging, and Subaru have improved the performance step by step. The same will happen to the RX8 / Renesis. But what Subaru didnt manage to do was give it good looks. You mention comments about the RX8 being slow and thirsty but I see hundreds of comments about the STi looking like a rat on stilts and dogs barking at it as it drives past. And that does matter to most people.

Originally posted by IkeWRX
They are different cars for people looking for something... well, different in a car. :p Lets just leave it at that and be done.

What was so tough about leaving it at that, you guys call me a troll but I'm clearly not the troll in this thread.

I don't think some people should call the WRX and STi ugly. This guy obviously likes them and calling it ugly will make your opinion on this matter irrelevant from the get go. I'm not crazy about the big spoiler on the STi but I hate the ones on the Mazdaspeed cars too. And I'm not totally in love with all the plastic ground effects that Mazda just tapes to their cars now including the 8. It makes them look like something a 18 year old would drive. Back to the Sti vs RX-8, I don't see how you could go wrong. One is a great sports car that is very practical in every day driving and the other is a street legal rally car that would be a blast to drive if you don't mind it for every day use. Two very good cars at what they are made to do. And IkeWRX, I think people can give you a little too hard of a time here. Usually you don't blast the 8 until someone blasts the WRX or you. But some of the Z people just look to piss us off. Just my opinion.

Ike,
Quick question..where have you read that Subaru has better reliability then Mazda? I only ask because that is the biggest BS I've heard this week. It's great that you like your car, I like my car but I am not all over your board posting how ugly your car is or how your car is slightly faster than mine (off the showroom floor). Give it time my friend and you will see what the 8 is capable of. Until that time take your P.O.S Subaru and post on your own board. Besides don't you have to watch Fast and Furious 1 and 2?

who says I drive a freakin Jetta? I have a blue RX-8, got it september 22.

Originally posted by Bigcat44
Ike,
Quick question..where have you read that Subaru has better reliability then Mazda? I only ask because that is the biggest BS I've heard this week. It's great that you like your car, I like my car but I am not all over your board posting how ugly your car is or how your car is slightly faster than mine (off the showroom floor). Give it time my friend and you will see what the 8 is capable of. Until that time take your P.O.S Subaru and post on your own board. Besides don't you have to watch Fast and Furious 1 and 2?


JD Power (only slightly better), Consumer Reports (much better)... In addition to good reliability they are among the safest cars in the industry. Before someone else brings it up there is also a reliability poll from an insurance company in the UK that places Subaru low (I think I'll trust other sources). That's a constructive 10 posts you've had, your fallacy laced arguments and petty insults only make your stance on things less credible.

Originally posted by RussellP
who says I drive a freakin Jetta? I have a blue RX-8, got it september 22.

Sorry, I guess that was Broker, you two are so similar.

Originally posted by IkeWRX
JD Power (only slightly better), Consumer Reports (much better)... In addition to good reliability they are among the safest cars in the industry. Before someone else brings it up there is also a reliability poll from an insurance company in the UK that places Subaru low (I think I'll trust other sources). That's a constructive 10 posts you've had, your fallacy laced arguments and petty insults only make your stance on things less credible.

So you are saying that Consumer Reports rated the Subaru WRX more relaible then the Mazda RX8? You are sadly mistaken little guy. And my "10" posts have been very credible considering I own a Mazda RX8, as opposed to you owning a..(snicker) Subaru, don't they make a 4 wheel drive station wagon? You drive a turbo charged Grocery Getter. As for my insults towards you and my "fallacy laced arguments" funny how anything or anyone that contradicts what you have to say seems to be deemed "less credible" by you the governing body that drives a Subaru? I don't think so, again post on your own site and leave us happy RX owners alone.

And here is your comparison from Edmunds:
Mazda
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2004/mazda/rx8/index.html?tid=edmunds.n.mmindex.popular.num1.1.ma zda*

Subaru
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2004/subaru/imprezawrxsti/index.html?tid=edmunds.n.mmindex.popular.num4.1.su baru*

Editors rating shows Mazda 8.2 to Subaru 8.1 Sorry this was just a quick search on Edmunds and I can continue to gather more info it you'd like? Also this is coming from a car that is brand new and can go up over time being reliable...

"but in the race for compact ultrasport sedan supremacy, the STi comes in a shade behind the more precise (and cheaper) Evolution."

"Cons
Handling not quite as sharp as Evolution's, vague gearshifter, audio system is a pricey option."

-Edmunds

looks like bigcat has a point IKE

Originally posted by Bigcat44
So you are saying that Consumer Reports rated the Subaru WRX more relaible then the Mazda RX8? You are sadly mistaken little guy. And my "10" posts have been very credible considering I own a Mazda RX8, as opposed to you owning a..(snicker) Subaru, don't they make a 4 wheel drive station wagon? You drive a turbo charged Grocery Getter. As for my insults towards you and my "fallacy laced arguments" funny how anything or anyone that contradicts what you have to say seems to be deemed "less credible" by you the governing body that drives a Subaru? I don't think so, again post on your own site and leave us happy RX owners alone.

We were discussing Subaru and Mazda, there is no report for the RX-8 in Consumer Reports yet. And yes, Subaru makes an AWD Station Wagon/SUV that will out accelerate the RX-8 as well will my "grocery getter WRX". And this is not your site, nor is it my site but I've been here a hell of a lot longer than you have like it or not. Keep insulting me because you certainly won't win the argument.

RussellP, I don't recall anyone discussing the EVO, it's a great car that has slightly better handling that the STi. The STi is also less stiff and a better daily driver in addition to having more get up and go. I rather like not having to pay a premium for a lousy factory stereo so I can just get my own. If you want to play the stupid magazine game... C&D Lows: "No mid range grunt", "bulbous profile","the RX-8 was the slowest around the racetrack", "the same goes for the ride, which is perhaps the hardest and loudest of this group". C&D loved the car, but it's not like it's perfect and neither is the STi or the EVO.

You also keep using these stupid sources for your info, Edmunds.... give me a break. They can't even get the MSRP correct. You keep insisting the RX-8 is better, I'm saying they're different, and you give me some stupid web site where people vote on how much they like their car and can get all kinds of misinformation.

Ike

Originally posted by mikeb
looks like bigcat has a point IKE

Mike, you of all people wouldn't know a point if it poked you in the ass. Besides you PMed me to tell me I was on your ignore list because I made a comment about how many pointless posts you make. So why are you reading my posts if I'm on your ignore list?

I lied IKE

I want to read your posts so I can clean up your mistakes and watch others attack you.

Originally posted by mikeb
I lied IKE

I want to read your posts so I can clean up your mistakes and watch others attack you.

Fair enough, you actually managed a full sentence, I'm sooo proud, though it looks like your PMs aren't very useful either.

Honestly Mike, I'm just giving you a hard time, I have no problem with you. By the way I haven't seen any mistakes yet, have you?

I can picture your bedroom covered in pictures of paul walker and vin diesel

Originally posted by RussellP
I can picture your bedroom covered in pictures of paul walker and vin diesel

I'll take that as you admiting defeat and having nothing useful to contribute.

If I am in the market for the sti, I would get the EVO instead, the better competitor in every category.

Originally posted by MPester
If I am in the market for the sti, I would get the EVO instead, the better competitor in every category.

The EVO is stiffer and a more harsh ride, it also doesn't have the grunt of the STi and the STi interior is nicer IMO. The EVO will edge it out on a roadcourse with a first time driver since the EVO is a little easier to drive fast and has a little bit better suspension.

Subarus as a whole also tend to be more reliable than Mitsubishis and the EVOs are already having lots of problems with their 5MT while Subaru seems to have found a great and more reliable fit with it's 6MT. They are both great cars but it's hard to say the EVO is better in every category, because it simply isn't. EVO gets the slight edge in price, the slalom, and on the track. The STi gets the edge in acceleration, better reliability history, and better interior.

"TO EACH HIS OWN" so choose wisely

on the reliability issue.. as subaru as a WHOLE.. I've got a '94 1.8L Impreza which i drive hard as humanly possible EVERYDAY up and down the freeway. this car has been in the family since 1994, brand new and so far the only thing that has gone wrong with it (besides the crap that wears out quickly, brakes and the like) is the timing belt. Its supposed to be changed ever 60k miles, but it lasted almost 200k miles. Wierd. hmm, and my cousin has a 02 WRX, bought it brand new. almsot 150k on it already. not ONE problem, and he drives its harder then i do mine. He has a significant amount of mods on his car (320whp woopee :D) and his tranny is just fine.. no engine problems.. nothing. Dont get me wrong, i love the RX-8 yo death tho :D.


Ok oops, football caught my attention and forgot what i was going to say.. take the above for what it is, i guess. Hehe.

Originally posted by Bigcat44
And here is your comparison from Edmunds:
Mazda
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2004/mazda/rx8/index.html?tid=edmunds.n.mmindex.popular.num1.1.ma zda*

Subaru
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2004/subaru/imprezawrxsti/index.html?tid=edmunds.n.mmindex.popular.num4.1.su baru*

Editors rating shows Mazda 8.2 to Subaru 8.1 Sorry this was just a quick search on Edmunds and I can continue to gather more info it you'd like? Also this is coming from a car that is brand new and can go up over time being reliable...


That is not reliability rating right? I don't think you will get any RX8 reliably ratings since the car just came out.

Originally posted by RussellP
STi is a turbocharged rent-a-car. Its just not a cool car, i dont care how fast it is. Nobody looks at an STi and thinks "wow thats cool" they think "why does that budget rent-a-car have a spoiler and look all retarded?"

Man, why does people flame other cars just because they don't like the way it looks. Looks are subjective, to some people the STI or Evo looks better than the RX8, who knows. As a car enthusiast I love all good cars even domestic models. You guys have to learn to appreciate a good car, not just how a car looks. If how a car looks is this important to you than other aspects then that my friend, is a true shame.

There are many factors that make up a good car and looks is one of them.

Haven't we had this discussion before?? *Yawn*

RotaryStalker

True, regarding the reliablity reports not coming out soon. As for the comparison between the wrx and the evo I would go with the evo hands down as having lived in Japan for 5 years I got to see and drive the evos they had there for quite a while. I now..thanks to Ike hate the wrx adn everything Subaru makes. and one more thing about the Grocery Getter out accelerating the RX8???? Good again I am very content with the power delivery of my 8 and if I wanted to race I would just get the superbike out of the garage...shoot if I bought a car for straight line or light to light racing why would I waste it on a Subaru? I would buy American Muscle for sure. Remember Ike people will only see your ignorance when you open your mouth or in this case post some dumbass comment about a (Walker /Diesel) wannabe car.

Originally posted by IkeWRX
The EVO is stiffer and a more harsh ride, it also doesn't have the grunt of the STi and the STi interior is nicer IMO. The EVO will edge it out on a roadcourse with a first time driver since the EVO is a little easier to drive fast and has a little bit better suspension.

Subarus as a whole also tend to be more reliable than Mitsubishis and the EVOs are already having lots of problems with their 5MT while Subaru seems to have found a great and more reliable fit with it's 6MT. They are both great cars but it's hard to say the EVO is better in every category, because it simply isn't. EVO gets the slight edge in price, the slalom, and on the track. The STi gets the edge in acceleration, better reliability history, and better interior.

Ike,
Arguing with some of these guys here is truly pointless. With comments like "its fugly", their maturity and breadth of knowledge lacking to say the least. These guys are the exception on the board as the majority of posters are informative and interesting. That's why I'm on this board and I suspect its a reason you are here as well.

Of course, I have to comment on your EVO - STI comparison as an unbiased EVO owner. :p The only problems EVOs have had is the clutch. It seems that most of the prematurely worn out clutches have been with guys who have drag-raced a lot (something the WRX guys are probobly familar with since I think they had similar problems). The clutch may be a tad weak, but putting in a steel clutch line or just going with an aftermarket clutch has fixed any of those weaknesses in the stock car.

The only other thing I've noticed from other owners is that the paint is cheap. Rock chips and dings are quite common.

The Engine and the 5 speed transmission is solid and proven. In stock form, its damn near impossible to overheat the engine (unlike some STIs detonation issues, though I think that is more likely on California's crappy low-octane gas). The engine is extremely modifiable. For less than $2,000 an ECU reflash/Piggyback System and a Catback Exhaust System will add at least 50HP at the wheels. The 5 Speed has been around for a long time and other than harmless noises, its solid.

BTW..I went with my buddy to buy a WRX this weekend (he couldn't drive stick well so I had to drive it home for him and teach him how to drive it). He got a nice silver one with the short throw shifter and it was very nice. That is a very worthwhile option vs. the stock gearbox. There seems to be a lot of STIs (which look nice BTW) at he dealers, was there a recent allocation?

*wobbles around dizzily and topples over*

Screw this.. I'm just gonna keep my prelude!

Remember when there was no internet, and people didn't have to seek valiadation for their automotive purchases from complete strangers?

Originally posted by revhappy
Ike,
Arguing with some of these guys here is truly pointless. With comments like "its fugly", their maturity and breadth of knowledge lacking to say the least. These guys are the exception on the board as the majority of posters are informative and interesting. That's why I'm on this board and I suspect its a reason you are here as well.

Of course, I have to comment on your EVO - STI comparison as an unbiased EVO owner. :p The only problems EVOs have had is the clutch. It seems that most of the prematurely worn out clutches have been with guys who have drag-raced a lot (something the WRX guys are probobly familar with since I think they had similar problems). The clutch may be a tad weak, but putting in a steel clutch line or just going with an aftermarket clutch has fixed any of those weaknesses in the stock car.

The only other thing I've noticed from other owners is that the paint is cheap. Rock chips and dings are quite common.

The Engine and the 5 speed transmission is solid and proven. In stock form, its damn near impossible to overheat the engine (unlike some STIs detonation issues, though I think that is more likely on California's crappy low-octane gas). The engine is extremely modifiable. For less than $2,000 an ECU reflash/Piggyback System and a Catback Exhaust System will add at least 50HP at the wheels. The 5 Speed has been around for a long time and other than harmless noises, its solid.

BTW..I went with my buddy to buy a WRX this weekend (he couldn't drive stick well so I had to drive it home for him and teach him how to drive it). He got a nice silver one with the short throw shifter and it was very nice. That is a very worthwhile option vs. the stock gearbox. There seems to be a lot of STIs (which look nice BTW) at he dealers, was there a recent allocation?

Sorry about the mixup with the tranny and clutch, but prettymuch on any higher HP awd car if you don't drive it properly you will have problems. The WRX guys don't have nearly as many clutch problems (the stock seems rather strong) as they do with the tranny (the 6MT seems so far so good). The paint on the Subarus as well are subceptible to chips.

It seems STis do not like the 91 octane gas and 93 or 94 octane seems to take care of the knock problems people have. As I'm sure you know both cars take very well to mods but the EVO has a head start so new mods are still coming out every week for the STi. Guys are starting to break into the mid 12s with a couple simple boltons so it should start getting fun as the EVO and STi start to compete more regularly at the strip and autox/trackdays.

I'll probably be picking up the STi or EVO in a couple years once my car is worth more than I owe and it will be a hard choice. Both great cars and the fact that they both exist in the marketplace makes the car world much more exciting for car enthusiasts.

Ike

The STi is a nice ride and it was my first choice. This changed to an RX8 based on a few reasons that I had personally. I think the STi looks good but the rx8 simply looks better just my opinion. Besides that I don't plan on racing everywhere and attracting that racing crowd or ricer crowd on the roads. Been there done that, I simply wanted a nicer ride rather than a faster ride. I think the STi however is a very well built car with amazing power and handling off the showroom floor. It just wasn't for me though.

Originally posted by Smack
The STi is a nice ride and it was my first choice. This changed to an RX8 based on a few reasons that I had personally. I think the STi looks good but the rx8 simply looks better just my opinion. Besides that I don't plan on racing everywhere and attracting that racing crowd or ricer crowd on the roads. Been there done that, I simply wanted a nicer ride rather than a faster ride. I think the STi however is a very well built car with amazing power and handling off the showroom floor. It just wasn't for me though.

Well said Smack, they are both great cars and neither one is better, they are just different and which one is better depends on what a person is looking for in a car.

Ike

Whew! What a thread! I felt like I opened a can of worms here. Anyways, I have yet to test drive the STi (if they allow me). I have driven the RX-8 and I love the ride! Surprisingly, smooth for a car that corners flat to the ground. Kinda like the SRT-4 except for the amazing acceleration.

The only thing stopping me from getting the RX-8 is gas mileage. The power loss? I could probably live with it. And also, coming from a Toyota/Honda owner, I'm very cautious with Mazda's reliability. Subaru, however, has had a good track record with reliability. And the gas mileage on the STi is fair enough for what you would get in power.

I guess, until RX-8 makes sense about less power and high gas drainage, I will hold my money in the bank. I'm a practical person who likes to enjoy my car. RX-8 and STi have their points in turning me away.

I wish Toyota made a car that is as gorgeous as the RX-8 and as well-performing as the STi :) Instead, they came up with Scion; a prime insult to our generation. Yeah, they are targetting our generation (80's kids) with stupid cars coz they think we are stupid enough to buy them.

The boxer engines are very strong and the tranny problem was with mostly the 02 WRXs, the STi has a totally different tranny and is much much stronger. You are also basing this on an article put out by an insurance company in the UK, look at consumer reports and Subaru reliability is almost on par with Honda in many cases.


This is an understatement. Although I don't care for Subaru's looks, their quality is VERY HIGH. I wouldn't rate any Japanese manufacturer higher and certainly not Mazda.

LIP

You guys are insane. I've been around these boards for quite some time, my friend has an RX-8, and it's a pretty nice car all around.

What is this paranoia with driving a car that looks like it is a "high school kids car" when damn near all of you act like your 12.

Grow up a little, I've never "flamed" your car, and i respect it for what it is. But at least i KNOW what it is.

The STi is an amazing performance car, i (being a suby fan) would take it over damn near any car less than 60K.

I have a WRX that is FLAWLESS (minus some door dings :mad: ) The quality is top notch, as is the driving experience.

The argument to just buy american muscle for speed is lame, old, and inapplicable. Some people prefer a car that weighs ~3000 pounds, can take a turn nicely and can be good on the gas mileage, haul 3 other people around, have four doors, trunk space etc. SO THEY GET AN STi OR EVO, and STILL outaccelerate a lot of american muscle.

I don't flame your car, why can't you all show some respect and grow up some?

:D :D :D :D :D My babies

:D :D :D :D :D

NICE PICSS love the color! love the 8

Originally posted by Optimus
NICE PICSS love the color! love the 8

Thank You:)

Someone please air brush out that STI abomination behind the beautiful RX8!

It seriously looks as though Subaru's designer took a crap and that crap designed the WRX.

Originally posted by RussellP
It seriously looks as though Subaru's designer took a crap and that crap designed the WRX.

Yes, heaven forbid someone design a car based on function instead of superficial looks. I mean if a car "looks fast" that's all that matters, especially if others think that.

Now, I'm going to try and impress the "cool" crowd at my next high school reunion.

Ok folks:

Not that we need yet another opinion, but I can't help myself...

I owned a WRX (my second Impreza) up until I traded it for the RX8 I got in July. Why did I trade? Performance numbers aside, I like the feel of the RX8 more. The sound, style, shifting, and driving dynamics. Plus, I'm a Rotary nut from way back.

I sure as hell wouldn't slam the WRX though; Subaru remains one of my favorites. The WRX I'm sure, was quicker in a straight line than the RX8, and more practical as well, since it was a wagon. And all-wheel-drive is nice in the snow, although I think the RX8 will do a decent job with snow tires fitted. In handling, I prefer the feel of the RX8, at least given that both cars are in their stock form.

As far as reliability, the WRX had numerous CEL's, fixed under warranty, and a juddering clutch, also finally replaced under warranty. Although I would hope any new car, even first allocation, shouldn't have problems like these, I know these things happen. In the long run, I think the WRX would have been a durable, minimum trouble car. So far, I've had no problems with the RX8, I think it will hold up fine in the long run as well.

I never thought the Sub was ugly, just funky looking. Most people who have seen my RX8 like the looks, but remember, beauty is subjective. I feel the RX8 is more refined than the standard WRX, but for ultimate performance, the STI sounds downright formidable!

People have their preferences; can't y'all just quit all this fussin' and'a feudin'? There is no such thing as THE best car.

No comparison.... I've driven the sti and driven in the rx-8 not to nock you guys car, but the sti owns it... no comparison! nicer interior and way, way better handling, If you are asking this question there is something wrong... the wrx would beat the rx-8 in all areas! the only reason i could se someone not liking the sti is b/c of the way it looks, and even then i really don't know why, i think they are both decent looking cars. But trust me you will not be dissapointed in the sti! it put a big smile on my face....:D
Test drive the sti, believe me there are dealers that will let you test drive it! you will not be dissapointed.
a few reasons i think the sti is a vastly superior car:
1. Loads of torque!
2. Rally proven handling and durability
3. You don't have to rev the bajesus out of the engine to make good power.
4. AWD
5. Good aftermarket folowing
6. One of the nicest car interiors i have ever seen!
7. Rare
8. It will put a smile on your face!
9. Super car like braking
10. Must I go on.....

Originally posted by revhappy
Yes, heaven forbid someone design a car based on function instead of superficial looks.

If you want functionality, get a tractor and stick a jet engine under the hood - which is pretty much where subarau have come from.

I want something that not only has performance, but looks like a work of art when its out on the road. So it may not have rally car performance, but then neither does your ten a penny look a likes in reality. It must also be such a pain to have to cover it in mud to bere to look at it.

Now all you Sabaru trolls run back to your own forum and worry about your mods and your 1/4 mile times, where you are safe from catching site of yourselves in any mirrors.

Cheers
---Dave

Vette Dude, did you REALLY just say that the STi has a nicer interior than the RX8? Please hook me up with your dealer bro, I need the shit you're smokin' :)

My car is better!!!
No my car!!
No, my car!!
Your car sucks!!
No, your car sucks!!
You don't know shit!!
No, you don't know shit!!
Your car sucks!!
Yeah, your car sucks!!
No, your car sucks!!
......7 pages


YOU GUYS ARE CRAZY!!! :mad: :mad: :mad:

Wait until someone starts Mazda v Skyline v Subaru v Mitsubishi thread!!
Should be fun to watch!!:D :D :p :p

out of curiosity, how much does the Skyline cost? Sorry to change the subject, well get back to subaru bashing in a moment.

BTW, WRX nicer interior than RX8? Flat out factually wrong.

All of you, quit acting like 5-year-olds.

"My dad could beat up YOUR dad!"

"My dad can kick YOUR dad's butt!!"

Whatever.
Give it a rest.

A picture is worth a thousand words:

Originally posted by downshift
A picture is worth a thousand words:

How appropriate...:D

Originally posted by downshift
A picture is worth a thousand words:


haha you beat me to it!

anyway, its painfully obvious if you care about speed, racing 1/4 mile, street and track days / auto x the STi is a much mucho more capable machine than an RX8.

The RX8 has a MUCH more stylized exterior and interior + a better balanced weight dist. and slightly lower weight, lighter feel.

end of story.

skylines can cost anywhere from 30k to 100k

Originally posted by RussellP
out of curiosity, how much does the Skyline cost? Sorry to change the subject, well get back to subaru bashing in a moment.

BTW, WRX nicer interior than RX8? Flat out factually wrong.

Russell he was reffering to the STi which I'm sure you've never actually seen at this point. If you want to see a current Skyline go to your local Infiniti dealer, it's called a G35. The last version of the Skyline it really depends on the trim level you want. They have trim levels much like the Impreza does, some are less expensive economy style cars the GTR is more performance oriented.

Originally posted by druck
If you want functionality, get a tractor and stick a jet engine under the hood - which is pretty much where subarau have come from.

I want something that not only has performance, but looks like a work of art when its out on the road. So it may not have rally car performance, but then neither does your ten a penny look a likes in reality. It must also be such a pain to have to cover it in mud to bere to look at it.

Now all you Sabaru trolls run back to your own forum and worry about your mods and your 1/4 mile times, where you are safe from catching site of yourselves in any mirrors.

Cheers
---Dave

I'm not too sure I get your tractor analogy as I have never seen one as you describe race on REAL roads with less than perfect conditions.

The STI is in a MUCH different league when it comes to performance. If the RX8's performance is enough for you, so be it. For some of us, it fell real short (in driving dynamics too).

For every type of person there is a car out there for them. For me, that car is the RX-8. I used to drive an IS300 and before that a Protege. When I switched from the Protege to the IS300, I thought I was in heaven. My IS300 was the greatest car I'd ever driven. When I switched to the RX-8, I knew I was in heaven! It is the greatest car I've ever driven!

For those of you who have never driven one, you don't know what you are missing. No amount of words describe the actual feel of it. I knew as soon as I learned of the car that it would be the next one I'd own. I had never even driven a rotary car before but I knew it was for me. When my dealer drove it to my house to give it to me, my heart skipped a little. I sat in it, put my hand on the shifter and immediately felt the vibrations coming from the tranny go up my forearm. It was like an electrical charge the car was giving me to tell me to drive it. As soon as I strapped in, put the shifter in first and engaged the clutch, I immediately realized how incredible driving can feel.

Originally posted by RXGr8
For every type of person there is a car out there for them. For me, that car is the RX-8. I used to drive an IS300 and before that a Protege. When I switched from the Protege to the IS300, I thought I was in heaven. My IS300 was the greatest car I'd ever driven. When I switched to the RX-8, I knew I was in heaven! It is the greatest car I've ever driven!

For those of you who have never driven one, you don't know what you are missing. No amount of words describe the actual feel of it. I knew as soon as I learned of the car that it would be the next one I'd own. I had never even driven a rotary car before but I knew it was for me. When my dealer drove it to my house to give it to me, my heart skipped a little. I sat in it, put my hand on the shifter and immediately felt the vibrations coming from the tranny go up my forearm. It was like an electrical charge the car was giving me to tell me to drive it. As soon as I strapped in, put the shifter in first and engaged the clutch, I immediately realized how incredible driving can feel.


I can certainly respect that and I'm happy that you found the car for you. But the senseless bashing I see of other cars on this forum is is totally uncalled for and I think that's what a lot of the people in this thread have a problem with.

Ike

After all this, I can't remember if you even have a car or not, but if U want to go off-road then buy a Jeep (the only true SUV, and I don't mean the crap they sell now but a CJ. YJ or blaarghh!!!....spew...hack...hack...TJ). Don"t buy a WRX with the idea that your're going to use it 4-wheeling, and PLEASE don't buy another SUV) the REX is a great car [turbo off the line and fast as shit] but FUGLY, chicks hate it , anyway..buy a Jeep Wrangler or CJ for off-road, buy a Z. s2000, boxter, 911, GT-R, 911-GT3, F355, Murci, 956, 787B, ENZO, Zonda c12S.....oh wait......sorry.....

Ahhh...I'm much better now...thanks to the good people at smack.com....

Originally posted by 8nomo
After all this, I can't remember if you even have a car or not, but if U want to go off-road the buy a jeep (the only true SUV, and I don't mean the crap they sell now but a CJ. YJ or blaarghh!!!....spew...hack...hack...TJ). Don"t buy a WRX with the idea that your're going to use it 4-wheeling, and PLEASE don't buy another SUV) the REX is a great car (, anyway..buy a Jeep Wrangler or CJ for off-road, buy a Z. s2000, boxter, 911, GT-R, 911-GT3, F355, Murci, 956, 787B, ENZO, Zonda c12S.....oh wait......sorry.....

Ahhh...I'm much better now...thanks to smack and the good people at Pfizer.....

Who the hell is talking about offroad? Have you ever heard of or seen a rallyx event or maybe seen another SCCA rally race? Or maybe a WRC race? You don't use SUVs for that. Here's a video of a recent rallyx if you want to take a peek, not one of the better tracks but you'll get the basic idea.

http://www.treesandturtles.com/RallyCross2003/Huntsville/Event2/RX02-WRX-preview-2.wmv

Hey all. I've driven the Evolution, the RX-8, but haven't driven an STi (Subaru dealers being jerks about it). Also driven a handful of other cars in the general market, regular WRX and 350Z.

My impressions so far:

The RX-8 clearly is the best looking of the bunch. The interior is a bit immature looking, however. It suffers some from some very questionable, cheap interior touches like the plastic/rubber seat bolsters. Shifter is far too close to the driver's position...obviously this car was designed for shorter people (I'm 6'3"). First thing I'd rip out is that ugly, uncomfortable shift knob. Mazda really took the whole rotary motif way too far with this car, it borders on juvenile.

The car is very fun to drive but....as you know...the engine is just too weak for the car to be considered anything more than a competitor to the CL Type-S and other faux sports sedans.

If you're interested in things like leather, a decent stereo, and a sunroof (which is NOT available on STi's) and intend to use your car as a comfy daily driver, get the RX-8.

The 350Z...well...honestly anybody who has driven any of the other cars listed above would never choose this thing. Ugly, heavy, atrocious visibility issues, etc.

I cannot comment on the STi, but I am certain that it would be much more fun and probably more reliable than the RX-8.

The Evolution is a blast. Most fun car I've driven since my '94 RX-7. Horrible interior. Most practical car here, though. Has more backseat legroom than any of these cars, huge trunk, bullet-proof drivetrain.

I'm going to buy the Evo unless the STi people let me test drive their car. I think the Mazda guys are sweating because my local dealership has 11 of them just sitting out on the lot and nobody is buying them. It's really too bad...Mazda needs to dump the Pontiac interior and get a 3 rotor renesis in there and then maybe it will be taken more seriously by me. It's a fun car around the turns and I choose RWD over AWD any day of the week, but the engine's output is just pathetic.

To the guy w/ the rex and the 8, awesome cars, good colors too ;)

To the children that insist on bashing. Your making this forum look like it's fool of immature children with inferiority complexes. Ike is right, theres no need for bashing, liking two cars never killed anyone :(

Originally posted by revhappy
I'm not too sure I get your tractor analogy as I have never seen one as you describe race on REAL roads with less than perfect conditions.


Sabarau started off making the stadard econobox but with the one disctinction of 4 wheel drive. It became very popular with farmers over here in the UK, as something which could go in to town, but also out on to the field without having to fetch the tractor.

Someone one day had the idea of putting a more powerful engine in it and taking it rallying. However these days the 20 something K STi/WRX rally look-a-likes, bear absolutely no relation to the million dollar real world rally cars. The only common parts are things such as the door handles.

However the road cars perform well enough if you like mild under steer up to speeds that will prove fatal when it does let go. They a very popular with the boy racer fraternaty away from the lights, and all the Max Power mod'ers with their oversized tail pipes. Highly lacking in any sort of class however.

Cheers
---Dave

its just a $#!t car

Originally posted by 8nomo
After all this, I can't remember if you even have a car or not, but if U want to go off-road then buy a Jeep (the only true SUV, and I don't mean the crap they sell now but a CJ. YJ or blaarghh!!!....spew...hack...hack...TJ). Don"t buy a WRX with the idea that your're going to use it 4-wheeling, and PLEASE don't buy another SUV) the REX is a great car [turbo off the line and fast as shit] but FUGLY, chicks hate it , anyway..buy a Jeep Wrangler or CJ for off-road, buy a Z. s2000, boxter, 911, GT-R, 911-GT3, F355, Murci, 956, 787B, ENZO, Zonda c12S.....oh wait......sorry.....

Ahhh...I'm much better now...thanks to the good people at smack.com....

I don't think the question was if he can off-road with a RX-8 or STI.

Originally posted by druck
Sabarau started off making the stadard econobox but with the one disctinction of 4 wheel drive. It became very popular with farmers over here in the UK, as something which could go in to town, but also out on to the field without having to fetch the tractor.

Someone one day had the idea of putting a more powerful engine in it and taking it rallying. However these days the 20 something K STi/WRX rally look-a-likes, bear absolutely no relation to the million dollar real world rally cars. The only common parts are things such as the door handles.

However the road cars perform well enough if you like mild under steer up to speeds that will prove fatal when it does let go. They a very popular with the boy racer fraternaty away from the lights, and all the Max Power mod'ers with their oversized tail pipes. Highly lacking in any sort of class however.

Cheers
---Dave

This is sad. Don't hate appreciate.

Originally posted by Hanzo
This is sad. Don't hate appreciate.

I dont hate the cars, I just dont particular like the way they look or drive. What I really dont like is the drivers though, they seem to think their car is gods gift, and cant understand why anyone would want anything else.

What I cant understand is what they are doing here. I like the RX8 for my own reasons, and I feel no need to go to their forums to continually spout nonsense about other cars, and how they are all wrong.

Cheers
---Dave

Originally posted by druck
I dont hate the cars, I just dont particular like the way they look or drive. What I really dont like is the drivers though, they seem to think their car is gods gift, can cant understand why anyone would want anything else.

What I cant understand is what they are doing here. I like the RX8 for my own reasons, and I feel no need to go to their forums to continually spout nonsense about other cars, and how they are all wrong.

Cheers
---Dave

Seams like a lot of people on this board are the same way, they think their car(s) are the best and everyone else’s are POS.

I think a lot of people here are not try to troll, they just appreciate this car and want to learn more and talk to people about them. True car enthusiasts are free of brand boundaries.

I'm not reading through 8 pages of bickering, so I'll give my opinion.

The STI looks cool IMO, but it is built from an Econo car, which kind of kills it for me.
Same with the EVO. Too expensive for a econo car. Sure it's fast and handles, but it's still an econo car when you break it down.
I'd pick the RX-8 just because of it's styling, and it's different. I wouldn't expect a race car when you buy it, because it's not. As far as the interior, it does seem to target a younger age group, but I'm noticing that in other car companys as well. As far as people thinking this bored is full of younger people. The marketing strategy is Mid 20's -30's, making around $70k and can afford a $27k car. Although dealers like to squeeze $32k out of you.

Originally posted by druck
Sabarau started off making the stadard econobox but with the one disctinction of 4 wheel drive. It became very popular with farmers over here in the UK, as something which could go in to town, but also out on to the field without having to fetch the tractor.

Someone one day had the idea of putting a more powerful engine in it and taking it rallying. However these days the 20 something K STi/WRX rally look-a-likes, bear absolutely no relation to the million dollar real world rally cars. The only common parts are things such as the door handles.

However the road cars perform well enough if you like mild under steer up to speeds that will prove fatal when it does let go. They a very popular with the boy racer fraternaty away from the lights, and all the Max Power mod'ers with their oversized tail pipes. Highly lacking in any sort of class however.

Cheers
---Dave

Hmm...I'm not that familar with the Subaru history of its rally cars, but the EVO was a replacement for the heavier Galant they used in the WRC.

The cars have much in common, albeit with much more advanced tuning and other goodies on the WRC cars as mandated by the homologation rules. The EVO and STI are closer to their heritage than just about any other street car that was inspired by a race car.

I've always wondered if "class" includes being hyper-defensive, judgemental and close-minded? :confused:

Subaru rallied the Legacy back in the early 90's before the Impreza came about..

And a reality check for everyone:

YOUR FAVORITE CAR SUCKS.

There is highly modified 340 hp WRX up for trade on ebay. The guy wants a new or used stock RX-8 and is willing to add cash to sweetin the deal.

I guess this sheds some light on the question......Sti or RX-8.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6467&item=2438624115


Ike is this your ad ??? :D

Originally posted by druck
What I really dont like is the drivers though, they seem to think their car is gods gift, and cant understand why anyone would want anything else.

I think you just described a lot of rx-8 owners that posted some very stupid comments in this thread.. this gem comes to mind:

"its just a $#!t car" http://webhome.idirect.com/~jsmialek/Smileys/rolleyes.gif

I could never understand why car enthusiasts cannot compare and talk about the positive and negative merits of two cars without resorting to childlish bickering, name calling and swearing in general.
:confused:

Maybe it's too much to expect from some immature people, I don't know.. but a lot of people here get on the defensive VERY quick and right away start attacking. Sure some "pro subaru" posters in this threads are idiots too:
"Subaru rallied the Legacy back in the early 90's before the Impreza came about..

And a reality check for everyone:

YOUR FAVORITE CAR SUCKS"

but some non rx-8 owners were trying to have a mature discussion about pro's and con's of both cars. shrug

Originally posted by Quick_lude

Maybe it's too much to expect from some immature people, I don't know.. but a lot of people here get on the defensive VERY quick and right away start attacking. Sure some "pro subaru" posters in this threads are idiots too:
"Subaru rallied the Legacy back in the early 90's before the Impreza came about..



He is right they did Rally the Legacy first: http://www.subaru-msm.com/global/history/history/1990.html

http://gamma.nic.fi/~globe/rally/paradise/pics/legacy92.jpg

Originally posted by Psylence
Subaru rallied the Legacy back in the early 90's before the Impreza came about..

And a reality check for everyone:

YOUR FAVORITE CAR SUCKS.

not as much as yours does!!! Thats why you are here and not an 8 owner. Go play in the dirt with your car or in the snow, we've got better things to do.

that is a sweet sound system and trunk set up from the ebay owner wanting a rx8 for trade but why didn't he post any pics of the exterior of his car

I'm not an Rx8 owner? Hmm.. then what mystical portal do these Mazda keys in my pocket open up? :p

Oh yeah... I *do* have an 8.. and 2 Subarus as well.

My comment about "Everyone's Favorite Car Sucking" obviously flew right over most peoples heads here.. ;)

Originally posted by Bigcat44
not as much as yours does!!! Thats why you are here and not an 8 owner. Go play in the dirt with your car or in the snow, we've got better things to do.

I think it's hilarious the moron RX8 fanbois in this post are attacking one another now, it's like a freaking feeding frenzy. He owns an 8 smart guy. No offense to the most of the RX-8 people on the forum, but I would be ashamed if some of these guys were defending my car.


Ike

Originally posted by Bigcat44
\we've got better things to do.

... no you don't.

i don't even think you guys even took into account the driver. i mean looks and styling is anyones opinion. ever hear of beauty is in the eye of the beholder? but when it comes to performance you can't just count on the numbers... put a diferent driver in each car and all i can say it's basically who's the better driver and which is the better car for you. TO EACH HIS OWN...

Sure, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. But anybody who beholds an eye believe Liza Minelli is sexy? Do any of them believe Rosanne Bar has a nice ass?

No.

Nor does anybody believe the STi is a decent looking car.

Yeah that comment apprarently did go over my had..my bad. As for Ike and your comments, I have had more intellectual conversations with a child than you have expressed within your posts. So Ike I will be the mature one here, while I personally would not buy a Subaru, the numbers they produce are impressive. I also actually like the Evo but my choice (and it's obviously different then anyone else's) is my 8. I don't appreciate people insulting the 8 if they don't own one because of what they hear. I base my opinions on just that (my opinions) not things I read or hear. If that were the case based on the negative stuff I read on this board I would probably not have gotten my 8 and missed out on a great car. Case closed.

Originally posted by Psylence
My comment about "Everyone's Favorite Car Sucking" obviously flew right over most peoples heads here.. ;)
DO'H! :) Instert a smiley next time! :p

Originally posted by Bigcat44
Yeah that comment apprarently did go over my had..my bad. As for Ike and your comments, I have had more intellectual conversations with a child than you have expressed within your posts. So Ike I will be the mature one here, while I personally would not buy a Subaru, the numbers they produce are impressive. I also actually like the Evo but my choice (and it's obviously different then anyone else's) is my 8. I don't appreciate people insulting the 8 if they don't own one because of what they hear. I base my opinions on just that (my opinions) not things I read or hear. If that were the case based on the negative stuff I read on this board I would probably not have gotten my 8 and missed out on a great car. Case closed.


That's funny, considering I didn't insult the 8, but you managed to insult the STi and all Subarus several times. FYI, saying one car is faster than the other does not mean I'm insulting the slower car, nor does saying good things about another car besides the 8.

:D This is crazy. I wanted the readers to post something to discourage me from getting the STi over the RX-8 and clearly specified that the RX-8 does look a lot better than the STi but not enough to win me over as RX-8 does have impractical results in it (ie. low power for a gas-hog).

I am not a poseur and I do not need to attract attention from people. I would also like to add how sad it is that most people base their decisions at how to get other people's attention. What are you, pale, fat and lonely? Here are tips: Make a friend, go streaking, kill a celebrity or be one!

Anyways, I appreciate Ike's valuable feedback on the issue and that most of his points are acceptable. As for those arguing how good-looking the RX-8 is and STi looks ugly, give it up coz you're beating a dead dog as far as I'm concerned.

Here's my take:
- 8 wins the interior
- STi wins the quality reputation
- 8 wins the looks :o
- STi wins the performance
- 8 wins the standard package
- STi wins the $30K-worthiness
- STi wins the gas mileage

I have always been a rotary fan. In fact, I have done my own research on concept and theory development for the rotary. But as for getting the RX-8, the impractical result (stated above) just makes it look like a "poseur's car". Sorry RX-8 fans :(

I am not a poseur and I do not need to attract attention from people. I would also like to add how sad it is that most people base their decisions at how to get other people's attention. What are you, pale, fat and lonely? Here are tips: Make a friend, go streaking, kill a celebrity or be one!

Ummm, some people don't like to climb into and drive a car they consider ugly.. It's not always about trying to atract attention or compensate for a small pecker...

RotaryStalker

Originally posted by RotaryStalker
Ummm, some people don't like to climb into and drive a car they consider ugly.. It's not always about trying to atract attention or compensate for a small pecker...

RotaryStalker

You are right. It's funny about what you said "or compensate for a small pecker..." I always think of SUV or truck buyers that way.

Don't want to attract attention? Don't get an STi then.

Can you say.... theft magnet? ;)

Real scientific analysis there too. Good thing I'm too much of a "poseur" to care :p

You can always buy a 1978 Chevy Malibu Classic!!

hey just a thought as that was my first car. Sorry about your not wanting to own an 8 or whatever your decision may be, hope you find what you are looking for.

Originally posted by Psylence
Don't want to attract attention? Don't get an STi then.

Can you say.... theft magnet? ;)

Real scientific analysis there too. Good thing I'm too much of a "poseur" to care :p

What makes you think theft on an STi will be any higher than the RX-8?

Bigcat, I'm still waiting for you to show me where I insulted the 8 in this post.

Originally posted by Psylence
Don't want to attract attention? Don't get an STi then.

Can you say.... theft magnet? ;)

Real scientific analysis there too. Good thing I'm too much of a "poseur" to care :p

That doesn't make sense kid. That's just your opinion. If you look at real statistics, Subaru barely makes the top 10 of most stolen car. I already drive a theft magnet, a Camry Solara (only #1 or #2 every year), but so far I don't park in notorious places.

Now the RX-8? I'm not sure, but I think the gorgeous looks might make it to the top 10 of most stolen cars. Don't take my word for it, we'll see in the coming years :)

Cars that get stolen are cars that have a large demand for parts, the RX-8 nor any Subarus are cars that will fit into that category. Hondas, Toyotas, and if I remember correctly Ford pickups are some of the most stolen.

Yeah I agree with IKE on this one, The main reason for theft is the demand for the parts of those cars... Honda Accords, Toyota Camrys, not so much because of how they look and drive but more so there are so many of them sold yearly that they need parts to repair them. The other reason they get stolen is ease of theft, the old Chevy's used to be some of the simplest cars to steal. I did a term paper on Car Theft almost a decade ago and you'd be surprised to learn there are Insurance companies that buy parts from chop shops..errr Salvage yards by placing orders for parts and then others get delegated to go out and ummmm...."find the parts". I don't think the Mazda or the Subaru is that high on any theft list .

Top 25 most stolen vehicles in 2002

1 1989 Toyota Camry
2 1991 Toyota Camry
3 1990 Toyota Camry
4 2000 Honda Civic SI
5 1994 Honda Accord EX
6 1994 Chevrolet C1500 4X2
7 1995 Honda Accord EX
8 1988 Toyota CAMRY
9 1994 Honda Accord LX
10 1996 Honda Accord LX
11 1997 Ford F150 4X2
12 1996 Honda Accord EX
13 2001 Ford F150 4X2
14 1995 Honda Civic EX
15 1991 Honda Accord LX
16 1999 Honda Civic SI
17 1990 Honda Accord EX
18 1995 Honda Accord LX
19 1992 Honda Accord LX
20 1995 Acura Integra GS-R
21 1997 Honda Accord LX
22 1997 Chevrolet C1500 4X2
23 1995 Honda Civic DX
24 1992 Honda Accord EX
25 1987 Toyota Camry


2002 overall top 10

Toyota Camry
Honda Accord
Honda Civic
Oldsmobile Cutlass
Jeep Cherokee/Grand Cherokee
Chevrolet Full-SizeC/K pickup
Toyota Corolla
Ford Taurus
Chevrolet Caprice
Ford F150 pickup

Yeah no freakin shit.. we are all familiar with the top 10 most stolen cars...

Some people steal to joyride, they dont steal camrys. Also, certain cars are, more importantly, frequent targets of vandalism. From what I've heard on Subaru boards.. STi has a big target on it. But hey, guess it depends what kind of neighborhood you live in.

Kid? jackass.... :p

yeah i had to key up an STi parked my my street yesterday. No matter how deep the scratch, it wouldnt get any uglier.

Originally posted by Psylence
Yeah no freakin shit.. we are all familiar with the top 10 most stolen cars...

Some people steal to joyride, they dont steal camrys. Also, certain cars are, more importantly, frequent targets of vandalism. From what I've heard on Subaru boards.. STi has a big target on it. But hey, guess it depends what kind of neighborhood you live in.

Kid? jackass.... :p

Actually, did you mean everyone on this thread besides yourself? Because you presented a bold statement as fact that is nothing but you making something up. I've seen some reports that RX-8s have been keyed, so I suppose that means they are targets as well, do you have some real scientific analysis to back this claim up as well? You, Bigcat, and Russell are shining examples of people that should read and not post. By the way Bigcat, I'm still waiting.

"You, Bigcat, and Russell are shining examples of people that should read and not post. By the way Bigcat, I'm still waiting."

Thought we cleared this up? I agreed with you in the previous post though I don't feel you are the authority figure on what I should and shouldn't post. And what are you waiting for? Am I missing something here?

I asked you to show me where I insulted the 8 in the thread, you were complaining about others insulting the 8 when for the most part the only people insulting cars here are the RX-8 owners.

OK after scanning through this entire thread I must admit that you never out right said the 8 is a pos, though you did make a reference to the 8 not being a fast car. That I would have to say while the STi is in your opinion a fast car so is the 8 in mine. So we are done with that, fair? fair. Also I noticed someone brought up the GTRs those cars are simply amazing. I left Japan in 2000 and I think the 99s were the R33s and they were just amazing. Too bad Nissan and Inifinite couldn't make that twin turbo race spec car here. Most of the Americans I knew owned the GTS-t the single turbos rear wheel and they were good but I think Toyota used to make the Starlet a little hatchback looking car that could smoke the bigger Nissans (Skylines and Cefiros) in a light to light race, I've got some good home video of the races, a couple races with a Toyota Aristo (lexus gs series) only they were twin turbos in Japan, ahhhhh I miss the orient

Originally posted by Bigcat44
OK after scanning through this entire thread I must admit that you never out right said the 8 is a pos, though you did make a reference to the 8 not being a fast car. That I would have to say while the STi is in your opinion a fast car so is the 8 in mine. So we are done with that, fair? fair. Also I noticed someone brought up the GTRs those cars are simply amazing. I left Japan in 2000 and I think the 99s were the R33s and they were just amazing. Too bad Nissan and Inifinite couldn't make that twin turbo race spec car here. Most of the Americans I knew owned the GTS-t the single turbos rear wheel and they were good but I think Toyota used to make the Starlet a little hatchback looking car that could smoke the bigger Nissans (Skylines and Cefiros) in a light to light race, I've got some good home video of the races, a couple races with a Toyota Aristo (lexus gs series) only they were twin turbos in Japan, ahhhhh I miss the orient

Word is for the MY05 there will be a R35 GTR introduced in the US, it has been confirmed by Nissan. It's going to resemble a G35 with the Signature round tailights. Most of the really fast R33 and R34s are single turbo swaps and when tuned properly there is very little that can take one with the exception of a single Turbo Supra, some American muscle, or a smaller car with an engine swap. My love for the GTRs has a lot to do with why I love the WRX, STi, and the EVO. AWD, big horsepower, turbos, and nothing overly flashy as far as curves go. Basicly sedan style bodies with some flared fenders and tons of grip, also very very tuneable cars.

Here's a pic of the R35 concept, hopefully they make it look a little better before release but if it's performance is anything like the R34 it could be a cardboard box for a cockpit and I'd want one.

Another

I don't know if I like the look of it yet. I guess it will have to grow on me. The one thing I liked about Japan car shops is they do anything and everything to a car. The body work was real popular, they flared the fenders on everything as the latest craze when I was there was the VIP car look. I local national friend of mine that I used to ride with bought a GTR R34 right out of the Nissan Showroom with the Nismo (I'm not sure if it was a rally kit) Paint and mods. That car was so amazing but aside from street racing, not much use. On Okinawa the speed limit is 60km on most of the roads and 80km on the one small highway. For mainland Japan I could see the use. I wish I could have bought one and brought one back. There was an importer that most American service members would use and when I was getting ready to come back, I brought my car to the shipping yard after having paid the importer in the states and the shipping yard refused the car. Apparently the importers were just doing a paperwork shuffle getting the cars in illegally and the Armed Forces didn't want to associate with them. So I had 15 days left on island to sell my car. If I can go back (which I am trying to do) I will get one and ship it back immediately and just pay some outragious price to do a legal import.

Mustang guys isn't going to know what the hell it is. While with the new propesed bodystyle even if you know nothing about the car the looks alone lead on that something might but up under the hood. I'll be suprised if that frontend goes into production, we'll probably know real soon.

Ike

I think the skyline would be great in US

but those pics are ugly IMO
especially the front damn

This post has gotten far too civilized... :p

I visit a lot of automotive forums, and of course trashing each other's cars is a popular activity in most of them. I guess it's fun, but I don't see much point to it. The RX-8, STi, and Evo are all great cars; just because I can only afford one of them doesn't mean I have to hate the other two. Living in snow country, purchasing a STi is very appealing, even though I'll probably never race anyone. (All three cars will need appropriate winter tires.) And this is the main purpose of the Evo and STi, to ourperform the competition. Every other consideration is secondary. So, for everyday driving the RX-8 is probably the best choice of the three, but I wouldn't criticize anyone for choosing otherwise (well, not much).

I have been driving an RX-8 for the past three months so I know how it behaves.
However, it is going back to Mazda on the repurchase offer. Please read the loong thread in the Tech Garage section about canzoomer's conclusions for my reason.

For the past month I also have an Evo in my garage, so I know how it behaves as well.
You can argue about looks all you want, but when it comes to a personal preference, the Evo today is a better car for me than today's RX-8. Hopefully, Mazda will fix the ECU problem that canzoomer has spent weeks proving is the cause of the low power and mileage. At that time, in MY opinion, the two cars will be equivalent on everyday performance.

So for all you Evo bashers, I have driven both long enough to have an informed opinion and have voted with my wallet for the Evo. Your mileage may vary :-).
For the originator of the thread, please drive all three cars (STi, Evo and RX-8), then go home and think about what you like about each. All three are fine cars and you won't regret either purchase. It just depends what you are willing to trade for what.

All right, let the flames begin.

no matter what canzoomer proves about ECU, the numbers are the same. 0-60 in 5.9 and 1/4 mile in 14.5.

Check the competition forum for proof.

Not true. The numbers were on 100 octane race gas and a Japanese spec ECU.

I don't think it was a Japanese spec ECU but it was on race gas which showed more HP on the Dyno. Regardless those numbers fall far short of what the STi and EVO are capable of.

Ike

P.S. I was just kidding about this post being too civilized :D

Where does he say its a JSpec ECU? I dont see that. How would he get that? He believes with 100 octane he can maybe get 14.2 seconds. He got 14.6 with a major error. In time, more and more people who actually know how to drive are gonna hit the track and all get mag numbers and you'll be drivin youre slightly faster but extremely ugly turbo-charged econobox.

Well the STi numbers are falling far short of what many american muscle cars are capable of.

1-1.5 sec in the quarter mile is NOT slightly faster, in the quarter miles that's huge.

Originally posted by RussellP
Well the STi numbers are falling far short of what many american muscle cars are capable of.

Name me one car car under 50K american or otherwise (stock) that will outrun the STi in the 1/4 mile other than the 03 Cobra. If you don't know there are a few people running very high 12s stock, and a others running 13.1 and 13 flat.

Ike

I saw rxdaniel's numbers and they were in the mid-15's. JudgeIto's seemed to be based on indicated speed with race gas. No time slips posted there. The Jspec ECU was for the pre-production press cars, not the unverified, setl-timed, red-light to red-light, speedometer-measured posts RussellP is presenting as evidence.

I'll believe the meticulous canzoomer, thank you. RussellP, I believe you read the entire thread at the competition forum; how come you presented only your side of the argument without the qualifications that are rife there? Another "fair and balanced" viewpoint, no doubt.

It was rxdaniel's first time on a track and he got 15.2.

When a turbo is available for the 8 there will be no advantage in the evo. And a turbo is inevitable.

Originally posted by RussellP
It was rxdaniel's first time on a track and he got 15.2.

When a turbo is available for the 8 there will be no advantage in the evo. And a turbo is inevitable.

Once again you prove you know little about modded cars. And comparing a modded car to a stock car is just stupid. Take the same amount you put into a turbo for the 8 and put it into an EVO or an STi and you still lose by a large margin.

RussellP, do you own an RX-8 or are you just culling others' opinions on this forum and presenting them as your own? Or is it a 15 minute test drive that is the basis of your informed opinion?

I own an rx8, wanker

Originally posted by IkeWRX
This post has gotten far too civilized... :p

Ike, you spoke too soon :P


Guy, keep it civil- this thread has come very close to being closed several times now, and it's heading in the wrong direction again.

Originally posted by IkeWRX
Word is for the MY05 there will be a R35 GTR introduced in the US, it has been confirmed by Nissan. It's going to resemble a G35 with the Signature round tailights. Most of the really fast R33 and R34s are single turbo swaps and when tuned properly there is very little that can take one with the exception of a single Turbo Supra, some American muscle, or a smaller car with an engine swap. My love for the GTRs has a lot to do with why I love the WRX, STi, and the EVO. AWD, big horsepower, turbos, and nothing overly flashy as far as curves go. Basicly sedan style bodies with some flared fenders and tons of grip, also very very tuneable cars.

Here's a pic of the R35 concept, hopefully they make it look a little better before release but if it's performance is anything like the R34 it could be a cardboard box for a cockpit and I'd want one.

The new up and coming GTR has been pushed back to 2007, I am very sad about that news.

BTW some of the fastest GTRs are still twin Turbo. For example the Top Secret Car: http://www.topsecretjpn.com/aerokit/34R/Engineroom.jpg

Originally posted by IkeWRX
Name me one car car under 50K american or otherwise (stock) that will outrun the STi in the 1/4 mile other than the 03 Cobra. If you don't know there are a few people running very high 12s stock, and a others running 13.1 and 13 flat.

Ike

I have to agree with you on that.

Originally posted by RussellP
It was rxdaniel's first time on a track and he got 15.2.

When a turbo is available for the 8 there will be no advantage in the evo. And a turbo is inevitable.

Maybe no advantage in straight-line acceleration. Not on handling and breaking the Evo is still better.

Power without control is useless

Originally posted by Hanzo
The new up and coming GTR has been pushed back to 2007, I am very sad about that news.

BTW some of the fastest GTRs are still twin Turbo. For example the Top Secret Car: http://www.topsecretjpn.com/aerokit/34R/Engineroom.jpg

Very sad news indeed, and yes there still are some very very fast TTs out there.

Ike

Originally posted by IkeWRX
Very sad news indeed, and yes there still are some very very fast TTs out there.

Ike

Ops, after looking at the photo closely I think what I thought was the second turbo is actually the exhaust side of the turbine. I thought I remember Top Secret had Twin Turbo, they might have changed their set up.

All I know is a lot of the sub 10 sec Skylines out there are large single HKS/Garrett turbos. Though there are probably some TTS out there running about as fast.

Ike

Sorry I had to share this, it has nothing to do with the topic but I can't resist.

http://www.donguri.sakura.ne.jp/~power/library/s301/005.jpg

More pics here: http://www.donguri.sakura.ne.jp/~power/library/s301/index.htm

Originally posted by Hanzo
Sorry I had to share this, it has nothing to do with the topic but I can't resist.

http://www.donguri.sakura.ne.jp/~power/library/s301/005.jpg

More pics here: http://www.donguri.sakura.ne.jp/~power/library/s301/index.htm

Heh that's pretty sick. Engine swaps on the old Z's are fairly common. I've got a video of a 280Z with a LT1 swap outrunning a Gixxer 600 from a stop.

If I remember correctly the GTR = Twin Turbo (at least up to R33 body style when I left) GTS-T= Single Turbo GTS-t2.5 was either bigger engine single turbo or all wheel drive single turbo and GTs was the non-turbo. You couldn't tell the difference between the GTR and GTS-t if the emblems were changed (very common) other than performance and looking at the engine.

Originally posted by Bigcat44
If I remember correctly the GTR = Twin Turbo (at least up to R33 body style when I left) GTS-T= Single Turbo GTS-t2.5 was either bigger engine single turbo or all wheel drive single turbo and GTs was the non-turbo. You couldn't tell the difference between the GTR and GTS-t if the emblems were changed (very common) other than performance and looking at the engine.

Yes the GTR is a TT, however much like the Supra TT many people get a larger aftermarket single turbo to replace the stock turbos.

Originally posted by Bigcat44
If I remember correctly the GTR = Twin Turbo (at least up to R33 body style when I left) GTS-T= Single Turbo GTS-t2.5 was either bigger engine single turbo or all wheel drive single turbo and GTs was the non-turbo. You couldn't tell the difference between the GTR and GTS-t if the emblems were changed (very common) other than performance and looking at the engine.

GT-R only came with AWD, it has a different front grill and some other difference.

Yeah I forgot the AWD feature. Man since we've been going back and forth with this I have been quite curious of the Evo and the STi. I see a lot of the WRXs but how can you tell which one is the STi? I only ask because I live right by a Sub dealer and there are a ton of wrxs. Also the mitsu dealer here has no Evos. I really want to drive one at least the new ones to see how they compare to the J-spec models

From the outside the easiest difference between the Wrx and Sti is the much bigger hood scoop, gold brembo brake calipers, and especially the huge picnic table wing :)

Originally posted by rabinabo
From the outside the easiest difference between the Wrx and Sti is the much bigger hood scoop, gold brembo brake calipers, and especially the huge picnic table wing :)

STi badging, if it has bugeyes it's not an STi, though might not be an STi if it has the new headlights... Some people (especially before you could get an STi in the US) will add STi badging to a WRX and dress it up with JDM STi parts, both performance and appearance. Probably the best way to tell is the wheels and the Brembos. The hoodscoop is a pretty common replacement on the WRX and there are certainly more than a few regular WRXs with the STi scoop and wing and vice versa. Quite a few STi people have been swapping STi trunks for regular WRX trunks which is what I will do should I ever own one. If you can get close to the car the interior is the biggest giveaway, the blue trim and red STi dials in particular. Now that the STis are actually out many of the people that had STi badges on their cars have removed them so the badges are fairly reliable unless you live in a certain... shall we say ricier areas. But then you've got all the people that debadge everything which is also very very common :p

Ike

Originally posted by Bigcat44
Yeah I forgot the AWD feature. Man since we've been going back and forth with this I have been quite curious of the Evo and the STi. I see a lot of the WRXs but how can you tell which one is the STi? I only ask because I live right by a Sub dealer and there are a ton of wrxs. Also the mitsu dealer here has no Evos. I really want to drive one at least the new ones to see how they compare to the J-spec models

Brembos, on Evo and STI.

Hi,

for me it's not a question. The 8 for the looks and it's uniqueness.

And for the price... for us in Hungary the price of a HP 8 with lot's of stuff vs a WRX STI is about 9 : 14!!!! Similar for an EVO.

So it's as simple as this for me.

Anyway I already have an AWD GT car so I was looking for something for a daily driver.....

Tamas

daily driver? I love that!

I'd love to get an Evo just for the hell of it. It would be fun in the snow up here and a lovely addition to the garage of rotary power.

Originally posted by Xyntax
Damn it!!! I was already set on getting the RX-8 until I realized what a disappointment it was (for me) that the power is not even close to 200hp and gas mileage is like it's running V8 @ 400hp! Anyways, a thought flashed in while I was flying down to Newport beach from San Jose. Looking at the Salinas area's open grounds I thought about how great it would be to go offroading there. And then... the idea of getting Subaru WRX STi came to me.

Its not that offroading is the only reason to get the STi over the RX-8 but many more. Anyways, aside from the looks (i know RX-8 wins hands down) could you RX-8 fans and owners give me points why I should not get the STi over RX-8? Like say, engine probs, transmission probs, bad ride, etc etc...

The reason I want you to is because at the time I first wanted the RX-8, I was looking for reasons why I should not get it. And then I found them...

HELP


STI will have a much harsher ride. RX8 has handling of a sports car and harshness of a Sports sedan.

STI will kill RX8 in performance, but STI is nothing but performance. RX8 has luxury to back up its looks and performance.

I would say go for the 8. It's a better sports car in my opinion and the handling will more than make up for the power.

Then again, I do have a V-8 running @ 400hp and it gets better mileage so I suppose my power cravings are well fed...

It's a '02 Z28 in case anyone was interested.

Let's put it this way, I can buy a volkswagen bug, and spend thousands of dollars on it and beat a friggin ferrari in a straight away. But I don't think anyone is gonna really pass over the ferrari and say hey, I want that buuuuuuuug. The truth is, you can make any ugly fookin car powered up and that's exactly what the STI and Evo are. For god's sake man, look at the damn design. The Evo is just a sup'd up Lancer and the STI is just some ugly crap design from the 70's with all the fixins. Its like a woman/man with the perfect bod, but the face is totally fugly. I guess for some people all you gotta do is put a bag over them and they're ok with it. Guess you can do the same for the sti and evo, just don't look at it lol.

There has been just as much bashing of the 8s styling by car periodicals as there has been for the EVO and the STi. Looks are too subjective and should be an afterthought when comparing cars.

Whoops... almost forgot <smacks the person that revived this thread>

Originally posted by IkeWRX
There has been just as much bashing of the 8s styling by car periodicals as there has been for the EVO and the STi. Looks are too subjective and should be an afterthought when comparing cars.

I disagree.

If your mission in life is to tear past every other car in creation to try to prove something, get a car with a good engine and 4 wheel drive like the STi or EvoVIII, and to hell with the looks.

However if you want something that drives well, and gives as much pleasure from the outside, you wont be happy with a family saloon, no matter how much body kit has been glued on to it.

So the STi is faster than an RX8 in a straight line, and its faster round the corners too. I'm not loosing any sleep about it.

Cheers
---Dave

http://www.989eq.com/wrx/wrx.jpghttp://www.989eq.com/350z/350z.jpg
http://www.989eq.com/rx-8/rx-8.jpghttp://www.989eq.com/corolla/corolla.jpg
Originally posted by IkeWRX
There has been just as much bashing of the 8s styling by car periodicals as there has been for the EVO and the STi. Looks are too subjective and should be an afterthought when comparing cars.

Whoops... almost forgot <smacks the person that revived this thread>

An afterthought? Uhh yea you're right. I gotta have that wrx. I mean look at the cool intake thingy on the hood. I haven't seen on of those since the 70's vetts! Gotta have that! Oh oh and the coooool gold pimpy rims. Must have! Matches perfectly with the peukish blue! Yea, whatever dude. Look at the damn cars. First thing anyone sees is the design of the car you're driving, not the engine unless you drive hoodless lol. Anyone think the wrx design is better than the other 3 cars? That's what i thought. Totally agree with ya Dave.

Originally posted by skagen
http://www.989eq.com/wrx/wrx.jpghttp://www.989eq.com/350z/350z.jpg
http://www.989eq.com/rx-8/rx-8.jpghttp://www.989eq.com/corolla/corolla.jpg


An afterthought? Uhh yea you're right. I gotta have that wrx. I mean look at the cool intake thingy on the hood. I haven't seen on of those since the 70's vetts! Gotta have that! Oh oh and the coooool gold pimpy rims. Must have! Matches perfectly with the peukish blue! Yea, whatever dude. Look at the damn cars. First thing anyone sees is the design of the car you're driving, not the engine unless you drive hoodless lol. Anyone think the wrx design is better than the other 3 cars? That's what i thought. Totally agree with ya Dave.

That "WRX"( an STI) sits four people better and is is faster in a straightline and the twisties....of course....that doesn't matter when looks reign supreme? :confused: Now, what was I thinking when I said many on this board appear vain? :confused:

Here are some good comparison shots:

http://www.michaelclee.com/pics/spool_fri_meet_829/images/IMG_0701.jpg

http://www.michaelclee.com/pics/spool_fri_meet_829/images/IMG_0700.jpg

Here is mine:

http://www.michaelclee.com/pics/spool_meet_gallery/images/IMG_0553.jpg

http://www.michaelclee.com/pics/my_photos/IMG_0452.jpg

Originally posted by revhappy
That "WRX"( an STI) sits four people better and is is faster in a straightline and the twisties....of course....that doesn't matter when looks reign supreme? :confused: Now, what was I thinking when I said many on this board appear vain? :confused:

LOL, vain...what's the point of buying a sports car if it doesn't look good? Ok, then why don't you just go buy a fooking bus, add some nos, headers, exhausts turbos, and there you have your dream car right? Seats 60, and its fast as hell. Who gives a sh@# if it looks crappy, it goes fast! Whatevers man, I made my point, look at the damn cars. We all conceded already that the wrx, evo, and such have waaay greater hp and acceleration so to compare that is just simply dumb, but it just as dumb to compare their designs as its quite obvious. I'm done with this thread. Hey Hanzo nice pics, what meet is that?

honestly for right now i went with ther rx8 hands down for the looks. The STI is one sick puppy, when it comes speed. test drive both and that should do it for u. if u like the smooth ride. the eight is your choice.If u dont care for a bummpy ride but want speed go with the sti. iv been in one and in an evo both feel like crap compared to the eight. but good luck on the choice.

Originally posted by skagen
LOL, vain...what's the point of buying a sports car if it doesn't look good? Ok, then why don't you just go buy a fooking bus, add some nos, headers, exhausts turbos, and there you have your dream car right? Seats 60, and its fast as hell. Who gives a sh@# if it looks crappy, it goes fast! Whatevers man, I made my point, look at the damn cars. We all conceded already that the wrx, evo, and such have waaay greater hp and acceleration so to compare that is just simply dumb, but it just as dumb to compare their designs as its quite obvious. I'm done with this thread. Hey Hanzo nice pics, what meet is that?

This is one ridiculous post! Putting aside your highly credible bus argument, I think being fast is more important than the illusion of that. Call me old-fashioned, but I prefer function over form.

I didn't mean that being fast isn't important. That's why I said the wrx and evo are obviously superior in speed when compared to rx8, but if you're talking about looks, then its obvious rx8, 350Z, NSX and such are obviously more asthetically appealing. But its like you said, some prefer power over looks, some looks over power, and some a mix. I myself, prefer a mix of the two.

Originally posted by skagen
LOL, vain...what's the point of buying a sports car if it doesn't look good?


Classic!

Oh, man... yes, the irony is thick!

Let me illustrate... the Ferrari Enzo. I think it's ugly.

So why would I want it? Um, because it's a sports car that eats nearly all others for breakfast.

But if I applied the "look good" logic, I wouldn't drive it.

This thread is getting seriously pointless... get what you like, don't try to convince others to get what *you * like and be done with it. Drive happily. The end.

Exactly, so you'd want something that has a mix right? I mean if I wanted nothing, but power I'd just go buy a 1990 civic hatchback and deck it out so it smokes just about anything else on the road. Its what a lot of people do, especially high school kids just so they can say "yea man, my civic hatchback smoked a Viper." But it wouldn't be very classy would it? Oh wait, forgot class and presentation don't matter apparently according to Ike, just look like sh@# and go fast. lol.

*wonders why thread wasn't closed 10 pages ago*

Btw i like this quote from the R32 vs RX8 article.

And that's a stroke of genius straight off. The RX-8 isn't just the world's only rotary-engined car, it has no direct rivals at all. Does this make it an outcast? In a sense it does. But it also means it will be gatecrashing some of the best parties in town. Few BMW 325i drivers can have given a thought to what it would take to get them inside a Mazda showroom. They will now. Audi TT owners, too. And aspiring Nissan 350Z pilots. Even the hardcore hot hatch brigade. The RX-8 isn't mucho-macho, but how can you ignore 228bhp at 8200rpm, a 9400rpm red-line, a shape that makes even the Alfa 147 GTA's look straight-laced, and backward opening rear doors with more kerbside theatre than a row of Merc SLs in hood stow mode? You can't. And, at £22,000 for this, the more powerful of the two models, you shouldn't.

amen... beat that horse!

:D

Originally posted by racerdave
amen... beat that horse!

:D

http://www.989eq.com/horse/horse.jpg :D

Um, I really like the RX-8, .. but... 0.5 seconds is a LOT!

While compared to the lenght of a human life you may speak of "only half a second", do you realize how far a car pulls at 60 mph in that half second?

I think it's like 3 car lengths difference.

So don't say "only 0.5 seconds faster"

I raced against an M5 the other day, I thought my car was accidentally in neutral because I seemed not to move at all and the M5 was gone. The M5 is "only 0.9 seconds faster" hahahaha



-Peter



Originally posted by RussellP
yeah it handles better than the STi and its only 0.5 seconds slower than the STi if you rev it up and dump the clutch. Plus the looks, interior and exterior. Test drive one and youll be hooked. STi is junk with a turbo. In three years theyll all be in the shop.

.5 secs is probably even more than 3 car lengths at extremely highly acceleration. There's no way an 8 can out run cars that got like 300hp. What happened with the M5, your 8 stalled or missfired?

the 8 is not a car to be on the same comparison as the STI or M5. That being said, it still does have very respectable performance numbers. And with the price, I can spend an extra $1000 or so and get an extra 25+hp (canzoomers mod) to keep up with the 350Z. The 8 with that extra pop would surprise a few of these high torque straight liners !

But lets face it, the 8, the EVO, STI, G35, 350Z are all great cars in their own class

I agree Broker...

Now lets leave give this dead horse some dignity and leave him alone!

:D

Originally posted by Broker73
the 8 is not a car to be on the same comparison as the STI or M5. That being said, it still does have very respectable performance numbers. And with the price, I can spend an extra $1000 or so and get an extra 25+hp (canzoomers mod) to keep up with the 350Z. The 8 with that extra pop would surprise a few of these high torque straight liners !

But lets face it, the 8, the EVO, STI, G35, 350Z are all great cars in their own class

I was with you til you said straight liners... Do you even have the slightest clue how well a STi, EVO, M5, or even Z handle? You make it sound like they're old hotrods or something. Also, stock STis are breaking into the high 12s 1.5-2 seconds may not sound like much but that's a LOT of carlengths as was pointed out.

A lot of you may think the EVO and STi are ugly but there are a lot of people out there that really like the way they look, and there are also a lot of people out there that don't think the RX-8 looks so hot. Stop acting like your opinion is a universal one!

Originally posted by IkeWRX
I was with you til you said straight liners... Do you even have the slightest clue how well a STi, EVO, M5, or even Z handle? You make it sound like they're old hotrods or something. Also, stock STis are breaking into the high 12s 1.5-2 seconds may not sound like much but that's a LOT of carlengths as was pointed out.

A lot of you may think the EVO and STi are ugly but there are a lot of people out there that really like the way they look, and there are also a lot of people out there that don't think the RX-8 looks so hot. Stop acting like your opinion is a universal one!

Amen, from some of the posts here you would think that the RX8 looks and handles like an Enzo and is only "a few seconds slower". :p

Wow! 14 pages!

OK, see ya... ;)

?? you guys bug us about getting touchy. All I was saying was Ike and a few have focused on straight line performance etc. I never said anything in my post about the EVO or STI or 350Z not being good handlers? they all are, as well as the 8.......now I know there is no pleasing you guys, and with all these posts you guys put on here, you have to wonder????? wow
My point was just tp say that the 8 has respectable performance, and with a little extra $$, it makes it much more complete !
Hell, a buddy of mine spent crazy $$ on a Jag that will not out run an 8, but I don't bug him about it being slow. Every car has a certain unique feature that sets it apart. I think the EVO and STI are good cars, just different than the 8. The 350Z is also different, but the closest comparison is the G35. I have driven one many times and there is little difference in performance, yet is costs more $$. Still a great car, but personally I think the 8 is better bang for your buck, and even with spending an extra $1000, I can have better performance than the G35, and overall it still costs me less. But just my 2cents.

Originally posted by Broker73
?? you guys bug us about getting touchy. All I was saying was Ike and a few have focused on straight line performance etc. I never said anything in my post about the EVO or STI or 350Z not being good handlers? they all are, as well as the 8.......now I know there is no pleasing you guys, and with all these posts you guys put on here, you have to wonder????? wow
My point was just tp say that the 8 has respectable performance, and with a little extra $$, it makes it much more complete !
Hell, a buddy of mine spent crazy $$ on a Jag that will not out run an 8, but I don't bug him about it being slow. Every car has a certain unique feature that sets it apart. I think the EVO and STI are good cars, just different than the 8. The 350Z is also different, but the closest comparison is the G35. I have driven one many times and there is little difference in performance, yet is costs more $$. Still a great car, but personally I think the 8 is better bang for your buck, and even with spending an extra $1000, I can have better performance than the G35, and overall it still costs me less. But just my 2cents.


I think one would call this reeling :p The way you worded it, you certainly made it sound like you were calling the G35, Z, Sti, M5, and EVO high torque "straight liners". Read it again and I think you will see the confusion. And for the last time stop comparing modded cars to stock cars, mod for mod you will lose to those cars, especially the FI cars.


P.S. You have a very Merry Christmas as well Broker!

IKE, you just won't accept the G35 is not much different than the 8 in performance?? R&T needed a high RPM launch to get a 14.6sec 1/4 mile in the G35? Sounds close to me.
Oh yes, the whole pre-prod. comparison again........There is not much difference between the 2.
Both cars are faster than most on the road, but if you compare it to a 350Z, or EVO etc, then yes they will lose. And I was comparing the cost of the 8 (with a modded stage one kit) to that of a G35 and making reference to the fact that it still cost me less, and I feel I get a better car. Now go have some Egg nog and enjoy the Holidays. Sounds like we all need a few !

you guys keep saying if you race a sti or g35 or zyou are going to lose. lose what? my virginity?, my sanity?, my pride?, my freedom?, my religion? who cares? the only place it matters is on the track. all these cars are great cars. please no egg nog. Happy Holidays!

Originally posted by Broker73
IKE, you just won't accept the G35 is not much different than the 8 in performance?? R&T needed a high RPM launch to get a 14.6sec 1/4 mile in the G35? Sounds close to me.
Oh yes, the whole pre-prod. comparison again........There is not much difference between the 2.
Both cars are faster than most on the road, but if you compare it to a 350Z, or EVO etc, then yes they will lose. And I was comparing the cost of the 8 (with a modded stage one kit) to that of a G35 and making reference to the fact that it still cost me less, and I feel I get a better car. Now go have some Egg nog and enjoy the Holidays. Sounds like we all need a few !

We're just magazine racing at this point, but it's all we really have I suppose... Consider this, in the G35 comparison of the G35 and RX-8 (the RX-8 that did a faster time than all but one RX-8 owner that we know of)

The
G35 trapped at 100mph
RX-8 96mph (still faster than even Ito trapped and a few MPH faster than many RX-8 drivers have been able to trap)

1/4
G35 14.2
RX-8 14.5

Ok, drivers race to this point with the edge to the G35

0-100
G35 14.2
RX-8 15.8

That's a lot of carlengths

0-130
G35 26.8 seconds
RX-8 33.5 seconds

That's a lot of buslengths, and I'm getting another beer as we speak :D Eggnog is for tomorrow :p

actually

0-100 was 14.9 for the G35
0-100 was 15.9 for the 8

so yes, advantage G35, but close on 0-60 and 1/4mile

R&T had the G35 at 14.6 1/4 mile with 98.6mph

pretty close to the 8.

Isn't it fair to say that Canzoomer's mod gets the car back to "true hp" with the 8 (248+hp). I know that may sound stupid, but with the ECU being slightly re-tuned, this mod probably takes the car close if not better than the test cars R&T where using. I know, an odd comparison, but just a thought.

Originally posted by Broker73
actually

0-100 was 14.9 for the G35
0-100 was 15.9 for the 8

so yes, advantage G35, but close on 0-60 and 1/4mile


The C&D time is a little faster than average and the R&T time is slower than what a good driver should get. Another example of why I don't like R&T, C&D always seems to get consistently good times and seem to have excellent drivers that know how to get the most out of each car, However, R&T and MT will be all over the place, sometimes they can match the time of C&D and what other good drivers will get at the strip but often they're a lot slower. With a good driver I would say the RX-8 is probaly a 14.7-14.8 car with a good driver and the G35 is a 14.3-14.5 car with a good driver, though the G35 will be more forgiving of a lesser driver due to the torque. Yes it's pretty close at that point, probably not as close as you envision it, but certainly close enough to make the driver be a big factor in the race. Once you get up to higher speeds the G35 should start pulling hard and that difference will not be made up by canzoomers mod. Even considering the highest RX-8 dyno and canzoomers claim of 25 WHP the RX-8 will be making around 210-215whp.

I tried to find a dyno for a stock G35 but had no luck but if Infiniti is being straight with the HP of the engine and the drivetrain lose is where it's supposed to be the G35 should be making 235-240whp with the MT which should still be enough to make the heavier G35 faster over the modded RX-8. There are other factors like gearing and drag, which has better of each I'm not exactly sure, but judging from the numbers there's nothing wrong with the G35s gearing and drag should be about the same.

Yeah but the sheer beauty of the 8 causes sti,evo,g35,350z,s2k drivers to stare in awww while the 8 peels away effortlessly into the sunset and wins the race easily. sure all your stats suggest how slow the 8 really is but it doesn't factor real world circumstances. Get a clue IKE....;)

Why bump a 3 year old thread? And why did I just add another bump?

Why bump a 3 year old thread? And why did I just add another bump?

DARKMAZ8 has been doing that all weekend. I shall call him, Sir Bumpalot.

how else will rx8club members know where they are in life if they never know where they came from?

I bought the RX-8 by the way. Dunno why I bothered to reply to a resurrected.

theres only so many mods left for the STi. RX-8 is a blank canvas.

I had almost forgotten what a moron Russell was/is.

STi is a turbocharged rent-a-car. Its just not a cool car, i dont care how fast it is. Nobody looks at an STi and thinks "wow thats cool" they think "why does that budget rent-a-car have a spoiler and look all retarded?"


he sounds brilliant to me :hahano:

It seriously looks as though Subaru's designer took a crap and that crap designed the WRX.



:mdrmed:

I wish my crap would design a turbo 8.

In time, more and more people who actually know how to drive are gonna hit the track and all get mag numbers and you'll be drivin youre slightly faster but extremely ugly turbo-charged econobox.

I rather liked this one...

I bought the RX-8 by the way. Dunno why I bothered to reply to a resurrected.
Damn Dean, this scared me for a second. I thought you went to the dark side! :nono:

I rather liked this one...

Feelings hurt?

Feelings hurt?

Nope again. I just thought it was funny since Polak's thread is still a sticky in competition racing and no one else is running mag times.

I looked at the STi too, and just couldn't get past the Fast and Furious image that comes with it (unfortunately). I hate that movie for the image it cast upon fast, affordable cars.

The STi is not just a boosted Imprezza that someone did in their garage. If you can deal with the F&F image and harsh ride daily, then get it.

reasons to get the 8

1. Wankel engine
2. Smooth like a v8
3. better all round practicle car.
4. A true sportscar
5 luxury and comfort
6 Damn good looking(sexy)
7. 9.5k redline
8. Most fun to drive
9. More fun to be seen in
10. Easy to own
11. It's a keeper
12. etc.

reasons to get the 8

1. Wankel engine (wait, this is a perk, right... right?)
2. Smooth like a v8 (and the gas mileage of one, without the torque and the horsepower)
3. better all round practicle car. (Huh, are you blind?)
4. A true sportscar (I thought those had two door, two seats and were light...)
5 luxury and comfort (Luxury... the RX-8 isn't luxurious)
6 Damn good looking(sexy) (and subjective...)
7. 9.5k redline (your redline is 9k, redline does not = fuel cut)
8. Most fun to drive (you've never driven an STi huh?)
9. More fun to be seen in (I can hear it now, Oooo he must be important, he drives a Mazda! Or is it more fun because you can sing the zoom zoom song while driving around?)
10. Easy to own (Sorta like this list, wait, shouldn't you be checking your oil levels?)
11. It's a keeper (I said the same thing about Culpepper in my fantasy league)
12. etc. (talk about losing steam...)

If this wasn't such an old thread I'd have something to say about that list.

Damn Dean, this scared me for a second. I thought you went to the dark side! :nono:

Scared you? It scared me?! I completely forgot about this thread that when I saw it again, I was like "Who the hell posted using my screen name?" LOL

Scared you? It scared me?! I completely forgot about this thread that when I saw it again, I was like "Who the hell posted using my screen name?" LOL

I have this theory when it comes to cars and threads like this... You knew the whole time you were going to buy the RX-8, the only reason you made this thread is that fear that you're making the wrong decision, not because you were actually considering buying a different car. So you make a thread on a car forum full of owners of that particular car so you can hear the answers you want to hear and feel ok with your big purchase. I bet you never even test drove the STi, did you?

I'm not slamming you, I understand it's a big purchase, and have probably made a thread or two like this myself in years past. I've just seen this very same type of thread over and over again, and the outcome is always the same and the answers are always very predictable, unless there's some fan of the other car on the forum... ;)

^ bingo

Big can of worms you opened...

when i was deciding whether to buy the RX-8, i was also considering the EVO IX or the STi... I liked the evo 9 better so ultimately it was a decision between the evo or the 8 (pls note: the STi 2.5 version was not released here yet until a month after i bought the 8).

The evo looks too aggressive for work, and thus i chose the 8.....

The reasons why i chose the 8 over the evo:
Looks - nothing can beat the 8 for looks
Engine - This was not enough research on my part. I actually believed this little 1.3 would produce 238hp... I was also concerned about the tunin issues with the evo's new mivec engine....
Handling - perfect balance was great and i really wanted a car to corner in (that said both STI and EVO 4WD are really great)
Price - The 8 is cheaper than the Evo and sti by about $20k (USD $10k) in my country...
Potential - I believed that turbo charging an already furious engine would make it zoom zoom (Little did i know about compression)
These are some of the reasons i chose the 8. My reasoning is what i saved on the 8 by not buying the evo, I would spend it on performance modifications....

Now that i actually have an 8 here is what i have to deal with:
Lack of performance options - The 8 doesnt have the amount of performance parts that the evo or sti has options too..
Lack of torque - the 8's 1.3 engine is really lacking the the torque department....
Engine mods - becoz the engine is quite new, ppl are still unsure of what to do to strengthen the engine. Plus the lack of rotary specialists in my country contributes to this problem. High compression also sucks...
An modded STI/WRx will almost always beat an 8 - A simple boost controller will make the sti/wrx a force to be reckoned.... A simple swap of turbo will make it fly...
4wd - Launches will always be slower than the 4wd. THat said the 8 is a great handling car.


These are some of the issues i deal with. Granted most of what i am worried about has to do with performance. But ultimately i am happy that i chose the 8. It is so unique (abt 20 in my country). Although the engine is not really known about, I enjoy learning about it and work hard to find good solutions to make this a better car.... The Interior and exterior is also a blessing and i often find myself staring at my car.... There are lots more issues to consider but it's really a personal choice...

Since u are after performance, i hope what i said helps. At least now with a turbo i can keep up with my frens in their STi's, Evo's and S15's...

reasons to get the 8

1. Wankel engine
2. Smooth like a v8
3. better all round practicle car.
4. A true sportscar
5 luxury and comfort
6 Damn good looking(sexy)
7. 9.5k redline
8. Most fun to drive
9. More fun to be seen in
10. Easy to own
11. It's a keeper
12. etc.

:hahano:
Thanks for the laugh!

:hahano:
Thanks for the laugh!


I laugh everytime I see a sti or Evo. Can you say kiddie clown car. It's performance attributes don't impress me. It's only advantage is higher torque and awd. Your car is too raw in every sense. It's not practical and not a real sports car. It's a hotrod made to perform like a sportscar. Not even in the same league as an rx8. A rally car is it's true function. I suppose you do alot off road rally events in your hood hey. Only then is it performing it's true fucntion. The rx8 is better for dailey driving. Sti's/Evo are little freak cars, unfunctional in the real world of driving in traffic. I'd rather have a highpowered SUV. At least I'd be driving a grownup's car. I have more insults so Elara :kiss: please close this dumb ass thread.

KJ238, I'm not sure what country you're in, but there's some weird things about what you said.

First, a STi will beat the crap out of a RX-8 off the line no modifications necessary. Second, the RX-8 engine does make 238hp (232hp with the new standards).

In general, most of what you said seems to indicate you didn't really do much research (which you did admit to) so I'm not sure what or who this helps. I think the issue was "why are people making threads when they already know that they're going to buy the RX-8".

In general, I do think we get too many "what should I do" threads, but in the end what does it matter. If I have to sift through more threads so that someone feels they got personalized advice, then so be it. I'm sure we've all done it in one way or another.

I laugh everytime I see a sti or Evo. Can you say kiddie clown car. It's performance attributes don't impress me. It's only advantage is higher torque and awd. Your car is too raw in every sense. It's not practical and not a real sports car. It's a hotrod made to perform like a sportscar. Not even in the same league as an rx8. A rally car is it's true function. I suppose you do alot off road rally events in your hood hey. Only then is it performing it's true fucntion. The rx8 is better for dailey driving. Sti's/Evo are little freak cars, unfunctional in the real world of driving in traffic. I'd rather have a highpowered SUV. At least I'd be driving a grownup's car. I have more insults so Elara :kiss: please close this dumb ass thread.

Wow, you really need to grow up. You have some real issues. Seriously, what's your problem? You feel the need to interject yourself into every STi/Evo thread and talk about how much better the RX-8 is. Then, you don't want to hear anyone else's response, so you ask for the thread to be closed after you post. I guess you are easily intimidated by superior automobiles. The funny thing is, you don't even talk about any of the real advantages that the RX-8 may have over the STi/Evo, such as price.

It's a shame that your experience with cars is so limited that you think the RX-8 is the be all and end all. All true car enthusiasts that I know of have a great deal of respect for the STi and Evo, even though they may not drive one. It's a shame that you are so immature and such a fanboi that you cannot appreciate the STi and Evo for the great machines that they are.

It's obvious that you have never driven an STi or Evo. I much prefer my daily-driven STi over our RX-8. It is much more fun to drive, looks way more masculine and aggressive, gets much more respect on the street, better gas mileage, and more practical. I find it humorous that you think your MAZDA is some ultra-luxury supercar that everyone bows down to when they see it. Get real.

Ok You've givin your rebuttle and that's fine. I don't interject myself until the end and not untill these stupid EVo threads have gone on for 16 pages. I don't test drive the EVo/sti because I can't get past the way it looks standing still. It flunks the first and most important test for me. Your entitled to your opinion. Let's move on and stop torturing us with your STi/ Evoism. It's not a sportscar and not like the rx8. Two very different cars.

Ok You've givin your rebuttle and that's fine. I don't interject myself until the end and not untill these stupid EVo threads have gone on for 16 pages. I don't test drive the EVo/sti because I can't get past the way it looks standing still. It flunks the first and most important test for me. Your entitled to your opinion. Let's move on and stop torturing us with your STi/ Evoism. It's not a sportscar and not like the rx8. Two very different cars.

The point is, you put your 2 cents in on EVERY STi/Evo thread, and all you can ever talk about is that the RX-8 looks better. This is very subjective. I think the RX-8 is round, bulbous, non-threatening, and feminine looking, while the STi is mean, aggressive, and masculine. Try talking about something that isn't so subjective.

I don't test drive the EVo/sti because I can't get past the way it looks standing still.

Then you have no room to talk AT ALL about the Evo/STi. Here you are talking about how much more comfortable and streetable the RX-8 is, yet you have never even set foot in an STi or Evo!

Let's move on and stop torturing us with your STi/ Evoism. It's not a sportscar and not like the rx8. Two very different cars.

Please point out the statements that "torture" you with my "STi/Evoism". I try to present a balanced view of the RX-8 and STi/Evo. You are an RX-8 fanboi who bashes every car that isn't an RX-8. All your posts do is show that you know nothing about the STi/Evo and are very insecure with your RX-8. I have said in many posts, on this forum and others, that I really enjoy driving my wife's RX-8.

And I certainly agree that they are two different cars, and that neither of them are sports cars. Both have 4 doors and seat 4, can't be a sports car! However, unlike you, I can appreciate both cars for what they are, and I have respect for both cars, even though I think the STi is a much better machine. Maybe as you grow up, you will be able to respect both cars, too.

^^ Can't you see that you're asking RX-8 owners to "bows down to (the STi/Evo) when they see it", and that you yourself think that the "(STi/Evo) is the be all and end all"? Don't want to call you a fanboi, but it's clear "you cannot appreciate the (RX-8) for the great (machine) that (it is)". I'm not sure how you can think that one car is "a much better machine" and still declare that you have respect for the other (unless you're using a very specific definition of 'machine')

Most of your recent posts are rather overly critical of the RX-8, although i must admit a lot of the stuff the other 8 owners post is a little too rosy.. but still, replying "thanks for the laugh" is condescending, and thus, inflammatory, leading roaddemon to overreact.

Anyway, i do think the 8 is more luxurious compared with the STi or Evo, although that doesn't make it a 'luxury' car.. sorta like being the 'fattest fashion model in Milan'..

Haven't we been down this road before? You like the way the STi and Evo looks, then turn around and call the RX8 a feminine looking car. So you're doing the same thing he is and then you have the audacity to talk BS to him? Come on now! I think the Evo/STi are great performance cars but they offer nothing for me in the looks department. That's my opinion. The performance of those two cars don't make up for the loss of artistic design on the outside.

I'm not sure how you can think that one car is "a much better machine" and still declare that you have respect for the other (unless you're using a very specific definition of 'machine')


You don't have to think a car is the greatest of all-time to have respect for it. I have respect for the SRT-4 for what it is. It is cheap and very fast. For those who are interested in speed at a low cost, it is the way to go, and I respect that.

Yes, overall, I think the STi is a better machine than an RX-8. It way outclasses the RX-8 in terms of performance, gets better gas mileage, is more practical, looks more aggressive, etc. HOWEVER, I also like the RX-8 for what it has to offer: high-revving engine, smooth shifter, fun to drive factor, all at anywhere from $3000-$10,000 LESS than an STi (depending on equipment). It is a great car for my wife, sporty, fun to drive, moderate performance without being more than she can handle.

That is how I can respect both the STi and the RX-8.

Haven't we been down this road before? You like the way the STi and Evo looks, then turn around and call the RX8 a feminine looking car.

I was merely pointing out the fact that looks are very subjective, and instead of talking about looks being an advantage for the RX-8, try talking about the things that it really does have an advantage in. I like the way the RX-8 looks, just in a different way than I like that way that the STi and Evo look.

The rx8 is a true sportscar. The only one of it's kind because of the rotary and ability to transport 4. It's a big sportscar but still everything a sportscar is suppose to be from the biginning of sportscar history. It's pure, and in my book unflawed in it's true function. The Sti is pure and unflawed as a rally car but it's not a sportscar. It's nice to talk about them, but enough already. If I wanted a rally car I''d buy an STi. I can afford both. I just don't want one.

^^ Can't you see that you're asking RX-8 owners to "bows down to (the STi/Evo) when they see it", and that you yourself think that the "(STi/Evo) is the be all and end all"? Don't want to call you a fanboi, but it's clear "you cannot appreciate the (RX-8) for the great (machine) that (it is)". I'm not sure how you can think that one car is "a much better machine" and still declare that you have respect for the other (unless you're using a very specific definition of 'machine')

Most of your recent posts are rather overly critical of the RX-8, although i must admit a lot of the stuff the other 8 owners post is a little too rosy.. but still, replying "thanks for the laugh" is condescending, and thus, inflammatory, leading roaddemon to overreact.

Anyway, i do think the 8 is more luxurious compared with the STi or Evo, although that doesn't make it a 'luxury' car.. sorta like being the 'fattest fashion model in Milan'..

well said.....I think sti eric needs to grow up aswell.

I'm cool with that.. just wanted to make you say it again!

Hey, I'm all for feminine looks :naughty:

I was merely pointing out the fact that looks are very subjective, and instead of talking about looks being an advantage for the RX-8, try talking about the things that it really does have an advantage in. I like the way the RX-8 looks, just in a different way than I like that way that the STi and Evo look.

Look, YOu are no better then cas and roaddemon is. You are an sti fanboi and that's all there is to it. If you want to compare apples with apples, the evo looks way better and has better execution then the sti. If you really wanted the better machine then why did you pick the sti? hmmmmm my guess is you are patriotic to them.

For me, If I was gonna spend 10k more, I would be driving a used z06.