Seeing as we are getting some good dynos coming out lately I put this up for general discussion . I know we have discussed this to death but I don't think anyone has tried to put actual real world charts together to get a better comparison .

i like this thread... I can help out - here's an overlay of a few runs. It goes past 7k, so you can get a better idea of the greddy power curve.

keep in mind this was a very mild tune, so there's people with an extra 20-30 whp over mine with the same setup.

if you can get some high res shots of the other dynos, we can overlay and get an accurate comparison.

I do wish we had a good dyno chart of Slavearm's 335 mazsport dyno. The couple posted are very low resolution.

thanks mysql101 - it was your chart I used but the one you had posted did not go past 7500 .

I'll do a better chart once I get info from Pettit installs & maybe put in SFR & Mazsport as well as they come along .
The numbers may be a bit out due to different dynos but I think they will be close enough for a good comparison.

Subcribes.

This could proove to be v interesting as I'm in the market for an FI solution now.

Cheers Brettus!

It's pretty much as I've said before. Centrifugals only make top end power. They don't do crap anywhere else and engines equipped with them make less power than stock until nearly halfway up the powerband. They are not a good match for a high revving engine. They have peak power. Take a look at the Greddy or Pettit runs. Those would be faster cars on the street as they have more average power. Peak power doesn't mean much.

Nice work Brettus. Finally a thread with something new.:) Interesting to compare the Greddy to the Pettit.

here's the SpeedForce Racing Turbo to add to the chart.

http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u34/shaunv74/rx8_1_6.jpg

putting it in a new thread so that the first post has the graphs:

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?p=1857145

thats awesome work mysql - can you put the Pettit in there as well please :)

looking at that - I think I would prefer the Greddy to the SFR . Sacrifice a little up top but much better down low .

here it is - not the best but you can still pick the no.s off it

http://www.rx8club.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=85970

heh. I'll wait for real dyno pics to be posted - we might get them tomorrow :)

Pettit SC looks good for the RX-8 Auto. The boost below 4,000 RPM looks nice. I wonder what their stage 3 will do?

that is very interesting how the power curve moves to the left for the sc... and it really is peaky

We need to get rid of HP ratings and start rating cars as area under the dyno curves. The largest area under the curve equates to the best average power for everyday use.

This reminds me.... why do we not have any torque curves in here...?

HP is a combination of torque and speed. If a kit makes more hp at a given speed (RPM), it makes proportionately more torque I should think. In this way, the torque curves would look similar. hp = tqxrpm/5252 I think.

HP is a combination of torque and speed. If a kit makes more hp at a given speed (RPM), it makes proportionately more torque I should think. In this way, the torque curves would look similar. hp = tqxrpm/5252 I think.

that .. and becuase its embarrassing

Wow. You know what's kinda scary...The Greddy really looks like the right turbo for street application and seems to have the most area under the curve overall. Very interesting. I didn't think the SFR turbo was quite as peaky as it looks compared to the Greddy unit. I guess I expected more grunt down low as well...

Just for shits and giggles let's say the usable powerband is from 6500-8500 rpms. The Greddy turbo in this chart would have about an average of about 265 hp over that range. The much higher peak power centrifugal would also have an average of about 265 hp over this rpm range. In spite of the higher peak power of the centrifugal, which one do you think will be faster in a race? The turbo would have a more steady rate of acceleration whereas the supercharger would be slower after a shift and then catch up on the top end before needing to shift again. It would only finally pass the turbo in top gear after the rpms climbed high enough. I'm not even going to venture at what speed that is but usably you'll never see it.

Average power is why knowing only peak power is useless. When people ask how much power something produces, they are looking for a number that impresses them. Go buy a Supra if you want mega numbers that do nothing useful except during drag races on freeways at speeds well over 100 mph. On paper seeing 326 peak hp appears much more impressive than 275 hp, More must be better right? 51 more hp is alot. However it doesn't tell you the whole story. Average power wins races. Not peak. In this case the average power is about the same over the usable powerband at full throttle but anywhere else the Greddy will walk all over it.

well if you look in the first post that shows the pettit as well you will notice that it is not too far away from the greddy up top but way better below 4000 which is your daily drive range .
Without that glitch in the mid range there would not be much in it at all - be interesting to see if they have resolved that.
So for a daily driver I'm going to stick my neck out & say the pettit looks to offer the best all round compromise .

Just for shits and giggles let's say the usable powerband is from 6500-8500 rpms. The Greddy turbo in this chart would have about an average of about 265 hp over that range. The much higher peak power centrifugal would also have an average of about 265 hp over this rpm range. In spite of the higher peak power of the centrifugal, which one do you think will be faster in a race? The turbo would have a more steady rate of acceleration whereas the supercharger would be slower after a shift and then catch up on the top end before needing to shift again. It would only finally pass the turbo in top gear after the rpms climbed high enough. I'm not even going to venture at what speed that is but usably you'll never see it.

Average power is why knowing only peak power is useless. When people ask how much power something produces, they are looking for a number that impresses them. Go buy a Supra if you want mega numbers that do nothing useful except during drag races on freeways at speeds well over 100 mph. On paper seeing 326 peak hp appears much more impressive than 275 hp, More must be better right? 51 more hp is alot. However it doesn't tell you the whole story. Average power wins races. Not peak. In this case the average power is about the same over the usable powerband at full throttle but anywhere else the Greddy will walk all over it.

so i am confused. again..

so in a straight line.. the cf sc is at a disadvantage in first gear to ~ 5 k.. after that all things are =.

on a road course. all things are =...

beers :beer:

well if you look in the first post that shows the pettit as well you will notice that it is not too far away from the greddy up top but way better below 4000 which is your daily drive range .
Without that glitch in the mid range there would not be much in it at all - be interesting to see if they have resolved that.
So for a daily driver I'm going to stick my neck out & say the pettit looks to offer the best all round compromise .

Totally agree. Will be interesting to see how the Pettit and Greddy further develop, tune, and are compared. So far, I like what I see with Pettit... hope it gets better... and we are still waiting on the AF supercharger...

This shows why BMW's cars, which typically have been down on peak HP compared to others, can have such great real world numbers. They tune for AVERAGE power. The 330i before the new twin turbo engine was down on power to the G35, but yet sill managed to be faster.

This is also why I'm going to build a turbo 8 that makes about 250-260whp with a nice torque shelf and be done with it. I don't care if someone's car can dyno over 300 with a peaky power band, I'm going to walk all over them with average power in real world/track situations

well if you look in the first post that shows the pettit as well you will notice that it is not too far away from the greddy up top but way better below 4000 which is your daily drive range .
Without that glitch in the mid range there would not be much in it at all - be interesting to see if they have resolved that.
So for a daily driver I'm going to stick my neck out & say the pettit looks to offer the best all round compromise .

Well it wasn't in mysql's prettier graph so I wasn't going to say that. Especially since it looks like the greddy still has more through most of the power band in your post. It's tough to tell what RPM range we're dealing with down there and if it really makes up for the rest of the power band or not.

Hopefully we'll see a dyno Chart from Shinka's install today or tomorrow to add in to the mix to get a better picture.

It has been a long time to get to this graph. Now we need a couple more SC's on there along with Scott's TC's.

Something we need to add in consideration with these graphs is $$$$$$ .
Lets just talk basic - get you running kits , not all the fancy add ons you really should have as well ......

Greddy Turbo - add say $200 to replace crap parts......$3400
Pettit Twin screw sc -$5000 + $1000? (for EMU) =........$6000
DNA Centrifugal stage 2 ...............................................$70 00(check)
Speed Force kit with powermod EMS.............................$7500
Mazsport Type1............................................. ...............$8000

Not sure on DNA (site is down at moment) or price of EMU for Pettit but I know Powermod can be had for about $1100 US . Will correct if someone can help with those .

fancy stuff should be left off the pricetag, since a wideband, boost, egt, boost controller, etc. are all separate add-ons and the cost will be the same regardless of which kit.

greddy seems to sell about $3200. Hoses are about $120. $7 for an oil restrictor. EMU comes with the kit. So no extra charge. It's an extra $1400 if you want an int-x, but you'll get about $400 selling the EMU.

do know the final price tag for pettit with fuel management yet?
also, there isn't a stage 1 mazsport, it's TYPE 1. All their kits use the same turbos, just different layout configurations.

fancy stuff should be left off the pricetag, since a wideband, boost, egt, boost controller, etc. are all separate add-ons and the cost will be the same regardless of which kit.

greddy seems to sell about $3200. Hoses are about $120. $7 for an oil restrictor. EMU comes with the kit. So no extra charge. It's an extra $1400 if you want an int-x, but you'll get about $400 selling the EMU.

do know the final price tag for pettit with fuel management yet?
also, there isn't a stage 1 mazsport, it's TYPE 1. All their kits use the same turbos, just different layout configurations.


thanks for that - edited .
Gee -that Greddy looks better and better when you look at those numbers .
Also would be very interested to see the effect of the mazsport upgrade to the Greddy turbo

oh alright, didnt mean to get off topic. comment deleted =)

It would be nice to know boost levels.

Removed as this was an untuned run at 8 psi and not a fair comparison

Right now I'am not feeling too bad That I have the Greddy...

shaun, also the x axis needs to be rpm for us to be able to use it.

Yeah saw that after the fact. I asked him to see if he could put up a final tune with rpm on x. We'll have to see.

I have to step in here with my 2c.

I agree with RotaryGod and others that area under the curve is important. But I have to disagree that it's that important on the race track (road racing). I think that it's well known that racing engines are very peaky in search for max power. It all comes down to evg. rpm used on particular track. Our engine guy had 7 different cam shaft sets for different tracks - according to what he saw from data aquasition.
Remember that while racing you shift at red line and depending on gearing you have some RPM drop. So you don't really care what tq/hp is available under that RPM. You also look at you RPM drop in slowest corner which is usually not lower than rpm when shifted from 2nd to 3d but it depends on the track.
I don't have RX8 gear ratios handy but it's relatively close ratio box so it allows you to keep the revs high on a race track.
So in racing SRF will beat greddy hands down. But on the street... well on the street we need that low RPM torque. So greddy has advantage on the street.

I can back this up with some simulations on some well known US or European race track from which I have data at hand.

Thank You
Ted

the pettit sc curve would be nice to include. it should have an increase below 3k rpm.

I vote for average dyno curves to be used. max power can be freaks and un-safe tunes for max power that not everyone will achive.

the pettit sc curve would be nice to include. it should have an increase below 3k rpm.

I vote for average dyno curves to be used. max power can be freaks and un-safe tunes for max power that not everyone will achive.

I would agree with you, but as it stands now, we have some from users, and some from the kit companies... and I would assume the companies will be more bleeding edge than regular users who aren't willing to push the envelope.

Pettit will be added soon as we see a real dyno. But judging from the preliminary hand drawn graph, I don't think it will be pushing much under 3k since it's not optimized for low end - it peaks nicely in the upper ranges.

I did redid the graphs...

http://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php?p=1850060&postcount=8

It's a lot more accurate since I didn't throw it together as fast as I could. The numbers line up properly, and the SFR kit is looking a lot better.

I don't have the dyno chart of the DNA SC handy so that is missing now...

very nice comparison graph!

greddy's looking pretty good :) i miss that snail.

i wonder why sfr stopped at such low rpm.

wanna add mine to the graph once it becomes avail? :rofl: jk

dude, this thread should be damn sticky!!!

updated with pettit dyno numbers.

Nice torque from Cameron's blower, really nice.

nice thread. I've been looking for something like this. A Mazsport kit (either type 1, 2, or 3) would be nice as well, even though I know it's pretty similar to the SFR kit.

A drag between an 8 equipped with the Petitt S/C and a properly tuned GReddy turbo (i.e. 270 or so rwhp) would be interesting. I think the S/C might pull from the a little quicker, but then the turbo comes to life and would pass the S/C equipped 8. But then it's around 7500 rpm it would be interesting as the GReddy runs out of breathe and the S/C is still pulling. Pretty damn close.

^ Keep in mind this is a mild greddy tune. you can go another 25 whp higher with the kit.

And Pettit stage 3 dyno has yet to be released...

Not mine, but I thought you might be interetested to graph the original 9PSI pull that Scott over at Mazsport published. Link to DynoJet graph here: http://www.rx8club.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=75528

Hey, I 2nd that we should be putting the psi boost too. I think the Pettit numbers were with 6 to 9 psi. But, it would be nice if it was confirmed. It looks like the greddy numbers are coming from 11 psi.

A "head to head" between Pettit and Greddy would be very interesting. For the RX-8 Autos though, I think the preference would be for Pettit because of the under 4,000 rpm boost. The Auto's have a slight torque advantage over the MTs as well, so low rpm to high rpm "speed ups" would be very interesting.

Also, if the ECU is flashed on the Auto and it has an ATF cooler than it could go to 8,000 to 8,500 rpm.

i started to list psi and price tag for base usable kit (means fuel management must be included). right now I only know of pettit base (5k) + int-x (1.5k), thus the 6.5k number. Greddy base price should be around 3200, but I added a few bucks for the hoses and pill. Though in reality you could be on the road running with the kit hoses, so maybe I should take that off...

I put in the hp for DNA, but it's graph clearly says crank horse power, which if it's measured at the crank, means it's a good 15-20% higher than it should be. Their torque graph was at a different scale, so I didn't bother plotting it till we find out about the crank hp number..

i started to list psi and price tag for base usable kit (means fuel management must be included). right now I only know of pettit base (5k) + int-x (1.5k), thus the 6.5k number. Greddy base price should be around 3200, but I added a few bucks for the hoses and pill. Though in reality you could be on the road running with the kit hoses, so maybe I should take that off...

I put in the hp for DNA, but it's graph clearly says crank horse power, which if it's measured at the crank, means it's a good 15-20% higher than it should be. Their torque graph was at a different scale, so I didn't bother plotting it till we find out about the crank hp number..

I'm confused by the greddy price. From all the threads on it, it seems that if you don't want to have some major problems there are a number of things that you should upgrade. Thus this would bring its price up.

Plus, I thought there are a choices with the EMU. You could use the int-x with greddy, thus the price would go up.

It's not fair to comare the DNS SC crank HP with WHP for the others. Maybe you should calculate the WHP from their numbers and bring it down a bit, so the comparison would be better.

I have to step in here with my 2c.

I agree with RotaryGod and others that area under the curve is important. But I have to disagree that it's that important on the race track (road racing). I think that it's well known that racing engines are very peaky in search for max power. It all comes down to evg. rpm used on particular track. Our engine guy had 7 different cam shaft sets for different tracks - according to what he saw from data aquasition.
Remember that while racing you shift at red line and depending on gearing you have some RPM drop. So you don't really care what tq/hp is available under that RPM. You also look at you RPM drop in slowest corner which is usually not lower than rpm when shifted from 2nd to 3d but it depends on the track.
I don't have RX8 gear ratios handy but it's relatively close ratio box so it allows you to keep the revs high on a race track.
So in racing SRF will beat greddy hands down. But on the street... well on the street we need that low RPM torque. So greddy has advantage on the street.

I can back this up with some simulations on some well known US or European race track from which I have data at hand.

Thank You
Ted

It applies to race cars too. Keep in mind that the average power is just over a narrower rpm range for them. The physics stay the same. The rpm range you need it to occur at just changes.

I'm confused by the greddy price. From all the threads on it, it seems that if you don't want to have some major problems there are a number of things that you should upgrade. Thus this would bring its price up.

Plus, I thought there are a choices with the EMU. You could use the int-x with greddy, thus the price would go up.

It's not fair to comare the DNS SC crank HP with WHP for the others. Maybe you should calculate the WHP from their numbers and bring it down a bit, so the comparison would be better.

this is the bible for the greddy kit... and you should thank everyone involved in the writing on that thread...

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=81825

the new kits out come with the new emu.. not a choice..

you cannot combine the interceptor and the greedy emu they do the same thing..

beers :beer:

I'm confused by the greddy price. From all the threads on it, it seems that if you don't want to have some major problems there are a number of things that you should upgrade. Thus this would bring its price up.

There's really nothing to upgrade. Just do fix #2 (which is nothing more than a small nipple) and you're good to go. The hoses are poor quality and can eventually break on you - so it's recommended to replace them so you don't need to do it down the road. That's $100... and there's no oil restrictor - so add another $7 for a pill. Upgrading to the int-x is an option, but it's an OPTION, it's not required. We can't get bogged down with what options you might get for the system - the only fair way to do it is to price the kits with the minimal configuration for what's needed to get it on the road. We're not counting boost controllers, gauges, install, tuning, etc.

I put in the hp for DNA, but it's graph clearly says crank horse power, which if it's measured at the crank, means it's a good 15-20% higher than it should be. Their torque graph was at a different scale, so I didn't bother plotting it till we find out about the crank hp number..

Pretty sure it is whp not crank hp . The guy who posted it (lennart)was pretty adamant on that & it lines up with DNA claims for st 2 kit .

Also - price is US$7800 (from DNA site) and dyno was at 10 PSI (peak)

Come on Richard, join the crowd

Pretty sure it is whp not crank hp . The guy who posted it (lennart)was pretty adamant on that & it lines up with DNA claims for st 2 kit .

Also - price is US$7800 (from DNA site) and dyno was at 10 PSI (peak)

You are right Brettus, Lennart is still adament, whp = 327 at 10 psi. Nm = 279,5

We can't get bogged down with what options you might get for the system - the only fair way to do it is to price the kits with the minimal configuration for what's needed to get it on the road. We're not counting boost controllers, gauges, install, tuning, etc.


The Int-X should then be an option for the Pettit. You could probably get by on an EMU with some dyno time. You're not going to get those Greddy power levels without some dyno time either I'd imagine, so dyno cost can be thrown out.

The Int-X should then be an option for the Pettit. You could probably get by on an EMU with some dyno time. You're not going to get those Greddy power levels without some dyno time either I'd imagine, so dyno cost can be thrown out.

if pettit sells their SC in kit form ready to bolt on with the emu and base maps, i will list it at that price. I am not playing favorites, right now I've only seen it sold with int-x. You guys can't expect me to know everything, post updated info as you see it.

dyno time isn't included, because you can't sell dyno in a box along with the kit...

I would steer clear of trying to nail down prices on kits. I would list guestimates and call it a day. If I bought a Greddy kit, it would still be a 5k min project because I'd like to cover all the bases. Someone else could scrape it together under 4k. Really, if you decide to do something to your car that you aren't entirely happy with and you chose that root to save a grand or two over what was what you really wanted (while still spending a X thousand dollar), you probably lack the mental capacity to even understand what you really want. So, if the Greddy is a 3k kit or a 4k kit isn't really the focus of this thread. It should suffice to say it's in that lower area with Pettit a step up in price and some of the other kits a step above that.

What would be nice to see is if someone running an Int-X on a Greddy or other kit/management can do some datalogging pulls to show things like EGTs, IATs, boost threshold, AFR, ETC. This would give some info on how well and safe that particular installation is running when it produces X power.

I would steer clear of trying to nail down prices on kits. I would list guestimates and call it a day. If I bought a Greddy kit, it would still be a 5k min project because I'd like to cover all the bases. Someone else could scrape it together under 4k.

Which is exactly why I said the basic kit as it comes new - with only what it needs to be functional on your car. What you plan to buy extra is your business and has nothing to do with the base price of the kit. Fuel management is a requirement, without it your kit is useless. So it must be factored in. We're just getting a baseline cost, it doesn't have to be exactly right based on market or dollar fluctuations.

One of the most important factors is what you get for the dollar, which is why this is important.

Not mine, but I thought you might be interetested to graph the original 9PSI pull that Scott over at Mazsport published. Link to DynoJet graph here: http://www.rx8club.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=75528


this is probably a reasonable graph to start with for the Mazsport kit. What do you think mysql? you able to add this one in? It sounds like you can't do much more without the ignition upgrade anyway so that kinda fits with your "out of the box" criteria.

yeah, I can add it. also need to add tq number for the DNA sc... busy tonight, hot date :)

Nice job Pettit, you've developed a FI kit that in daily driving will be the best kit IMHO for the rx-8, now just make it cost less :-p :worship:

And RG depending on how tight a track is your all underestimating how close the Pettit vs. Greddy race would be.

if pettit sells their SC in kit form ready to bolt on with the emu and base maps, i will list it at that price. I am not playing favorites, right now I've only seen it sold with int-x. You guys can't expect me to know everything, post updated info as you see it.

dyno time isn't included, because you can't sell dyno in a box along with the kit...


You don't have to buy Pettit's kit with the Int-x, that's simply the only one they offer themselves, at $0 discount I might add. If I'm not mistaken, your numbers are using the EMU? I'm not sure you could attain them with the blue. But then I don't know much about the Greddy kit. The Pettit is definately more expensive, but the install ease alone is worth that to me.

Maybe price should just be left out of it all together. The kit price isn't the only factor anyway (eg Pettit's should be significantly less to install for the average buyer).

You don't have to buy Pettit's kit with the Int-x, that's simply the only one they offer themselves, at $0 discount I might add.

Okay, let's rephrase this - how are you going to make use of any FI kit without fuel management? You can't, therefor fuel management must be included. The lowest cost that you can buy a kit for, fully functional, from the company (or reseller) and able to make boost. That is the number I'm listing. Listing a price tag for a kit that you cannot use is idiotic. Which is what we'd be doing by omitting fuel management costs.


Maybe price should just be left out of it all together. The kit price isn't the only factor anyway (eg Pettit's should be significantly less to install for the average buyer).

Price ranks in the top 2 items for just about everyone. The other is performance. Now the graphs reflect both. Should we be hiding what a kit costs? Is it unfair to list what a kit costs? What's the problem?

Install costs can change depending on location, and who does the work. That's for you to decide - or to install on your own. This is a small graph, it can't store total cost of ownership, or what kind of mpg you'll get on a summer day driving through south africa on a tuesday.

Feel free to waste your time tracing dyno graphs and post your own :) I have no monopoly on it.

Okay, let's rephrase this - how are you going to make use of any FI kit without fuel management? You can't, therefor fuel management must be included. The lowest cost that you can buy a kit for, fully functional, and able to make boost is the number I'm listing. Listing a price tag for a kit that you cannot use is idiotic.

Ok, buy an EMU, tune it and go. But I'll give you the $1500 for the Int-X.


Price ranks in the top 2 items for just about everyone. The other is performance. Now the graphs reflect both. Should we be hiding what a kit costs? Is it unfair to list what a kid costs? What's the problem?

I've no problem with listing prices. The price for the Greddy seems unrealistic to achieve those power levels. There are many, hard to calculate costs involved that tell the true cost to get up and running. The Greddy kit, and any turbo kit really, has more of these costs than any supercharger kit. The prices are misleading.

It's your graph, so do what you want. I'll complain about it no further.

Ok, buy an EMU, tune it and go. But I'll give you the $1500 for the Int-X.

Is it offered with EMU?

i need to know:

- cost of sfr turbo
- what psi the pettit sc made the 261 whp

I'm going to assume the lowest cost mazsport kit, since they all contain the same turbocharger, and thus the power levels should be basically the same between them.

I have no monopoly on it.

me neither ........

You did a lot better job than i did and i'm happy someone took the idea and ran with it .....

Mysql101 damn nice thread.

Therm8 Price is very important. There is no one stop shop for info on FI. If a person is going FI and only using one thread to make thier choice then they are being foolish. This thread provides a rough comparison with rough price estimates.

If/when I go FI I will be using this thread. but I will also be reading like crazy, pricing stuff out myself, and looking up all the dynos I can.

You don't have to buy Pettit's kit with the Int-x, that's simply the only one they offer themselves, at $0 discount I might add. If I'm not mistaken, your numbers are using the EMU? I'm not sure you could attain them with the blue. But then I don't know much about the Greddy kit. The Pettit is definately more expensive, but the install ease alone is worth that to me.

Maybe price should just be left out of it all together. The kit price isn't the only factor anyway (eg Pettit's should be significantly less to install for the average buyer).


EMU = Engine Management Unit
Int-x, e-manage, Cobb, are all EMUs


It is my understanding that the Greddy kit includes either an e-manage blue or e-manage ultimate. The blue is supposedly crap while the ultimate is passable.


If you get a newer kit it ought to still be ~$3k - ~$4K. Aside from $100 - $200 for new hoses and $7 for an oil restrictor what other costs are there? I would like to know.

mysql101 The greddy kit doesn't come with motor mounts? Roughly how much did it cost you to have them made? Is there anything else missing from the Greddy kit?


As for other costs: gauges, install, and tuning on a Dyno:
1. No matter which kit you choose you will have these same costs.

2. The actual cost varies so greatly that it is beyond the scope of any one thread to cover it.

Thus, it is necessary too set aside these costs for people to figure out for themselves.

EDIT: Doh! Just saw the new thread! Swee-tuh!

the greddy kit doesn't come with any of the extras the mazsport kit comes with - it doesn't need to. it's meant for 6-7 psi, and makes about 60 whp from it. With a boost controller, we can turn up the boost to 12 psi and it still runs great. Under 300 whp, there's no need for new motor mounts - check out my dyno video, smooth as silk, no engine movement or anything. The fuel injectors are also not maxed out, so not needed.

Mysql101 damn nice thread.

Therm8 Price is very important. There is no one stop shop for info on FI. If a person is going FI and only using one thread to make thier choice then they are being foolish. This thread provides a rough comparison with rough price estimates.

If/when I go FI I will be using this thread. but I will also be reading like crazy, pricing stuff out myself, and looking up all the dynos I can.




EMU = Engine Management Unit
Int-x, e-manage, Cobb, are all EMUs



Price is very important. And it should be represented accurately.

EMU = E-manage ultimate in Rx8club slang.

Oh I thought people used it when talking about other units too. My mistake.

I agree price is important. But aside from the basic kit, it's impossible to figure out what things cost. Because there will be such a wide variation from person to person, location to location.

And no matter which kit you get the cost will be roughly equal.

If you want to include the cost for everything. Then find out the cost for install for every kit in every performance shop in the world. Now add all the possible gauge options and their install costs. No you can toss that in a spread sheet, up load it then we can all use it.

Now if your argument is just the install time is different, then can someone post rough estimate of install time /cost for each kit? That would be useful.

mysql101: Sorry I thought therm8 meant that it didn't come with mounts for the turbo.

install time and cost will vary based on shop, that's why I am not going to bother trying to list it. also you can always do the install yourself, so the cost could be zero. the cost of a kit isn't going to vary from $0 to N, there is a minimum price the company will sell the kit for. That's the only number we can realistic list.

i need to know:

- cost of sfr turbo
- what psi the pettit sc made the 261 whp

I'm going to assume the lowest cost mazsport kit, since they all contain the same turbocharger, and thus the power levels should be basically the same between them.

The SFR basic kit with no EMS or injectors is $5500
Ready-to-Run is $7500 (With pre-tuned EMS, injectors, etc)

The cheapest Mazsport kit is $8000 (Type-1) with Int-X and injectors, etc. You could get the SFR basic kit and then an Int-X for $7000 all said and done.

the lowest cost mazsport kit comes with bov, 4 new fuel injectors, motor mounts, new fuel pump, and battery relocation kit. so unless the sfr comes with those items, the mazsport is actually the better deal for the money.

I would stick with the Engine Management the company most associates with it's product. That's Int-X for Pettit/Masport, V-con for PTP, EMU for Greddy, and whatever SFR is using for thier kit. If you really wanted to mix and match to get the lowest price possible, we'd all be running off megasquirts we built for $150. These are just going to be token points of comparison anyway.