bhammer

All, I have a nosie in my transmission during downshift. It is only present when the trans gets hot from being in stop and go traffic or higher RPM running. It starts in 2nd and then will also show up in first. To reproduce it, you downshift but not let off of the clutch. Here are a couple videos of the noise.

Mazda tech help and dealer says it's normal but none of the two other I have driven make the noise. I called the 800 Mazda line for help and they are researching.....

Your thoughts and comments please.

ASH8

Hi sorry for the late response..

Certainly not 'Normal...'

Will you get this noise in other gears 3,4,5 or 6 at the same or similar RPM/Speed?..
with Clutch Pedal foot to the floor?

I am thinking your Clutch Throw Out Bearing is defective.
Possibly also damaged Pressure Plate because of.
Either way it is a gearbox out to fix.

Does your S2 have any Mazda Warranty left?
Are you the Original Owner?

I suggest you try another Dealer, or if no warranty take it to a Good repair shop or specialist and ask to check...

xexok

Yea my car has never made noise like that, I only get the noise when it let my foot off the gas in first gear but I think thats normal for this transmission. Your noise is just horrible and I cant believe they would tell you that is normal.

bhammer

Hi Ash, I have not gotten it in anything other than 1st & 2nd. But, to be honest, I haven't really tried to either. I'll have to try that on Monday when I'll be back in traffic.


I am the original owner. When I bought the car, the dealer essentially gave me the Mazda extended up to 75k miles so I'd buy the car. It had 4800 on it when I bought it because it was used here and there as a loaner.

I took the videos becasue I don't think the dealer relayed the proper info to the tech help desk. I am working with the Mazda Customer Center now trying to get resolution. In the end, I am switching dealers. There is one about 20 miles from home that, according to the service meanager, has "trained" RX-8 technicians.

ASH8

Good you still have a Warranty...

I would be asking to take a tech for a road test with you so YOU can show him what is happening.

bhammer

Yes, did that after he drove it and couldn't find the problem. He didn't have the "time" to get it real hot so I was showing him that it happens at higher RPMs with a "warm" transmission.

It was then he told to me that... well, Mazda does not recommend having the transmission at that high of an RPM in second gear. My comment was, well, in 2nd, I can hit 55-60 before the beep and at 50, that should be well within the margin. Isn't the beep more of a limit on the transmission than the engine.... I told him that we can continue driving and let's act like we are in stop and go traffic. He did for about 5 minutes and then headed back to the dealer and said he would contact tech help.

I think the main issue is that the dumb *** tech told the hoitline that it only happens at extreme RPMs. This is true when the transmission is not "hot" and only warm. If I get it out on the highway and just drive straight out at 4k rpm, no noise.

I'll copy the email I sent to Mazda when I get home this evening.

bhammer

Here is the email sent to Mazda Customer Service:

ASH8

The Beeper is for Engine protection, telling you to change or slow engine RPM.

Personally, I am not one to engine brake using transmission, unless really necessary or emergency...or for changing down or back at high RPM.
If you drive it like your on a track then I wont guarantee any trans to last, I don't care what brand of car you own....
Having said that I have changed up on many occasions in 2-3 rd at Beep RPM, apart from 1st there is no other gear you can do this with here, otherwise I would be 'speeding'.
Particularly where I live the number of fixed and mobile Speed Camera's is just ridiculous, I would not have a license if I drove mine as I would prefer.
I came within 1 point of losing my Drivers License in the first year of ownership of my RX-8, I get a clean license next week, it took 3 years no camera/driving offenses and $2800's in fines to get it back.

Anyway, lets us know what the outcome is.

ASH8

BTW..Just read the part about Coolant smell....the dealer should pressure test your system to see where the leak is coming from...if external...you don't have a smell inside your cabin do you?...in other-words a leak around back of center dash stack or heater core.

IF, and it is a possibility you may have internal engine coolant leak, which means a new rotary engine/rebuild...do you have any starting issues, or white smoke out of exhaust when engine is hot?....strong smell of coolant can happen from the exhaust. (don't confuse white smoke with condensation smoke during cold engine winter start)

bhammer

Thanks Ash for your comments. I have always used downshifting and was taught that way when I learned to drive. Doesn't mean that I was taught right though.... My normal downshifting routine is let off the gas, down to 50 and then into 3rd, then into 2nd at about 40/45 or so and leave it there until down to about 15 or so. I can't say that I have ever used 1st as a downshift, only to get moving from a roll after being in 2nd.

I'd love to "track" the car but never have. I'd say that the majority of time, I drive like I had Corolla and the other times, I don't think it is too much for the car. Most probably wouldn't admit to it, so this doesn't have much weight, I don't think I abuse the car. Being 38, I tend to be a little more conservative with my driving.

Never gotten the beep in 4th or higher. Would love to but the risk of the ticket or jail.... Got it in 3rd one time as his Camaro was rapidly increasing the distance. Was at a small airport with a 6500' runway. The airport manager was taking me to dinner at the other end of the runway/airport. I followed him as we rapidly went down the runway. About that time, it was time to start slowing down.

I'll keep the group posted.

bhammer

I have the coolant smell inside the cabin, only when fresh air is selected. No white smoke and things with the performance / engine seem just fine. I just ordered new plugs as I am past due for them. When I ordered them, my thinking was why as they "seem fine" and don't need them. I'll check to see if they pressure tested or not. Don't think they did. It just seems very strange that I got this right after they added the orfice at the heater core.

More to come....

bhammer

I just read the TSB on the coolant light. My VIN flls below the 403405 so this may be a direction to head.

fyrstormer

If I downshift into first gear above 10mph (without closing the clutch afterwards, just pre-engaging the first-gear synchro), I get a slight whirring sound as the synchronizer parts rub together. THAT is normal. What you're hearing sounds more like a bearing inside the synchro has worn out and is vibrating when you apply pressure to it using the shift lever.

In any event, while downshifting is useful, I've never downshifted into a gear that put my engine speed above 4000rpms or so. Also, I hope you're pre-revving the engine using the gas pedal before you close the clutch when you downshift like that, and you're not forcing the clutch to rev the engine for you. It *can* withstand that kind of punishment, but it's not good for it. Also, I've never seen an engine that needed pre-revving more than the Renesis does; if I screw up and close the clutch while the engine is idling and the car is coasting, the sudden deceleration will chirp the rear tires even in 4th gear.

bhammer

Okay guys, an update... Finally got the issue fixed with a remanufactured transmission installed. I took it in to a quality monitoring dealership and they brought in a tech to help diagnose the problem. The root cause was FOD. Here is the final write up:

Found foreign material stopping up oil passages inside transmission. Removed and disassembled for inspection. Found foreign material stopping up oil passages causing internal damage to bearings and shafts. Reassembled transmission and replaced it with a new remanfuactured transmission test drove......

The FOD was plastic from the sub assemblies before final assembly of the transmission at the factory. There were two bearings starting to blue steel from heat and a couple gears that had real abnormal wear. One bearing the race had real bad wear on it. Mazda would not let me take my own photographs.

I dropped it off on June 18th and got it back on July 27th..... Thank god for a loaner car. I have to admit though I was starting to like the gas milage of the Mazda 3...

ASH8

Good news I guess..

FOD...that is a new one...Did you actually see this foreign matter/plastic?

I find this interesting as this is a Mazda in house made Transmission and sub assembling SOP is usually so thorough that sub assembling of parts (counter-shafts, main shafts and gears) can't be moved to position, fixed (snap ring) and tested unless these plastic supports are removed first, in other words the trans is locked until these plastic holders/tabs are removed.

Frankly if this was the case, and I have no reason not to believe you then I would have been demanding an all new latest Trans (I would keep this in mind, and even put it in writing to MNAO in case something else happens)..here is the Part Number for latest 6 speed S2 Trans P6Y1-03-000 and YES they have a few in stock in USA at very good prices.

How does your Trans 'feel', I have just never found a re-built trans to be as good, there is always something that was not there before...if you know what I mean...

What about your coolant smell?..

Good luck M8

bhammer

Yes, I saw the plastic. There were a couple peices and they were milky white. The largest was no larger than 3mmx3mm and a couple that were even smaller. Upon further discussions with the dealer, they are assumming that this material came from when the 5th & 6th syncros were changed right after I got the car. I argued about getting a brand new transmission and they would not budge. I am supposed to have all the latest updates but who the hell knows if that is really the case.

The transmission moves in and out of gears a lot smoother now but I guess I really don't have a good baseline to compare it with.

The coolant smell was from a very slight drip at the heater core. They cleaned it up and tightened the clamp. They also replaced my resivor as I fell right before the VIN cutoff. No more smell and the issue seems to be gone.

I appreciate all your help with this issue!!!

ASH8

Milky white?..ok

Usually most of sub assembly plastic holders used during assembling are red or brightly coloured, so I don't think it was any of those.
White used to be (earlier trans) change bushes or lever pivot bush.

I know some of our Shift Lever ones are Black, and a thick white one that can't be replaced.
The 3/4 linkage are Black.

I might be able to identify other bushes... later.

All good that your car is better anyway..