Umbra

I just want a decent looking reasonable performance rear brake set that works with the ebrake and looks decent to go with the multitude of already decent BBK front kits out there. I don't see much reason for someone to bring yet another front bbk kit to market.

Todd TCE

The car will soon sport a matching rear rotor kit retaining the oem caliper.

Yes I know; everyone wants a more "performance minded" rear design with multi piston calipers. While it can be done it will come without the parking brake which greatly limits the customer base- to almost nothing. Even fitting a double caliper design has limitations as there's no real space to work with and you'd still be left with the oem caliper if appearance is the intent.

While Wilwood manufactures a nice parking brake caliper, this one is not going to be practical for two reason; first is the cable- the oem cable will not work due to the way it fits the caliper. That means fully custom cables. Second is cost- a proper rear kit (without those custom cables!) will run about $1300 and unless you have a matching front kit already I don't see too many folks rushing to buy a Wilwood shod brake set up to go with their Brembo/Stoptech/AP etc front kit. The caliper is also a single pot floater which, other than appearance, doesn't offer you any real performance gains you'd not get with a simple rotor enlargement kit.

Hope this helps clear up the smoke a bit.

PhotoMunkey

Sorry about the delay everyone... Had to get the car ready to display at the Formula Drift Finale at the Irwindale Speedway this past weekend. I thought I'd have internet access over the weekend, but that didn't pan out at the roach motel where I spent my nights.

Here's one to start!

PhotoMunkey

Here are a few more...

swoope

iTrader: (5)

nice shots, weather looked like ***.


beers

PhotoMunkey

Now, to answer the big question... Yes, they work great! The pedal feel is excellent; perfect travel, easily controlled modulation, possible to push the hairy limits of traction yet will unlock instantly with just a light let-off. I've done roughly 750 miles on this kit since last Wednesday when they were installed and I'm very pleased with them. I even had the chance to drive in rain and on rough roads with them. My concern was if a 14" rotor would add too much mass and leverage for this car. My fears turned out to be unfounded as even on the wet SoCal roads this weekend I never had a problem with unintended lock-up.

Now, for those interested, Todd's bracket WILL run th 6-piston caliper, should Wilwood ever decide to MAKE a 6-piston unit with slightly smaller piston bores. Todd's argument is that the 4-piston unit is a superior unit, with aluminum pistons and dust boots. He's right, of course. Many years of experience designing successful brake kits using Wilwood components certainly helps.

Installation is a breeze! Even with me shooting photos, which certainly slowed him down some, it still only took an hour and fifteen minutes!

All in all, highly recommended... a 14" kit for the RX-8 for less than anyone else's setup, AND it fits behind stock wheels and Enkei RPF1s! It should fit far more wheels than this too! Just repeat after me... "Wheel spacers suck horsepower!" LOL

PhotoMunkey

The weather was fine... clouds were rolling in and out all day, both days. It rained Friday night. Both RX-8s in the field made Top 32, but didn't make it in to the Top 16 due to crappy runs at the wrong times.

Perhaps I'll post some of the "regular" photos I do of drifting... but I'm going to be busy trying to sell the story to a magazine so I can continue to buy nice things for my RX-8.

success07

Eric, The Wilwood kit looks really good! I'm glad the performance matches it's good looks.

At this point, are there other available colors?

And just to review; We are looking at approx. $2700 for a front and rear BBK?

Thanks in advance.

PhotoMunkey

I'm not sure on the final prices. I think Todd's planing on somewhere around $1900 for the front setup, which is well worth it, IMHO. BTW-I didn't get this stuff for free either!

I believe there are other colors available from Wilwood, but black, silver, and red appear to be their main three choices. I elected for red for obvious reasons, but now have to find a brake lacquer which will match for the rear calipers. If anyone has some ideas, I'd like to hear 'em...
Eric

PhotoMunkey

Now if you want to see NICE RX-8 shots, these fit the bill! LOL

All bow down to PhotoMunkey, master of the long-lens panned shot!

LionZoo

Oh silver. Perfect to match the stock caliper color. This just went up a notch in my book...

You guys are still offering the 13" kit right and not just going with the 14" ones?

AGLRX8

What's the story with the rear setup? You looking for rear caliper paint, does that mean that the rears will not be part of the line up?

PhotoMunkey

If the Wilwood rear calipers are used, first, they're only a single piston, so essentially they're the same as stock. Second, they'd require a custom brake cable setup, because they can't use the stock cables at all. Third, there would be no increase in stopping force with the new calipers. Fourth, they cost as much EACH as the front 4-piston calipers! This would make the cost of the rear kit as MUCH as the fronts, if not more because of the need for both stainless steel brake hoses AND custom parking brake cables. There's just no market for a $2000 rear kit.

Anyone building an actual race car from an RX-8 is going to toss the parking brake calipers anyway and fit lightweight 2-piston calipers, and damn the cost. The street/track day owner isn't going to do that. The e-brake is just essential for parking this car.

No, Todd is only offering the 14" kit, due to the needed increase in brake leverage and heat-handling capacity (more swept area and mass on the rotor equals fewer degrees per inch of temperature). Going to a 13" rotor wouldn't provide enough of a leverage benefit.

Now, if someone wanted to, Todd's calipers can have the studs removed, and can be turned on a lathe or mill to accept the 13" rotors, but Wilwood only makes the 13.06" rotor in a 1.25" width. The 14" calipers are 1.10", so the caliper alignment won't work out to be the same, unfortunately. If someone wanted to make their own mounts, with the help of a good machinist, it's easy to do, but with the cost of aluminum, mill time, and anodizing, you'd be far above the cost of Todd's mounts anyway! It becomes self-defeating at this point to do a 13" rotor kit.
Eric

LionZoo

What's the weight difference between the 14-1.1" versus the 13-1.25"?

tajabaho1

hey photomunky, thats looking real good man, how much do you think the kit would sell for?

PhotoMunkey

The 13 x 1.25 was 12.3 lbs, the 14 x 1.10" is 14.5 lbs. Todd's kit already saves around 6-7 lbs per corner over the stock brake system. While those 2 lbs of rotational weight would be nice to lose, the loss of brake torque from the extra .5" when going from a 14" rotor to a 13" rotors would be an even greater loss.

This car can really generate some eye-popping brake force now, and it's going to get better when the rear 13" kit has been fitted with some upgraded rear pads!

PhotoMunkey

I think Todd's looking to market the front kit in the $1800-1900 range. Pad compound can be changed to be more aggressive if wanted. Black with a machined "Wilwood" logo is standard (and it's a very glossy black) but red and silver are available for extra cost from Wilwood (Todd just passes the cost straight through).

Todd's doing a teen performance driving instruction class in LA this week, but I'm sure he'll post something later. Look up his sig and send him an email if you need more detail than this. The board won't let him sign up as a vendor yet, but soon.... hopefully!

eviltwinkie

Curious...could I just get the rotors and calipers...I do not need anything else in the kit...

PhotoMunkey

You already have radial mounts with the proper spacing, safe secure steel hardware, adapters for your brake lines, locking nuts to mount the calipers properly, properly sized hats, and the ability to engineer and machine two quality brackets? That's terrific! Why didn't you build your own brake kit first? Seriously... man, what's up with this question?

Folks, a brake system is just that... a SYSTEM, designed to work as a whole unit and SAFELY stop your car, time after time with no fatigue of the metal components. Perhaps you'll save a few dollars if you skimp here and there but, c'mon, you're not going to save that much. I've looked at the cost numbers and believe me, Todd ain't gettin' rich like Donald Trump off these kits! Unless you've got an engineering degree, you've probably got no right to be messing around with the brakes on an RX-8.

If you do need individual components, I'm sure Todd WILL sell them. He's only been a Wilwood dealer for 14 years! Parts sales are parts sales. From what I've seen, he's very good at this, and one hell of a hot shoe driver himself, which at one point netted him a 17-race win streak. Four years straight in his class at Pike's Peak!

eviltwinkie

Ha...you answered the question partially...

I need "MOST" of the kit...I already have several components which I do not need and which are "usually" sold as part of "a" kit....

Good to know that I can request individual components...Let's not start making assumptions...mkay....haa haa

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

you should be able to order those parts from the Wilwood online catalog, they won't be specific to an RX-8 listing, just generic Wilwood parts with rotor hats made to order per the specs you provide

Todd TCE

Checking in gents. Yes I'm interested in the vendor option when the dust settles of sorts, so I hope someone remembers my messages sent...

Limited replies to keep the mods happy.


Yes there is a smaller kit available also.

No, there are no plans for a caliper included rear kit unless by special order.

Yes the parts "could be" modified to work with a wider and smaller rotor and such but you'll be doing the work on it. With what is now offered I'm done with r&d of new product here and very please with what we have. No need for 5 or 6 optional designs. Special orders however are just that. And Prepaid.

Caliper colors are wide open by special order. Limited options from Wilwood but custom work is available. The issue is often the logo reproduction. From none, to decals, to reworded mill work to even fully custom logos it's your choice.

Rotor weight is slightly higher but is more than offset by thermal capacity, swept area and overall efficiency for braking needs. And yet I believe still lighter than stock.

For anyone needing only a few parts with most of a kit in hand, I'll be happy to sell any and all related parts ala carte. It won't save you any money but business is business. If you need Wilwood factory parts just be certain to review your needs and list the correct part number for a proper quote.

PhotoMunkey

Okay, as it turns out, it might still be possible to do the 6-piston kit through Mazdatrix. Once Dave's workload has evened out there, I'm going to touch base with him about it (after SEMA) and we'll talk with Wilwood. We'll have to do a test-fit of the components on my car, if Dave still wants to pursue it. I think he will, but haven't heard back at this point because he's so darn busy right now.

Todd at TCE Performanc Products will be offering the 4-piston 14" kit with two piece rotors (zinc-washed for no rusting!), and will be making a rear 13" Up-size kit available to work with the stock calipers very soon. He'll also have a very hard-core track kit which uses the lighter, forged aluminum 4-piston caliper that Wilwood makes along with about a 13.5" rotor which is wider, for better heat management with aggressive track pads. I think the 14" kit is probably a great match for anyone's needs for use with street tires.

This week I have to clean and paint my rear calipers, which ought to be very fun. I can't do it today or tomorrow because we're under a wind advisory here and I simply can't have paint blowing all over my wheel arches right before SEMA. I already need to clay-bar the sides and roof again before the show! Ugh!

I'll be at the SEMA show next Sunday and the following week, vehicle #2400 if they every bother to publish a map, so I'll have some more photos from there too. I wanted to clean the car up and shoot more, but I'm waiting for the rear kit before I do it. If anyone has any questions about the details of Todd's kit, feel free to PM me.

Todd TCE

If Dave wants to talk about the pros and cons of the BSL6 caliper on this I'm more than willing to help. I feel the real value here is in this design for a number of reasons. Moving to the six is a lateral move in my mind and not one I'd personally suggest in my experience.

The rear kit for Eric's car is going to be ready before SEMA by my plans. Might make for a busy week!

rx8spiritR

can anyone please please please tell me how does the Stoptech ST-10 caliper work?????? I am so confus, if I put a bbk at the rear then I'll have to use the Stoptech ST-10? this is from a guy at a local shop told me. but when I ask him how does it work ,he said he don't know either. ANYONE???