speeddemon32

ha ha ha, yeah I thought it was fitting for now.



yes the spring on the right is a stocker.

savedsol

Possible, but only four people work there.

r0tor

iTrader: (1)

it still fails to work...

kwescott

speed...you could always consider changing your new siggy to:

Springs, sometimes they just don't measure up

LionZoo

You're right. Assuming 800 pounds per front corner and a 0.752 installation ratio, just to get to static ride height you'd need more than 3.75 inches of travel on a 155 pound spring. There has to be more than 4 inches of travel in that spring...

It looks even worse on rear springs as that requires more than 5 inches of travel to reach static compression.

speeddemon32

i dont remember ever once saying that there is only 4 inches of travel.... look guys, its simple, they are what they are. there is no magic inch in there that the spring is ungodly stiff ok. if you think there is, then by all means think what you want.
I give up.


chicken, I was thinking more along the lines of "what did you want me to tell you your springs rates were........... yeah thats what they were"

LionZoo

https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php...4&postcount=32

https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php...5&postcount=33

I'm not trying to give you a hard time, but when something doesn't add up you have to get down to the bottom of it.

Tom_Brady

I have the Mazdaspeed Springs and struts, and I think they are a great setup. I had them tested and they are definately the stiffest setup available for the 8. And you can believe me, after all.....I'm Tom Brady.

speeddemon32

^^^ ha ha ha,.... well there you go. from mr. Brady himself.


Lion, the first MEASURABLE INCH. your trying to find a loop hole in my testing for no reason. I DID skip the first inch, to be honest I even skipped a little more just so I was closer to the actual tension of the spring. and I went ALMOST to the end. when your strut is fully compressed on the car the spring is STILL not fully compressed. so yes there is more the 4 inches I mentioned. there is no magic to this maddens. there is no magic inch in the Mazdaspeed or any other spring that is going to be stiffer then the rest.

send me a spring (because I no longer have any) and I will measure from the moment it touches the perch to the moment the coils are touching each other. I will give inch by inch readouts. but I am telling you, there will be no magic inch that holds any more spring rate then the other inches.

hell I will even video the whole process and post it on you tube. or you can come on over and see for your self. I don’t care how but please for the love of god people either think about your arguments for a second and realize I know what the hell I am talking about, or come see for yourself. I'll even let you do it that way you cant say I did it at the wrong time of day.

or again, just trust the numbers that were posted on this forum by god knows who that never even tested them because they heard from a guy that heard from a guy that has a friend that is a dealer at Mazda that once heard that they were 280 pound springs. there is no rhyme or reason for the 280 pound springs, just accept the fact that that number is bogus and move on.)

RX8Maine

Someone beat me to it . . . thanks for pointing out the lever factor.

LionZoo

I will say, as much grief as I'm giving speeddemon at the moment, my first cut is to believe his tested rate. The coils of the Mazdaspeed spring is thicker, which increases the rate, but there are also a lot more coils in the setup, which decreases the rate. My instinct tells me the tradeoff between the two might be a wash. Of course I can do a rough rate estimate of the two if someone is willing to give me the approximate coil diameter, wire diameter, and the number of coils per vertical inch.

speeddemon32

kwescott

What are you planning on doing with your car Lion? Are you competing with HPDE events, SOLO 2, drifting...what?

I hope you don't tell me that your just trying to find a good spring for your daily drive....

speeddemon32

^^^ yeah no kidding. :-/

Jedi54

iTrader: (7)

I was starting to wonder the same thing...

LionZoo

Let's just say for my purposes I need a setup that is less aggressive than a track setup. Something that is more forgiving of bumps and retains all the travel that the stock setup has to deal with dips and drops while at the same time being stiffer than stock to help improve transition characteristics.

I'm not in a huge hurry to improve my suspension though as that's not the part of the package that needs the most work right now...

Jedi54

iTrader: (7)

in other words: daily driver with a heavy foot.

kwescott

In other words.....oh, never mind.....+1

lesper4

iTrader: (3)

Lol

speeddemon32

you mean........ oh never mind.... :-/

LionZoo

Put words in my mouth if you like, but if I were going for a racetrack setup I have my choice of coilovers. If it was just a daily driver there's no point in improving transition characteristics. How many chicanes are there in the LA concrete jungle?

Jedi54

iTrader: (7)

I didn't put any words in your mouth, just deciphered your response. Look, there's nothing wrong with improving your suspension and wanting to know eactly what you're buying but don't you think you took this a little too far????
Wow...

kwescott

So let us review. The only information that we do have from a forum member actually testing a product is 180/100...but yet you still want to believe in information that was agreed upon on this forum, in which no one has ever been able to determine the origin, and in which DPE (a forum vendor) even indicated was not accurate, and told to you by another vendor that you called. Maybe what would be prudent at this point, to prove your side of things, would be for you to call that same vendor back, and ask him where he got his information.

In contrast, what we have also told you was the conversation Speeddemon32 had with techs from Mazdaspeed. Why is this information more beleivable (in my eyes)...is that Speeddemon32, like I, were trying to get a spring setup for track applications....so numbers were important to us. We both had reasons, important ones, to find out the truth.

I went more blindly into things than Speeddemon32 did. I beleived, as you still do, that the original forum myth of 280/190 was valid. I bought the springs based on this, as well as other forum members who used their butt dynos and amatuer tracking experience to provide feedback on the springs.

Ultimately, springs, struts, alignment....are preferences to driving style, track, conditions....etc.

Since it sounds that you are not looking for a track application at this point, just get yourself a set of lowering springs and call it a day.


{EDIT}Another thing to consider is the term "sport" spring.

speeddemon32

^^^ WOOT WOOT!

this thread reminds me of the whole "well I put this intake on, which sounds better then your intake, so there for I MUST have more power then you. and since It makes more power, it MUST have picked up at least 10 H.P! wow I feel such a difference" thing.


my problem was/is not really the whole concept of the thread, someone had a question and wanted to question somethign about my testing method.... fine. by all means, ask questions. but when I go into such deatail, and provide undisputable proof, and the someone keeps drilling, looking for every last nook and cranny of a shread of a chance that i might be wrong.

its not rocket scince, like Kwescott said, NO ONE ever said for sure mazdaspeed (or any other spring) spring rates were what they were. except me.... not even MAZDASPEED said they were what this forum myth is.

my eibach spring for a custom race car tagged from Eibach at 500 pounds test as a 500 pound spring. backing up their claim. same with the 700 pound spring, same with the stock RX-8 front spring, same with the stock RX-8 rear spring. but no one questions those results. it just boggles my mind when I am only questioned on the Mazdaspeed and Vogland springs because the results didnt come back what you wanted.

sorry but my dyno results came back at 201 h.p. but they were not what I wanted, I wanted 450.. there for the dyno must have been wrong.

thank you Jedi and Kwescott for seeing clearly. I say we start posting more rumors of spring rates just to make people feel better. what do you say? the new Sprint spring rates according to my friends friend is 450/350. I think I even heard Tein say theirs was 550/475. oh, oh... I got it, the new Intrax springs are 280/190 just like Mazdaspeeds.


.

LionZoo

Here's why I started this thread; for my application 280/190 was basically the rate that my first cut analysis told me I needed. Coilovers are a bit stiffer in rate than optimal and lowering springs are pretty pointless to me as what I'm after is not lowering but a stiffer spring;if anything I'd want to keep the stock ride height and suspension travel is VERY important. I e-mailed a couple different vendors, and Online Mazda Parts told me 280/190 sounded similar, DPE said that he didn't have any springs to test, but based on the weight and setup of the springs he had his doubts on the spring being a rate that was close to stock. As evidenced, Team, among others, was still quoting the 280/190 rate. Therefore, I'm sorry if I didn't take speed's word to be gospel, but there were still differing opinions and here was a spring where one quoted rate was exactly what I needed so of course I'm going to get down to the bottom of it. For what it's worth, I quoted speed's misgivings about the Mazdaspeed spring rate on several threads that had people considering them, I wasn't trying to stick my head in the sand and continuing to believe 280/190 regardless, however I was going to figure out exactly what rate that spring is. I haven't bought anything, but I'm doing my due diligence in researching every possible option before making a decision and putting my money down.