muncheyboy

my 8 wont even start that good cold. & once it is warm i dont shut it off unless i have an hour before i need to use it again. man i miss my rx-7s!!! much easyer to work on.

AC0KG

Here is my chirping sound, maybe someone will recognize it.

Does it only when it's hot. It's louder now than it has been in the past.

AC0KG

Also, here's a comparison of starting before the coil replacement, image of the coils, and hot and cold start after replacement.

AC0KG

I'm starting to think this is an exhaust leak. It's been getting worse, I can hear it now when the car is just sitting idling. Guess I'll have to get some hose and see if I can track it down.

Edit: I wonder if this could be a vacuum leak?

Also, after replacing coils and wires the car is still running rough after warming up. I've stalled it a couple of times. I have to be careful to turn the AC off before stopping for lights.

cjcoll

Glad I caught this - was about to change my coils for the rough after warm up issue. Sounds like we have the exact same thing going on. And I'm in Texas, so turning off the AC when I'm at a red light is becoming a very uncomfortable option. Is your problem worse when the fuel is low? Mine seems to be - wondering if it is a fuel pump issue.

AC0KG

I see a few threads about this, but not much about getting it fixed.

I haven't noticed any correlation to fuel level, but it is worse at times. I'll watch and see if there is any link. I'll add fuel pressure to the Torque log too, maybe that'll catch something interesting.

Have you tried seafoam? Another thread suggested that carbon buildup can make the apex seals stick a bit, which can cause loss of compression and rough idle.

I'd like to give it a try, but I'm reluctant to generate the clouds of smoke. If I wait a few weeks I can do it in the evening on the 4th, and nobody will notice :D

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

Testing for coil failure: Buy a coil tester from a local auto-parts store for $8 to $15 (looks like a sparkplug with a clamp on the side), with the car off, remove a plug wire from a plug, plug it on the end of the coil tester, clamp the coil tester to something metal to ground it. Start up the car and let it idle. The spark showing should be clear and steady in color and brightness and frequency. Test with each plug wire end. If you get one where it's unsteady in any of the 3 ways, then swap that plug wire with a plug wire that have you a good result, so you can rule the plug wire out.

Testing for vacuum leak / MAF issues: With an ODB2 reader / logger that can see STFT (short term fuel trim) and at least to 1 decimal of MAF g/s (mass air flow grams per second), log and inspect the log or watch your STFT and MAF g/s while at idle. If your short term fuel trim is outside of -1% to +1% then there is something wrong. A negative value means that it's pulling fuel, because it sees that the engine is running rich. This should be accompanied with a MAF that is greater than about 5.5g/s to 6.0g/s, and would suggest a dirty MAF. If your STFT is positive, it means that it's seeing the engine as lean, and adding fuel. This would be accompanied with a MAF of less than 5.0g/s or so, meaning your engine is pulling in air that isn't passing the MAF, so the ECU doesn't know to add fuel for it. You have a vacuum leak.

I cApstone I

Wow! I have that exact sound (bird chirping). It's only at low speeds, right?? And....if you go through a drive-thru it echoes a lot louder off the side of the building?? lol. It may just be me but I listen for motor/exhaust noises when I go through a drive-thru. haha.

Anyways, It's very annoying. I plan on checking it out tomorrow. I was thinking it could just be a belt but now Im re-thinking that possibility.

I also have the same issues in my '04. Rough idle/trying to stall/increased with A/C/No power and hesitation when taking off from a dead stop.

Only thing is...My issues just started today and I've yet to get a CEL (knocks on wood)

AC0KG

Yep, that's it exactly! It starts out subtle and gets worse. I hear it all the time now, which I hope will make it a lot easier to find!

Let us know if you find anything, sounds like these issues aren't uncommon.

I cApstone I

Notice this sound?? Of course this was only in park.

Car is not really running bad right now. Of course that's just right now, lol. Cleared ESS/Room fuse and visually inspected vacuum lines...no problems that I can "see". About to clean the MAF which looks dirty as hell and also going to spray the belts a little to eliminate that issue.

I cApstone I

Just drove it down the road to the parts store. It's idling "ok" but not perfect. The A/C is definitely not running right....(cool, warm, cool). It blows colder at higher RPM. Hmmm.....

Right now I'm going to clean the MAF...

Try some belt dressing just to make sure it's not creating any noise...

Put my airbox walls back in place... (It over 90 degrees every day here and maybe that will help with the idle)....

Do this A/C mod:

AC Amplifier Re-Program
Helps poor AC performance.
Notes: Procedure states that it only changes the air source. Many have said that it does more than that. I used a temp gauge and saw lower temps after, as well as reduced A/C cycling.
Best DIY is … https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php?...24&postcount=3

To save clicks, the basics are here:

1. Verify ignition switch is in OFF position.
2. Press and hold the front defrost and air intake selector buttons simultaneously.
3. Turn the ignition key to the "ACC" position for 3 seconds. (Continue to hold the buttons down from step #3.)
4. Turn the ignition key to the "ON" position for 3 seconds. (Continue to hold the buttons down from step #4.)
5. Successful programming will be confirmed by the rear defrost indicator light flashing 3 times. NOTE: If vehicle's battery dies or cables are removed, the programming will not be retained and must be performed again.

Add some Lucas Fuel System cleaner and top off on gas (Possibly bad gas??)....

Reset ECU/fuel trims...

And finally, take a little road trip and we'll see what happens.

I cApstone I

WOW! A lot smoother!!

My MAF was dirty as hell and had oil deposits all over it.

I took it on about a 5 mile trip driving it pretty hard, and a little slow at times. With A/C blasting. I;m proud to say I have no more idling problems, even with the A/C on. (knocks on wood) Hopefully, this solved my main problem.

I still have the chirping birds and It has nothing to do with the belts as I can tell. Hmmmm.....You said you replaced the coils??

And...my A/C still might not be working that great but it's much improved. (hopefully the mod helped it a bit) It also doesnt help that the ambient temp is readin about 97 degrees out.

Either way, after doing the above mentioned, my car is running a lot better!!

I'll post a video soon showing acceleration and idle....keeping my fingers crossed!

MariesRX8

Oh wow, that sounds soooo much like my "What is that tinkling sound the engine makes?" at https://www.rx8club.com/rx-8-discussion-3/what-tinkling-sound-engine-makes-218482/

Maybe some clues in that thread. I dunno though, I've never figured it out. Mine isn't loud enough to be recorded, and it only happens now and then. But it was there before and after swapping the engine, coils, plugs, wires. fixing a heat shield and replacing my front end links.

EDIT: I was kinda convinced it was just transmission noise, but I see you have an AT... and mine is manual. Hmmm. I dunno then.

I cApstone I

bump...

I cApstone I

So, I've come to the conclusion that that rotaries simply are a pain to diagnose!!

Anyways, my issues still persist. Noise is still the same. Basically, the cooler the weather....the better my car runs. A/C makes the symptoms ten times worse. It ALWAYS cranks fine....idles and runs fine for about 10 ten mins in hot weather....then this is exactly what happens after ambient air temp goes up:

BTW....still no CEL

Coming to a stop (after say, a highway run) the brake pressure fades as if the car is dying. ( Actually tries to buck a little ) No...this is not brake/rotor related.

After I come to a complete stop (with A/C on) the idle starts to surge from the fan cycling with A/C. It will fluctuate from about 300 RPM- 1000 RPM and back down the 300. It "feels" like it's going to stall but NEVER does! When it dips to 300 there is a LOUD fluttering noise and BAD vibrations (sounds like a loud exhaust leak or maybe SSV) that are NOT there when idle is smooth or A/C is OFF!

When taking off from a dead stop it will hesitate badly....almost too dangerous to take off, or pull into traffic with A/C on. Very little power until it revs up a little. When I get going it runs perfectly fine.....this only happens at low speed/stop.

Also, the bird chirping is still there. This was not fixed by changing the coils as I thought. Also, there is still a slight ticking (valve ticking) sound. I suspect maybe from carbon build-up??

Things I have done in the past few months:

Cleaned MAF (x2)
Cleaned ESS
Changed Coils/Plugs/Wires
Inspected all vacuum lines
Reattached FAD to airbox and checked filter
Cleaned Throttle Body/Butterfly
Had injectors cleaned
Ran fuel system cleaner (x2)
Inspected intake for oil (none)
Regular Oil changes + adding (normal)

Things to try: (no particular order)

Possible CAT (no power loss at high RPM though)(Replaced in '10)
Check SSV
Compression Test
Fuel Pump
Seafoam
Motor mounts
Oil metering/injectors
coolant problems
Prob a few more I cant remember

I'm baffled by all of this and it seems to be VERY common with no definitive answers. It's always try this....then this...maybe this will work. This is too common after doing many searches. Im just surprised there's not a know-it-all Guru in these forums. Does anyone know what the problem is?? After all....'04's are the MOST prone to issues.....and this car has been around for about 8 years now. Very frustrating....

Bladecutter

You have asked this before, and we have already told you what to do.
You have it listed in your list of things to do, but you have simply chosen not to do it yet.

Again, I believe you have MULTIPLE problems all at the same time, hence the reason why you can't track it down to just one thing.

Problem with stutter at idle that is worse with the A/C on - Neutral position switch and/or bad motor mounts. Could be one, could be the other, could be both. Its up to YOU to test it, and figure out which one is the problem. Been mentioned before, and in many other people's threads.

Better performance in cooler weather - compression.
Low performance at low rpm - compression.
Low performance at low rpm - stuck SSV valve.
Surging at idle - compression.

Seriously, how many times do we need to tell you this?
Just take your car in for a compression test already.

BC.

DarkBrew

I've heard of the ticking sound being related to the rear shaft seal...
Poor idle can be plugs, coils, ESS, MAF, injectors, neutral switch, clutch switch, vacuum leaks, compression, OMP or oil line or oil injector failure and I'm sure there are more.

You are working your way down the list so stay systematic and patiently research and test each possibility until it is solved.
Then we can call you a guru... at least for idle issues

AC0KG

Sorry I didn't reply sooner, didn't get email reply notifications.

You've just described my car, it acts pretty much like this, but not quite that bad. Idle is usually ok when it's cool, but once it's hot it runs from 800 to 1100 or so, lower when the AC kicks on. Shudders a lot, but I think that's probably a separate issue from the low idle.

I had my motor mounts replaced about a year and a half ago when I got the car, so that's probably not the problem for me. Is the neutral position/safety switch the same thing on auto and manual transmission vehicles? I'm not getting a CEL for it (no codes at all since I replaced the downstream O2 sensor), but it certainly has trouble keeping a reasonable idle when it's hot.

Any way to test that switch?

AC0KG

I edited the sound on the video to remove the rumble and hiss so it's easier to hear this noise.

AC0KG

Logged STFT and MAF today. At cold idle it ranges from -3 to +2.3, with MAF at ~6.3.

Driving, it ranges mostly +/-5 (tends to be more negative than positive), but regularly hits -10, and reaches -20 at a couple of points.

Coincidentally, it stalled at a stoplight today while I was logging.

AC0KG

P0300 this morning. Thinking it might be from when the car stalled yesterday.

I'm coming up on 2 years on this set of plugs though, about 8k miles, suspect it's getting close to time to replace them. That may be contributing to the issues I'm having.

I cApstone I

Funny.... I don't recall YOU telling me anything...

I'll be the bigger man here and just ignore the above response.



Yep....that's the noise! Frustrating trying to find the cause of it.

I cApstone I

So, today I had a look at my Cat...pics below.




Cat internals looked fine, nothing loose in the element. It appears as though it is not the problem.



This on the other hand...Im not so sure. Of course, this is the O2 before the cat....a little bit of build-up there.

Also, cleaned the crap out of my ESS again, re-checked the plugs.

Guess its back to the drawing board.

AC0KG

Well, I solved the problem with mine. Traded in on a new car (Nissan Versa, mostly for the kids). I think I'll wait around a bit for the 2010 and 2011 RX-8s to get a bit cheaper, then get one of those, but manual this time :D

Mr.Rx8alex

so have you come up with anything i also have the same issues with my 2004 mazda rx8 AT and have a handfull of things i did to try to solve the problem but still nothing i have noticed if i put it in nuetral and hold the brake and gas it seems to idle a lot better but i only did that once so i could make it home and not get stuck on a busy intersection also ran the crap out of it but all it did was pop at high rpm shifts