progress anti-sway bar bump noise fix
04-25-2010, 01:36 PM
#26
Just was reading this and wanted to chime that if you did what I think you say you did, you just added a weld on the bend itself with no crack and not bonding any support to the bend.
If you did this, you just weakened the material up with a weld without bonding additional support and I wouldn't be surprised if it cracked there again. If I were you, I'd look into the metal selection and find a proper grade of steel contrast to normal mild steel to do the job; as an engineer that would be my route.
And as far as what Team said, the slots are not the problem nor the positioning. We have brackets just above those that come with the sway bar and prevents us from leveling the sway bar in the middle of the slots. Regardless, this does nothing to add to the stressing. The slots are there for adjusting to fit on the car with the brackets in the way, nothing more. In theory if you lowered or raised the sway bar via those slots if brackets on the car were not in the way, that's all they'll do; position it higher or lower. Perhaps in the case if you drastically lowered your car and had the stock or fixed end links then they might be an issue which then you should get adjustable end links.
If you did this, you just weakened the material up with a weld without bonding additional support and I wouldn't be surprised if it cracked there again. If I were you, I'd look into the metal selection and find a proper grade of steel contrast to normal mild steel to do the job; as an engineer that would be my route.
And as far as what Team said, the slots are not the problem nor the positioning. We have brackets just above those that come with the sway bar and prevents us from leveling the sway bar in the middle of the slots. Regardless, this does nothing to add to the stressing. The slots are there for adjusting to fit on the car with the brackets in the way, nothing more. In theory if you lowered or raised the sway bar via those slots if brackets on the car were not in the way, that's all they'll do; position it higher or lower. Perhaps in the case if you drastically lowered your car and had the stock or fixed end links then they might be an issue which then you should get adjustable end links.
Last edited by Vlaze; 04-25-2010 at 01:48 PM.
04-25-2010, 02:30 PM
#27
Tony says, RX8s are GREAT
Thread Starter
I would agree with what you said, but you have not seen the new home made fix.
But then I reread you post and disagree, Positioning does matter with the original problem and that is why several people have had bent anti sway bar brackets. One side will flex and lift. I do not think you have read the entire thread. I agree with how you feel if you have not read the entire thread, but if you see what I found out then maybe you will see why I did what I did. G.I.Joe say knowing is half the power..lol
The brackets itself is thicker material now and material has been added at the weld. The fabricator did not just add a little weld across. It is beefy. I saw someone post new updated brackets from the company with arches welded on the top which I like too.
But either way you look at it, the original brackets were made out of weaker material.. period. The original designer choose bad material, Stainless Steel did not work well either.
Yes I know you can position it up down and what ever. But having a thick beefy bracket with fixed holes is the way to go. It is also nice that you do not have to lay it over in other bolts while trying to center the slotted brackets. Also look at Navy ships that are welded together on the hulls. I am sure that if you do the weld right with the right material, it will be strong as hell.
The ss brackets shear because they did not want to flex. I do not offer those anymore. They broke at the bend on me any someone else. The older steel ones were ok, but after the ss ordeal I said screw it and made some beefy *** ones that will never fail. The weld makes it stronger because I had the fabricator also add material to the back off the bend where it bolts down which you can not see in the photo. Hell, I go take a pic now..lol...brb.
Overall, it is hecka strong.
But then I reread you post and disagree, Positioning does matter with the original problem and that is why several people have had bent anti sway bar brackets. One side will flex and lift. I do not think you have read the entire thread. I agree with how you feel if you have not read the entire thread, but if you see what I found out then maybe you will see why I did what I did. G.I.Joe say knowing is half the power..lol
The brackets itself is thicker material now and material has been added at the weld. The fabricator did not just add a little weld across. It is beefy. I saw someone post new updated brackets from the company with arches welded on the top which I like too.
But either way you look at it, the original brackets were made out of weaker material.. period. The original designer choose bad material, Stainless Steel did not work well either.
Yes I know you can position it up down and what ever. But having a thick beefy bracket with fixed holes is the way to go. It is also nice that you do not have to lay it over in other bolts while trying to center the slotted brackets. Also look at Navy ships that are welded together on the hulls. I am sure that if you do the weld right with the right material, it will be strong as hell.
The ss brackets shear because they did not want to flex. I do not offer those anymore. They broke at the bend on me any someone else. The older steel ones were ok, but after the ss ordeal I said screw it and made some beefy *** ones that will never fail. The weld makes it stronger because I had the fabricator also add material to the back off the bend where it bolts down which you can not see in the photo. Hell, I go take a pic now..lol...brb.
Overall, it is hecka strong.
Last edited by Benjamz; 04-25-2010 at 02:51 PM.
04-25-2010, 03:00 PM
#28
Well generally speaking, SS flexes so I'm not sure why you state it doesn't. It might of been stressed beyond the yield point of the material grade but SS in general, flexes. Tool steel is not meant to be flexed and will crack easily under flex. There are also different grades of SS to use that are stronger than one another with different treatments so if someone says SS didn't do it, well SS isn't "a" grade of steel.
To the positioning, it still should not matter. Why? Because all the positioning does it lift or lower the sway bar vertically along the diagonal frame member it bolts into. So long both sides are at the same height then you're fine and there is no binding. Theoretically speaking, you are not increasing or decreasing stress in the bar by adjusting it to any effective amount. The only importance it has to be adjustable is to get around other brackets in the way to fit in the car and/or if any adjustment is left, to move it for the stock end links which are fixed. For me I had adjustable end links so that didn't matter. Also, with the brake cable bracket right there in the way as you mentioned in this thread, you have limited movement already to even adjust it IF you wanted to.
Yes, I read the entire thread before I even replied. The bracket broke because likely you're using stock end links which position the sway bar at quite an angle and as you said, they're weak bracket material. Position of the sway bar brackets is quite limited and when positioned at the same height on both ends doesn't do anything to add/remove stress on those brackets. Perhaps we're looking at it from two different ends. If you are using fixed end links then you're saying it's the sway bar's positioning fault. I say because with what's in the way and our limits to adjust it, you should use adjustable end links instead. What you're doing is likely preloading those end links I bet and instead of them going first, the sway bar bracket is. I could be completely wrong, guess I'll find out with my adjustable links if those clamps give or not.
In a perfect world, regardless of bar height, if the end links are free on the sway bar at regular height with no preload and the sway bar is level even under load during twisting it won't twist in a straight line and is going to put some pressure against the bushings. This means height is irrelevant unless you have no means to adjust your end links and have enough adjustment to take preload off it by tinkering with the sway bar clamp brackets
To the positioning, it still should not matter. Why? Because all the positioning does it lift or lower the sway bar vertically along the diagonal frame member it bolts into. So long both sides are at the same height then you're fine and there is no binding. Theoretically speaking, you are not increasing or decreasing stress in the bar by adjusting it to any effective amount. The only importance it has to be adjustable is to get around other brackets in the way to fit in the car and/or if any adjustment is left, to move it for the stock end links which are fixed. For me I had adjustable end links so that didn't matter. Also, with the brake cable bracket right there in the way as you mentioned in this thread, you have limited movement already to even adjust it IF you wanted to.
Yes, I read the entire thread before I even replied. The bracket broke because likely you're using stock end links which position the sway bar at quite an angle and as you said, they're weak bracket material. Position of the sway bar brackets is quite limited and when positioned at the same height on both ends doesn't do anything to add/remove stress on those brackets. Perhaps we're looking at it from two different ends. If you are using fixed end links then you're saying it's the sway bar's positioning fault. I say because with what's in the way and our limits to adjust it, you should use adjustable end links instead. What you're doing is likely preloading those end links I bet and instead of them going first, the sway bar bracket is. I could be completely wrong, guess I'll find out with my adjustable links if those clamps give or not.
In a perfect world, regardless of bar height, if the end links are free on the sway bar at regular height with no preload and the sway bar is level even under load during twisting it won't twist in a straight line and is going to put some pressure against the bushings. This means height is irrelevant unless you have no means to adjust your end links and have enough adjustment to take preload off it by tinkering with the sway bar clamp brackets
Last edited by Vlaze; 04-25-2010 at 03:16 PM.
04-25-2010, 07:42 PM
#29
Tony says, RX8s are GREAT
Thread Starter
I love that response Vlaze, I'm totally not being sarcastic. This is the very reason why the forums are so usefull. It is because of that input that helps us understand or think about the other potential reason as to what the real problem is.
I do not know all the grades of all the metals. I some is meant for bending and some are not. I do know that I could not use ss in this application for the reason you stated. The ss was bent past the integrity/flex point. The regular one worked fine. But I will ask my fabricator to what metal he used exactly. What ever he used is some pretty tuff **** and I have not had any problems. I do know that if stuff is not welded correctly is can cause more damage then good. But baised on my experience with the canyon driving and time attack events I have been to, my sway bar mounts worked like a charm and have no issues.
I do understand what you are saying and I think you for the input so that those of us can learn and understand what other know.
Thank you for the helpful input and putting me in forum check...lol
Ben
I do not know all the grades of all the metals. I some is meant for bending and some are not. I do know that I could not use ss in this application for the reason you stated. The ss was bent past the integrity/flex point. The regular one worked fine. But I will ask my fabricator to what metal he used exactly. What ever he used is some pretty tuff **** and I have not had any problems. I do know that if stuff is not welded correctly is can cause more damage then good. But baised on my experience with the canyon driving and time attack events I have been to, my sway bar mounts worked like a charm and have no issues.
I do understand what you are saying and I think you for the input so that those of us can learn and understand what other know.
Thank you for the helpful input and putting me in forum check...lol
Ben
04-25-2010, 11:02 PM
#30
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Thanks for posting about this issue. I've just started noticing this same noise. The other day i checked all my suspension bolts and they were tight so i didn't know what it could be 
I bet my brackets have the same problem. They are pretty soft metal -- i've bent one before on accident. My brackets are also bolted off center so i'll be sure to make that adjustment too.
I bet my brackets have the same problem. They are pretty soft metal -- i've bent one before on accident. My brackets are also bolted off center so i'll be sure to make that adjustment too.
11-15-2010, 10:09 AM
#31
Sorry to revive this thread, but i think i am having the same issues here:
https://www.rx8club.com/series-ii-technical-trouble-shooting-160/need-some-help-finding-root-cause-207648/
I will def take a look tonight to see if my brackets are loose or something. That would be spectacular if it is something as simple as that.
https://www.rx8club.com/series-ii-technical-trouble-shooting-160/need-some-help-finding-root-cause-207648/
I will def take a look tonight to see if my brackets are loose or something. That would be spectacular if it is something as simple as that.
11-17-2010, 03:23 AM
#34
Tony says, RX8s are GREAT
Thread Starter
The ones im talking about have additional rails welded accross the bend. I hope you find the problem, I read your other thread, I think you have a different issue... bummer.
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