New engine lasts 3 days
07-17-2007, 10:19 PM
#29
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So I was talking to the dealer again today. They said they were gonna call some "Big Wig" at the Reman. plant. And see if they can possibly speed this up a bit. So as not to be another 3 weeks.
Like that's gonna happen.
I think I'll call MNAO and see what they say.
Thanks MM for the info for the masses.
Like that's gonna happen.
I think I'll call MNAO and see what they say.
Thanks MM for the info for the masses.
07-18-2007, 07:06 AM
#32
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Ask any of the Berge service advisors!
07-18-2007, 06:57 PM
#34
Well ,it looks like Karl contacted the Mazda Reman. Plant.
He tells me that they were very perturbed that one of the new (reman) engines failed.
Well after all was said and done they are going to expidite an engine to the dealership.
Thank you Karl and Berge Mazda. And thank you Mazda.
He tells me that they were very perturbed that one of the new (reman) engines failed.
Well after all was said and done they are going to expidite an engine to the dealership.
Thank you Karl and Berge Mazda. And thank you Mazda.
Last edited by Easy_E1; 07-18-2007 at 07:31 PM.
07-19-2007, 10:30 AM
#35
Registered User
Sorry but I have never delt with Mazda before. I am an ex technician coming from a Porsche dealer and all warranty replacement engines were:
1. New
2. Shipped to the dealer from Atlanta in 2 days
3. Origionally shipped from Germany
4. The defective engines were shipped back to Atlanta and Germany so they could figure out and correct the problem(s)
It just makes me think twice about Mazda if they are using remans for warranty replacements OR customer pay, regardless of the quality.
07-19-2007, 11:18 AM
#37
Sorry but I have never delt with Mazda before. I am an ex technician coming from a Porsche dealer and all warranty replacement engines were:
1. New
2. Shipped to the dealer from Atlanta in 2 days
3. Origionally shipped from Germany
4. The defective engines were shipped back to Atlanta and Germany so they could figure out and correct the problem(s)
It just makes me think twice about Mazda if they are using remans for warranty replacements OR customer pay, regardless of the quality.
1. New
2. Shipped to the dealer from Atlanta in 2 days
3. Origionally shipped from Germany
4. The defective engines were shipped back to Atlanta and Germany so they could figure out and correct the problem(s)
It just makes me think twice about Mazda if they are using remans for warranty replacements OR customer pay, regardless of the quality.
07-20-2007, 12:44 PM
#38
Registered User
07-23-2007, 01:32 AM
#39
kevin@rotaryresurrection
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IT is well known that mazda remans are not as good quality as a new japan-assembled rotary. This is even worse news for the 8 owners because if their first engine failed quickly, think about what the second is likely to do?
I have personally disassembled lots of remans from mazda. Their signature is a ton of sealant on the oilpan, which then gets inside and lodges on the pickup strainer. You'll also find a bunch under the head of the e-shaft front hub bolt, and oozing out of the "legs" of the engine housings adjoining to the oilpan.
I've taken apart an FD reman that lasted less than 20k in a stock car. The FD engine came with 9.0:1 rotors. This particular reman had broken all the apex seals on the front rotor. The rear rotor was a stock 9.0:1; the front rotor was a 9.7:1 from an 89-91 nonturbo 13b. Wonder why it broke?
A few engine builder friends of mine have taken apart plenty of remans too and found various build errors. One found a MISSING side seal. Not broken, not worn...MISSING, never installed. In the older 13b there is no way for a side seal to exit the engine while assembled.
Here is some other info:
http://www.rx7club.com/forum/showpos...9&postcount=93
http://www.rx7club.com/forum/showpos...1&postcount=94
I have personally disassembled lots of remans from mazda. Their signature is a ton of sealant on the oilpan, which then gets inside and lodges on the pickup strainer. You'll also find a bunch under the head of the e-shaft front hub bolt, and oozing out of the "legs" of the engine housings adjoining to the oilpan.
I've taken apart an FD reman that lasted less than 20k in a stock car. The FD engine came with 9.0:1 rotors. This particular reman had broken all the apex seals on the front rotor. The rear rotor was a stock 9.0:1; the front rotor was a 9.7:1 from an 89-91 nonturbo 13b. Wonder why it broke?
A few engine builder friends of mine have taken apart plenty of remans too and found various build errors. One found a MISSING side seal. Not broken, not worn...MISSING, never installed. In the older 13b there is no way for a side seal to exit the engine while assembled.
Here is some other info:
http://www.rx7club.com/forum/showpos...9&postcount=93
http://www.rx7club.com/forum/showpos...1&postcount=94
07-26-2007, 03:15 PM
#42
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That is some seriously f*cked up sh*t.
07-26-2007, 06:28 PM
#44
Mazda Re-manufactured engines
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is a lot of misleading information floating around on Mazda Re-manufactured engines. Some people think they are virtually new engines and other's think they are piles of crap. There was a time when they were not so great but a couple years ago they started putting in a lot of new parts, making them a bargain in some respects.
We have been buying the re-manufactured engines from Mazda for quite a while, simply to use as cores for rebuilds. Customer engines are often so blown up that there are few re-usable parts. This is pretty common for FD motors (13B-REWs) that were detonated by running lean, running too much ignition timing or some fatal combo of the two. What we have found is that Mazda DOES put a lot of brand new parts in their rebuilds...far more new parts than is reflected in the ~$2500 price tag. However -- and this is a big one -- they also often put some scary parts in there as well. Keep in mind, we tear them down before ever running them, so we see the parts in the same condition as installed. Lately, the pattern seems that they are installing bearings that are unbelievably bad. Sometimes it's other parts. A while back, we had one FD engine with two different rotor housings...one was a series 4 NA housing, with exhaust diffuser and different leading spark plug location! Generally, though, it's the small stuff like bearings and the big, expensive stuff is almost all brand new. One that came in the other day, in addition to worn out bearing, the flywheel had ALL BUT ONE pressure plate bolt holes filled with sheared-off bolts. How did they not see that?! Instead of extracting them, we just removed the flywheel and put it on the core we were returning.
Our recommendation is to buy the Mazda Remans for the wealth of new parts, tear them down, check everything, replace any bad parts, port, oil mod and re-assemble. I would never just run one out of the box, having seen what they sometimes put in there.
__________________
Blake Qualley
Pineapple Racing
blake@pineappleracing.com
503-233-3878
This is reassuring
This was written in the year 2006, so I hope they have improved since then.
This might explain the failure of the last engine that lasted 385 miles.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is a lot of misleading information floating around on Mazda Re-manufactured engines. Some people think they are virtually new engines and other's think they are piles of crap. There was a time when they were not so great but a couple years ago they started putting in a lot of new parts, making them a bargain in some respects.
We have been buying the re-manufactured engines from Mazda for quite a while, simply to use as cores for rebuilds. Customer engines are often so blown up that there are few re-usable parts. This is pretty common for FD motors (13B-REWs) that were detonated by running lean, running too much ignition timing or some fatal combo of the two. What we have found is that Mazda DOES put a lot of brand new parts in their rebuilds...far more new parts than is reflected in the ~$2500 price tag. However -- and this is a big one -- they also often put some scary parts in there as well. Keep in mind, we tear them down before ever running them, so we see the parts in the same condition as installed. Lately, the pattern seems that they are installing bearings that are unbelievably bad. Sometimes it's other parts. A while back, we had one FD engine with two different rotor housings...one was a series 4 NA housing, with exhaust diffuser and different leading spark plug location! Generally, though, it's the small stuff like bearings and the big, expensive stuff is almost all brand new. One that came in the other day, in addition to worn out bearing, the flywheel had ALL BUT ONE pressure plate bolt holes filled with sheared-off bolts. How did they not see that?! Instead of extracting them, we just removed the flywheel and put it on the core we were returning.
Our recommendation is to buy the Mazda Remans for the wealth of new parts, tear them down, check everything, replace any bad parts, port, oil mod and re-assemble. I would never just run one out of the box, having seen what they sometimes put in there.
__________________
Blake Qualley
Pineapple Racing
blake@pineappleracing.com
503-233-3878
This is reassuring
This was written in the year 2006, so I hope they have improved since then.This might explain the failure of the last engine that lasted 385 miles.
Last edited by Easy_E1; 07-26-2007 at 06:31 PM.
07-27-2007, 07:30 PM
#45
Well the newly re-manufactured engine (as not to cause confusion) has arrived today. According to Karl ( my personal Mazda mechanic) He will have it installed in about 10 minutes( J/K). Looks like it will be Monday or Tuesday at the latest.
Hope this one lasts longer than the last one. Third times the charm.
Again,, Thanks to Karl and Berge Mazda.
I just wish the dealer was allowed to tear these engines down and inspect and determine what the problems are.
Hope this one lasts longer than the last one. Third times the charm.
Again,, Thanks to Karl and Berge Mazda.
I just wish the dealer was allowed to tear these engines down and inspect and determine what the problems are.
Last edited by Easy_E1; 07-27-2007 at 07:33 PM.
07-27-2007, 08:04 PM
#48
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Hmm. Dumb question, but when it was said the dealer isn't allowed to rip the engine apart, that's in all cases right? I know its all replaced under warranty but after seeing the stuff from RotaryResurrection I'd be curious as to how much it'd cost to have them inspect it before install...
07-27-2007, 08:14 PM
#49
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Good point. Since I've got your "ear" for the moment, any idea of what an "inspection tear down" might cost at a reputable shop?
Personally I'd love the opportunity to do it all myself someday...but I'd have no idea what I'm doing...
Personally I'd love the opportunity to do it all myself someday...but I'd have no idea what I'm doing...
07-27-2007, 08:17 PM
#50
Hmm. Dumb question, but when it was said the dealer isn't allowed to rip the engine apart, that's in all cases right? I know its all replaced under warranty but after seeing the stuff from RotaryResurrection I'd be curious as to how much it'd cost to have them inspect it before install...
They would, I would think, charge you the cost of a rebuild. Labor only , no parts.
I think Mazda won't allow it due to what horrific things the Technician might find. And then it would permanently scar him for life. Might even cause blindness.