F. Chugging, Hesitation, No power.
11-29-2011, 07:32 PM
#1
F. Chugging, Hesitation, No power.
2004 RX8 GT
81,687 Miles
Original Motor
5w20 GTX every 3k
1:32 premix every fill-up
Plugs and wires -3k roughly
Mods:
Turbo XS Catback w/midpipe
AEM CAI
AP w/ MM #4 Tune
Oil Catch Can
BHR Ignition Kit
Ok, here is my story.
Left for work this morning at 530am temperature was about 30 degrees F. Let the car warm up as usual till the gauge read above the "C". Took off keeping under 3k until fully warmed up. Car drove normal and sounded normal. Parked. 2 hours later. Left to come home to change, let the car warm up, same as before, temperature was about 36 now. once it was fully warmed and i reached the highway I stepped on the gas to get up to speed (45mph) wrapped it up in 1st gear to buzzer, and shifted. Cruised the whole way home.
Parked the car and noticed it was making an unusual chugging/rumbble kind of sound and idle was rougher than normal. left it running and got out looked under the car and the noise was coming from the exhaust/header area. Figured maybe it expanded and now I have a small exhaust leak. Shut the car off went inside for hour or so. Came out to head back to work and started the 8 up again. Still same chugging/rumble and vibration. Kinda sounded like a subaru almost, just quieter and not as low of a chugging/rumble noise. Let it idle for a minute and took off, paying close attention throughout the rpm band. Really just seemed like a small exhaust leak. Drove it gentle all the way back to work.
Got to park it and it was a little louder and kind of hesitant on getting up from lower rpms. It really sounded like a subaru now from 1k - 3k rpm. Vibrations worsened, and constant popping almost from underneath the car at the header/exhaust area. Didn't seem to hesitate or sound as bad at higher rpms. Still thinking it may be a good size exhaust leak from the header i shut off the car and went to work. 445pm rolls around and time for me to go home. I go out and start the car. While it is warming up i walk around and look underneath checking for any visible signs of exhaust leak or fluids...Nothing. Sounds remain and so does the vibration and hesitation in lower rpms. I wanted to get home to check it out and lift car up so i can get under it, on my way home while driving at around 2.5k rpm the car stumbles and gets really throaty.
Power loss is significant and it struggles to stay even at idle. I quickly look at gauges and for lights..normal. I coast to a parking spot and let the car idle, its really rough, but holding at 800 rpm, it chugs if i touch the gas but i am still able to take up to 5k, (didn't try to take it higher, but i am sure i could have) but it struggles until about 3k where it smooths out a little. It still sounds like a subaru as far as noises from the exhaust. I lift the hood looking for anything visible, engine is noisy like a deep ticking. I look and listen for vacuum leaks and see and hear nothing. I shut the car off..Inspect vacuum lines and hoses further, make sure intake is still tight, check oil, it is full, check coolant, Normal.
Pacing back and forth and thinking about anything that could be wrong, I go to start it again to try locating anything...it turns over slower than normal almost as if it was flooded, and wont start. It may have been flooded. It tries to start but just barely cant. I sit there pissed...thinking to myself..Have i just blown it? I try one last time to start it, it barely starts, and idles just as rough as before but holds at around 800 rpm. I take slowly up to 5k listening and its worse at lower rpms until about 3k then smooths out some. I let it drop back to idle and it hesitates between 500-1.2k rpm from here on out. I do a quick datalog with my AP at idle and then taking it to 5k and holding it at 3-4k for a short period. Turn car off, call buddy to take me home.
FYI- The whole time i don't get any abnormal readings on gauges and warning lights. I was at the end of my oil change about 2700 miles on that oil.
I am torn between what it could be. A vacuum leak? An exhaust leak? blown engine? Inop Air-pump? Bad MAF?...The only things that make me rule out a blown engine is that the 2 rx7 motors i have blown didn't act like this. 1 from my old 81 rx7 12a motor, smoked like a *****. 1 from my 87 TII, pushed all my coolant into the overflow and just overheated it. Both still ran fine. With the rx8 i am really leaning towards the vacuum leak, exhaust leak, or bad MAF.
Yes I searched, but nothing that sounded like this. I know there are more steps I can do to rule out MAF and others, but it was dark and I had no light.
Any input from anyone would be great. If you need additional info let me know.
Thanks for your time.
Trevor
81,687 Miles
Original Motor
5w20 GTX every 3k
1:32 premix every fill-up
Plugs and wires -3k roughly
Mods:
Turbo XS Catback w/midpipe
AEM CAI
AP w/ MM #4 Tune
Oil Catch Can
BHR Ignition Kit
Ok, here is my story.
Left for work this morning at 530am temperature was about 30 degrees F. Let the car warm up as usual till the gauge read above the "C". Took off keeping under 3k until fully warmed up. Car drove normal and sounded normal. Parked. 2 hours later. Left to come home to change, let the car warm up, same as before, temperature was about 36 now. once it was fully warmed and i reached the highway I stepped on the gas to get up to speed (45mph) wrapped it up in 1st gear to buzzer, and shifted. Cruised the whole way home.
Parked the car and noticed it was making an unusual chugging/rumbble kind of sound and idle was rougher than normal. left it running and got out looked under the car and the noise was coming from the exhaust/header area. Figured maybe it expanded and now I have a small exhaust leak. Shut the car off went inside for hour or so. Came out to head back to work and started the 8 up again. Still same chugging/rumble and vibration. Kinda sounded like a subaru almost, just quieter and not as low of a chugging/rumble noise. Let it idle for a minute and took off, paying close attention throughout the rpm band. Really just seemed like a small exhaust leak. Drove it gentle all the way back to work.
Got to park it and it was a little louder and kind of hesitant on getting up from lower rpms. It really sounded like a subaru now from 1k - 3k rpm. Vibrations worsened, and constant popping almost from underneath the car at the header/exhaust area. Didn't seem to hesitate or sound as bad at higher rpms. Still thinking it may be a good size exhaust leak from the header i shut off the car and went to work. 445pm rolls around and time for me to go home. I go out and start the car. While it is warming up i walk around and look underneath checking for any visible signs of exhaust leak or fluids...Nothing. Sounds remain and so does the vibration and hesitation in lower rpms. I wanted to get home to check it out and lift car up so i can get under it, on my way home while driving at around 2.5k rpm the car stumbles and gets really throaty.
Power loss is significant and it struggles to stay even at idle. I quickly look at gauges and for lights..normal. I coast to a parking spot and let the car idle, its really rough, but holding at 800 rpm, it chugs if i touch the gas but i am still able to take up to 5k, (didn't try to take it higher, but i am sure i could have) but it struggles until about 3k where it smooths out a little. It still sounds like a subaru as far as noises from the exhaust. I lift the hood looking for anything visible, engine is noisy like a deep ticking. I look and listen for vacuum leaks and see and hear nothing. I shut the car off..Inspect vacuum lines and hoses further, make sure intake is still tight, check oil, it is full, check coolant, Normal.
Pacing back and forth and thinking about anything that could be wrong, I go to start it again to try locating anything...it turns over slower than normal almost as if it was flooded, and wont start. It may have been flooded. It tries to start but just barely cant. I sit there pissed...thinking to myself..Have i just blown it? I try one last time to start it, it barely starts, and idles just as rough as before but holds at around 800 rpm. I take slowly up to 5k listening and its worse at lower rpms until about 3k then smooths out some. I let it drop back to idle and it hesitates between 500-1.2k rpm from here on out. I do a quick datalog with my AP at idle and then taking it to 5k and holding it at 3-4k for a short period. Turn car off, call buddy to take me home.
FYI- The whole time i don't get any abnormal readings on gauges and warning lights. I was at the end of my oil change about 2700 miles on that oil.
I am torn between what it could be. A vacuum leak? An exhaust leak? blown engine? Inop Air-pump? Bad MAF?...The only things that make me rule out a blown engine is that the 2 rx7 motors i have blown didn't act like this. 1 from my old 81 rx7 12a motor, smoked like a *****. 1 from my 87 TII, pushed all my coolant into the overflow and just overheated it. Both still ran fine. With the rx8 i am really leaning towards the vacuum leak, exhaust leak, or bad MAF.
Yes I searched, but nothing that sounded like this. I know there are more steps I can do to rule out MAF and others, but it was dark and I had no light.
Any input from anyone would be great. If you need additional info let me know.
Thanks for your time.
Trevor
Last edited by TrevorsTII; 11-29-2011 at 08:15 PM.
11-29-2011, 07:52 PM
#2
Hey!
First of all - paragraphs, please. lol
Sorry. I know you are frustrated, but I am having a hard time reading all of that.
What I got was: cold day. Commute in. All is good. Commute out. All seems good until you go to idle. Then, car becomes chuggy.
What was the idle vacuum? Now that it has cooled off, does it start?
It is really hard to break an NA motor. Pull the spark plugs and the ESS. Turn the motor over and listen for even puffs. Try the stock ignition.
First of all - paragraphs, please. lol
Sorry. I know you are frustrated, but I am having a hard time reading all of that.
What I got was: cold day. Commute in. All is good. Commute out. All seems good until you go to idle. Then, car becomes chuggy.
What was the idle vacuum? Now that it has cooled off, does it start?
It is really hard to break an NA motor. Pull the spark plugs and the ESS. Turn the motor over and listen for even puffs. Try the stock ignition.
Last edited by MazdaManiac; 11-29-2011 at 07:56 PM.
11-29-2011, 08:14 PM
#4
Sorry, i will separate it into paragraphs.
I think it all started with my WOT pull in 1st. From then on it only got worse.
The car is 15 miles from me right now. So i can't check it, but i will tomorrow.
I am pretty sure it will start, but just have a hard time doing so. It starts like it is almost flooded or a weak battery if that helps.
I no longer have the stock ignition, just the BHR kit, it isn't that old, but then again I have been driving on it for the past 3k or so un-tuned.
I guess I won't be uploading them off here. The forum doesn't like csv files. I didn't log vacuum anyways. Just the normal things you look for when sending them for tunes. Stupid me. If I don't figure it out tomorrow I will log another one with vacuum.
I think it all started with my WOT pull in 1st. From then on it only got worse.
The car is 15 miles from me right now. So i can't check it, but i will tomorrow.
I am pretty sure it will start, but just have a hard time doing so. It starts like it is almost flooded or a weak battery if that helps.
I no longer have the stock ignition, just the BHR kit, it isn't that old, but then again I have been driving on it for the past 3k or so un-tuned.
I guess I won't be uploading them off here. The forum doesn't like csv files. I didn't log vacuum anyways. Just the normal things you look for when sending them for tunes. Stupid me. If I don't figure it out tomorrow I will log another one with vacuum.
Hey!
First of all - paragraphs, please. lol
Sorry. I know you are frustrated, but I am having a hard time reading all of that.
What I got was: cold day. Commute in. All is good. Commute out. All seems good until you go to idle. Then, car becomes chuggy.
What was the idle vacuum? Now that it has cooled off, does it start?
It is really hard to break an NA motor. Try the stock ignition.
First of all - paragraphs, please. lol
Sorry. I know you are frustrated, but I am having a hard time reading all of that.
What I got was: cold day. Commute in. All is good. Commute out. All seems good until you go to idle. Then, car becomes chuggy.
What was the idle vacuum? Now that it has cooled off, does it start?
It is really hard to break an NA motor. Try the stock ignition.
Last edited by TrevorsTII; 11-29-2011 at 08:28 PM.
11-29-2011, 09:56 PM
#5
Sorry to hear about the car Trevor,
My car had one of the coils go which caused over fueling and then the cat to overheat which put excessive heat back into he engine resulting in really bad idle and general running and got progressively worse until I got it to the dealer, ultimately new coils, leads and plugs. You can see if this is happening because Cat will be glowing red by the rear O2 sensor. This might not be the same thing but if you run the car for more then a few mins have a look at the cat and make sure it is not glowing.
Good Luck!
My car had one of the coils go which caused over fueling and then the cat to overheat which put excessive heat back into he engine resulting in really bad idle and general running and got progressively worse until I got it to the dealer, ultimately new coils, leads and plugs. You can see if this is happening because Cat will be glowing red by the rear O2 sensor. This might not be the same thing but if you run the car for more then a few mins have a look at the cat and make sure it is not glowing.
Good Luck!
11-30-2011, 09:43 AM
#6
Update: so I got car this morning popped the hood and checked for anything out of the ordinary that pops out, I didn't find one thing. Got and attempted to start it up, after a few trys it crawls on, still doing the rough idle at about 700rpm. Same problems as I left it with. Did a couple more data logs for anyone that cares to help me and look.
Shut it off looked, for anything new, checked and cleaned MAF and made sure all couplers on intake were still tight. Went to start back up and waht do you know, a CEL! Finally something to work with.
P0506 is only code that came up with my accessport. I shut the car off... Any suggestions? I am on my cell and its not the best phone for internet so please bear with me.
Shut it off looked, for anything new, checked and cleaned MAF and made sure all couplers on intake were still tight. Went to start back up and waht do you know, a CEL! Finally something to work with.
P0506 is only code that came up with my accessport. I shut the car off... Any suggestions? I am on my cell and its not the best phone for internet so please bear with me.
12-01-2011, 08:38 AM
#7
This is EXACTLY what my car did and sounded like when I lost compression in the 2nd rotor and they had to replace my engine...exact same symptoms and noise. Also, my car never through a CEL when this happened. Lets just say since then, January of this year, my car has had 5 engine replacements. The 5th one I am on now is running great...finally.
12-01-2011, 06:05 PM
#8
This is EXACTLY what my car did and sounded like when I lost compression in the 2nd rotor and they had to replace my engine...exact same symptoms and noise. Also, my car never through a CEL when this happened. Lets just say since then, January of this year, my car has had 5 engine replacements. The 5th one I am on now is running great...finally.
12-21-2011, 12:56 PM
#10
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Mine made this subaru type sound you speak of least night :/ but it only lasted a like 1 1/2 minutes and then snapped out of it. I thought it was lack of fuel because I just did a 3rd gear pull before it happened and then my gas light came on and then I got this described sound and lack of power. While I was limping it to a gas station and monitoring her vitals (afr and vacuum looked fine) I thought I'd give her on last fighting chance so I got on it again a bit and she snapped out of it. Went to the gas station filled her up and stomped it... no more issue. Am I just really lucky? I hope so! Started fine this morning drove it to work and back crusing and playing a bit and no problems..
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