Excessive Oil Consumption
 

Background info:
-68k miles
-2006 RX8 Sport M/T
-Engine replacement mid 2009 @ 42k miles
-I have noticed no visible leaking, and I don't leave any oil marks on my driveway or garage.

I am consuming roughly 2qts of oil between fill-ups (usually ~200 miles). Previously was about 1-2qts of oil every oil change (3000 miles). I am concerned about the massive amounts of oil being consumed by my car... obviously, my apex seals should last longer, but oil isn't that cheap! Has anyone else had this happen to them, and if so, what ended up being the fix?

That's normal oil consuming rotary engine. I checked mine every month and top it off as needed. You don't really have to worry about it and i know oil is expensive. Just make sure you check the oil level every month or so.

^ Ummm, no. 2 quarts every 200 miles is not exactly normal. 1-2 Quarts every 2000 miles is normal.

OP, I cant say what is wrong, but I have not seen a situation where your consumption is normal... What is your driving style?

thats a bit excessive. do you see blue smoke coming out the exhaust when you start it or rev it?
my S2 burns 0.5qt per 600-700 miles(3 fillups).

There is no way that this car is supposed to consume roughly 2 quarts of oil per Gasoline fill-up (about 200-230 miles, and one week of daily driving, sometimes less). I have had this car for over 2 years, and it usually consumes 1-2 quarts per oil change, if I only checked it once per month, my engine would be bone dry and seized! The last month or so, it has been drinking motor oil. As it stands, I am out of the manufacturer warranty, except for the engine warranty.

I check the oil every fill up, and every time, its 1.5-2 quarts low... but there are no noticeable leaks, or evidence of leaks (drive-way/garage stains). I know the Wankel consumes oil, but this is more than it has ever consumed before. I bought a case of oil 2 weeks ago, and now its down to half a case already. Has anyone had this happen to them under normal driving conditions (I.E. not tracking the car)?

Are you reading your dipstick right? Just making sure ;)
Check your OMP. At times it may be stuck open without throwing CELs.
We should all sign a petition to prevent monchie from posting, he's not only useless but he also fills this board with false and misleading advice for the less experts.

is it smoking at low loads ? ie idle and cruise

Sounds like oil leaking into the combustion chamber either from a worn oil control seal or the OMP is jammed on full somehow .....

Normally, I drive to work, and I drive home... I always try to get a red-line or two in each time I get in the car, but only after she is warmed up. Other than that, its mostly city-highway (yay San Antonio...) and no more than 5-7mph over the posted...

I have noticed a bit of smoking when I first start it up, but its not dense enough to see a color in it. I have noticed it smells more like oil than it used to, and I am not pre-mixing at all. I am due for coils/plugs/wires, which I ordered from mazmart yesterday, but I don't see how that would relate to the oil consumption. I am concerned about the seals around the eccentric shaft and the OMP at this point... The car is running poorly, but I think thats more related to the coils/plugs/wires than anything else. If the tune-up parts dont fix the poor idle, then I know its more likely that it is

I can say I am hoping for the seals cause I am out of the manufacturer warranty for most of the car (bought the car from carmax, and an extended warranty from carmax, but I don't trust carmax with the car, good news is i can take it where ever I want, but I end up having to pay a co-pay)...

I'll double check the start up thing when my wife gets home... maybe that will shed some light on this

how would I go about checking this... I've done plenty of work on cars.. but the most I have done to the RX8 is a plug change...

You should remove it and check the shaft\stepper motor condition.
However if it's blowing smoke at start up i think that you'd contact mazmart for a lil more than just coils and plugs :)

Oil ring failures suck, you might have to take a well working engine apart and rebuild it completely just for a stupid ring. Mazmart's core exchange program is solid and would be the best choice i'm afraid.

If its that, I still have the 8ys/100000 mile engine warranty to fall back on. The coils and plugs were for the rough idle (and its been like 30k miles since last change), if it fixes the rough idle, I know its something with the oil system only.. if the rough idle still persists, its gotta be internal engine/seals of some sort.

I know she is missing at high RPM, and mid-range is feeling meh, but not like before when I ended up needing a new engine. Bad thing is, this is my only car... :(

Downtime for an engine swap is not more than 8hrs if you already have the engine ready... You can do it in 5-6 if you're in a rush but that's definitely not a good practice on a customers' car :)

The 8yrs\100.000miles doesn't apply to new engines as well, i'm not sure about your warranty laws but a check would make up for many mistake :)

Also check your catalyzer, high oil percentages quickly kill it.

Where do I sign up? :smoker:

I thought there were people on this site on their 3rd+ engine from mazda under warranty?

Yes but the replacement units should fall into the minimum legal warranty :)

At first, i didn't say it's losing 2 quarts every month. All i said is check your oil level once a month like i usually do. These engines really eats up oil but not 2 quarts a month. Don't tell me what to say and do.

And by the way, sign the petition. And i know exactly who will do it. :yesnod:

Ill sign, kinda tired of seeing his post in every thread. I do enjoy laughing at most of the post though.

Dude... you totally told me 2 quarts per fillup (~200-230 miles) was normal.......

^ Ignore him, he posts are full of crap anyways. I am down for the petition.

Anyways, back on topic. For your style of driving, the consumption is definitely an issue. As stated before, I would be surprised if your catalytic converter is still live and well :rofl: .

Hey buddy,

I see you are local :) Your consumption is excessive and could be a few things. If you want to stop by the house sometime we can check out oil metering pump to see if adjusting it helps and scan for any codes, etc. It could be something simple or it could mean it's time for a rebuild.

Feel free to PM me and we can talk. Also check out the gulf forum and look for the SARX lounge thread.

NO.16 HIGH OIL CONSUMPTION/LEAKAGE

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BHE010300103W18



16

HIGH OIL CONSUMPTION/LEAKAGE

DESCRIPTION
The oil consumption is excessive.
POSSIBLE CAUSE
• Air cleaner element malfunction (damaged, poor installation)
• Improper dipstick
• Improper engine oil viscosity
• Engine internal parts malfunction
• Metering oil pump malfunction
• Improper operation of metering oil pump control system
• Oil leakage from lubrication system parts and them joints (oil pump, oil filter, oil cooler, housing oil nozzle, manifold oil nozzle etc.)


Diagnostic procedure


STEP

INSPECTION

RESULTS

ACTION

1 Inspect for the following:
• External leakage (lubrication system parts and their joints.)
• Proper dipstick
• Proper engine oil viscosity
• Damaged and/or poor installation air cleaner element
Are all the items normal? Yes Go to the next step.
No Service if necessary.
Repeat Step 1.
2 Perform the metering oil pump control inspection.
(See Metering Oil Pump Control Inspection.)
Does the metering oil pump control properly? Yes Overhaul the engine and repair or replace the malfunctioning parts.
(See Engine Workshop Manual.)
No Repair or replace the malfunctioning parts, according to the metering oil pump control inspection results.
3 Verify test results.
• If normal, return to the diagnostic index to service any additional symptoms.
• If the malfunction remains, inspect the related Service Information and perform the repair or diagnosis.

I came across this earlier, but I could find little on the Metering Oil Pump Control Inspection as far as a task list is concerned... anyone have any info on this?

Here is a great website.

http://foxed.ca/rx7manual/2003mazdarx8/

:ylsuper: an offer too good to pass up ....

Just a minor update, I did check if it was smoking at startup, or during reving, and it is not. Going to have Mazda give it an oil change, and see if the service rep will run the compression test on it before I do the tune-up.

Ask the dealer not to just dump oil in it, but actually use the friggin dipstick the way it is meant to be used. And.....I know you believe you are having high oil consumption, but don't let them overfilll it is my point. That may lead to other issues, and a lot of dealer tech's tend to overfill.

We will be awaiting what they say.......so please update us once you know something.

I am scheduled for an appointment tomorrow, but I have a feeling they may try and use my carmax warranty for payment, and I am heading out of town for work tomorrow afternoon. I may delay the diagnostics till after the plugs/coils/wires to verify if I am still experiencing a lack of power (going to install this weekend if the parts come in). That way they cant say no to a compression test cause my coils and plugs are old.

The stupid carmax warranty has a 50/75 copay on it (50 at carmax/75 anywhere else) and I dont want to be shelling out money for no reason, especially if it is covered under the 8yr 100k mile warranty on the block itself.

If the consumption is due to too much oil getting into the combustion chamber, wouldn't the spark plugs show evidence of fouling? Have you had a chance to take a look at them, considering you do say you're needing to change them soon.

I haven't swapped em yet, that's slated for this weekend. Sometimes it's a curse to have a 13 month old

If you need any help, just let us know

Update: Tune up complete
 

Well, I did my tune up. I think the pics will speak for themselves.

Front Leading Plug:
http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/5...adingfront.jpg

Front Trailing Plug:
http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/1...ilingfront.jpg

Rear Leading Plug:
http://img852.imageshack.us/img852/6614/leadingrear.jpg

Rear Trailing Plug:
http://img861.imageshack.us/img861/7...ailingrear.jpg

As you can see, the front rotor plugs are fouled heavily. It doesn't really show much in the wonderful iPhone 3GS pics, but the trailing front plug was oily. So, basically, either my OMP is pumping a boatload of oil, and my rear injectors are clogged, OR my front rotor is leaking oil like the Titanic took on water. Mind you, this oil consumption has only been bad for the last 2 weeks. I took it for a spin after replacing the plugs, and resetting the computer. When I got on the highway, I kept it in second gear, and after about a minute or two of riding second @ 60-65mph, I got a flashing CEL. I am guessing its either air-fuel related, and my O2 sensors are boned from the excessive oil leaking in the engine. Next stop, Mazda Dealer...

Well, the dealership ran the compression tests. Looks like its time for a new engine. Last I heard from them, they will be filing the warranty paperwork, but I have not heard if it will or wont be covered.

Definitely the motor, they said the front rotor failed compression tests, which i believe, as 1-2 quarts per 200 miles is crazy... plus those spark plugs were BAD from the front rotor.

Well as long as you have maintenance records you should be good. Who is handling your case at North Park?

Shawn's last week was last week. Right now, Joshua is handling it, I don't remember seeing him there much before, but my memory sucks. I know Al handled the last engine replacement 1.5 years ago (@42k miles). We shall see if they want to play nice... if not, I'll be breaking out the angry stick...

Ironically, all the major services, I've had performed by engine replacements... O.o

I haven't made it 30k miles yet on an engine for the coolant flushes, and I do the oil changes at North Park so they are on record :)

You should be good. Shawn quit? wow, he has been there since I got my car years ago. The remans are hit or miss, my first one lasted 75,000 miles, this one has 20k or so on it now.

Got my new engine, only thing I had to pay for was one of the motor mounts. We shall see how she does after the engine break-in ;)

You should have broke her in with us yesterday during the Texas8.

Did you ever find out what the actual problem for the oil consumption was?
I see you just had your engine replaced. I'm having the same problem as you but my car passed a compression test last week even with a bad starter cranking at 178rpm

High oil viscosity leading to high consumption?
 

See the quote below, I'm having high consumption... It's been a problem for about 4 months... I've been using heavy oil, 10w30 for about six months. Could the viscosity be causing the system to rev up consumption in some way I'm not familiar with? Would this happen with a heavier than spec oil? I'm inclined to think so, because there is no oil in my exhaust, no ground spotting... AND it's weird that long hot trips exhibit little oil consumption, whereas short, cold commutes are causing me to put in at LEAST a quart every fill up.

EDIT: 2005 87k on the odo. No coolant consumption

Quote:
Originally Posted by invasion08
NO.16 HIGH OIL CONSUMPTION/LEAKAGE

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


BHE010300103W18



16

HIGH OIL CONSUMPTION/LEAKAGE

DESCRIPTION
The oil consumption is excessive.
POSSIBLE CAUSE
• Air cleaner element malfunction (damaged, poor installation)
• Improper dipstick
• Improper engine oil viscosity
• Engine internal parts malfunction
• Metering oil pump malfunction
• Improper operation of metering oil pump control system
• Oil leakage from lubrication system parts and them joints (oil pump, oil filter, oil cooler, housing oil nozzle, manifold oil nozzle etc.)


Diagnostic procedure


STEP

INSPECTION

RESULTS

ACTION

1 Inspect for the following:
• External leakage (lubrication system parts and their joints.)
• Proper dipstick
• Proper engine oil viscosity
• Damaged and/or poor installation air cleaner element
Are all the items normal? Yes Go to the next step.
No Service if necessary.
Repeat Step 1.
2 Perform the metering oil pump control inspection.
(See Metering Oil Pump Control Inspection.)
Does the metering oil pump control properly? Yes Overhaul the engine and repair or replace the malfunctioning parts.
(See Engine Workshop Manual.)
No Repair or replace the malfunctioning parts, according to the metering oil pump control inspection results.
3 Verify test results.
• If normal, return to the diagnostic index to service any additional symptoms.
• If the malfunction remains, inspect the related Service Information and perform the repair or diagnosis.