ShowHBK

Hey all,

2006 Shinka with 76000 miles.

I took a trip this weekend and drove my 8 perfectly for the 120+ mile trip and topped off the oil before I left. She ran great for the trip and I went around town today with some family and I had no problems at all when we were driving, but when I went to start her to take everyone home it would die after about 3 seconds and then try and come back by itself. When I say "come back" I mean it would seem to stall and then start back up for half a second then die.

I know its not flooded because I tried a de-flood and it instantly went to high rev after i came off the gas slowly.

This has happened to me before and the MAF sensor was to blame and all I needed to do was blow on it or spray it with MAF cleaner and the system would work. This time around I did get an OBDII code of P0113 for "air intake temperature". I was very confused by this because it was only 80 F outside today and not that humid. When I checked the live data for my IAT sensor it was coming back at 38 C

No leaks under the car and no fluids dripping anywhere. fuel pump is priming and sending fuel to the engine because the engine is starting and running for about 3 seconds and a few times even stalls and then comes back for a second. I honestly believe that I need to just go buy some MAF cleaner because my can is at home.

Any ideas would be much appreciated and I am happy to provide any more information if needed.

Ajax

Those aren't flooding symptoms.
Check the battery connectors to make sure the battery cables aren't loose.
If you've got a good connection, clear the computer using the break pedal and try to start it afterwards. (Put the car in accessory and hit the pedal 20x within 8 seconds, watch for the oil pressure sweep).

Nothing wrong with cleaning the MAF sensor.

ShowHBK

BOOM! She works now. Cleaned the MAF sensor and disconnected the negative side of the battery to get it to run. I took her around the block with no problems but my traction control light is on and it looked like it just wanted me to turn the wheel all the way left and right to reset my turning radius? Not sure but it's off now.

Thanks for the help and advice
:-)

ShowHBK

Sorry to open up this issue again but I was able to get the car home last night with no problems... she made the trip back home after I cleaned the MAF sensor and disconnected and reconnected the battery. When I woke up this morning I attempted to go get some food when after ignition I noticed that my crank was about two seconds longer than it should have been and the car would not idle and just die, but then after three seconds it would come right back and start itself (with my foot on the clutch still) then die again, then start itself, then it finally died.

I attempted to clean the MAF sensor again spraying the sensor, the hole, and the plug itself but the car still will not idle. It will instead crank fine but then die still after three seconds.

Oil Levels are fine, Fuel pump is priming, engine is not making any noise, no OBDII errors or CEL on, I tried pumping the break 20 times as well.

after researching on this site for a little while and some advice from a friend I am beginning to think i have a bad E-shaft sensor or it may be loose? any ideas?

kevinande

Make sure the battery connections are on nice and tight and there is no corrosion on the cable ends. Pull the ESS sensor if you suspect it may be a problem and simply clean it off and replace. Do the reset again and see how she runs. That's all that comes to mind at the moment.

ShowHBK

The Battery connector is a good idea... Ill check that as well.

Could i also get a confirmation on the location of ESS sensor? I found this Youtube Video but I just would like a confirmation on if this video is correct on the location.

kevinande

If you look at the crank pulley from the front of the car, it is just below that on the right hand side close to the bottom. It is easily accessed from underneath the car. 1 bolt and an electrical connector is all there is to disconnect.

ShowHBK

*UPDATE*

so I went out today and jacked her up and found the ESS sensor and was shocked to see it was the only thing that was clean under my car. I wiped it off as best i could but could not get it loose or off because the screw is rusted shut and I unfortunately do not have a crows foot to get it off.

I cleaned the MAF sensor again, but I neglected to mention something about my MAF sensor in a previous post...

The 2 screws holding my MAF sensor on are not originals and the orange/black rubber ring around my MAF is missing. The screw holes are 99.9% stripped and only the top screw is holding the sensor on (but just barley).

The car will once again, start but the crank is very short and if I give it gas at any point or time it will instantly die. My money is on the fact that I now believe 1 of 2 things. 1. The Sensor is letting in to much air into the engine due to the leak at the sensor hole or 2. the sensor is fried/broken due to not being attached properly.

any ideas? I'm thinking of just buying a new MAF sensor and seeing if that fixes the problem.

ShowHBK

*UPDATE*

Found the source of the problem.

It was the MAF sensor for sure. I was working on the car today and decided to unplug the sensor and run the car but it would just do the same things, so I plugged it back in and had a friend hold it down and BOOM! she runs fine....there was a noticeable bit of oil dripping a little out of the tail pipe after i got it to run... but now that I know its the sensor I have a source of the problem.

thanks anyone who has replied in this thread... your advice helps out a lot

wcs

iTrader: (2)

Ok,
Update us please.

My bet is still on coils and plugs

ShowHBK

It still could be tbh... I know the coils and plugs are original to the car but the engine is it's second one. When I was under the car I could tell they did a half *** job on putting the new one in because I can clearly see screws that were not placed in some areas of the wiring and what looks to be a mount for something.

04Green

iTrader: (1)

ciols and plugs next. if ess was clean, somebody was trying to get it to run.

check the $100 thread in my sig for some other ideas, like grounds.

also, make sure the ecu gets to learn after the changes. start it and let it idle until the idle comes down to 800 and is smooth.

Posted From RX8Club.com Android App

ShowHBK

*UPDATE*

Worked on the car a little more today and she was driving fine over the past few days to be honest. but we are back to the same problem with the car shutting down after about three seconds or so.

I got a new O-ring for the MAF sensor and new screws that were a little shorter and a little wider and now the MAF sensor is on the car and is rock solid and clean.

My friend and I noticed something odd though near the back end of the intake system when starting the car up. We could hear an audible sucking in of air somewhere behind the upper intake manifold but could not pinpoint where at was. Now, this is where things get a little weird. He sprayed the entire intake manifold with starter fluid while i cranked the engine to see if there was a leak and no joke the car started to run but had a VERY weird crank. The car ran fine then idled for about 5 or six minutes with me giving the engine a few good spins up to about 4-5K and no problems at all until I took it to about 6k and then the engine shut itself off with a little backfire out the back.

Now I feel like i have to take apart the entire UIM to see if there is a leak anyplace. or get another compression test done on the engine, but I already had the engine tested when a got the car a year ago, so i feel like that cant be the problem.

any ideas?

ShowHBK

*UPDATE*

So I got down and dirty and did some more work today. Here are some images I took while working under the hood. Also Attached to this is my Live ODB2 Data for two different key cycle starts back to back.

I checked the intake, cleaned the MAF, checked for VAC leaks and everything is on solid. I checked the coils and there are no silver spots or stars under them to show any signs of wear on them. (NOTE! please omit the fact that a screw is missing in one of the shots on the front coil. I put it back on after the photo was taken.) I checked my Oil and its 100% full on the dipstick. I am clueless at this point as to what is causing the problem.

The car still cranks really fast and I now get a flashing CEL after the car stalls. is there anyone out there who could read my OBD2 data and maybe see whats going wrong here? I was under the impression that a flashing CEL was for misfires but the engine is not misfiring from what I can hear and tell. Any and all help with this information would be much appreciated and I am willing to send beer at this point to anyone who can figure out what is wrong... I am trying to avoid going to the stealership.

P.S. I have seen that CEL code before in the data and the temperature here today was 89 F but the air around the car was much lower then that.

blckninja

iTrader: (1)

What were the numbers for the compression test last year? Does it stall only at idle?

dannobre

iTrader: (3)

Unplug the MAF and see if it will run. If your IAT threw a code and is giving you incorrect values you need to replace the MAF as they are together in the same sensor. Cleaning a broken one wont fix it

If you have a buddy with an 8 swap his in to try it before you get another one

ShowHBK

I think its interesting you said this, because I called my mechanic today and he told me to try the same thing after I put it all back together again and it still would not idle after I unplugged the MAF sensor. My Father has a 2008 MX-5 with the same MAF sensor... Ill try that when I see him.

I don't have the compression numbers from when I had it tested unfortunately and it will stall about 2-3 seconds after ignition AND when I try to give it gas. The only thing I have not checked is the fuel pump at this point but, the car is priming and pumping from what the OBD2 data shows.

dannobre

iTrader: (3)

There isn't any OBD11 data that will give you fuel pressure or anything like it.

If you don't know if you have fuel or ignition for sure that is a good place to start

You can jump the fuel pump in the fusebox...there is a 2 pin connector that turns it on

ShowHBK

Oh, sorry I must have misunderstood that fuel thing in the OBDII log...

my bad

ShowHBK

*UPDATE*

so to bring everything full circle here I have compiled a list of things that I have done to the car up to this point and I still have no clue as to what is going on.

This is the TL;DR version of this entire thread.

Car dies three seconds after ignition:

Crank is fine, fuel pump primes (because the car IS in fact running for that three seconds). One thing to note here is that the crank normally takes about two seconds and then the engine starts, but now it only takes about 1 or less and boom the engine starts.

Things that have been checked or done.

1. MAF inspected and cleaned (known issues before hand)
2. MAF screwed down properly and does not wiggle
3. MAF taken out of a 09 MX-5 and tested but problem still persists
4. dismantled the UIM and air intake to check for leaks (see pics above)
5. Inspected all the coils and plugs (no silver stars on the bottom or issues)
6. Spark plugs inspected ( no problems)
7. OBDII reader throws up code P0113 for "air intake temperature" sometimes (but not all the time)
8. CEL comes on now on occasion and will flash a few times after the car shuts off (no audible misfires can be heard from engine)
9. Tried running the car off the key and not the Advanced key
10. Check the Oil (its fine, but I do need an Oil change (3000 miles))
11. check the battery, both + and -, and cleaned them
12. no fluids leaking anywhere
13. Fuel pump seems to be working ( can hear it prime, and the engine runs)
14. OBDII data has been posted to this thread and (after research) can tell that it shows nothing wrong with the car while it is running.
15. Break pumped 20 times to reset ECU

have not been able to find an other Youtube video or thread that deals with my problem. I will post A video tomorrow of the car having the issue.

The flashing CEL troubles me, and after doing research it means a misfire. My own accounts contradict this because there are no misfires occurring during ignition, crank, or during the three seconds of live engine time that I can hear.

My work continues on this issue and I am willing to provide anything from pics to videos if someone else may have a clue.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

car dies instantly if the MAf is unplug.

to op, check your wiring harness and the plug, cuz car dies almost instantly when it does not sense the MAF (or when its having connection issue)

jasonrxeight

can be a throttle body problem too. my dad's car just had the same problem. it does not want to idle.

ShowHBK

In your opinion what would be the best why to go about cleaning the throttle body? because I went out to my local auto parts store and they had a two pack of throttle body cleaner and MAF cleaner so I went ahead and got that, but the bottle of throttle body cleaner says "do not use on rotary engines"

The tip about the MAF sounds weird to me. I believe you 100% about what you are saying, but I called the local Mazda dealership the other day and they told me that the car "should" idle without the MAF plugged in and I have never heard of such a thing. Was that guy just lying though his teeth to me?

dannobre

iTrader: (3)

It will idle without the MAF...and for that matter it will run above idle as well

Does it quit suddenly...or sorta starve itself till it dies?

ShowHBK

Starts up, runs for 3 seconds, then quits suddenly. No beeps, no engine knocking, no misfires.


I'm working on it right now... ill post a video if it keeps doing it.