Possible New Renesis Engine Failure Theory?
#376
Personally, I believe a few things contribute to the premature failure of the Renesis motor. I think you can look at the changes to the Series II and get a good idea of what the problem areas are with the Series I.
I think a malfunctioning OMP system will affect engine life eventually. Whether the affect is from the lack of cooling from the oil injectors or from a lack of lubrication is debatable but likely both are important. IMO, Injecting dirty engine oil is not ideal, Mazda only did this because the normal owner is not going to monitor and refill an oil reservoir. Premixing also helps but again, the average owner is not going to mess with premixing their fuel. I believe premixing and running the SOHN are necessary if you want your engine to live a long healthy life. We have seen bearing wear. I attribute that to insufficient 5W-20 oil in high load/high temp "extreme" situations and possibly due to low oil pressure. Running fully synthetic (if you have the SOHN) 40 weight or higher is a good idea and changing your oil regularly is a must due to the amount that remains in the engine and coolers. The Mazmart oil pressure mod is a no brainer.
Cooling is always a concern. Coolant temps and oil temps should be monitored and if you are seeing excessive temps then they should be addressed. There are several options to address these issues like proper ducting, freeing up area behind the fans, secondary radiators, Mazmart water pump, Mazmart Thermostat, better radiators (griffin, Ron Davis, etc.) better oil coolers, or simplified oil lines like the Racing Beat lines, and better coolers or a large single oil cooler.
Filtration is also important, and personally I don’t think there is any real benefit to running a hi flow filter on a street driven vehicle. The minuscule HP gains are far outweighed by the damage sand and other types of dirt can do to your engine. All I have to do is look at the built up dirt in the tray under my intake box to see what could possibly make it into my engine. I’ll stick with an OEM type WIX filter on this motor.
Habits are important too, if you are the type who just gets in your car in the morning and takes off, driving hard when the engine and oil are cold, then you are likely doing damage to your engine. The engine needs to be warmed up before revving hard and a stock 8 takes some time to get fully warmed up. I am in South Texas and even here when the factory temp gauge reads normal, the oil is still too cold to start redlining or putting a high load on the engine. However, to avoid moisture in the oil, and to help minimize carbon build up the RX8 needs to warmed up and driven hard from time to time.
Of course, if you only plan on owning the RX8 for a year or two and could care less if it makes it to 100-150,000 miles then just drive the damn thing and don’t worry about all this
I think a malfunctioning OMP system will affect engine life eventually. Whether the affect is from the lack of cooling from the oil injectors or from a lack of lubrication is debatable but likely both are important. IMO, Injecting dirty engine oil is not ideal, Mazda only did this because the normal owner is not going to monitor and refill an oil reservoir. Premixing also helps but again, the average owner is not going to mess with premixing their fuel. I believe premixing and running the SOHN are necessary if you want your engine to live a long healthy life. We have seen bearing wear. I attribute that to insufficient 5W-20 oil in high load/high temp "extreme" situations and possibly due to low oil pressure. Running fully synthetic (if you have the SOHN) 40 weight or higher is a good idea and changing your oil regularly is a must due to the amount that remains in the engine and coolers. The Mazmart oil pressure mod is a no brainer.
Cooling is always a concern. Coolant temps and oil temps should be monitored and if you are seeing excessive temps then they should be addressed. There are several options to address these issues like proper ducting, freeing up area behind the fans, secondary radiators, Mazmart water pump, Mazmart Thermostat, better radiators (griffin, Ron Davis, etc.) better oil coolers, or simplified oil lines like the Racing Beat lines, and better coolers or a large single oil cooler.
Filtration is also important, and personally I don’t think there is any real benefit to running a hi flow filter on a street driven vehicle. The minuscule HP gains are far outweighed by the damage sand and other types of dirt can do to your engine. All I have to do is look at the built up dirt in the tray under my intake box to see what could possibly make it into my engine. I’ll stick with an OEM type WIX filter on this motor.
Habits are important too, if you are the type who just gets in your car in the morning and takes off, driving hard when the engine and oil are cold, then you are likely doing damage to your engine. The engine needs to be warmed up before revving hard and a stock 8 takes some time to get fully warmed up. I am in South Texas and even here when the factory temp gauge reads normal, the oil is still too cold to start redlining or putting a high load on the engine. However, to avoid moisture in the oil, and to help minimize carbon build up the RX8 needs to warmed up and driven hard from time to time.
Of course, if you only plan on owning the RX8 for a year or two and could care less if it makes it to 100-150,000 miles then just drive the damn thing and don’t worry about all this
didnt know this... (next mod,Sohn it is... anyone knows where to get a ready custom made fluid holder with tube for the somp?) Thanks 9krpmrx8 !
Veryz nice summary writeup !!!
#378
Super Moderator
V Good, Cut off seal red arrow is a little too long, actually pointing to Oil Control Rings (orange, which are sold as a PAIR inner and Outer), the outer green ring is the COS.
#382
Registered User
Great post OP. Im going to make SS braided lines for the OMP oil lines. Any1 wishing to recieve more info on this please PM me. this could be a great addition to our cars and prolong the engine life.
:
:
#383
SARX Legend
Thread Starter
iTrader: (46)
Thanks. SS OMP lines are not really worth the hassle, you just need to check yours or just replace them and the oil injectors as a precautionary measure if you wish.
#384
Out of NYC
iTrader: (1)
yea, the most outer ring is the cut off seal, not the red one.
I always wonder if I can use the newer corner seal on older engine like my FC S5.
I know I can use the spring from FD into my FC(cuz FC and older rotary corner seal spring is garbage)
just not sure about the corner seal and plugs. if I can use the Renesis Corner seal & plug + its springs that will be cool.
I always wonder if I can use the newer corner seal on older engine like my FC S5.
I know I can use the spring from FD into my FC(cuz FC and older rotary corner seal spring is garbage)
just not sure about the corner seal and plugs. if I can use the Renesis Corner seal & plug + its springs that will be cool.
#386
BearBlasterExtraordinair!
iTrader: (3)
One thing I was thinking about a little while ago... With the Sohn adapter installed, the chances of your lines getting gunked up are probably slim to none. I remember looking at them before, and there were air bubbles and junk all through them. Now, they are nice and full of clean two stroke.
Just for that reason alone (no air bubbles, no gunk) this mod was 100% worth it.
Just for that reason alone (no air bubbles, no gunk) this mod was 100% worth it.
#387
I wanted to thank you guys for all your input on possible solutions to the 8's engine failures.
I recently had my engine replaced a few day's ago. It's my daily driver with 62,000 easy miles.
All routine service was performed religously, only to have a low compression motor. With that
shocking news, I began reading all the posts on what to do when my replacement motor arrived. First. I got the oil lines and injecters, a mazmart water pump and t-stat. A new clutch,
radiator hoses,BHR ignition. Then I asked my service guy to install these parts when the new motor arrived. No problem he said, only the water pump was a new upgraded version. I asked to replace it anyway and give me the new pump for later use. To my surprise (and the service guy) the mazmart unit was far superior to the upgraded one. It's nothing more than a stock pump with small impeller blades. I also added new belts, even though they said my old ones were fine. Everything was installed except the ignition. I'm saving that for Charles @ BHR. I'm already premixing with Idemitsu and will change my oil 1,000 miles from now. My only concern is my warranty will expire in 38,000 miles So. I hope these efforts will give me some longevity. I love driving this car and hope to do so for years to come. So. Thanks guys and keep up the good work.
I recently had my engine replaced a few day's ago. It's my daily driver with 62,000 easy miles.
All routine service was performed religously, only to have a low compression motor. With that
shocking news, I began reading all the posts on what to do when my replacement motor arrived. First. I got the oil lines and injecters, a mazmart water pump and t-stat. A new clutch,
radiator hoses,BHR ignition. Then I asked my service guy to install these parts when the new motor arrived. No problem he said, only the water pump was a new upgraded version. I asked to replace it anyway and give me the new pump for later use. To my surprise (and the service guy) the mazmart unit was far superior to the upgraded one. It's nothing more than a stock pump with small impeller blades. I also added new belts, even though they said my old ones were fine. Everything was installed except the ignition. I'm saving that for Charles @ BHR. I'm already premixing with Idemitsu and will change my oil 1,000 miles from now. My only concern is my warranty will expire in 38,000 miles So. I hope these efforts will give me some longevity. I love driving this car and hope to do so for years to come. So. Thanks guys and keep up the good work.
#389
SARX Legend
Thread Starter
iTrader: (46)
I wanted to thank you guys for all your input on possible solutions to the 8's engine failures.
I recently had my engine replaced a few day's ago. It's my daily driver with 62,000 easy miles.
All routine service was performed religously, only to have a low compression motor. With that
shocking news, I began reading all the posts on what to do when my replacement motor arrived. First. I got the oil lines and injecters, a mazmart water pump and t-stat. A new clutch,
radiator hoses,BHR ignition. Then I asked my service guy to install these parts when the new motor arrived. No problem he said, only the water pump was a new upgraded version. I asked to replace it anyway and give me the new pump for later use. To my surprise (and the service guy) the mazmart unit was far superior to the upgraded one. It's nothing more than a stock pump with small impeller blades. I also added new belts, even though they said my old ones were fine. Everything was installed except the ignition. I'm saving that for Charles @ BHR. I'm already premixing with Idemitsu and will change my oil 1,000 miles from now. My only concern is my warranty will expire in 38,000 miles So. I hope these efforts will give me some longevity. I love driving this car and hope to do so for years to come. So. Thanks guys and keep up the good work.
I recently had my engine replaced a few day's ago. It's my daily driver with 62,000 easy miles.
All routine service was performed religously, only to have a low compression motor. With that
shocking news, I began reading all the posts on what to do when my replacement motor arrived. First. I got the oil lines and injecters, a mazmart water pump and t-stat. A new clutch,
radiator hoses,BHR ignition. Then I asked my service guy to install these parts when the new motor arrived. No problem he said, only the water pump was a new upgraded version. I asked to replace it anyway and give me the new pump for later use. To my surprise (and the service guy) the mazmart unit was far superior to the upgraded one. It's nothing more than a stock pump with small impeller blades. I also added new belts, even though they said my old ones were fine. Everything was installed except the ignition. I'm saving that for Charles @ BHR. I'm already premixing with Idemitsu and will change my oil 1,000 miles from now. My only concern is my warranty will expire in 38,000 miles So. I hope these efforts will give me some longevity. I love driving this car and hope to do so for years to come. So. Thanks guys and keep up the good work.
Man, good on you. It is so nice to see a newbie who took the time to search and do his homework. You should be given a prize or something, hmmmmmmmmmmmm..............
#390
Super Moderator
I wanted to thank you guys for all your input on possible solutions to the 8's engine failures.
I recently had my engine replaced a few day's ago. It's my daily driver with 62,000 easy miles.
All routine service was performed religously, only to have a low compression motor. With that
shocking news, I began reading all the posts on what to do when my replacement motor arrived. First. I got the oil lines and injecters, a mazmart water pump and t-stat. A new clutch,
radiator hoses,BHR ignition. Then I asked my service guy to install these parts when the new motor arrived. No problem he said, only the water pump was a new upgraded version. I asked to replace it anyway and give me the new pump for later use. To my surprise (and the service guy) the mazmart unit was far superior to the upgraded one. It's nothing more than a stock pump with small impeller blades. I also added new belts, even though they said my old ones were fine. Everything was installed except the ignition. I'm saving that for Charles @ BHR. I'm already premixing with Idemitsu and will change my oil 1,000 miles from now. My only concern is my warranty will expire in 38,000 miles So. I hope these efforts will give me some longevity. I love driving this car and hope to do so for years to come. So. Thanks guys and keep up the good work.
I recently had my engine replaced a few day's ago. It's my daily driver with 62,000 easy miles.
All routine service was performed religously, only to have a low compression motor. With that
shocking news, I began reading all the posts on what to do when my replacement motor arrived. First. I got the oil lines and injecters, a mazmart water pump and t-stat. A new clutch,
radiator hoses,BHR ignition. Then I asked my service guy to install these parts when the new motor arrived. No problem he said, only the water pump was a new upgraded version. I asked to replace it anyway and give me the new pump for later use. To my surprise (and the service guy) the mazmart unit was far superior to the upgraded one. It's nothing more than a stock pump with small impeller blades. I also added new belts, even though they said my old ones were fine. Everything was installed except the ignition. I'm saving that for Charles @ BHR. I'm already premixing with Idemitsu and will change my oil 1,000 miles from now. My only concern is my warranty will expire in 38,000 miles So. I hope these efforts will give me some longevity. I love driving this car and hope to do so for years to come. So. Thanks guys and keep up the good work.
YES, definitely change Oil at 600-1000 Miles, I would ALSO renew your Oil Filter and also Buy an Oil Filter Magnet.
I am not sure "if" the Remans have the RX-7 FC INTERNAL Oil Pan Magnet like the Series 2 RX-8's have, anyway the Oil Filter Magnet is external, and a must IMO.
YES, Pre-Mix...a must.
Some advise, renew your spark plugs much sooner than recommended, IMO every,20,000 Kilometres or 12-15,000 Miles.
Also, just keep your eye on your Coolant Level when you get your car back from Dealer (new engine), also take car for a drive with HEATER on full, just to make sure any air pockets are eliminated, the Dealer should do this, but not always.
Check coolant levels during a few weeks of use, there is a F mark on the left side of coolant bottle, I keep mine just past the F when HOT, it will be lower when coolant/engine is cold.(all the usual warnings about pressure cap applies when engine is hot).
If you are in a HOT Climate, open up the REAR of your black plastic splash guards (behind oil coolers) to allow more or easier air flow through your two oil coolers.
AND, make sure you Oil Level is Full, not over full.
Good Luck!
Last edited by ASH8; 03-30-2011 at 11:21 PM.
#392
Registered
iTrader: (3)
Desert guy? Get the Az rotary club out there--they have a LOT of good info and seem to have a bunch of good guys.
My suggestion since you live in such a hot climate---get a real engine coolant gauge--the oem one sucks big time.
Make SURE after the engine install that the foam around the radiator has not been bothered and it is still sealed up.
I would also suggest better coolant fans and a secondary radiator if you notice your coolant temps getting over 220F.
Yes and you are doing your homework--- kudos for sure.
rotor on dude
olddragger
My suggestion since you live in such a hot climate---get a real engine coolant gauge--the oem one sucks big time.
Make SURE after the engine install that the foam around the radiator has not been bothered and it is still sealed up.
I would also suggest better coolant fans and a secondary radiator if you notice your coolant temps getting over 220F.
Yes and you are doing your homework--- kudos for sure.
rotor on dude
olddragger
#393
Surf Hard, Drive Hard
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Indialantic, Florida
Posts: 7,840
Likes: 0
Received 11 Likes
on
9 Posts
Yes GOOD ON YOU mate...for doing research BEFORE hand!! ..
YES, definitely change Oil at 600-1000 Miles, I would ALSO renew your Oil Filter and also Buy an Oil Filter Magnet.
I am not sure "if" the Remans have the RX-7 FC INTERNAL Oil Pan Magnet like the Series 2 RX-8's have, anyway the Oil Filter Magnet is external, and a must IMO.
YES, Pre-Mix...a must.
Some advise, renew your spark plugs much sooner than recommended, IMO every,20,000 Kilometres or 12-15,000 Miles.
Also, just keep your eye on your Coolant Level when you get your car back from Dealer (new engine), also take car for a drive with HEATER on full, just to make sure any air pockets are eliminated, the Dealer should do this, but not always.
Check coolant levels during a few weeks of use, there is a F mark on the left side of coolant bottle, I keep mine just past the F when HOT, it will be lower when coolant/engine is cold.(all the usual warnings about pressure cap applies when engine is hot).
If you are in a HOT Climate, open up the REAR of your black plastic splash guards (behind oil coolers) to allow more or easier air flow through your two oil coolers.
AND, make sure you Oil Level is Full, not over full.
Good Luck!
YES, definitely change Oil at 600-1000 Miles, I would ALSO renew your Oil Filter and also Buy an Oil Filter Magnet.
I am not sure "if" the Remans have the RX-7 FC INTERNAL Oil Pan Magnet like the Series 2 RX-8's have, anyway the Oil Filter Magnet is external, and a must IMO.
YES, Pre-Mix...a must.
Some advise, renew your spark plugs much sooner than recommended, IMO every,20,000 Kilometres or 12-15,000 Miles.
Also, just keep your eye on your Coolant Level when you get your car back from Dealer (new engine), also take car for a drive with HEATER on full, just to make sure any air pockets are eliminated, the Dealer should do this, but not always.
Check coolant levels during a few weeks of use, there is a F mark on the left side of coolant bottle, I keep mine just past the F when HOT, it will be lower when coolant/engine is cold.(all the usual warnings about pressure cap applies when engine is hot).
If you are in a HOT Climate, open up the REAR of your black plastic splash guards (behind oil coolers) to allow more or easier air flow through your two oil coolers.
AND, make sure you Oil Level is Full, not over full.
Good Luck!
There have been quite a few that weren't replaced with "re-mans" and started fires.
I wouldn't touch them, but I would give them a good look over and if I smelled any gas at all, I'd be all over them!
Last edited by Mazurfer; 03-31-2011 at 04:27 PM.
#394
Super Moderator
Agree Dave..
#396
Surf Hard, Drive Hard
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Indialantic, Florida
Posts: 7,840
Likes: 0
Received 11 Likes
on
9 Posts
^............if talking about the fuel hose, then "yeah, I totally agree".............did that point not come across?
Anyway.............not what this thread is about, so now...............back on topic.
Anyway.............not what this thread is about, so now...............back on topic.
Last edited by Mazurfer; 04-01-2011 at 08:33 AM.
#400
BearBlasterExtraordinair!
iTrader: (3)
I try not to swear... On the interbutz and out in the scary real world. I do a pretty good job, usually... Hahah
I wonder what sort of percentage decrease in injector failure there would be with the Sohn? I would imagine they wouldn't get gummed up with dirt... I imagine it would be pretty close to 0, since all you would have is mechanical failure. Besides, they would have a constant supply of lube... Hahah
I wonder what sort of percentage decrease in injector failure there would be with the Sohn? I would imagine they wouldn't get gummed up with dirt... I imagine it would be pretty close to 0, since all you would have is mechanical failure. Besides, they would have a constant supply of lube... Hahah