Blackstone labs results .... w0w
03-01-2007, 01:51 PM
#1
Blackstone labs results .... w0w
The results came in this morning thru my email. I sent motor and rear diff oil. I opened it up and I was like wtf ?
I had nothing but RP in it. but this sample is my first and ONLY sample that I've never added any oil after the change. the oil dip stick saids I have about 1/2 oil left before I drain this sample oil out.
Aluminu 2
Chromium 22 (Where these came from)
Iron 63 (where these high numbers came from)
Copper 2
Lead 3
Tin 1
Nickel 1
Manganese 1
Silver 0
Titanium 0
Potassium 0
Boron 9
Silicon 12
Sodium 7
Calcium 1974
Magnesium 1085 (wtf ? Universal average is 25 and I have 1085?)
Phosphorus 661
Zinc 780
Barium 0
SUS Viscosity 64.7 (should be 54-61)
Flashpoint 360 (should be >365)
Fuel TR (should be <2.0, what TR means anyway)
Antifreeze 0.0 (should be 0 of course)
Water 0.0 (should be <0.1)
Insolubles 0.3 (should be <0.6)
Comments : Your 25000 mile rotay engine is leaving quite alot of chromium and iron in the oil after the 3000 mile use run. You would know better than we, the source for these metals. Rings, in pistion engines, leave chrome in the oil. Our average oil sample for this type engine has 2705 miles on it, so you may want to consider fewer oil use miles for the next sample. Universal average wear levels are based on those miles. We found a trace of gas in the oil and a higher than expected viscosity. The TBN was 4.4 still okay. Air and oil filtration are doing wel..
I need Comments ! please come in ! give me Comments !
Here is the Rear Differential, First change @ 5K, Second change at around 19 or 20K miles not sure.
Aluminum 2
Chromium 12
Iron 852 (@!#@!#@,Universal Averages 319)
Copper 1
Lead 0
Tin 0
Molybdenum 118 (Universal Average 5 ?!)
Nickel 1
Manganese 25 (Universal Average 7?)
Silver 0
Titanium 0
Potassium 5
Boron 266 (Universal Average 128)
Silicon 48
Sodium 3
Calcium 47 (Average 593!?)
Magnesium 9 (Average 59 ?)
Phosphorus 2436 (Average 1117?)
Zinc 4
Barium 3
SUS Viscosity 72.3
Flashpoint 345
Water 0.0
Insolubles 0.3
Comments : We assume this is the second oil tha was in use in this differential. The high chrome is possibly from a bearing unit while the high iron is from the steels parts sharing the oil. These high wear metals could still be from new parts going through wear-in. Iniversal averages for typical wear are shown in the far right column for comparison to a differential that has finished wear-in. The TBN was 1.7. A reading of 1.0 is considered too low for remaining "active" additive in the oil. Since you changed out this oil, the new fill should be good for at least 24000 miles. Check back.
Hmm is it going to affect the results if I didnt change my magnet plug ? Cuz when I did my first change @ 5K I didnt change the plugs, and these are the oil from that one.
I had nothing but RP in it. but this sample is my first and ONLY sample that I've never added any oil after the change. the oil dip stick saids I have about 1/2 oil left before I drain this sample oil out.
Aluminu 2
Chromium 22 (Where these came from)
Iron 63 (where these high numbers came from)
Copper 2
Lead 3
Tin 1
Nickel 1
Manganese 1
Silver 0
Titanium 0
Potassium 0
Boron 9
Silicon 12
Sodium 7
Calcium 1974
Magnesium 1085 (wtf ? Universal average is 25 and I have 1085?)
Phosphorus 661
Zinc 780
Barium 0
SUS Viscosity 64.7 (should be 54-61)
Flashpoint 360 (should be >365)
Fuel TR (should be <2.0, what TR means anyway)
Antifreeze 0.0 (should be 0 of course)
Water 0.0 (should be <0.1)
Insolubles 0.3 (should be <0.6)
Comments : Your 25000 mile rotay engine is leaving quite alot of chromium and iron in the oil after the 3000 mile use run. You would know better than we, the source for these metals. Rings, in pistion engines, leave chrome in the oil. Our average oil sample for this type engine has 2705 miles on it, so you may want to consider fewer oil use miles for the next sample. Universal average wear levels are based on those miles. We found a trace of gas in the oil and a higher than expected viscosity. The TBN was 4.4 still okay. Air and oil filtration are doing wel..
I need Comments ! please come in ! give me Comments !
Here is the Rear Differential, First change @ 5K, Second change at around 19 or 20K miles not sure.
Aluminum 2
Chromium 12
Iron 852 (@!#@!#@,Universal Averages 319)
Copper 1
Lead 0
Tin 0
Molybdenum 118 (Universal Average 5 ?!)
Nickel 1
Manganese 25 (Universal Average 7?)
Silver 0
Titanium 0
Potassium 5
Boron 266 (Universal Average 128)
Silicon 48
Sodium 3
Calcium 47 (Average 593!?)
Magnesium 9 (Average 59 ?)
Phosphorus 2436 (Average 1117?)
Zinc 4
Barium 3
SUS Viscosity 72.3
Flashpoint 345
Water 0.0
Insolubles 0.3
Comments : We assume this is the second oil tha was in use in this differential. The high chrome is possibly from a bearing unit while the high iron is from the steels parts sharing the oil. These high wear metals could still be from new parts going through wear-in. Iniversal averages for typical wear are shown in the far right column for comparison to a differential that has finished wear-in. The TBN was 1.7. A reading of 1.0 is considered too low for remaining "active" additive in the oil. Since you changed out this oil, the new fill should be good for at least 24000 miles. Check back.
Hmm is it going to affect the results if I didnt change my magnet plug ? Cuz when I did my first change @ 5K I didnt change the plugs, and these are the oil from that one.
03-01-2007, 03:23 PM
#3
Got Another Rotary
Here is link to a person on BITOG that has done 9 oil analysis on his 8 to show what his numbers look like (he uses redline oils).
His Chromium and Iron are slightly lower than yours in the later changes, but in the same ball park. It was suggested that fuel dilution may be the cause of the high Chromium/Iron wear numbers and that more frequent oil changes may help.
In your case, a double change to assure all the oil is swapped out might be a good idea to get rid of any and all fuel dilution - just a thought.
http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...fpart=all&vc=1
His Chromium and Iron are slightly lower than yours in the later changes, but in the same ball park. It was suggested that fuel dilution may be the cause of the high Chromium/Iron wear numbers and that more frequent oil changes may help.
In your case, a double change to assure all the oil is swapped out might be a good idea to get rid of any and all fuel dilution - just a thought.
http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...fpart=all&vc=1
Last edited by Jax_RX8; 03-01-2007 at 04:23 PM.
03-01-2007, 06:19 PM
#4
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I'll just begin by saying IMO the tests are a gigantic waste of time/money as is the BITOG forum (although it was fun making fun of tem at work back in the day)... but since you did it...
The calcium/magnesium/phosphorus/zinc are an indicator of the anti-wear additives... it will vary drastically from oil company to oil company depending on their technology so the "universal average" is pretty worthless. Fuels also have their own additive packages which will intermingle with the oil numbers in these reports. Bottomline is its useless.
In reality, most of the things listed in these reports in the "elements" section doesn't mean squat except for the basic wear materials and silicon (which itself is easily debateable to the worth since it can show up in an additive package). Wear materials could indicate a problem, or could indicate your getting a less then ideal sample as all the contaminates usually sink to the bottom of the oil pan - which happens to be where you grab the sample from (adequate flush time is monumentally important but not very practicle in a resevoir that contains a few quarts). In the world where oil samples are useful, its normal procedure to drain a few gallons before taking a sample.
the Viscosity, Flashpoint, Fuel TR, Antifreeze, Water, Insolubles... the antifreeze/water is pretty useful for detecting gasket problems, the fuel dilution will generally tell you how your piston rings are doing... the viscocity is a bit hoaky as it varies alot more from the refinery then people like to know but if the number is way off its a clear indicator of oil abuse. Flashpoint doesn't mean a whole lot since the additive packages will fail before the oil flashes.
The calcium/magnesium/phosphorus/zinc are an indicator of the anti-wear additives... it will vary drastically from oil company to oil company depending on their technology so the "universal average" is pretty worthless. Fuels also have their own additive packages which will intermingle with the oil numbers in these reports. Bottomline is its useless.
In reality, most of the things listed in these reports in the "elements" section doesn't mean squat except for the basic wear materials and silicon (which itself is easily debateable to the worth since it can show up in an additive package). Wear materials could indicate a problem, or could indicate your getting a less then ideal sample as all the contaminates usually sink to the bottom of the oil pan - which happens to be where you grab the sample from (adequate flush time is monumentally important but not very practicle in a resevoir that contains a few quarts). In the world where oil samples are useful, its normal procedure to drain a few gallons before taking a sample.
the Viscosity, Flashpoint, Fuel TR, Antifreeze, Water, Insolubles... the antifreeze/water is pretty useful for detecting gasket problems, the fuel dilution will generally tell you how your piston rings are doing... the viscocity is a bit hoaky as it varies alot more from the refinery then people like to know but if the number is way off its a clear indicator of oil abuse. Flashpoint doesn't mean a whole lot since the additive packages will fail before the oil flashes.
03-01-2007, 11:14 PM
#5
Hmm
I jack my car up today and check, damn its pretty hard to drain from the oil cooler.
Im just gonna drain the crap from the pan maybe tomorrow or next monday, do it more often so I can remove all the dirty stuff that has been sitting inside my oil for god knows how long.
I jack my car up today and check, damn its pretty hard to drain from the oil cooler.
Im just gonna drain the crap from the pan maybe tomorrow or next monday, do it more often so I can remove all the dirty stuff that has been sitting inside my oil for god knows how long.
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