Turblown

I actually calculated the rwhp based on fuel flow before hearing what the Dyno operator said, and I was within 20 rwhp. It's the intake manifold, and port timing of the aux ports. Big extended port 13bs with pro jay style intake systems make same power if not more.

lastphaseofthis

it's people like you that need to post on this forum more often, but alas, i know which rotors i am going to use now :D and then i'll swap rx8 rotors in and see how much they gain.

rxspeed7

Are you on Rcc?

Not trying to stir up a lot here but there has always seemed to be quite a bit of mis-information on this site.
No where in these papers does it mention that the cutoff seal was deployed to help keep heat off the control rings. It's merely a way of keeping egr down In order to provide better emissions and leaner idle afrs.



Now not saying that it prob does help but until someone has proof or has a sae paper stating that I'm going to trust what I've done and what I've seen. And that happens to be that the cutoff does dick for a performance minded motor. If this wasn't the case you would've seen wear on the older rotaries from the same problem..... Outta all of our race engine(1000rwhp mind you) we have never seen a issue of such.

lastphaseofthis

I've seen the Paper before. But you have to remember previous rotaries didn't have side exhaust ports, the EGR effect was created by putting the Eports on the side irons. it's all about minimizing OVERLAP. the reason for sideports in the first place.


HOWEVER, you are right.
it's about idle mix and emissions. with older 13b's you had exhaust/intake over lap from the factory.

Second and Third Generation Turbo 13B

IO 32° ATDC
IC 50° ABDC
EO 71° BBDC
EC 48° ATDC

for 16° I and E are both open. AND THEN people ported them too have huge amounts of overlap.

we're adding peri exhaust, and therefor overlap.


it would be interesting to see the amount of over lap that is produce'd be using rx7 rotors in a Renesis without the gas control rings, or the effect on power/drivability, and then have the exact same rotors machined to make the over lap back down to O°. then re-dyno.

EDIT: after eye balling the above diagram... i would say the amount of overlap by time(degrees) is quite high, anytime the export is exposed to the side of the rotor while the intake is OPEN. BUT the amount of clearance between the housing and rotor(less then 1 mm, I hypothesize) is very small, so it's open to EGR for a lot of time, but by a very small area. dyno's before and after would tell you what that overlap means. but that's not for THIS thread.

999miki

This is understandable and shows how flawed the boost thinking is, at least as peak power goes. Torque values are pretty comparable for given manifold pressure, but boosted Renesis has peak power at much higher rpms than REW with stock intake.

Thanks for the info.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

I have always wondered if the reduced amount of metal surrounding the side seal contributed to less cooling in that area? Doesnt the cut off seal kinda isolate the side seal further?
Cut off seal does add friction......
Sorry for the highjack here.

lastphaseofthis

lets order some parts of the rotor from compression chamber to the shaft. Cmon, OD you can say them with me!
The bathtub--HOTTT+++
The apex seals/side seals HOTT++
the area between the side seals and "cut off" seal HOT
the "cut off" seal hot
Oil control rings medium, just doing their job
gear, cool enough when kept properly lubed
Bearings, ditto.

so now i ask you, what the **** are you thinking? the "cut off" seal does none of what you posted. go back and re read the paper :D... goof.

bse50

...And if it's doing that kind of stuff your engine isn't going to last

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

conduction--thats what I was thinking. The oil scrapper could interfereswith the oil cooling because the scrapper ring doesnt get as cool as the metal it replaced would? Just a thought...dont get your blood pressure up dude, my thoughts are not worth it. The proxiemity of the side seals to the combustion chamber etc is the real problem with them--i know.
The oil scrapper has been reported as causing increased wear on the irons in relation to the rx7 rotors. That has been observed.
emissions stuff---blah.
again sorry for the highjack--no more of this from me.

Turblown

Rotor housings are getting machined next week..

Turblown

Housings are done, engine is being prepped for assembly...

RotaryMachineRx

iTrader: (1)

"Like"

mavictb

saw the housings on facebook... lookin good I wonder how it will perform/sound.

oneclean8

i want to hear this thing run love pp

Turblown

Getting Closer..

bumblebeerx8

iTrader: (7)

was the center divided port blocked off or is that being done with the header flange?

ReV2ReD

Any news?

rotoryfreak

I like the idea of the pp exhaust .. Now did Goppy do a thermal expansion on that pp exhaust slug?

If not, hope you did heat those up to least 1800F degrees and check it with a straight edge?

If aluminum slugs ? you will get mad expansion unless its lower siting on the housing and not flush with the chrome on the face/housing.

Hope it helps Eliot..

Thanks
Chip U

reddozen

iTrader: (1)

Depends on the type of aluminum...
Hypereutectic Aluminum expands at similar rates to iron/steel. It's essentially what all modern aluminum pistons are made from.

rotoryfreak

True, the surface of the rotor housing is chrome plating the slug is not.. they expand at different rates. If the slug expand out when hot and the apex seal comes along i'm sure you know the rest...

i'm just brain farting over here......

200.mph

iTrader: (9)

idk if goopy did. the renny housing i saw two years ago at the occ mazda meet was brought there by a shop in jersey

reddozen

iTrader: (1)

Very hard to tell... like you said, heat it up and find out. They may need to or already have simply radiused the edges.

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

the flange looks strangely familiar, lol

ReV2ReD

Still nothing?

Turblown

We assembled the engine, and cut the flange. A coolant compression test yielded a leak. We are waiting for some time to tear the engine apart, and fix it. Will probably make a jig from now on to bench test..