canzoomer

I spent some time this last week tuning.

We were working on a few things:
1) Highway Fuel economy
2) Comparing the "L" flash to the "K" flash I had in before.
3) Working on making a tune map that removed the "dips and bumps" in the power curve.
4) Devising a map that will work with the old "K" and new "L" ECU flashes from Mazda.

I am doing a series of posts on this topic this weekend, and this is the first one.

As you may have heard from various postings the new version of our setup is now incorporating full ignition control in all versions, so that the difference "in the box" from now on is only the tuning maps provided.
Along that theme I have some good news for those of you who ordered Stage 2:
(Drum roll please)

ALL Stage 1 and Stage 2 units are now the same price!
$600

All Stage1 may be upgraded to Stage2 with a re-flash of the tuning map

All Previously shipped Stage1 units may be upgraded to the new hardware version and maps for free. All you pay is the freight charges.

More to follow.

canzoomer

Fuel economy results, all on the same stretch of highway, same road conditions, on cruise control at 135 to 145kmh (84-90mph)
Mostly on cruise control at 135, a bit of short stretches passing at 145. A few moments waiting for idiots to get out of the left lane.

Using Shell Optimax fuel, 91 PON octane.
rpm at this speed is between 4,100(135kmh) and 4,800(145kmh)

On "K" ECU flash, old Stage1 map:

litres Avg
KM Miles filled Speed L/100km mpg
326 203 51.3 135.00 15.72 14.96



On "L" ECU flash, old Stage1 map:

litres Avg
KM Miles filled Speed L/100km mpg
243 151 36.1 135.00 14.86 15.83


On "L" ECU flash, NEW Stage1 map:

litres Avg
KM Miles filled Speed L/100km mpg
184 114 22.5 135.00 12.22 19.24

I am so damned proud of that last one!

racerdave

Whoa! Look at that last mileage jump! Holy cow! :D

So would you say that your Stage 1 now is easier to adapt to future potential Mazda ECU changes than before?

Also looking forward to more descriptions on how the L flash "feels" different and the revised Stage 1 as well...

Sanguine_Dark

umm....Wow

"ALL Stage 1 and Stage 2 units are now the same price!
$600"

Question.. If a stage one is puchased now but later wants to upgrade to stage two (or greater) and install the midpipe etc, how much will the upgrade for the ECU be (midpipe seperate)

Absolutely great work CanZ, You are the difinitive 'man' of ingenuity. Nice work on the MPG too!!

Now if only there was a turbo to go with all these goodies....(ha ha)

racerdave

Oh yeah... and dyno plots too.

Sea Ray

It sounds like it was very much worth the wait. Now I want it worse than ever

Thanks for the hard work.

Lock & Load

Maurice

Thanks for the last e-mail , i will definetely be keeping a close eye on your forum .
cheers
michael

canzoomer

"L" flash feels smoother.
They did some interesting tricks in it.
Leaned out some areas a whole bunch, then retarded timing to compensate to prevent pinging.
Other areas that were lean before also received the ignition retard trick, as they had some cases of pinging on stock cars in hot, humid, sea level uses.

It is now easier to adapt adn revise our tuning maps as all models are now flash upgradeable.

We are about to start supplying a reflash kit, with cable and software to allow map upgrades for $75.
We also now have the full tuning kit with cable and software available for $150.

In the latter case do not consider it unless you are also prepared to fork out for a proper wideband lambda sensor, and logger, having it installed in the exhaust, and have some knowledge of what fuel/air ratios mean! If you do it blind I pretty well guarantee you will be causing pinging.
It is also really a good idea to install at least one pyrometer ( exhaust gas temperature probe and gauge) so you can keep an eye on that too. Certain combinations of ignition advance and fuel/air ratio will result in exhaust gas temperatures that will cook your catalytic converter.

canzoomer

Cost of upgrading a Stage1 to Stage 2 for ones we already shipped is free. Email me, and i will give you the details for shipping, etc.

Cost to upgrade Stage1 map to Stage2 map will be the cost of the programming cable and flash program.
One may also buy the full programming software and cable for $150.

One warning if you are buying the latter:
The maps we ship are locked on our units.
That means you have to start from scratch on doing your own tuning.

We have to do that for warranty reasons. If somebopdy monkeyed with a Stage1, went too lean, or too much advance, clobbered their engine, then tried to blame us, we can tell if they are running our map, or if they did their own thing.

Once you overwrite our original map, that one is GONE.
It has a unique ID in it, and is encrypted and password protected.

canzoomer

I don't have dyno runs handy yet, but have been doing some GTEech Pro Comp runs.

The following ones were done in conditions that are not exactly ideal for drag racing, so disregard the horribly low power and times. Just look at the two runs for comparison.
These were done in my car, absolutely stock, except with the Stage 1 turned on and off.
Road conditions:
Winter 17" tires. Nokian 225/45/17 "WR"
-9C (16F)
Two people in car, haf a tank of gas.
Running weight of 3,432 lbs (1560Kg)
Altitude of 3,000 feet (about 914 meters)

Highway which was clear of snow and ice, but a bit on the slick side. Slight uphill incline.
Both runs were done on exactly the same part of the road and direction.
Ignore the rpm settings as I had my calibration screwed up as I recently upgraded the GTech firmware and forgot to recalibrate the rpm calibrations.

Runs were done with a clutch dump at about 3,500rpm, and quite a bit of clutch slip to keep the tires reasonable engaged, and the car straight.

Black line run with Stage1 engaged.
Red line run with stock settings, no modifications.

canzoomer

HP/Time

The dip in 1st gear is tire spin when it came on at 4,900rpm.
The 3rd and 4th gear parts are most useful, as there was no tire spin.

canzoomer

Speed vs. Time.
0-60is better than a second faster.
Look at that nice flat line in 3rd and 4th!

canzoomer

GForce.
1st gear was pretty well useless. All i could get was tirespin.

adrian-1

So what about the details of:
4) Devising a map that will work with the old "K" and new "L" ECU flashes from Mazda.

with the NEW Stage1 map since that's what I'll be getting. I will try to get the dealership to reflash it to the L version while I'm getting the airbag recall in a couple of weeks. But I'm unsure they'll do the reflash since I don't have a check engine light.

So should I wait til I get the L reflash to use with the new map or is it ok to use the old version with the new map. (My unit should be shipping soon).
Thanks,

93rdcurrent

Adrian 1,

The dealer will re-flash it. Tell them you get the CEL while pulling away from a stop if they give you a hard time. I just had it done. They wrote it in my service order and even stated that they couldn't get it to happen and didn't show any codes from the ECU. They still gave the the latest version.

canzoomer

The map we are using now will work (and be safe) with the old and new Mazda flashes.

But, it will work best with the new one.

canzoomer

I tried to get some decent GTech runs this afternoon.
Since the last batch were done at -7C, and with a large (2565lb) passenger, I figured I could do quite a bit better.
So, went out today to do some runs.
It was bit warmer ( +1C / 34F).
Unfortunately the roads are pretty damp as things began to thaw.

Kind of ridiculous as I just could not get the tires to hook up in 1st gear.

So, I am not so proud of these 1/4 mile runs, but I think that what they DO show is informative.

One can prettywell toss out the 1st gear curves as useless. If I could hook up I would have pulled at least a half second better in 0-60.

On 2nd, 3rd, 4th it is a different story.
One of the big goals we are seeking is an even and smooth delivery of power.
Take a look at this curve:

canzoomer

Here it is shown as delivered HP vs Time:

JD32

Great work CZ!! Can't wait for my wife to buy my Father's Day present.

Omicron

Um, maybe I'm misreading this, but are you REALLY getting peak HP up around 280 HP Maurice? Is this what your dyno is showing too? And is this for STAGE 1???

If so.... TOO COOL!!! :D :D :D

canzoomer

Putting some things into perspective regarding horsepower.

Todays GTech runs were not at the best conditions, but it still can give an approximate idea of power.

Vehicle weight today with me and fuel was 3,190lbs ( I had a full tank of gas).

Firstly, running at 36 degrees Fahrenheit, 2,800 foot altitude,
air pressure at 28.94 inches of mercury, 88% humidity, and the dewpoint today at 33 degrees F:
Weather conditions:
http://weatheroffice.ec.gc.ca/forecast/city_e.html?yxd

Compensation factor using these:
http://wahiduddin.net/calc/calc_hp_dp.htm

Conversions of air pressure from:
http://www.disabilityuk.com/masterpa.../presscalc.htm

We see that I was losing about 5% of power due to atmospheric and altitude conditions.

So our power correction factor is 1.05.

Taking my best run today at 14.816 seconds, with a trap speed of 97.28mph, we get the following power calculations from a few websites :

http://www.dsm.org/tools/calchp.htm
194HP based on ET and 229HP based on speed.
Add the 5% compensation factor and we get:
204HP based on ET and 240HP based on speed.

http://www.rallyinfo.com/rihpcalculator.htm
193.86 HP at the wheels, and about 252.02 HP at the flywheel.
Add 5%:
204 HP at the wheels, and about 265 HP at the flywheel.

http://www.speedworldmotorplex.com/calc.htm
Based on trap speed:
229 at the wheels and 270 at flywheel.
Add 5%:
240 at the wheels and 283 at flywheel.

Based on ET:
194 at the wheels and 229 at the flywheel
Add 5%:
204 at the wheels and 240 at the flywheel

Obviously I lost ET on the wheelspin, so these are all skewed low on the ET based calculations, hence the huge disparity comparing trap speed versus ET methods.

Add these variations up and average and you get an average power of 216 at the wheels, and 263HP at the crank/flywheel.

If I could get my tires to hook up I would certainly do better. I pulled a 13.78 at a trap speed of 102 for my best run ever on a tune similar to this one, but on much better road conditions, so I figure I am now making around 275 at the crank, and 220 at the wheels.

canzoomer

This is peak for a brief moment based on an accelerometer.
When you shift the flywheel is disconnected by the clutch, it stores the energy, then you dump it. For a moment you get the benefit of that stored power.

Disregard that peak please!
Real sustained engine driven HP at the wheels is around 220.
But in stock configuration I was getting around 175.

Look at Maniacs runs for comparison at:
https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...5&pagenumber=1

Or my runs the other night posted on the first page of this thread.
Comparison to stock is the best way to look at these.
On Thursday morning, very early in the a.m. I got a stock run of
15.607 at a speed of 89.52mph.
I had zeroed the maps in the computer, so it was a dead stock run.
I had a passenger weighing 250lbs, and a half tank of gas, and my scale weight was 3,432 lbs.

I then loaded the maps, and ran the same section of road, same direction, same conditions:
14.825 at 95.33mph.

Today i had less weight, but could not hook up as well due to tirespin, but I still managed a 14.83 at around 98mph.

So, NO , NOT 280HP !!

Around 265 at the crank and 220 at the wheels.
On the map we are now shipping one can pull at least a 14.25 ET at sea level on good road conditions, with a decent driver, but not a pro drag racer.

Also, I do not clutch dump at 8,000rpm.
3,000 to 4,000 depending on traction.
I am sure a good driver, dumping at 8k, and slipping the clutch artfully could break 14.
That could be like Judge ito. How many transmissions do you want to break??

The main thing i was trying to demonstrate with these more recent GTech runs was how smooth the power delivery now is with our current tune.
I know some of you will miss the old 5,500rpm kick in the ***, but remember a lot of that was subjective, because it rose from basically stock power levels at 4,600 to much higher than stock at 5,500.
This results in a gain in the 1/4 mile of around .8 to 1 second.

Look at the speed and G Force logs. In 3rd & 4th gear there is basically no tire spin or wheel hop. The charts are almost a perfectly straight line.

It is no almost like an electric motor.
This means we are making the same torque across the rpm range
That puts a LOT of power "under the curve".

Hymee

iTrader: (1)

Very good info Maurice.

And yup - it is the "Area under the curve" that counts.

Would like to see some "in one gear" runs if possible, like 40km/h to 100km/h. Can the G-Tech Comp Pro do that?

Cheers,
Hymee.

(PS - gets Hymee's award for the days most informative post )

canzoomer

Sure, that is easy to do.
What gears, what speed start and stop?

The GTEch will log whatever you do, as long as you travel at least 1/4 mile.

racerdave

Ok... it's not Hymee, but here's my request:

3rd gear, from 60 kph to 120 kph (or there abouts... just trying to show the flexibility of the motor at somewhat low revs up through the curve)