zoom44

Since the Judge is unwilling at this time to let us in on what he has done i thought maybe we could put our collective noggins together. there are enough "rotorheads" tech wizards, rx8 specific people and radical thinkers on this board that we should be able to figure out close to what he could have done. then we can save this until the day he reveals his secret and see how close we were. i will not tolerate any flaming in this thread at all. any posts i deem offensive to me, the judge or any poster who chooses to share an idea in this thread will be removed. any one who argues with me about my decision to have a post removed will have all posts removed from this thread.

that said my first idea- raising/removing the rev limit. two problems i see with this are that it is a pcm function and so far no one has cracked the pcm. second how much higher can the rpms go with the stock coils?

nosubstitutec4s

*drool* 13000 rpm rotary

well i have no idea what hes done, so i can be of less than no help to this thread. with upgraded coils do you think he could hit 13k or would something else brea?

zoom44

thats his point though - he didnt change out any oem parts for aftermarket- so we need to know how high an rpm can the oem coils handle. that is the limit then to his raisng rpm limit.

gotta go home now. keep this clean guys and gals

rumatt

I just want to see the x-axis of the dyno chart picture.

ranger4277

Question: What does the vertical line on his dyno represent? It is the solid line that intersects the curve and 125 HP. Is this significant to anyone?


Second point, assume the limit has been raised.. the stock flywheel isn't rated over 10.5K, correct? Kind of dangerous and potentially destructive for a car he doesn't own yet, don't you think?

Omicron

My guess: Street porting.

fxdsconv2000

I think he did that Gerbils on Crack mod I read about a long time ago

rx8cited

Did the nitro theory get blown away?

Spazm

Wouldn't nitro require some oem parts to be swapped?

slavearm

Im with Omi on the porting. He owns a shop and takes apart 13x motors all day and probably has quite a bit of experience porting as well. Perhaps Ito could say do some work on an engine not in a car and let us know how that works... that way he wouldn't be admitting doing anything to his car.

Or.... I have this thought. I know for a fact that mazda has already contracted racing beat to do FI testing on the renesis. They mentioned it last time they had an open house. Perhaps Ito go ahold of a FI kit from mazda. He could claim its stock since it would be a factory mazda part. Although the Dyno certainly doesn't look like FI unless that was a REALLY REALLY big turbo.


Also hear is a thought... Ito has posted pics of his car racing as well as time stamps... technically mazda could void his warranty for that alone. So what's all the fuss unless is some uber-secret mazda prototype style stuff.

2c

Slavearm

red_rx8_red_int

Either n2o or higher rpms. The higher rpms require a non-stock change but not visable. The n20 requires very little change, does a hole in the intake to inject n2o qualify as stock?

robertdot

I'm with Omicron on this one.

newtlicious

Bingo, I'm lost on this one. He already got busted by MNAO so his warranty is void anyway. He keeps referring to testing and tuning, I had originally thought it was a mild port job but now I'm thinking ECU mod (hard to test and tune a port job in a few nights).

Racing Beat has been dragging their feet on updates. Their website has had the same paragraph about the ECU test bench development since March. If it takes that long to build the bench, I'm not holding my breath for the actual product. I wonder if he's in cahoots w/ racing beat? The dyno chart looks eerily similar to the one canzoomer posted for his stage 1.1, very abrupt climb at a given RPM.

I still have to wonder, wouldn't a well executed ECU mod produce more power across the spectrum? I would think someone as well known as ITO would be looking for more "under the curve" rather than peak. I'm completely lost on the whole thing.

Black-dragon

I'm with omicron on the porting

rotarygod

I don' t think it has the redline raised. The stock intake manifold can't supply enough air that high. It would be totally worthless to do this. Judging from the dyno chart, my vote goes to something around a 50 shot of nitrous.

Hymee

iTrader: (1)

Can someone cross link me back to the charts etc. that started this all off?

Cheers,
Hymee.

Doctorr

This is the (worst posting of a document you will ever see) chart, HymeeGuy!

Actually, that posting is SO bad, and ALL the details hidden, it almost could be deliberate........
.
.
.
doc

Xyntax

Charles just posted his results with 235 rwhp. I know it's from the Gtech, but is it a coincidence that he is getting the same numbers as Ito with his "bone stock" 8?

see here: https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-major-horsepower-upgrades-93/nitrous-g-tech-37435/

Charles R. Hill

iTrader: (7)

If Ito has some magic he is working then he is entitled to keep that info to himself. Perhaps he is trying to generate a market for himself using mystery as promotional tool. I might be doing the same for when I release my PPF and header. In the meantime, I choose to generate a market by communicating real, applicable, information to those who ask.

Charles

BTW, I would be happy to race Ito sometime.

StealthTL

iTrader: (1)

I'm going with porting.

The curve (what little you can see of it) seems to show regular power on the primaries, then the familiar transition to secondaries, and a huge lump of power as soon as the 'tertiaries' open. Ergo, the 'six' ports have been worked over.

It is obviously not a rev-limiter issue, as the power peak (again, what is visible) is well within the normal rev range.

Also, nitrous is usually turned on by a WOT switch, and on a dyno it would be 'on' right up the rev range, right? So there would be no specific 'bump' in the plot....

S

Wildcard

Agree. The major scale of the x-axis starts at '35' (read 3500rpm) and goes up in incriments of 5 (500rpm). The Big jump in power is coming on at 6750rpm. Curious...

MrWigggles

You know, I really don't care.

A 40 HP jump in the last 1/4 of the RPM band just doesn't do it for me anyway. I don't like driving up there even when I am flogging the car.

I am skeptical regardless. By the questionable way the photo was taken, the graph just screams to me that something is fishy. I bet something broke on the dyno possibly a measurement sensor or something. There could be something strange about the portion of the curve we can't see that might shed some light on the matter. (However the image doesn't appear to be digitally cropped since it is still 640X480, a common size, he could just be a lousy photographer.)

The question is the x-axis RPM or MPH. I think it is actually MPH. Most dynos don't know or care what RPM the engine is at.

Now, if it is MPH then they are probably doing third gear testing which means 9.9 MPH per 1000 RPM. So we are back to where we started (67 MPH = 6800 RPM), the performance doesn't kick in until late in the RPM range. If by strange chance the dyno run was done in fourth gear and the x-axis is indeed MPH (which I bet it is), then we might actually have something here. The performance gain would be coming in at 5000 RPM (4th gear is 13.7MPH/1000RPM). That would be commendable.

So if the dyno is authentic with reproducable results (I kind of doubt) AND the test was done in 4th gear (I really doubt - I bet it was in 3rd), then I am excited.

Otherwise, I don't care.

-Mr. Wigggles

canaryrx8

iTrader: (3)

doesn't a guy have to have an ego in order to "stroke it"?

as curious as I am to know what he did/done, I'm even more curious to know how accessible it is to the rest of the 8 owners, that's what I'm really interested in.

zoom44

someone asked what the bold vertical line in the chart is. i believe that is the line highlighting the crossover point between hp and T. if i am corect than that point on the chart is 5250 rpm.

futureownr4sure

IMO, here are the options :
-it's a fake dyno
-it's a nitrous oxide shot
-the X axis isn't RPM
-it's a ecu mod but it's unfinished
-etc