Stop&TurnFreak

First, track days DON'T count, because, it is NOT a race. I have run with race prepped GT3's an f50, and even turned times in the same range as a test drive for a busch team at CMP. However, does that mean I can run with the Busch guys at Talladega?:???? Hell no.

In all fairness, the RX8 does left to right physics better than a beamer, but not a M3. And, if you watch TopGear, they don't distinguish between dry track times and driving rains, it is only "the time". So, using them as a benchmark, is not really a good tool.

However, I have to admit, there is nothing like running down a car, faster than you, contribute it to the driver, whether you are better, or he is just taking it easy, fact is, that day, you were faster.

BlueRenesis82

yeah, always a huge ego boost when you are running down a faster car......I had a situation where I ran down a newer 'stang GT on Victoracers!

RX8SpdDmn

You're funny. I used to sell BMWs. I've spend plenty of time driving E46 M3s. They're fantastic. So is the RX-8. I've driven stock and modded Evos. They're in the same class, although I don't like them nearly as much as the M3 or RX-8.

Now, why do you feel that you need to qualify your statement by saying "any track with meaningful straights? Any roadcourse will have meaningful straights. They all mean something. But it's about the whole package, isn't it? The RX-8 is a horrible drag racer, that's a fact.

The RX-8 is dynamically superior and it's "huge" power defecit is a little under 100 hp, yet the car is 3-400 lbs lighter than an E46 M3. Would you say that Watkins Glen has some meaningful straights? I run down tons of faster cars going up the esses, including E46 M3s.

I typed this all with a straight face.

RX8SpdDmn

I'll go with you on that, although I won't say that they're all crappy drivers. However, I do believe that an M3 has an edge over the RX-8, drivers being equal. The point I was trying to make is that an RX-8 runs much more closely with an M3 than any lesser 3-series.

Oh, and to all of you out there...
Contrary to popular belief, a BMW car is a BIMMER, not a BEAMER!!
A Beamer is a BMW Motorcycle.
Thank you.

John V

iTrader: (1)

Actually, a BMW motorcycle is a "Beemer."

A "beamer" is a guy in a BMW coming at you with his brights on.

Stop&TurnFreak

Well, what really counts is the corner before the meaningful straight. @ Roebling, you have a nice long sweeper, where you can roll through, and take advantage of the lighter weight and superior grip, without being penalized for the lack of grunt. However, at CMP, you have a tight turn before the long front stretch where you need torque to get off the corner. My Evo suffers here, because I am barely below boost range for a few ticks, before hitting full boost. M3's just grunt their way off the corner, and down the straight.

RX8SpdDmn

I stand corrected. And embarassed. I wrote what someone else did and forgot to check my spelling. You're correct. A BMW Motorcycle is a Beemer.

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

funny, I always thought they were just "a-sholes", oh wait, that descibes all BMW owners

John V

iTrader: (1)

And some former BMW owners too .

RX8SpdDmn

hey! Not ALL!

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

it's a joke ...

formally TeamM3 (E36 and E30), TeamZ3, TeamZ4

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

oh boy, don't get me started on those P-car pr-cks

John V

iTrader: (1)

Doesn't GH own a Boxster?

RX8SpdDmn

Now wait... Shouldn't we distinguish what owners we're talking about? I know there are BMW and Porsche and M-B (etc, etc) owners who are pr1cks, however, in my experience, they're rarely enthusiasts. Have you guys ever done track days with PCA or BMWCCA regions? Everyone there is usually awesome. The only person that comes to mind that was rude was someone driving a Cobra. I don't think that most true enthusiasts are pr1cks. They ususally have an open mind and I've always been welcomed at PCA and BMWCCA events, even though I'm driving an RX-8. And people are always talking to me respectfully, too.

So, I know that peoples' experiences differ, but I'm just sharing my perception, and my own actions, as I've had my BMW Z3 for almost 4 years and a little over a year ago had a 325is at the same time. I don't think I'm a pr1ck (of course).

Then there's the old joke...
"What's the difference between a BMW and a porcupine?"
"The porcupine has the pr1cks on the outside!"

hahaha.

John V

iTrader: (1)

I was ing Mr. BagOnHisHead, because he used to own BMWs. He's a *****.

He was ing me for owning a Porsche. I am also a *****.

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

there's always the unusual exception

Stop&TurnFreak

Ok, I can vouch for some experiences the other way. I was at a car event, um, not BMW, and I was in my Evo, when it was bone-stock. At CMP in SC, I was running quick, lapping in the 1:55's. I had been asked to instruct, but when I arrived, they wouldn't let me, because I didn't own a Porsche. Well, I get ready to go out, and they move me from the Solo group, to the instructor group, citing, I may be too quick. At the driver's meeting I heard them talking about the Evo they were about to have fun with. Well, after the first session, I passed everything on the track (light rain) still lapping in the 1:56's. I even had a guy in a race-prepped 911 run off the end of 11 trying to out-brake me. I came in, and the chief instructor walked over to my pits. He told me I was 'too' aggressive for instructor, that I needed to be moved into full race. I had NO cage, nothing, and they wanted me in this group. Well, ego took over, and I said, sure, I will hold back, and run in your race group. I went out last, still raining, and passed every car on-track. I also put a full straight on two 911sc's running in full race trim. After this session, I came in, and they told me tomorrow, the first day of the DE, I could instruct, that I was obviously qualified.

The next day, in the dry, I clipped a 1:53 80, which is smokin fast for that track in a 'basically' stock Evo. But, it took them a full day of trying to 'humble' me to let me instruct.

TrackAddict

Last summer I was working a corner at Roebling and the lady who owns that worker stand was telling me how cool all the drivers and racers are except for the Porsche club. At event after event it isn't the EVO guys that get dissed. It is the Boxster guys who everyone thinks are ******. That being said, I'd get rid of my 8 in a heartbeat if I could afford a Cayman S or a late model 911.

Stop&TurnFreak

Cayman S Must not be weak.....

BlueEyes

Cayman S with 3.8L engine swap LSD

RX8SpdDmn

As I read your post, I gathered that you hadn't run with them before, so they didn't know you, right?

I think you'd agree that they might be hesitant to let someone instruct who they don't know, who may not have experience with the types of cars that most of the students are driving. However, it's good that they gave you the opportunity to prove yourself and didn't hold you back.

At the end of October, I ran at Watkins Glen with TracQuest. This was my first event with them and only my 5th DE overall. My car is basically stock. I ran in the middle group on the first day to get a feel for the group. In that group, there's open passing in the straights and point-by passing in the turns. I didn't get passed by anything and I've run with some of the fast groups with PCA before, so I figured I was ready to go up. On the second day, I asked to have an instructor ride with me to evaluate me to go to the fast group (I took the "no frills" school, which didn't include meals or instructors). Although the director was skeptical, he said I that if an instructor felt that it was ok, then he'd bump me. So, I got the chance and took it. In the fast group, there's open passing everywhere. The instructor passed me with no problem, stating that I had good car control and judgement. So, I ran with the fast group, among Ferrari Challenge cars, a Gallardo, NSX's, 996 Turbos, etc. I wasn't faster than them, of course, but it was good to finally get passed!

Video here: http://www.scottbarton.net/anthony/T...tMachinery.wmv

The point I'm making is that they didn't know me, so they had to be a little skeptical, but they gave me the chance to prove myself. They didn't have to.

Hotsauce

Nice video! Great driving fast and aggressive, it seemed the only thing passing you was exotics and a modified corvette. It good to show what the Rx-8 can do on the track against these cars. Now is your car totally stock or do you have upgraded suspension or tires? Also did you have DSC on or off?

BlueRenesis82

I would totally rock a Cayman S. badass to the core.

Red Devil

Not a Porsche fan, but I like the Cayman. I drove my friend's new BoxsterS and that was much better than his previous BoxsterS.