Section 8

Don't ride with them the first time they learn how to turn off all the driver aids, you'll end up spining in a fast RH sweeper and heading towards a light pole :D



All joking aside, crimson is learning very fast, he just has to learn to drive the car all over again now that he's figured out how to get rid of the 'crutch'

Paul_in_DC

So where were you autox'ing, with SCCA? Was it this past weekend?

crimson-rain

HEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was just trying to drift (a pathetic attempt at that)!!! LOL

My fellow RX-8 club members ... I have been an idiot. After 3 autox's, it has just come attention that to turn TC off, you must hold the DSC button. TC does not go off with the DSC.

It was funny though when I spun out. It was like an e-longated 180 that sent debris through the passenger window (my bad Section8). Another RX8 club member almost got it on video. He got my last two runs though which were a LOT better. Section8 has helped me out A LOT. I was improving quite a bit even with rogain needing tires (my tread is definitely gone after that spin) while he was riding with me giving me pointers.

Imp

For 8 seconds.

Nationals *grumble* 2nd run day 1 *grumble grumble* left them on at start *grumble* got DSC shut off after 1/4 of the course *grumble grumble* 1/10th faster than 1st run *grumble* could have been much faster *grumble grumble*

zojas

are we sure that just pushing the button once (not holding it down) doesn't turn off both TC and DSC? give me your anecdotes!

Section 8

Sorry for the late response. We autocross with the Capital Driving Club http://members.***.net/capitaldrivingclub/

They're more of a "lets just have fun" club, not an SCCA chapter. There are no classes, but the autox itself follows SCCA guidelines.

This event was at Osbourn Park HS in Manassas.

Section 8

Unfortunately I won't be at the next event to see you run on the new tires, I'm going to VIR in November for a 2 day HPDE so I'm gonna cut out autox until then to save money on gas towards travel fees, new track brake pads, etc.

Imp

Once is DSC off. Holding it down for a further 8 seconds shuts off TC. No anecdotes needed.. it's in the manual.

--kC

zojas

no, that's not what the manual says.

the manual says just pressing the button will turn off the traction control, and the dynamic stability control. the manual goes on to say that if the button is held down for more than a second, the system will take it as a problem with the button, will turn off the traction control and stability control, and will then ignore the button until the engine is turned off and back on. so I was wondering where the idea came from that you have to hold down the button for more than a second.

here's all the relevant quotes. these came from pages 5-21, 5-22, and 5-23 of my manual:

To turn off the TCS, press the DSC off switch.

Press the DSC OFF switch to turn off the TCS/DSC. The DSC OFF indicator light will illuminate.

Press the switch again to turn the TCS/DSC back on. The DSC OFF indicator light will go out.

Leaving the TCS/DSC on will provide the best stability. when the TCS/DSC is off, the TCS/DSC does not activate but the brake LSD function remains.

If the DSC OFF switch is pressed and held for a second or more, the TCS/DSC system may become inoperative doe to the system detecting switch trouble. If the TCS/DSC system becomes inoperative, the TCS/DSC and the DSC Off indicator lights illuminate simultaneously. In this case, turn off the engine and restart it to restore the TCS/DSC.

Section 8

Well, having experience from the passenger seat what happens when you hold the button for 8 seconds, I think the manual is leaving something out for the benifit of the average driver. pressed once, the system turns only part of the system off, held for 8 seconds it disables everything.

The same system is used in the Corvette Z06, you have to press and hold the button after you get to the 'compeition' selection to actually turn everything off, otherwise the system will still kick in when it feels that the car is really getting out of shape.

bbq0801

Based on first hand experience (driving the car) in the snow, @ autox, and on the track, pressing the button once turns the entire system off. I tried holding it for 8 seconds once, but I didnt notice any difference. IMHO, Its a myth.

The only funny thing I have noticed is that once I was running more than the max reccomended 52psi (i think), in the tires, i got a tpms warning light, and the tcs/dsc system told me it was off but i felt the dsc doing its braking thing and a glimpse of the dsc light flashing. I dont know if the tpms is connected to dsc/tcs, but thats what i have experienced.

dazygirl415

From first hand experience, TPMS is connected to the DSC/TCS: On a road trip just after I got my car back from the shop, my TPMS sensor went off. I thought it was just slightly less than optimum so I let it go (we were also cruising in a caravan on the highway). A while later, after trying to shift into 6th while going around 70 mph, the DSC kicked in and I couldn't go any faster. I was thinking, WTF??? After a couple attempts, I finally pulled over to a rest stop and I had only 7 psi of air in my rear passenger tire. The low tire pressure had caused the DSC to kick in.

TheColonel

As a future law student, my guess would be that Mazda doesn't want you to be able to turn off a system that can potentially be considered a "saftey feature". Calling the complete shutdown of the DSC and TCS an error and telling you not to do it probably to prevent people from shutting it off, crashing thier car and then bringing suit against Mazda claiming that Mazda said I could do it in the manual.

TORacing

Both systems are not deactivated until both lights have illuminated, both lights being DSC and TCS. You must hold the button for more than 7 seconds for both lights to illuminate. If you don't believe me try just pushing it and not holding it and then find an empty parking lot and try doing a donut, the TCS light will flash, showing you that you are loosing traction and TCS will kick in. Now stop and hold the buton for 7 seconds and let both lights illuminate and try this process again, and you will see what the 8 can really do with out some stupid computer inhibbiting it!

BigOLundh

iTrader: (1)

Hasnt this already been argued on the board... many times?
How can you say its a myth when you can actually see the second light on the dash come on when holding it down for 8 seconds?

BAH HUMBUG!!

bbq0801

I dont get it, I have done tons of doughnuts, and tons of autox (finger lakes region scca, NY), looking at the dash even during doughnuts, after having just pressed the button once. My tcs light never flashes and the engine never cuts. Are there different versions of the system? My car is an early one.
Ill try the 7 second thing again tomorrow morning.

REMillers

ROFLOL!!!!

I'm sorry that I showed him out to turn the traction control off.

But was dang funny.

"Hey guys watch the black 8 just showed him out to turn traction controo"

*insert scretching tires, smoke, corner works running*

"control..."


*insert sound of Crimson yelling out the window "First time without traction WOOOOO"


Great times.

He is looking better to, Autox good place to learn the dynamics of any car and not to lift throttle in middle of a turn.

REMillers

Oh and it does, first runs with just the DSC off can feel traction control kicking in.

next run with all off, not a single hicup from the traction control and the same turns where it was kicking in before.

btw I'll get your videos uploaded at some point in time.

You going to the Harry Grove race this weekend?

bbq0801

OK, I tried the 7 second thing this morning, you guys are right. I dont know what happened the last time i tried it, but it definately worked this time.

zojas

what do you mean? what was different after holding the button for 7 seconds? did the car behave different when you were driving crazy?

TORacing

Of course it did, this car is a whole different animal when you hold the button for moere than seven seconds.

bbq0801

yep

REMillers

Simply put the difference is just pushing the button turns of DSC, put leaves traction control on.

Holding it will turn off all the driving aids and does free it up nicely. On the course we were at last time it was easily a 2 second difference, but some of that is just me learning the car more.

Remember to turn the DSC and traction back on after disabling it you need to shut the car off and restart it.

Have fun

zojas

interesting. next autocross I'll try it.

my last bout of experimenting was on an autocross course in the rain. first run, I pushed the button once (not held down). I didn't really notice any driver assists kicking in, and I did some fish tailing but nothing too crazy since I was trying to go fast.

second run, I left the dsc on, just to see what it would do. anytime I would start to fishtail, it stepped in right quick, using both brakes and throttle to stop the sliding. it also bled off a lot of speed though, and was too abrupt for fast driving. definitely made my time slower.

then on all later runs, I again pushed the button briefly and couldn't detect any driver aids active, but again, I was trying to stay smooth (fast) so I only fishtailed a little bit. I'd say the things I ran into were mostly oversteer, and maybe 1 episode of understeer, but I never had the back tires spinning for traction. is that when I would expect the traction control to kick in (when the back tires are spinning)?

mike0615

when u learn how to drive the 8 with dsc on it makes u a worse driver. cuz u go into turns faster then u should cuz dsc comes on and makes u feel like that is a good entry speed. if u want to be fast u need to learn the 8 with dsc off. once u get used to going into turns slower, ur exit speed will improve allot, making u a faster driver. thats how i felt anyway. first time with dsc off i slide all over the place. once i adjusted to enter corners slower everything was brand new again.