I was talking with a Porsche race prepper at the last DE I went to (this weekend) and when discussing camber, he had suggested picking up some crash bolts for my 8. He made some pretty impressive/liberal claims about the amount of camber that could be gained by using them, but numbers are arbitrary...

I was wondering whether there was a TSB or place in the manual that denotes crash bolts as suitable replacements on our vehicles, as I'd love to have the option of being able to run B-Stock or STU (ignorant of the rules, for the most part) in the future. I ask this because I know that on many applications, you would need to cut slots to accommodate the crash bolts.

So basically... is Mazda anything like Dodge (ACR's, anyone?) in that they'd actually want to *help* those of us that autocross their cars by releasing a TSB allowing for crash bolts? This was a huge topic of convo/anger w/ some of the guys in the Houston area when I was autocrossing a few years ago.

Lastly, can I pick them up at a dealership parts counter, or would I have better luck ordering online?

Can anyone give me an accurate number as far as maximum front camber after crash bolts? The mechanic said 1.2* in the front, and that seemed too high, as it's twice the # most people seem to be getting with stock front suspensions. [this question may be hard to answer if you've dropped your car :/ ]

 

I have -1.2 on stock hardware.

Crash bolts are usually thinner in diameter than the stock camber bolts.
My performance alignment guy refused to install them on a previous car that I wanted to use them on, saying that he's seen too many of them fail.

 

Appreciate the input.

How'd you swing -1.2? Or is that the status quo? I just read through the entire alignment thread and got the vibe that -.6 was the norm.

 

Crash bolts are used on a Mac Strut car, not one with upper and lower A arms like an RX-8. They will do you as much good as the camber plates that are on the market for the RX-8.

If you want more camber lower the car, ok in STU/SP/SM, or get some offset control arm bushings made. As far as more camber in BS make sure you have taken the caster down to the minimum and you have low pressure gas shocks like the Koni sport, but other than that you are SOL.

 

I find it interesting that there's such a large difference in camber capability on the RX8. Mine gets -1.7f with about 4 degrees of caster, others struggle to get more than -.6 on both sides...I've never heard of a car with such huge manufacturing tolerances in the suspension.

 

Sigh. Bad news but at least now I know.

Once again, thank you for the input.

I'm very reluctant to lower my car because Houston and Dallas roads both blow goats. I scrape everywhere I go at stock ride height. How much will the Koni/Tein combo drop the car? This is also a concern for me because in the near future I'll be trailering my car to DE's - which will be a problem (high center itself on the ramps).

I spent an hour on Sunday pushing a slammed GTS-R Viper that was all sorts of fucked up (when he turned on the car gasoline spewed everywhere, so it couldn't move under it's own power) up a ramp into an enclosed trailer built for a stock-ride height Boxster S. It had ramps inside so that you could work under the car, so we got the Viper halfway into the trailer and it high centered. It was the most technologically challenging solution I've ever had to come up with, then we (a bunch of fellow drivers) had to push it up diamond plate ramps, all wearing tractionless driving shoes, in a torrential downpour. There were more faceplants than I care to remember.

Modding a daily driver is all about compromises, so if the drop from koni's/teins is moderate and the camber gained is acceptable, there's no reason to go past that. I can't even take advantage of the 8's fullest potential as it is, at my skill level.

 

Just start with an alignment shop that has a clue. The camber you have is in line with the car right off the dealer lot. I have never heard of anyone that could not get -1 if they take the caster down. I would guess you still have caster in 6-6.5 range so you are giving up -camber.

 

the reason for the differences is not a mystery

at least not for me

 

I'm talking about stock, as delivered, RX8's with 1 degree plus variance in front camber adjustment, not stock class set up cars with degassed shocks.

Now, if that's not a mystery to you, please explain...I don't know that I've ever seen or heard of another sports car with that type of oem range of potential adjustment.

 

I'd like to know as well. In fact, my tires are literally dying to know.

 

0.6 is all I got with caster all the way down, so I'm the first one. Still on stock shocks though.

 

What is you caster?

 

you'll never get there on OE shocks

 

Caster was 4.4 deg. I had the adjuster all the way to minimum at 3.8, but didn't do anything so I just gave up. I'm planning on Koni's next year. Could use a little more front grip, but I'm fixing the driver first.

 

I only picked up an additional .1 of a degree (in other words, nothing, given possible variance, even using the same rack and equipment) negative camber in the front when I changed to ots Koni yellows

 

Fully stock '05, I got -1 camber with caster 6.8/6.9 on L/R. Sometimes it just takes the right mechanic who knows what to move.

 

Pardon my ignorance, but how does changing the shocks alone effect camber? Do Koni's alter the ride height?

 

Somebody knows something. Despite what my mother told me, I am not somebody.

At nationals, I could not believe how low Isley's car seemed in the front. Must have some of those extra rare lower stock springs. I assume baggie's car was lower because of the hydraulic shocks, but maybe there is more to it. I would pay upwards of 23 cents for the information.

 

Then you should find the right mechanic because yours blew it. Take that caster down to the minimum, around 4.5, and your -camber will go up another .2-.3.

 

I have seen a number of cars lower than mine. My best guess looking at the shop manual
is I have the second lowest set of springs. I have off the shelf Konis, still have full gas pressure, and they are brand new as I had one leaker. The Konis drop the car a bit because they are still lower gas pressure than the OE shocks. I went from -1.2 on stock shocks to -1.4 on the Konis, however there was also about 4000 miles on the car between those two alignments.

 

I must have received the 4x4 version of the springs...plus those beautiful tokicos. I actually bought another set of springs and they were just as high as the first set.

 

the variation in springs is small, you're getting colder ...