Monique

Let me just add how oh I miss those hot summer days at Belle Chasse! Esp when Joe goes "shirtless"! lmao. I really do miss Delta and all you boys. My 8's set up pretty good now too. I've done quite a bit since last I've autocrossed. No more B-Stock!

PoLak check the Delta & CenLa sites for schedules. TLAC is is coming and I think a school (?).

PoLaK

iTrader: (1)

Joe where are you heading this Sunday, i'm free and looking to do 1/2 more events before I deport home?

Ike

That's nonsense, if anything AWD turbo cars are tougher to drive well in autox than RWD cars (especially NA RWD cars).

shinronin

*blinks* seriously? that's the first time i've heard that viewpoint. i've autox'd several AWD turbo cars (audi s4, STi, Evo 8, eclipse gsx, talon tsi and for myself at least the boost buggies are all infinitely easier to drive. driving a RWD momentum car (of which the rx-8 is one) takes much more precision and finesse than just manhandling a boost buggy around a course imho. why do you think AWD turbo cars are tougher to drive?

tmak26b

no, point and shoot, that's all you need to do in an awd. there is no need to worry about spinning out. how hard is it to back off the gas when the car plows?

PoLaK

iTrader: (1)

do explain ike do explain.

Ike

I've just always felt that with the many low speed turns on an autox course it's tougher to get AWD cars to rotate, especially those with a tendency to understeer. "Oversteery" cars will almost always be faster given equal power when compared to an AWD car IMO. Lastly, turbo cars struggle to stay on boost on a lot of autox courses and doing everything in your power to not let boost fall off is crucial. The punchy nature of turbo cars and the tight confines can also unsettle the car much easier than an NA car. I've seen too many ES MR2s whoop up on BS MR2s to think otherwise. I've also seen too many WRXs, STIs, and Evos struggle in stock categories against cars that they would pummel on most road courses.

Yes, it's much more difficult to spin an AWD car, but I think it's still no easier than RWD to get the most out of one in autox. Maybe a novice would do better with AWD to start, but as skill levels go up I don't see being fast with AWD as any easier than RWD.

PoLaK

iTrader: (1)

IMHO, keeping a turbo car on the boost is as crucial as keeping an low torque N/A car in the upper part of its powerband and I think the former is easier.

The nature of low-torque RWD cars like the Rx-8 needing to carry momentum through the (whole) course on the edge of "too fast"/"just in control" also makes it easier to unsettle the car, infact IMO alot easier than unsetling the car by getting on and off the boost in 1 or 2 particular turns/sections or being "punchy" because you can't balance the car with your right foot.

I'll forever believe that an AWD car will take less real driver skill to drive at the absolute limit than any traditional midengine RWD sports car, at any level of competitive driving.

shinronin

AWD shines in just those sort of low speed (tight) turns where, if enough care is given to late apex, the AWD driver can just floor it relying on AWD and good torque to claw out of the turn. the rx-8 is just hosed in such a turn. the rx-8 still needs a late apex, but then needs to maintain that speed longer as it took longer to get to that speed than the AWD car.

the issues you note are indeed valid, but they're also driver and course dependent. in my STU battles with the boost buggies last year the evo and STi don't lose much (if anything) depending on the course. they can lose out on slaloms and do lose out on big sweepers, but that's about it. as polak noted, it's hard to screw up in a AWD car. it's pretty easy to do so in RWD.