SCC's review of the RX8
03-18-2003, 11:08 PM
#53
Wow...
Well I'm suprised.. I'll wait up till Mazda decides to re-release the car and booyah maybe we'll get some more power out of that puppy yet!
Either way though... I'm a happy camper.
Well I'm suprised.. I'll wait up till Mazda decides to re-release the car and booyah maybe we'll get some more power out of that puppy yet!
Either way though... I'm a happy camper.
03-19-2003, 12:30 AM
#55
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Originally posted by confucious
Assuming this is true, it begs the question: how would an owner diagnose this problem if it were to happen to him? If C&D did their comparo with an RX-8 with this problem and were presumably satisified with the power, how would an owner ever notice?
Assuming this is true, it begs the question: how would an owner diagnose this problem if it were to happen to him? If C&D did their comparo with an RX-8 with this problem and were presumably satisified with the power, how would an owner ever notice?
Same question: How would anyone know if the power port valves are stuck shut ? besides actually feeling the lack of power would this be indicated by some kind of light on the instrument panel?
Question #2:
Would this be harmful for the engine if you keep running it, port stuck, for a long time?
03-19-2003, 12:57 AM
#57
Originally posted by Maximus
Question #1:
Same question: How would anyone know if the power port valves are stuck shut ? besides actually feeling the lack of power would this be indicated by some kind of light on the instrument panel?
Question #2:
Would this be harmful for the engine if you keep running it, port stuck, for a long time?
Question #1:
Same question: How would anyone know if the power port valves are stuck shut ? besides actually feeling the lack of power would this be indicated by some kind of light on the instrument panel?
Question #2:
Would this be harmful for the engine if you keep running it, port stuck, for a long time?
03-19-2003, 01:46 AM
#58
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Originally posted by DonG35Miata
I think the whole story is TREMENDOUSLY fishy. #1, I don't think an RX-8 with the top end of the powerband missing could hit 60 in 5.9 seconds. #2, if either of my cars was 15% down on power I'd sure notice. You don't think the engineers/testers/Mazda people in the USA and Japan know what an RX-8 should feel like when all the ponies are present and accounted for? I can tell the difference in my Miata when the A/C compressor is turned on, and that is probably a 10 hp drain at the absolute max. It's probably more like 5 hp. 40hp is a world-changing amount.
What's more, if the car wasn't opening up all the way, I doubt their would be the rush of power over 6,000 rpm that the magazines described.
I think the whole story is TREMENDOUSLY fishy. #1, I don't think an RX-8 with the top end of the powerband missing could hit 60 in 5.9 seconds. #2, if either of my cars was 15% down on power I'd sure notice. You don't think the engineers/testers/Mazda people in the USA and Japan know what an RX-8 should feel like when all the ponies are present and accounted for? I can tell the difference in my Miata when the A/C compressor is turned on, and that is probably a 10 hp drain at the absolute max. It's probably more like 5 hp. 40hp is a world-changing amount.
What's more, if the car wasn't opening up all the way, I doubt their would be the rush of power over 6,000 rpm that the magazines described.
That's true. Mazda engineers should have calculated the power-to-weight ratio before releasing the vehicle.
Could the missing horsepower come from the transmission?
03-19-2003, 02:37 AM
#59
Registered User
You got to understand that this article was written before the R&T or C&D articles saying 5.9 was possible.
However, the lack of power would explain why some of the reports from a couple months ago had RX-8 in the 6.3 area.
I think 0-60 will stay at 5.9
-Mr. Wigggles
However, the lack of power would explain why some of the reports from a couple months ago had RX-8 in the 6.3 area.
I think 0-60 will stay at 5.9
-Mr. Wigggles
03-19-2003, 12:40 PM
#60
I am believing that SCC is right actually..
If you re-read the C&D article, they said the G35 beats the RX-8 to 100mph and has better top end power. However given the nature of the torque and horsepower curves it always seemed unlikely to me yet I just looked past it. Passing power is generally better on rotary powered cars, and thus I had a little curiosity as to why the RX-8 would be any different in this regard.
That said, we'll give it some time and see... it's only a few months until the car is released and then we will see for certain whether it was running fine, or did signifigantly change.
It would have been nice for SCC to have done a straight line test because if they recieved the same numbers as C&D and R&T, and THEN dyno'ed it... the point would be proven already.
If you re-read the C&D article, they said the G35 beats the RX-8 to 100mph and has better top end power. However given the nature of the torque and horsepower curves it always seemed unlikely to me yet I just looked past it. Passing power is generally better on rotary powered cars, and thus I had a little curiosity as to why the RX-8 would be any different in this regard.
That said, we'll give it some time and see... it's only a few months until the car is released and then we will see for certain whether it was running fine, or did signifigantly change.
It would have been nice for SCC to have done a straight line test because if they recieved the same numbers as C&D and R&T, and THEN dyno'ed it... the point would be proven already.
03-19-2003, 01:11 PM
#61
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Originally posted by Elara
Thanks rx7tt95
What issue is that? I swear I dug through that entire car section and only saw the April issue....
Edit: nevermind, you're still posting- I'm just impatient. Sorry!
Thanks rx7tt95
What issue is that? I swear I dug through that entire car section and only saw the April issue....
Edit: nevermind, you're still posting- I'm just impatient. Sorry!
03-19-2003, 02:38 PM
#63
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I think it may be posible to see a small increase in performance.
there is some thin that I found strange I dit some cheking and the numbers i get tell me that the RX-8 does have a better power to weiht ratio compare to the infiniti G35 yet the infiniti have beter 0-60 time.
g35 3,435lbs divided by 280 =12.26lbs for each hp
RX-8 3,000lbs divided by 247=12.14lbs for each hp
am I right?
there is some thin that I found strange I dit some cheking and the numbers i get tell me that the RX-8 does have a better power to weiht ratio compare to the infiniti G35 yet the infiniti have beter 0-60 time.
g35 3,435lbs divided by 280 =12.26lbs for each hp
RX-8 3,000lbs divided by 247=12.14lbs for each hp
am I right?
03-19-2003, 05:44 PM
#64
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I dunno, it kinda makes some sense. In Road & Track, the RX-8 starts to die at higher speeds. Considering the horsepower is pretty much located at the top end, a pause in power in 5th gear would explain why it's such a dog after 100mph. My $0.02, maybe I'm wrong. I certainly hope it's a little faster than the mags are saying.
03-19-2003, 06:17 PM
#65
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Yeah I agree...I was checking out the power to weight ratios, as well as the gearing ratios...the RX8 should be able to keep up (with just a driver but not four passengers!). They did not include the dyno graph in the article unfortunately. From what I understand, other magazines had tested this car BEFORE SCC got it. I really hope there was another 40hp worth of acceleration to be had...that'll take .3-.4 seconds off the 1/4 mile time using the same launch techniques.
If they're wrong...we need to start a letter writing campain :D
If they're wrong...we need to start a letter writing campain :D
03-20-2003, 12:11 AM
#67
Originally posted by Maximus
Does this mean that all magazines like R&T, C&D, MT, have been using the same car (the one with the ports stuck shut) for their reviews ???
Does this mean that all magazines like R&T, C&D, MT, have been using the same car (the one with the ports stuck shut) for their reviews ???
03-20-2003, 11:00 AM
#68
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This was great information to have been discovered, and I had also noticed the same thing about the top end accelleration falling off at 100mph (if not a little before) in the auto mags.
One question...are any of you guys in the first allocation getting nervous about the possibility of this materializing in your production cars?
Considering when this article was written in order to be published in next month's SCC, chances are Mazda has already identified and rectified the problem for all the production vehicles, but it does make me feel a little better knowing that I'm in the third allocation.
:o
One question...are any of you guys in the first allocation getting nervous about the possibility of this materializing in your production cars?
Considering when this article was written in order to be published in next month's SCC, chances are Mazda has already identified and rectified the problem for all the production vehicles, but it does make me feel a little better knowing that I'm in the third allocation.
:o
03-20-2003, 11:43 AM
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There are actually 2 6-port sleeves - one for each chamber. If one or both are stuck open, the engine won't idle smoothly. If one or both are stuck closed, high-rpm breathing will suffer, but it'll be difficult to detect unless you know what the car felt like before. If only one was stuck closed, that would make it all the more difficult to tell.
On my '91 Coupe (Zoom-ZoomH, where'd you get the picture of MY car) you can definitely feel the power rush when the 6-port sleeves open up and I would feel it if something wasn't right.
When I first bought the car (about 5 years ago), the rear sleeve was stuck open and I didn't notice it for a couple of years. I'm sure I could have fixed SCC's test car in 30 minutes. If only I had known
On my '91 Coupe (Zoom-ZoomH, where'd you get the picture of MY car
) you can definitely feel the power rush when the 6-port sleeves open up and I would feel it if something wasn't right.When I first bought the car (about 5 years ago), the rear sleeve was stuck open and I didn't notice it for a couple of years. I'm sure I could have fixed SCC's test car in 30 minutes. If only I had known
03-20-2003, 11:45 AM
#70
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It bugs me only from the standpoint that:
1) There is possibly no electronic detection system
2) The RX-8 shows up after traveling for 1+ month, and sticking before I get it, hence no way to know it is stuck.
If it sticks after having it, I would think the loss of power would be evident.
1) There is possibly no electronic detection system
2) The RX-8 shows up after traveling for 1+ month, and sticking before I get it, hence no way to know it is stuck.
If it sticks after having it, I would think the loss of power would be evident.
03-20-2003, 01:40 PM
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Well the article says that the ports got stuck cuz of some hard driving (i.e. around laguna). So I don't think you will get them stuck driving normally. By then you should be able to get a feel for it and notice any power changes.
03-20-2003, 01:51 PM
#72
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Originally posted by JohnnyG
I could have fixed SCC's test car in 30 minutes. If only I had known
I could have fixed SCC's test car in 30 minutes. If only I had known
03-20-2003, 02:47 PM
#74
Originally posted by jonalan
I wonder how much of this (if it is true) could be due to the hard driving right off the line; without a break-in period.
I wonder how much of this (if it is true) could be due to the hard driving right off the line; without a break-in period.
After that I'll be hearing a lot of buzzers!
03-20-2003, 03:24 PM
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Originally posted by Hercules
Dunno... will be bad for me as I'm not too keen on breaking in the car. Maybe for the first 250 miles, then an oil change.
After that I'll be hearing a lot of buzzers!
Dunno... will be bad for me as I'm not too keen on breaking in the car. Maybe for the first 250 miles, then an oil change.
After that I'll be hearing a lot of buzzers!