Return of the ROTARY
10-12-2011, 02:54 PM
#76
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yes.
the concept is that the more you lighten parts, the more you can lighten the parts that conect to those parts, etc. so you compound the savings through the system, engine, tranny, etc... part of the skyactiv engine gains come from the combustion cycle and part comes from engine redesign/lightening.
If Mazda can lighten the rotors, e-shaft, flywheel, housings, etc then use the skyactiv tranny, we could see significant gaines in hp and weight reduction.
10-12-2011, 03:09 PM
#77
THe skyactive piston engines had a specially designed cavity in the piston head. Maybe the Sky-active rotary would have specially shaped rotor face cut outs to improve torque.
I had always wondered, the current 13b rotor had a uniform cavity on the rotor face. But knowing that the rotor only spins in one direction and the combustion always go in one direction only, why isn't that cavity sloped to increase torque.
I had always wondered, the current 13b rotor had a uniform cavity on the rotor face. But knowing that the rotor only spins in one direction and the combustion always go in one direction only, why isn't that cavity sloped to increase torque.
10-12-2011, 03:41 PM
#79
After looking as Mazdas skyactiv site it looks to be pretty much a marketing thing. The ideas behind the skyactiv G could be implemented in a rotary though, as it doesn't seem to use a Miller cycle at all(don't know where I heard that it did). Long tube headers, 14:1 compression rotors 
))), maybe they'll move the location/change the shape of the exhaust ports to speed exhaust gas removal/make it more complete.
))), maybe they'll move the location/change the shape of the exhaust ports to speed exhaust gas removal/make it more complete.
10-12-2011, 03:45 PM
#82
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Clever, but I dunno, it's all getting a little too "SkyNet" for me lol...
Darn cars shift when THEY want to, stop the engine when THEY want to, start at the push of a button (or smartphone app), rain-sensing wipers, auto-off headlights, traction control, stability control... hello? Remember ME?
Darn cars shift when THEY want to, stop the engine when THEY want to, start at the push of a button (or smartphone app), rain-sensing wipers, auto-off headlights, traction control, stability control... hello? Remember ME?
I don't mine some of the "safety" "controllers"..but all the other AUTO on or off stuff leaves me totally cold....it is just more stuff to go wrong...and lazy car pilots.
And believe me as a parts guy these modules are horrendously expensive, I am not talking the 50-100 $$, some of these black boxes are in the $500+ range and are not a universal unit but brand, country, model and sometimes year specific.
10-12-2011, 04:08 PM
#84
Clever, but I dunno, it's all getting a little too "SkyNet" for me lol...
Darn cars shift when THEY want to, stop the engine when THEY want to, start at the push of a button (or smartphone app), rain-sensing wipers, auto-off headlights, traction control, stability control... hello? Remember ME?
Darn cars shift when THEY want to, stop the engine when THEY want to, start at the push of a button (or smartphone app), rain-sensing wipers, auto-off headlights, traction control, stability control... hello? Remember ME?
10-12-2011, 05:32 PM
#86
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10-12-2011, 05:47 PM
#87
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Not for me. I don't fit in them. The RX-8 size is perfect for me, and the versatility is great for all the stuff I tote around on weekend trips. I hope whatever they eventually replace it with has at least as much imagination and versatility. After the RX-8, a simple roadster just doesn't do it for me...
It's about as close as a true sports car can get to a SUV!
10-12-2011, 06:18 PM
#88
at your local stealership ...
hmm...
I mean Mazda dealer
One day, human being gonna be like that movie, hmm whats it call again, oh yeah, Wall-E. Everybody will be "feed/grow" by machines, not doing a single thing. everybody is overweight, can't even walk with their own feet(cuz they never had to)
That's just sad.
IMO, it will be kinda hard to use it on Rotary engine, cuz of the shape and engine position. I'm no engineer so take my 0.02 as bs. *flame suit on*
hmm...
I mean Mazda dealer
I had a guy talking to me today, telling me about an idea to have an EGOS chip in vehicle gas tanks that logs octane, typical fill level, and has your credit card info, so you can just pull in to the gas station and the pump fills your car for you, without you having to do anything.
My only thought was: "people aren't lazy enough?!
My only thought was: "people aren't lazy enough?!
That's just sad.
IMO, it will be kinda hard to use it on Rotary engine, cuz of the shape and engine position. I'm no engineer so take my 0.02 as bs. *flame suit on*
10-12-2011, 06:22 PM
#89
THe skyactive piston engines had a specially designed cavity in the piston head. Maybe the Sky-active rotary would have specially shaped rotor face cut outs to improve torque.
I had always wondered, the current 13b rotor had a uniform cavity on the rotor face. But knowing that the rotor only spins in one direction and the combustion always go in one direction only, why isn't that cavity sloped to increase torque.
I had always wondered, the current 13b rotor had a uniform cavity on the rotor face. But knowing that the rotor only spins in one direction and the combustion always go in one direction only, why isn't that cavity sloped to increase torque.
well I don't know, maybe Mazda can employ some plasma spray like Nissan did to their GT-R to minimize friction then use some sort of alloy to create some super light and super strong rotor ... ($$$$$$$$)
10-13-2011, 05:24 AM
#93
As been said, there are several designs of rotor recess, some are better for fuel economy, some for emissions, some for power. It goes in hand with position of sparkplugs itself and many more variables
In rotary engine, its always compromise
10-13-2011, 09:17 AM
#95
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I think I remember reading that was one of the things they were doing with the 16X: messing with the "eccentricity" of the e-shaft to increase torque.
10-13-2011, 11:32 AM
#98
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What is your line of thought there OD?
If I apply that to the Renesis, it would mean a redline of 3,000rpm, though I can't work out if it would put more or less torque to the ground (either 3 times more or 2/3rds less)
If I apply that to the Renesis, it would mean a redline of 3,000rpm, though I can't work out if it would put more or less torque to the ground (either 3 times more or 2/3rds less)
10-13-2011, 12:07 PM
#99
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not sure how that would change power out put but without the gears the rotor head would move in a simple circle not the epitrochoid movement we come to know and love. Actually I'm not sure it could it could complete the otto cycle since the chamber sizes would remain constant....unless i'm completely missing your point olddragger, which has been know to happen.
Last edited by serothis; 10-13-2011 at 12:09 PM. Reason: pancakes
10-13-2011, 12:24 PM
#100
Torque is solely function of displacement and BMEP. What you will do is, that maximum torque is reached at lower rpms because engines natural VE% curve quite follows mean piston speed - which is higher with longer stroke. Just recall simply physics, work is application of force on distance. When you increase stroke - distance, you surely produce more work, but this example is not valid, since displacement itself changed. Very same we would increase force by using piston with larger diameter or rotor face with larger area, but again, we changed displacement. Point is, that no matter how much you fiddle with engine geometry, these two parameters always cancel each other out
If 16X will ever see light, and if it will produce more specific torque than renesis, it will be due to better combustion characteristics, which has been documented in patent, no due to excentricity
And it doesn´t transmit any torque or power.OD, with respect, grab the oldest RE by Kenichi Yamamoto and read it whole....