WTBRotary!

iTrader: (6)

Whatever makes you happy man... That's all I have at this point...

Rotary_Redliner

Hmmm?

Nathan Atkins

I think it's just that now my fanboy-ness is wearing thin.

It's always irked me when people say things like "it's 232hp from 1.3 liters!" A line which essentially contains two lies. And where before I would politely correct people, now I'm just saying "ah gimme a break!"

Anyway, I've always been up front about the car faults, and never have recommended the car to anyone. It should only be owned by people who know what it is and love it warts and all.

The rx8 has a unique niche and it fills it perfectly and I'm glad there is a strong enthusiast community to support it. As for me, soon enough I'm moving on.

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

^ just like it irks us when people can't ever let the faults of the car go.

Nathan Atkins

Jesus RIWWP, that comment is so out of character for you. I think I made it pretty clear that I've spent an awful lot of time being perfectly content with the faults of the car and have defended it pretty fiercely, I think I'm entitled to eventually have the faults begin to overshadow the charms. Especially when cast in new relief by a newer car built to serve a similar market. It would seem that's the point of this thread.

bladeiai

iTrader: (1)

Can't we all just get along...

Nathan Atkins

Dude that pic is hilarious wtf

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

The "faults" you are harping on aren't faults. Sure, I totally get that some people, probably even most people, will feel a need to move on. I did, I don't currently own an 8 after all. But harping on a published number that simply never mattered even when the 8 was new and doesn't change the reality that has been proven over and over... it's just pointless. If you were complaining that the 8 only made 180-190whp, then whatever, we get it. Instead you are complaining that the window sticker number is wrong on a car that isn't even produced any more. MOST window sticker peak HP numbers are wrong, on most cars, but you aren't harping on those? Why not?


I'm not saying you don't have a right to argue against the 8 and prefer another car. I'm saying that your choice of points to support that argument has zero force behind them. It's like complaining that the window sticker doesn't say that the 8 has a fuel pump, when there is plenty of evidence to show exactly what hardware is installed and why does it matter what was on the window sticker 9 years ago anyway?

That's my point.

How is your wife's FR-S valvetrain holding up? Plenty of them were self-destructing. No car is perfect. I gave the BRZ a fair shot, but ultimately rejected it due to the seats and the sound of the motor. Good chassis but I couldn't ever daily it.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Every car has faults and the good points of the RX-8 far outweigh the bad. Even today there are few cars in the sub 50k range that really are a replacement in my opinion. Which is why I still have it after all these years. And of course turbocharging it has made some of those faults an even bigger issue but that is par for the course when you turbocharge a car that was not designed to be turbocharged.

The BRZ/FRS is barely competition for the RX-8 now and it's a decade newer design. And they just conformed that there will be no turbo version so owners are left to the aftermarket and you will see just how well this NA designed 2.0L boxer does when turbocharged. The 370Z is a boat and felt horrible to me. The Genesis R Spec (both V-6 and Turbo versions)looks good on paper but I have never driven one.

I will wait until I can get the Cayman I want

Habs24 7

9k-new issue of Grassroots Motorsports has a quick review of the R-spec Genesis. they compare it to the FRS/BRZ. interesting read.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Thanks, that reminds me that I need to renew that subscription.

Nathan Atkins

Her valve train seems to be ok, it doesn't make any of the cricket chirping noises(which I have heard on several frs's) but I've been pretty fortunate with not getting typical problems with cars: I had a few Miatas that didn't have the the crank issue, an rx8 that never flooded, lets hope that good luck keeps up for the life of the scooby.

You what would be nice is an rx8 with the power train from the newer 3.7 mustang, I feel like whenever Mazdas hand was forced on dropping the renesis, that's something they could've thrown together over a weekend and put on sale. Maybe that's a headache I'd like to give myself. I bet you could find a rolled stang for cheap. It's be a modest bump in power and some decent fuel economy(on 87 octane no less) maybe ill start a swap thread with 6 months of conjecture to **** off TeamRx8 haha

bladeiai

iTrader: (1)

Maybe I'm a purist but I feel the RX-8 should have a rotary in it, once you take that out it's just some freakish hybrid...

blackenedwings

The RX-8 is a niche car. It's a great option for RWD, excellent handling, low power GT car that has 4 usable seats. There are very few cars for any price that compete with the handling the car has. It's insanely forgiving at the limit, so it can comfortably be driven hard without risk. That being said, it's heavy, and underpowered, which makes it slow. It doesn't take well to modification so there aren't a lot of ways to improve it's speed.

On the other hand, the FR-S is more expensive, has no usable rear seats, and is also underpowered. It can however be modified quite easily to make it very fast. I just raced against Phil Grabow's Element Tuning turbo FR-S at Hyperfest this year, and to see a car originally putting out 200 bhp running at the front of TT2 is impressive as hell.

If you are happy with the performance range that a stock RX-8, 350/370Z, S2000, or BRZ/FR-S has then the RX-8 is arguably the best option weighing price, seats, and handling together. If you want something faster start with a platform that can reach those targets reliably.

I don't even really count the Genesis as being competition because the handling is worse than the RX-8 and although it makes decent power, its insanely heavy. It's not a terrible car, but I would rather have an RX-8 over a Genesis.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Doesn't the Genesis weigh about as much as an EVO? I wouldn't say it's insanely heavy.

And as for power, once you start modifying and tracking then all the rest goes out the window. I could build a REW powered RX-8 track car that would be a pretty fast track car for under $20,000.00.

And while agree the Renesis is not the best platform to go on, I also don't think someone has really done it right (myself included) yet. I think a 350WHP reliable track car is very doable with the right setup. The problem is that most of us have not done it properly and had a proper build done with all the details addressed from the turbo kit, to supporting mods, etc.

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

Evo9 is ~3,285lbs curb weight (MR trim)
Evo10 is ~3,517lbs (GSR trim, the MR is automanual, adds more weight)
'12 Genesis 2.0T is ~3,294lbs (R-Spec)
'12 Genesis 3.8 is ~3,389lbs (R-Spec)

Blackenedwing's Evo9 is around 3,000lbs if I remember right?

blackenedwings

Yup, and my girl is still a fat bitch. Because one of the series I intended to run in this season required an OEM interior from the driver forward I still have a full dash, full door panels, including speakers, sound deadening, etc. I'm even still running an OEM battery. The only reason I'm competitive in TT2 is a crapton of power and extremely limited fear reflex. Next season I will be dropping a ton of weight out of the front of the car and reducing the power a bit.

It's not that the Genesis 2.0T is all that heavy, because realistically its about Evo 9 weight like you show, it's that the Evo weight comes partly from the AWD system. The Genesis is RWD, and the 2.0T is very low power for that weight. The engine isn't particularly strong either as it's an even weaker version of the Mitsu 4B11T which isn't all that strong compared to it's predecessor.

The 3.8L is even heavier, and although it's OEM setup is faster than the 2.0L turbo, its actually easy to make the 2.0L turbo faster than the NA car with minor modifications. For the power output the car makes, and the "meh" suspension the car is just too heavy.

I mean, Mike can tell you, I have a totally skewed sense of what is enough power/weight in a road car because I'm a power junkie. I'm also a boost junkie, so I am always looking at the platform as a candidate for boost and lots of it. I personally believe the Renesis is an excellent motor design for an NA lightweight platform... something well under 2500 lbs would move like hell with a tweaked 200+ whp Renny. The Renesis just doesn't handle boost reliably. The REW motor does more reliably, but why would you put that motor in a chassis that base weight is 300 lbs heavier than the chassis it came in originally? If you want to build a baller rotary track car, the FD3S chassis is better suited for it in every way.

I can say very confidently that a 350 whp reliable turbo Renesis track car is a pipe dream. It will never ever happen. The engine design (exhaust ports and side seals) is not compatible with the heat and buildup generated with that setup. I ran 12 psi with a Devil's Hairdryer for a year on my boosted Shinka and never blew the motor, but had nonstop problems even after redoing everything on that car painstakingly.

Where the Renesis would shine is as a power plant for a small chassis like an Exocet (that Mike and I have talked about) or the NC Miata chassis. It actually is an ideal fit for a really lightweight chassis because the low torque profile is a huge benefit in that chassis instead of a detriment. The wide power band, and high revs work perfectly there.

Rotary_Redliner

Went for a back road run after work today with an FR-S, surprisingly capable little car! Even with Prius tires :p

Fernandofan08

Cant stand the FRS. I believe the 8 is a better car in standard form performance wise. My only problem with the RX8 is Mazda UK's attitude and the fuel consumption to power ratio.

New Yorker

Sigh. I don't think you folks appreciate just how good the RX-8 is. Was. Think you'll see pieces like this after the FR-S is gone?
http://m.automobilemag.com/reviews/d...8/viewall.html

Nathan Atkins

New Yorker, I loved that article, I read it in print back when it came out. They really help to return to light just how great the RX8 was in it's day, and for dedicated owners, how great it will continue to be for as long as they all last. I think that the BRZ and FRS will be regaled in a similar way, not obviously for their uniqueness or raw capability, but for servicing a niche that most car makers were ignoring at the time. Hopefully they'll spark some quality competitors and we can have a little sports coupe renaissance.



I just mopped the floor with every STX RX8 that turned up to WDCR SCCA solo this sunday in my wife's showroom stock Prius tire shod BRZ. Take it from me, the BRZ/FRS is at worst equal to and at best a cut above the RX8. I would expect nothing less from a car designed nearly a decade later. I don't just 'believe it'. I own both cars and have competed with both cars. (John cue up the Anakin Skywalker turns to the dark side picture haha)

Fernandofan08

lol! Over here the GT86 isnt too hard to beat in the corners. Legs on the straights though. They have more BHP than the 250/231ps RX8 though and they are much lighter and better MPG. I just wouldn't pay £31k/$50k for one though, no way in hell.

I just cant see why anyone would want a car with an interior that not really that good, two seats with performance which isn't better than a £3000 RX8 rebuild included at 10 times the price. Its really poor.

Slidin8

The 86 has less horsepower. It has 200bhp

bladeiai

iTrader: (1)

WWAAAAAAIIIIITTT a minute... Now I will give you that you own both and have the ability to drive both and make more of a side by side comparison than most if not any of the rest of us.
BUT, is there ever a time you don't mop the floor with all of the STX RX-8's when you bring your RX-8? Or basically anything at the CDC that doesn't out class you by 100hp?
I don't think I'm going too far out of line by saying you are much more experienced than any of the other RX-8 owners that probably showed up out there. I would be more interested to know how you do with each car on the same track.



And you knew it was coming...

Nathan Atkins

haha! I actually LOLed at that! Did you make that pic?

one of these days I'll get both of them out there at the same day, or at least co-drive with someone else who has an 8 on a day I bring the BRZ. Hopefully before my ($129ea!!) G-force Rivals arrive on my doorstep!