ASH8

Hi Jeremy,

Perhaps you can convince Doug Dickson and John Read your Australian Counterpart here for a similar Warranty extension for the forgotten cousins in Australia...after all we have a RX-8 vehicle park of close to 6000, not bad for a population of 20 million people.

Anyway I am talking to John Read hopefully next week.
Cheers
Ashley

swoope

iTrader: (5)

thanks zoom,

that was much better written than what i had sent you. was up all night.

now the answer?

btw, thanks jeremy for your time and effort.

beers

expo1

Did I miss something or did what we learn today from Jeremy was dealers are independent business / Mazda has no say in how they treat customers & read the owners manual??

dmc27

^ More importantly, did we learn that Mazda knows some dealerships are less than stellar, but Mazda still chooses to let substandard dealerships have the final say in the choice to deny vs. honor Mazda's warranty?

fahrfegneugen

I guess, he seemed to dissapear.

swoope

iTrader: (5)

recommend oil from owners manual. non syn and premixing is not needed...

i think there is more to come.

beers

Mazmart

iTrader: (12)

Probably not today.

Paul.

swoope

iTrader: (5)

yep,

not today.

beers

zoom44

yeah he'll be back. the problem with his first post combined with some timing issues unfortunately.

Bran

Looks to be the extent of it.... extend our warranty ( just to keep us quiet for 09 introduction )so the deadbeat dealerships can continue to jerk us around. My car was a daily driver however, since its embarrasing when your stranded on a customers parking lot for 3 hours with the heat index at 105+.... I parked it and got a Honda Accord!

robrecht

The Mets have lost 29 games so far this year and are in next to last place, but at least we know all the statistics to measure their failures. Are you guessing that 5% of Renesis engines have failed?

RotoRocket

iTrader: (1)

That should not be the case. Any dispute with an individual dealership over a warranty issue should be taken up directly with Mazda North America, I'd hope and expect.

zoom44

update- Jeremy had to run out to the race track to throw his Spec Miata around. He'll log in again later tonite or tomorrow with more responses.

Razz1

I hope I will not need the warrenty.

Excellant way to address the issues over the last few years.

ASH8

Thanks Charlie for setting this up with JB....your the man!

Give us a thought (transcendental ) down under for a similar warranty extension.

Mazurfer

Wow....need to keep reading, but I'm guessing he might answer the first, but I'll bet he can't touch on two and three.

This is basically just to subscribe to the thread. I appreciate Jeremy answering what questions he can, I just believe we aren't going to get that much out of him.
Please prove me wrong. Also, think everyone should not harass him in this thread, but try to keep it clean and with short, precise questions.....as opposed to what I just did!

Mazurfer

JeremyB,

Really glad to see you on here attempting to answer some questions concerning this extended warranty as well as other questions(where you can).

I have one that is somewhat related.

As you know, a great majority of RX8 owners do their own maintenance(where the can) and are very particular about their cars. Given that MazdaUSA.com has an owners page that allows you to input and keep track of all of your service history(even if done at home.....oil changes etc?), will this be considered as proof of upkeep?
I put as much info in there as I can from each time I work on my car, including date, cost, location, mileage, etc. and I of course keep all the receipts from work done at the Mazda dealer(which has only been once for a recall flash and the visor). Would Mazda consider the info input on the site they provide as proof of keeping up on maintenance? I even put each and every oil change in there.

Again......Welcome and I love my car! I've owned two other Mazdas, but this is my first rotary.

dmc27

I agree, but as Nubo and a few others have mentioned there seems to be a land of limbo where owners get stuck between a dealership that decides the warranty won't be honored and MNAO saying "what the dealer says goes."

"- dealers: as you all know, every dealership is an independent business, neither owned nor operated by us. as such, they all run slightly differently. you are not obligated to return to the dealer from whom you purchased your car for service, nor are you required to service your car at a Mazda dealer. You are, however, required to maintain proof of maintenance of the car (per the maintenance schedule) if you wish to receive warranty service. I'm sure you can understand this..."

This response seems to imply (in my opinion) that Mazda knows there are dealerships that aren't top notch. I don't believe it reflects well on Mazda when customers get caught in said land of limbo, especially if I inferred correctly that Mazda knows some dealers stink. If that's the case I think MNAO should be advocating for their owners, rather than accepting the decision of the dealerships w/o any real attempt at diagnosing the problem on their own.

I would like to see the "warranty denied" issue discussed in more concrete terms, if you could please Jeremy. And perhaps some discussion about the state of a warranty system that allows "an independent business" the power to void a Mazda warranty.

I do love my 8, and have been trouble free for 40k, with the only issue being the taillight condensation that was fixed under warranty. But even with this minor issue the dealership I used jerked me around a bit by telling me I had to come back when "the tech who takes pictures was working", then following that BS up by NOT taking any pictures when I came back another day. I understand that Mazda can't be expected to police the large number of dealerships across the country, but I think it's fair to expect MNAO to side with an owner unless a dealership shows some proof of why a warranty should be voided, rather than just claiming some aftermarket part, "abuse", or other factor caused the problem w/o any real diagnostic evidence, which seems to be the case more often than not.

New Yorker

Yes, 5%, more or less, and that's a guess on my part. Significantly higher than that and it would certainly be reflected in Consumer Reports reliabilty ratings (where the 8's reliability rating is going UP as the years go by and the miles accumulate), and it would be written about—or at the very least mentioned—in newspapers, auto mags and on cable news.

But I'm certain the replacement rate for owners who post on this forum is much higher. Unfortunately, people on this forum are hardly a representative sample of all RX-8 owners. In many cases, they found their way here because they had an engine problem in the first place, and sought information and/or solace. What's more, people here tend to mod their cars, drive competitively, ignore Mazda's oil recommendations, and "premix" at far greater rates than the general RX-8 owning population. (Which, I believe, is why many here believe—erroneously—that the replacement rate is high for all RX-8s. It would be easy for people unfamiliar with statistics and sampling to casually read the many engine replacement posts on this forum and conclude that most, if not many, Renesis engines will ultimately need to be replaced prematurely: "There's twenty-one guys in our RX-8 club and seven of 'em had their engines fail. Do the math!" )

robrecht

5% engine failure (I know it's just a guess) seems huge to me--do you have any idea how that would compare to other 5-year-old car models? Also seems like quite a logical jump to attribute engine failures here to oil choice and premix. Or, as someone who is familiar statistics and sampling, do you have any evidence for this assumption? Do you think there is a higher rate of Renesis failure in the rest of the world where 5w-30 is recommended?

Rotr8

iTrader: (2)

It would be interesting to do a poll on this forum comparing the different regions,US,EU,an Asian. Taking into consideration the factors discussed above, mods, oil preferences,etc. In regards to engine problems, complete engine failure and maitenance I wonder if there would be any trends, and of course realizing that we are only a small percentage of the RX8 population..

New Yorker

I have no idea what the engine replacement rate is for other 5-yr old models.

I've never made that assumption. As I've said before, my hypothesis is that engine replacement is correlated to one or more of the following factors:

• New to the market '04 models suffering from first-year-of-production teething problems (i.e. ECU poorly calibrated for US driving conditions)
• AT cars with just one oil cooler
• Owner neglect or misuse: i.e. not following Mazda's oil recommendation, modding the car, racing, wrong grade of fuel, not checking oil level frequently, not revving the engine regularly, premixing

Again, I don't assume these are causes; it's merely a hypothesis. Thus, I also suspect that few '05 and later MT cars, not modded, not raced, properly maintained, following Mazda's oil recommendations, not premixed—and revved/redlined regularly—will require engine replacement.

I do believe the Renesis has a narrower margin of (owner) error than ordinary engines. And I believe Mazda's changes for the '09 and beyond will reduce this margin of error.

No, I don't. In fact, I'd like to believe that 5W-30 is every bit as good as 5W-20—albeit at a small cost in fuel economy (and possibly effectiveness at critical start-up). Oil technology continues to evolve; today "full protection" and "better mileage" are not mutually exclusive. I wouldn't be surprised if, in time, the "rest of the world" comes around and moves to 5W-20—not just for the RX-8, but many cars. You read it here first.

Do you believe Mazda would recommend an engine oil that would adversely affect the longevity of the Renesis, its technological pride and joy, knowing full well that the world would be watching the reliability of this "last chance" rotary engine under a microscope? And if, for arguments sake, in 2004 Mazda did recommend an oil that proved to be unsuitable for the Renesis, do you believe they would then continue to recommend it in model years 2005, 2006, 2007 and 2008, knowing it could lead to the demise of the RX-8, let alone the rotary-engined car?

Rotr8

iTrader: (2)

ummmm is it me or does all of the arguments made here referring to whom follows what oil practices sound all to familiar to hundreds of post in the tech garage???

Revolver

By all means continue to answer the lubrication problems but what about ignition?

Why are coils, plugs and leads failing at 40K and under? I'm only a touch over 40K and I've replaced 4 coils, 6 plugs and 2 leads. And I'm not the only one.

This is serious for two reasons:

1. Some owners are being advised to replace their engine!! This is expensive when you're out of warranty.

2. Spare parts prices in other regions are ridiculously expensive.

Has the ignition system been reviewed for the '09 model?

(I sure hope Mazda Australia are watching this thread. Hopefully they have the ***** to post as well).

ASH8

^^^ Touché!!