LionZoo

Hello. I'm a first time poster currently considering between the MX-5, RX-8, and S2000 (will make a purchase new within the next year). I'm posting to confirm what issues there are on the RX-8 to get a better understanding of what I would possibly be getting myself into.

My main concern is the transmission. There seems to be a lot of reports of replaced transmission due to grinding and locking out of gears. However, I'm wondering how prevalent they actually are and whether its been fixed by Mazda or not. I know when the NB Miata came out, it seemed like everyone had the #4 thrust bearing issue, but actually very few people did.

In addition to the transmission, I've compiled the following list of problems that seems to be commonly reported:

fuel consumption (not a big deal)
adding oil (not a problem at all)
squealing brakes (slightly annoying)
warm cupholder (slightly annoying)
rattles (somewhat annoying)
flooding (not a concern)
weak interior trim (somewhat concerning)
carbon choking on 4 ports (I'm going for the MT)
possible cooling deficiency in hot climates (slightly concerning)

Is there anything I missed and can anyone tell me how common these symptoms are? I'm just doing my research right now, and even though it looks like I'm fairly negative on the RX-8 it's actually my first choice right now. Just trying to gain as much information as possible. The fact that the RX-8 is the only rotary on the road is a very big plus.

9291150

LionZoo, I only had mine for 5000 miles so I had no problems other than squealing brakes (seems common, happens only in the cold for me) and one small rattle. That said, I never drove any car that I couldn't find a rattle. Otherwise, best car I ever owned.

I'd buy all three cars you mentioned in a heartbeat. I think with these three it'll come down to do you really want a convertable or not. I don't 'cause I prefer to ride motorcycles on sunny days. But I once had a Miata, and the few convertable drives I had were memorable.

Otherwise I selected the 8 because is a better all rounder. The S2000 is slightly quicker if thats your thing, but not by much considering it's a more focused sportscar. The new MX5's are the best bang for your buck in a quality package.

Chasvhill

I'm coming up on 19,000 miles on my '04, 6MT, Touring Package w/sunroof.

I can honestly say I haven't experienced any of the issues you listed except the fuel, oil and warm cupholder (nice when I'm drinking coffee on my way to work). So far (knock on wood), this car has been as solid and reliable as a...a Toyota Camry or a Honda Accord.. ...but a lot more fun.

It's been over a year since I bought the car and the interior is still like new. There are no rattles. I do hear more drivetrain noise than most cars, but it seems to be just the way it's put together.

I agree with 9291150, all are good cars. I was close to buying the S2000 until I drove it and realized how difficult it would be to live with in the long run. I needed a car I could drive every day. The Mazda is that car. Also, the S2K is quick, but it's also noisier and the motor is just so much less refined.

On the other hand, a convertible is a convertible. If that's what you want, I think you need to buy the Honda. The Miata is nice, but it's a major step down in performance.

Whatever you do - Happy Motoring (you can't lose with these choices)

HolyCross05

I have 90 miles on my '05 8, no problems yet

Only complain I have is impatient people honking their horns when I stall
(I just learned how to drive MT 4 days ago).

ALP22

I'm sure you know this already, but check out www. miataforum.com for more than you could ever want to know about miatas. The #4 bearing issue only affected 99/00 miatas, and mazda has been very good about engine replacements for original owners. Luckily its a very small number that were affected, but unfortunately the bad press it generated was overwhelming.

The NC miata (new 3rd gen') is in the opinion of a lot of miataphiles not as "passionate" as the older models. It is a bit too refined and mainstream, but that may change with time. I remember all the 1st gen miata owners saying the same when the NB's came out.

I'm debating whether to change from a miata to an 8, but right now the biggest stumbling blocks are fuel consumption, price (the miata is paid for), and the wife

NoTears316

Well, I have had my 8 since Aug 2003, have 33k miles on her. As far as your concerns, I will gladly add my input from experiance.

fuel consumption: well, the 8 is not the most economical car in the world, but it isn't as bad as some would like you to believe.

adding oil: you will want to check the oil regularly, and it doesn't hurt to have a quart on hand if taking a long road trip.

squealing brakes: there is a service bulletin on this, easy fix.

warm cupholder: there is a service bulletin/recall "kinda" pertaining to this where Mazda is installing heat insulator pads.

rattles: I have not experianced any odd sounds related to stock parts.

flooding: I have never flooded, just follow the cold start procedures.

weak interior trim: my temperature control **** broke... was replaced for free.

carbon choking on 4 ports: Cant help here, I have the MT

possible cooling deficiency in hot climates: I live in El Paso, TX... we see temps in the 100's fairly often here, and I have never had any problems with my cooling system.

For service bulletins on anything related to the 8, check here... http://www.finishlineperformance.com...ins_index.html

Hope this helps!

zoom44

do you need/want 4seats?

hemanrulez

exactly if you don't need 4 seats the S2000 rocks.

LionZoo

Well, I guess a little more background is in order. My ideal car would be a lightweight (around 2,500 pounds), short wheelbase, rotary powered, high revving, 2 seat RWD coupe. Obviously no car in production meets all those criteria, so I need to compromise a bit.

I don't need 4 seats, but the RX-8 does have a high revving rotary. The RX-8 has the longest wheelbase of them all and gives up a bit in the handling department to the S2000, but having a fixed roof is a plus in my books; I am a bit of a stiffness fanatic. The RX-8 is also the heaviest of the trio and barely meets my weight requirements.

I would like a fixed roof or at least something more substantial than vinyl or cloth and so the S2000 or MX-5 would need a hardtop. The MX-5 is too soft stock and would need the Mazdaspeed bits to bring it up to my tastes. However, the MZR engine has too low of a redline and doesn't pack the kick at the top end that I like (I don't mind having no torque at the low end). The final mark against it is that it has the most flexible structure of the three.

The main knock against the S2000 is that with a hardtop, it is substantially pricier than the other two. It has the best handling off the showroom floor of the three and I personally like the interior of the car the most, but at such a high price premium it better fit me better! If the S2000 was the same price or just a bit more expensive than the RX-8, it would be my choice even factoring in the RX-8 has a rotary; but a $9,000 increase is hard to stomach. For that much money I can do quite a few things to the RX-8 to make it perform better (wheels and tires, uprated brakes, stiffer suspension, lighter exhaust...).

However, my main concern with the RX-8 is currently the transmission. The prospect of having to replace a transmission at the 15,000 mile isn't too appealing to me, so I'm trying to get a handle on exactly how many RX-8's are afflicted with transmission woes. The other things I can live with, transmission problems probably not.

tuj

If you've ever had a Miata, you'll know that they can be hard to get into first gear when the transmission is cold. Swapping to redline brand fluid helps. That being said, the RX-8 transmission is made by Aisine, who also makes the s2000 and MX-5 (and previous Miata's) transmissions. I have had some trouble with grinding during redline 1->2 shifts. There can be a similar issue on the Miata, both due to deflection of the driveline under high loads. Its not really a big issue. I've missed some shifts and my transmission is fine.

fuel consumption - expect between 13 - 20 mpg
adding oil - about every three weeks
squealing brakes - non-issue if you bed the pads
warm cupholder - non-issue for me
rattles - what car doesn't have some?
flooding - a non-issue w/ the newest flash+starter+batt.
weak interior trim - non-issue, the trim is pretty strong
possible cooling deficiency in hot climates - fixed with new flash+recall

I have driven and considered all 3 cars you are considering extensively and I ended up with the RX-8, primarily because of the rotary engine. The S2000 feels even tighter than a Miata to me, and can be a bit twitchy at the limits, but obviously is the fastest of the 3. All 3 are nice cars. The RX-8 is probably the most civilized and 'GT-like', the S is the most raw. BTW, putting a hard top on the S2000 does not make it any stiffer or safer, same with the Miata.

Another thought would be a Mazdaspeed MX-5 (NB). In factory trim, the car is underwhelming and has a lot of boost lag. This is a software issue, and some of the new tuners are seeing big gains in hp. Something to think about.

Slick8

Do the math, 18mpg vs 20mpg, only $5.50 more a week for gas if you drive 12,000 miles a year. The RX-8 has the 2nd generation airbag system, lower the insurance considerably vs S2000.

Car and Driver logged 11 quarts of oil extra in 40K miles during their long term test of the RX-8. $20-30 dollars worth of oil.

That is a TSB, new brake pad are in warranty.

This is a feature not a design flaw, heated cup warmers.

Never experienced this, the chassis is ultra stiff.

Over-exaggerated problem, never experienced this. Fixed with a new flash, and higher output starter, battery and plugs. On short trips where the engine is still cold, just let the engine idle at 3K rpm for 10sec before you shutoff.

Over-exaggerated problem, never experienced this.

Carb cleaner can take care of this in 10 seconds.

I live in Philly and don't have this problem.

zoom44

ok thanks for the backround.

the transmission woes are not that prevalent. i can count the busted transmissions on this forum without taking my shoes off. ok maybe there is afew more than that. some have been replaced withotu any questions. but there are a handful of disturbing ones that not only wouldnt be fixed under warranty but dealerships had the persons whole powertrain warranty voided.


id suggest the Miata for now and to get over to www.rotarynews.com and get your comments in on the Kabura. thats the car your looking for- hi revving rotary coupe at 2500lbs with a wheelbase in between teh MX-5 and the RX-8

Dinhx8

Depending on what trim level rx8 you get, the price dff btwn the s2000 diminishes...if you get a base, certaintly the price difference is about 9K (with hardtop factored in ). But a GT rx8 loaded, even without Nav will be near 30. nav ones are about 30-31. My brother bought his 04 s2k two weeks after I got my rx8, and only paid about 3000 more than myself (my 8 is loaded sans nav). However, when he rides in my car, he always says "wow your car has so many 'features'...."

If you want a rotary, the answer is pretty clear You just can't substitute that-but if you don't mind the convertible top issues, the s2k is still a good choice. Like you said, if you get a lower trim 8, you can also save money though, and have the uniqueness of the rotary engine.

As far as my 8, i have 20,000 miles on an mt 04, and its been flawless. It has had a few rattles, that come and go. But no flooding, about 20 highway , only 16 city though. but its my daily driver in a 10 mile commute 90 percent in the city.
No transmission problems here, but i have done very few if any full clutch drops, though i do hit 9k once a day.

good luck

rx8wannahave

Over a year of ownership and 7,100 miles later...

fuel consumption (not a big deal)
I've never hit under 18.6mpg city or over 20.5mpg city with a lifetime average of 19.2mpg. I can't stress enough that this is mainly based on your driving style and not so much the RX8. Is there problem RX8's out there? Maybe, but for me at least I'm satisfied with the 19mpg city I'm getting.


adding oil (not a problem at all)
Overblown issue, every 2-3 weeks I give my 8 a sip. In 7,100 miles I've used less than two bottles of oil. Check every fill up and add as needed, again...not a "issue" the rotary is designed to eat a bit of oil but it's nothing to worry about.

squealing brakes (slightly annoying)
I currently have this issue every now and then and I plan to bring it up with the dealer, it does not happen all the time but it makes my nearly new RX8 sound like I don't take care of my breaks. Again...it's not a biggy and has it's resolution.

warm cupholder (slightly annoying)
True, but only on long drives do you notice it but it can get pretty warm. Like stated, there are resolutions to fix this or at least make it better. I can tell you that when I'm playing with my RX8 in 9K heaven...the last thought in my head is "Gosh, my cupholders are warm" lol

rattles (somewhat annoying)
What rattles? I hear some people complain about that by my 8 is perfectly rattle free. I've seen some people drive and they are really rough on their cars (pot holes, curbs, road junk, etc)...to later complain that their RX8 has rattles. But...this is a per car issue and mine at least is perfect in this regard.

flooding (not a concern)
Yet another highly overblown issue, follow the plan and you will never see the flooding monster. Don't shut her off cold and you will be fine. Also, to be extra safe rev her to 3.5K and turn it off to flush out any extra fuel...but again this is not a big issue. I can't stress enough, don't turn it off cold and you will be fine.

weak interior trim (somewhat concerning)
Not with my base 6spd, while the interior does seem easy to scratch. I think the quality is good...I have no complaints.

carbon choking on 4 ports (I'm going for the MT)
First I hear of this, but I got a 6spd so I can't comment.

possible cooling deficiency in hot climates (slightly concerning)
I live in FL and we see 100's and high 90's all the time and I've only heard my fan come on like twice during the summer so not a huge concern. Keep in mind that there was a recall for some 8's in certain places so this issue should be resolved fully.

The S2000 and MX-5 are fine sports cars but I'm not into convert's, not my cup of tea. The RX8 let's you bring along friends and family while giving you a great fun to drive experiance. Honestly...I love this car more everyday.

I hope the best...

LionZoo

Thanks guys, I guess I should clarify. The problems I've listed are just ones that I've seen and I'm wondering if there are any other things I've missed, they're not stuff that I'm actually worried about. As you can see by my response in parenthesis, I hardly care about the majority of them and none of them are deal breakers. Only the transmission is a real concern and as long as they're only limited to maybe 0.5% of RX-8s I'm willing to take a chance.

I'd also be getting either a base or a Sport. The base has everything that I need and I really don't want things like a moonroof or power seats adding extra weight; the RX-8 is heavy enough! The Sport has HIDs, which would be nice to have, but I don't really need it.

As it is, my current ranking is:
1. RX-8
2. S2000
3. MX-5 (sorry zoom, there is reputed to still be a little cowl shake and the MZR is just uninspiring)

I reserve the right to change my feelings at anytime however.

rx8wannahave

OK...

Well, my tranny has been fine while 2nd gear tends to be a bit more harsh I've done at least 4 0-80 take off's and it's never been anything but smooth. When it's cold...2nd gear tends to fight you a bit when putting into gear, but nothing major.

About the tranny strength...well, I got a stock 8 so it's doing fine but ask the turbo guys and so far it's doing just fine with the extra power.

Here are my few complaints...

The trunk opening is narrow (while the trunk itself is pretty large for a sports car)

Door stop points seems wrong to me

Center armrest is not really soft and seems it wont be too durable

Seats a "bit" on the firm side and back support a bit off (base model seats that is)

Interior plastic a little too sensative to scratchs (while overall quality is good)

I wish it got a better fuel economy and more HP, but as you can tell I'm pushing it and being greedy.

For it's price...the RX8 is a pleasure to own.

Ledfoot

Being an S2000 owner who is currently looking around to find an RX-8 to buy, as a daily driver the RX-8, IMHO, is a better car.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE my S, but if you are concerned about dealing with mechanical clatter inside while you drive? The S isn't the ideal choice to make. ESPECIALLY with the hardtop on (which I got with mine)

The interior appointments for the 8 are more inviting by leaps and bounds, even in sport trim. It's much more of a touring machine. The materials, fit and finish are excellent in an S, but there really isn't that much to look at. All the black melts into a kind of background while you drive. It really feels like you're wearing the car...not sitting in it.

The hardtop is great in the winter, but it captures all the noise generated by the engine.... on the highway and sometimes even in town, you have to shout to be heard, generally. Also, I'm not the tallest guy in the world (5'-10"), but even for me, climbing in with the hardtop on is a bit like a limbo contest.

Not all of your friends may fit in the S...not because of height...but because the bolstering makes the seats uncomfortably narrow for some... The trunk is decent for a convertible...but you learn really fast to travel light and use only soft luggage.

If this is going to be your daily? I would definitely go new since the S2000 now has VSC. even 2005's don't have this feature, and I know many owners who have had the rear come loose on them....We're talking a gentle curve doing about 35 and rolling over som sand in the road. Personally, I have never had such troubles.

The RX-8 pretty much can do everything the S2000 can't, but has a very similar driving experience...which is why I am making the switch.

Raptor75

I just pick up a RX-8 grand touring for $26,500 out the door. $2,500 of it was Mazda incentives but if your looking for a 05 you can get some good deals.

LionZoo

I know the S isn't a quiet car by any stretch of the imagination, but mechanical clatter as long as it's normal is okay. Rattles can annoy a bit, but they're nothing that I can't live with. I also know that a lot of S2000s have 1-2 grinds (but that seems to have been fixed for the AP2) though on the Hondas, they don't seem to eventually require replacement of the transmission, while the RX-8 has at least a few documented cases of the same failure for the transmission. Even though this car will be a daily driver, I can live with something that isn't a plush luxocruiser as long as its fun.

Ledfoot, I actually prefer the S2000's interior to the RX-8's. I love how functional everything, it sort of sends the message "This place is for driving and nothing else." I also love cars that feels like you're wearing them and not sitting in them, and the S2000 seems to exemplify that the best of any car I've ever tried. I'm also pretty slim (5'9" and 140 lb.) and so are most of my friends and family.

Ledfoot

It takes some time to get used to all the noises....you'll swear you've broken something...."normal" is a state of mind.

The 1-2 gear grind was an issue for pre-AP2 cars..it's moot if you're buying new. I know plenty of guys who have had to replace their tranny, or at least have it dropped and repaired. Like an 8...the S2000 has had it's own fair share of TSB reports. S2000's can have a tendency to blow their rear diffs...especially turbo'd or S/C'd ones. Comptech sells a reinforced diff for exactly this reason, which I got when I went F.I.

The only cars that come anywhere near the feel of an S2000 shifter....at or below the same price point... are the miata, and the rx-8. Everything else either costs close to twice as much...or can't compete.

I love cars that feel like your favorite pair of jeans too...and the thrash of an S2000 motor is truly addictive.... but having two cars just to cover "practicality issues" can be annoying...plus I pay to store the S2000 in the colder months (no garage).

I think you'll be thrilled with either one you go with. I just thought I'd share my experiences, having owned an S for 4 years now.

tuj

The s2k is a great car, and with dsc for 06, its even more practical and safe. A buddy of mine nearly destroyed himself in his s2k on a cold day, so the older cars are ones to really drive w/ respect. I drive competitively and still find the dsc to be a wonderful feature on a street car, and as a learning tool/safety net on new tracks.

The s2k is basically at a different level than the RX-8, both of which are at a different level than the MX-5. The S2k is a very tight fitting car, perhaps even more so than the Miata because of the S2k's high doors and sills. Its got a very noticable exhaust note which sounds great, but can be overbearing for long periods of time. Not an issue in the RX-8.

I think the RX-8 is the best of the three in terms of everyday driving, while still being very capable and very engaging, with a very good chassis design. The S2k is when you want to hop into a tight-fitting factory racer with the reliability of a Honda. The MX-5 comes much cheaper while still being a classic and nimble roadster. I still think the MSM is worth thinking about if you are into modifying your car. I think these will become a new 'find' in the used market rather quickly as the aftermarket support picks up. Nearly all turbo cars find better gains in power in the aftermarket than NA engined rides.

Also, the Richard Paul shifter for the RX-8 improves the feel and sound(!) of the transmission considerably.

124Spider

We've had our RX-8 for 10,500 miles, and 13 months. It has been flawless, mechanically. The gas mileage is gruesome--15mpg on a commute our Honda Odyssey minivan got 19mpg. Otherwise, it's a wonderful car.

We've had our S2000 for 27,600 miles, and almost 2 years. It has been flawless, mechanically. It averages 25mpg, and it gets over 30 on the highway. And I really flog it on the track and in autocross (I don't fit in the RX-8 with a helmet, so I've never had it on the track or tried it in autocross).

Your choice; there's a huge difference in driving experience between a roadster and a four-door coupe, and only you can decide what floats your boat. But if you don't like convertibles, and are looking for a substantial hard top, don't get a convertible. The bolt-on hardtop is of absolutely no structural use in case of a roll-over accident; it just arguably looks better, and may be more water-tight (and, in the case of an S2000, probably adds to the noise--which is very substantial, BTW).

You should drive both quite a bit to see what you really feel about them. The RX-8 is much more refined--quiet, comfortable, and relatively roomy (except headroom if you get a sunroof). The S2000 is much more elemental--noisy, harsher ride, stiffer suspension, not very comfortable or roomy.