zoom44

2003 Jun 14
2003 Jul 1342
2003 Aug 2209
2003 Sep 2105
2003 Oct 2510
2003 Nov 2087
2003 Dec 2079 Total sold 2003: 12,346


most of the above people would have been very very angry had it taken another year. it was already a year late to most of the early buyers

BunnyGirl

I know a lot of people that specifically look for autos because they have to commute in heavy stop and go traffic/traffic jams all the time and it is a giant pain in the *** to do that in a stick.

Of course, then there is my step-dad's brother who says he is getting too old to have to shift (just turned 57) so he is shopping for an auto. Of course he also doesn't want power windows or power locks because all those "goo-gaws" (his words) are way to fancy for him.

He wants a new Mustang but thought he was being asked to pay too much when the salesman was trying to sell him a pea green auto for just over $18K. He said the mileage was too bad since gas was going to cost $5 a gallon by summer.

msrecant

Soap Alert!

All I heard from summer 2003 to summer 2004 was how the 2005 model was going to have the horsepower "fix" and the 8 would be back up to the originally promised 250-hp. Just wait until those 2005's come out and you will see. I can give you a list of links to posts and on-line articles talking about magic ECU mappings or the new CAT that would set things right.

Well, it never happened. Here we are, almost in the 2007 model year, and the RENESIS has the same power they delivered in July 2003. So I don't buy the idea that with a little more time Mazda would have had a fix. The RENESIS is what it is and its not going to change a lot anytime soon. Hell, it took Mazda 22 months to finally make a dent in the flooding issue. Yes, they have taken the gas mileage up a few MPG and the AC runs better but that is about it.

Disclaimer: This was not intended as an HP, MPG or FLOODING rant and should not be taken as such.

RichardK

From the UK perspective:

It doesn't need to be changed. The car is already punching above the price-point and holds a unique position in the marketplace. Mazda RX8s are amongst the best selling coupes in the UK. despite the oddball engine technology.

I know RX8 forums are hardly the place for environmental issues, but - why do you want a NEW RX8? Especially something facelifted? So you can sell your old one before you have had a full useful life out of it? Every new car manufactured has an environmental impact vastly in excess of the meagre differences in fuel consumption we fret about between decent cars and SUVs.

Every car revised for fashion and replaced for fashion has a knock on effect; the guy jonesing for a cheaper RX8 sells his functional car to get the cheap one offered when the new car is bought, and at the end of the scale, someone scraps a perfectly useful 1980s sedan because it isn't worth repairing it, financially - even though what needs repairing is more than likely wear and tear items like clutches or brakes.

RX8s handle better than most cars, are more powerful than most cars, and are for a modern car, pretty light, yet are practical and attractive. If cars were sold purely on their merits, the RX8 could remain in production for 12 years and remain perfectly marketable. And perhaps, if happy owners don't have a new one to make them feel out of date, they'll look after their cars, make them last a decade or more, and reduce the environmental impact of car production.

Okay - the US/North America is better than the UK in this regard, where an 8 year old car is considered worthless scrap even though they don't rust these days (well, except RX8 sills of course...), but don't fall into that trap.

Go watch the film "Good Bye Lenin!", and you'll understand how spoiled and pathetic we are - as a car nut, the most touching part of that film for me is the lead's reaction to a car. It reminded me of when I was 17, when my 8-year old Chevette was my pride & joy, with a 1.3 pushrod engine, 4 speed box, and manual everything. That car got me everywhere just as well as my RX8 does (in fact, better - it was six months before the Chevette, a used car, needed suspension replacement ).

Go48

A lot of generalizations there Rich, but you have some good points. You should understand the American psyche. And that is: If a little bit is good, MORE is better and we want it right now. So, more hp, more torque, better mileage, and so on--right now. Not saying that is the way it should be, it's just the way it is. How's that for a generalization?

BTW, I have a 16-year-old RX-7 that is in top shape and probably will be running at least another 10 years. So not everybody fits your generalization that, "...where an 8 year old car is considered worthless scrap...".

RichardK

Of course not everybody fits that generalization, and if you'd read in context, you'd note that I was referring TO THE UK in that case, and that the US/NA approach is different; Canada offers 7-year finance deals on cars, and in Canada, I was unable to get a cheap landyacht banger - they still have some value. When I visit the US, I don't rent a car, I buy something fun (next one should be a mid 70s Coupe DeVille, I think, but I dream of picking up a cheap Pacer).

rotary crazy

why dont people just tell the truth, you wanted more hp thats all!

mazda never intended the rx-8 to be a large sale car in the us if they dit they are pretty stupid, the way to have large sales # is to have a base model, the base model its avalible in other markets but not in the US, the 4 port 5 speed version would be price in the low 20,000

the rx-8 is continusly upgradet, the only thing that has not change its the hp that the car is supouse to have, but we have seen the car continuosly dynoing in the 190+ range in 2004 most dyno in the 170 to 180 rwhp, so I belive mazda is working on the problems

do you think that I would buy and 2006 that have more power without any cosmetic change?

you are not going to see mayor hp increase NA until they find a new cat that can take the heat

this is all my personal opinion

msrecant

Actually I agree. The RX-8 is a fine car and I would prefer if they left it alone for at least another 3 or 4 years. The Miata (NA) did fine with minor improvements over (I believe) an 8 year period.

RichardK

Pretty much longer - the MX5 was launched in what, 1989/1990, and replaced in 2005/6? So a good 15 years for the same basic car, though it was facelifted at eight years old. BUT, that facelift was partly in response to legislation, not fashion, as all cars with pop up headlights lost them for pedestrian safety reasons.

Mechanically the MX5 went from 1.6 to 1.8, but I feel that is no different to 192 and 231 RX8s offered in most markets.

Yes, there is room for improvement in the RX8, though I don't believe there is much room for improvement with the Renesis engine - looking at a history of Rotary engines, it seems most benefits come from overall technology advances - fuel injection, better/faster/stronger sparks. So the next advances (aside from just bolting on more chambers/forced induction) will probably be Gasoline Direct Injection (which I doubt will make a huge difference), or alternative fuels.

It seems to be that the rotary engine is a very single purpose solution. You can't really detune or mess with it, as you can with four stroke engines. You put this much fuel and air in, and get this much power back - it needs x amount of fuel to burn and make it turn, so you may as well make it burn that fuel as efficiently as possible, which of course, delivers more power.

So you either get, for more power - extra chamber (return of the 20B) which gives worse economy, or, FI (return of the FD's reputation, with the detonating engine for the mass market consumers that don't look after their cars), or more revs.

None of these options would make me want to change from my 4-port 5 speed model, which gives 'reasonable' economy and performance and was cheap. Now, a rotary-powered RWD-biased CX7 (as in, an AWD system based around a longitudinal layout with the front wheels getting less torque), or a new, CVT transmission based minivan with a transverse rotary for ultra-small powerplant configuration and smoothness, that has NO REV COUNTER, so doesn't scare the soccer moms - just start it, the engine and transmission operate to maximise torque and efficiency without the owner being scared that the smooth renesis is actually pulling 5,000rpm because they can't tell... that would be interesting and would have safety implications, as the package could be smaller than a traditional engine/gearbox and be designed to slide under the car in the same way as the Mercedes A-class.

Raptor75

Hell, if it just got the EPA numbers or close to it that would be enough and make sure all the cars get it not just half of them. Flooding can be all but eliminated by putting in a faster starter. Put the right parts back in and tune the car to deliver the original 250 hp this can be done easily. You now have a great car. If you want to secure the deal offer a 100K warranty on the engine, Mazda needs to stand behind the car.

RichardK

Or people should just quit whining about the HP and accept that it is an almost meaningless measure. Sure, a 2003 Chrysler 300M has more HP than a similarly aged BMW M3, so it must be real fast...

Flooding has been all but eliminated. Few cars offer the smoothness, power and ease of maintenance that the RX8 does and return better economy.

If Mazda had said 230hp instead (which they do, and always have done in the UK as long as the cars have been on sale), you'd be happy.

msrecant

The NB came out in 1999 after they skipped 1998 (I may be off by a year) and was substantially different from the NA. It was a second generation Miata but did share components with the original. The 2006 Miata is a totally new car.

Smokin_LaLa

i dont care iam still waiting for the 06

RichardK

As I understood it. the 98 model (which they didn't skip a year here with, as far as I can tell) is the same chassis, same interior, same hardpoints, same basic structure - just a reskin. The 1.8 engine and six-speed gearboxes both made appearances in the NA.

Which, for my idea of 'same car', is little more than a reskin, a cosmetic makeover. Like the fact that J-bodies have been the same horrid "World Car" platform for eons, something abandoned in the UK in 1988 in favour of the Vectra platform which became something else (either Sigma or Epsilon, I can never remember which but the Saab 9-3/Cadillac <strike>New Cimarron</strike> BLS are based on it. I think the J-bodies are finally, once and for all, dead, but I was amazed at how long they soldiered on.

RichardK

The '06 is here. If you're waiting for something new, then you're waiting for the '07

(I've got an '06. I know I have, because it is Galaxy Grey).

Krankor

Ok, we're cool. Sorry if I overreacted. The possibilities for misunderstanding in the text-only milieu of the internet are notorious.

Sigh, how I yearn for the "quote" button to quote back all the nested quotes, not just the top level. In any case, the quote you quoted here, about them not advertising properly, was really my main point.
Well, I hope that you are correct.

MEGAREDS

Gee, I wonder why I've stopped reading this site?

RichardK

Evidently you didn't, otherwise, you wouldn't have responded to this

SSJ 909

Probably because their rx8 profits arent through the roof. thats why it hasnt been happening. All I am saying is.
If your gonna introduce a car like this.
You want to make it as perfect as possible.
And the changes I suggested are not out of this world un heard of.
Just a matter of tightening up a great machine

bascho

I understand that Mazda was able to let the RX7 linger in the face of low sales back in the 80's and 90's......but this is a different time. Mazda didn't have to deal with Korean car makers, Chinese car makers AND fellow Japanese car makers for sales in the US market back in the 80's and 90's......today they do. The 2006 RX8 is going to be competing for buyers with 2007 models from just about everyone else. The RX8 is bringing almost nothing new to the market for the 2006 version to follow up a pretty horrific 2005 year of sales on the 8. I understand that Mazda did not expect to sell a million of the RX8......but what did they expect to sell? I find it very hard to believe Mazda can turn a profit on the 8 selling qtys of 10K to 12K in 2006. It's possible.....but not probable. Mazda probably turned a profit in 2004 selling almost 25K RX8's......but selling just over 14K in 2005 probably took Mazda into the red (or close to) on this program. Is Mazda willing to lose money on the RX8 just to keep the car alive......possibly, other companies do it all the time, especially when they have other nameplates making all the money. I hope Mazda continues to develop the 8 because it is a very attractive car...as was the RX7. I just hope they understand that this is the 21st Century and the US market is ultra competitive and getting moreso every year. To keep customers they will have to step-up their offerings as almost everyone has done and will do. Our world is getting more and more tech savvy and offering 'gadget' content is the way to entice future buyers. 2006 is a lost cause.....let's just hope that Mazda has something amazing up their sleeve for 2007.

mike1324a

I think power is the big issue with the sales. People (americans especially) look at cars and want as much horsepower a humanly possible. People see the horsepower the 8 has and instantly turn away. I think it is possible to solve this with a mazdaspeed turbo kit. It would add more power and bring up the image while makng it an option so production doesnt have to change on the 8. It can be done easily and safely just put the effort into a good tune. Make a good solid reflash for it and with an ecu that is so intrusive, imagine if it was used to work with a turbo! To make it warrenty friendly then make a more agressive or atleast a good tune and then if people start messing around with tuning and adding bigger turbos and stuff then void the warranty but if it is dealer installed then i see it being perfectly good as an option. Make 300 whp and keep your warranty and you are sitting on a gold mine! Most people would be more then happy with 300 whp. Its a good solid number thats not outragous and would change the driving characteristics much. This would also sell alot more 8's and the 8 owners would be happier aswell. The option is viable and you have all the experiance of the australian divisions little turbo toy to work with. We dont need 360 whp like they had, it would be nice but to be reasonable i say just 300whp. less stress on the parts better chance of keeping the warranty. That would put a serious dent in the competitions sales. Again 300 whp with the vehicles warranty would sell more 8s as well as keep the 8 owners happier, you are sitting on a gold mine mazda.... get busy!

skullone

No offense, but maybe you bought the wrong car ....

bascho

Perhaps....but I leased the best car I could afford at the time. As my income increases I will move on to better automobiles......but for now I have the 8 and it has been moments of bliss broken up by moments of frustration. I love the looks of the 8, always will...........but I am not some fanboi that thinks the 8 is perfect.

DARKMAZ8

I'm glad the 8 is slow cause when I shove the 20b in there ppl won't know what hit them.....

viggen

Very good summary re: positioning, product, advertising and future. Sad, but ypu're right on the money...