flatso

on the 8. I was just wondering if anyone knows how much of an influence Ford had on the production version of our car.

Alessandro

Since its made in Hiroshima I dont think it was too much...

Spin9k

I think it is limited to the horn. :D

Racer X-8

I would rather like to know what kind of an influence they imparted on the RX-8. Ford isn't all bad, they have been around since the beginning of time. They know how to run a company about as good as any other company in the world. What was their influence? Planning, procurement, logistics, funding, resources, recourses, supplier bases, you know, that stuff. I doubt if they used an iron hand at all in the design of the concept, thru to the production version. I would like to think that anyway, that Ford's input to Mazda is all good. It could be and should be for their sake as well as ours.

Baller

Ford owns only 35% of Mazda

Velocity-8

I think Fords influence stops right after the check clears.

Seriously, I know it's marketing but I read the interview with the Japanese guy (I forget his name) who is the project manager. I don't think Ford had much to do with the development of the RX8 at all. Also, if you look on the window sticker you will see that very few parts are from the USA and Canada. I don't remember the percentage but it's low.

FirstSpin

Regarding Ford being a well-run company -- "They know how to run a company as good as any other company in the world" ---

I refer you to this AFP wireservice quote from November::
"NEW YORK, Nov 11 (AFP) - The Standard and Poor's credit agency downgraded the Ford Motor Company's credit rating Wednesday, leaving it just one step above junk bond status.

The agency lowered Ford's rating to "BBB-" from "BBB" -- S and P's lowest investment-grade classification, and one step above high-yield or "junk" status -- after putting the stock on creditwatch in October.

The agency said the outlook for Ford credit was "stable," but noted its continuing poor cash flow and profitability and expectations of only limited improvement over the next few years."

They could be doing a lot better in terms of how they run their company....

murix

The engine is definitely not from Ford.

The interior is definitely not from Ford.

The body is definitely not from Ford.

97% made in Japan.


The horn. Yeah, that sounds right. :D

klegg

Actually, this car was developed sort of "under the radar"....ford new about it fairly late in the design....according to that nice rx8 book..

stangmatt66

I love Ford, but if they had their hand in the development, the RX-8 would have ended up as a 3rd generation Probe. This is a Mazda built, developed and engineered car all the way! Just the engine tells you that.

Like most huge car companies (ie, GM), in order for new engine technologies to make money and to get back R&D costs, they have to be used in many vehicles like Ford's modular 4.6L V8 which serves duty in no less than 5 models. The RENESIS is only in the RX (for now). Ford would have put it in the RX, Miata and Mazda3. Make sense?

New Yorker

If Mazda had to be bought by someone, I'm glad that it's Ford - and not GM, Daimler-Chrysler or Toyota - who bought them. At least they show signs of having a heart for good cars, i.e. their new GT supercar, the new Mustang, and the Ford Focus. (Yes, the Focus - apparently the Focus suspension is well-liked.)

ranger4277

I'm more interested in Mazda's influence on Ford. Anybody notice the door handles on the upcoming mustang or the air vents in the new F-150? There is some obvious Mazda cues in the design department. I wouldn't doubt that the drive by wire throttle in the new mustang is the same unit used in the 8 too.

I think Ford is now willing to adapt and learn from its extended-independent automotive divisions.

stangmatt66

Well you all know that upcoming Focus and other Ford small car engines are all from Mazda, right? They will use the Mazda3's 4cyl.

RX-MEN-8

I have nothing good to say about Ford. The more I read and understand this corporate bafoon of a company, I will never buy a pure Ford product. (Nor any member of my family)

I just finished reading TRAGIC INDIFFERENCE a book by Adam Penenberg regarding the Ford SUV / Firestone fiasco. If you love books about automakers --please buy it. You will get so frustrated reading about how Ford knew about the Bronco II, and later the Explorer problems with instability, yet did not act on the engineers advice to save money. (Hey, remember the Pinto--great car!!(RIGHT!!), And how about the Crown Victoria. Ford cars that are burning police officers due to poor gasoline tank configuration?) Get the book.. It is a must read for "car" people.

J-D

Even though they only own 35% that is enough in Japan to have the controling interest so they don't need to own any more of the company.

murix

The engine is developed by mazda, but the frame is from ford modified by Mazda for the 3. The next Focus and Volvo V40 will based on the same underpinnings with different bodies and suspension tuning and engine options. This is not a bad thing as all three will prove to be very good cars catering to slightly different markets. It is a very good small car platform, some consider it the best.

JDubz

Personally, I don't like Ford. I think some of their designs for the 2005 rollouts are good. I don't think that FORD had any hand at all in the making of the RX8's. My second car is a Probe GT, and if I didn't love working on the engine (KL-03) I wouldn't still have the car. It's the most UN reliable POS I've ever owned. Truthfully I would never sell it because I love it so much. And to correct someone earlier... the 3rd Gen Probe, was originally the Mercury Cougar, named the Cougar due to the lack of interest in the PROBE. I love both of these cars (RX8, & Probe), and honestly, judging from the cars I've driven, NOTHING handles like a Probe, and if it weren't from Mazda, the Probe would've been in production for a year, then it would've bombed on the market.

Nuff said....

J-D

I've had both Probe SE and GT, I sold the GT because the motor went bad and had to put a new one in it. Still got the SE though. The 4cyl is a great motor, which is why they still used it in the protge after the probe was done. It is fun car to drive, that's why got a mazda.

Mitch Strickler

The bound book from Mazda details how Ford execs were sent in from Europe and elsewhere to run Mazda during development of the 8, and had the final say on critical design points -- the elimination of the B-pillar, for example.

The book doesn't say anything about who made decisions that kept the car from being all it could be -- for instance, keeping an old four-speed auto on a sports car when even inexpensive small cars have five-speeds. In my mnd, it's obvious that was because struggling, money-poor Ford wouldn't put up the bucks to do the job right. (BTW, I have an auto and like the car, but I'd like it better with a five -- or, like a few new designs, six -- speed auto.)

As for using the Renesis on many variants, Mazda surely will. In fact, they hurt themselves by not having an RX-7 successor out to compete with the Z. But they can't do it for another year or so, because Ford didn't come up with the dough for a new engine factory. The old one, refurbished to save money, only has capacity for the 8's projected 60,000 annual sales. When production increases, Mazda will be able to move forward on other 8 variants as well as the 7 (which will be on a shorter 8 chassis, appropriately sport tuned). There will be a convertible, and very likely an 8-chassis Miata, maybe with entry-level piston engine. To some degree, the delays reflect sound management planning, but IMO Ford finances are holding things back. To put this in perspective, though, Mazda wouldn't be building anything if Ford (or someone else) hadn't come along when they were sinking.

JimW

Since Mazda and Ford has merged, maybe they can give the Mustang some of the RX8s handling and of course we would all love to see the Cobras power and torque in the RX8! The RX8 looks like a supercar and therefore should perform as such, the only thing were lacking is the power!

Velocity-8

Don't count on it. Ford is STILL going to use a solid rear axle for the new Crustang. Only the Cobra will get a fully independant suspension. Way to go ford.

klegg

Actually, most folks think the 8 is a better car then the Z...this months motor trend, for example...

I think 2 seat cars have a very limited market, and the area is getting crowded...miata, mr2, Z, s2000 ect.

What makes the G and the 8 such nice packages are the performance with the practicle back seat...

khoney

To me, the 8 has a very "Ford-sounding" tranny. Loud synchro noise is something I've noticed on the Fords I've been in.

fan

If I had to guess, I would say it is Ford who decided that we would have "packages only" in the US.

Also the lack of climate control I blame on Ford.

s13lover

I hate Ford cars. I will never own one. However, they do own most of my favorite companies - Mazda, Aston Martin, Jaguar, Volvo and are the major manufacture that supports the automotive department at my college (so I hafta put up with them for now) along with Toyota. I believe when Ford bought Mazda the agreement was that Ford was not allowed to touch anything that had to do with the rotary engine or the Miata. Ford is plannning to use alot of Mazda products to underpin their cars in the future. THey will be using the Mazda 6's motor, chasis, and possibly the Mazda 2's chasis on a new upcoming youth oriented small car that is actually good (unlike the Aspire and Festiva).