tramahound

I live in central New Jersey and hope to purchase an rx-8 next year. I'm struggling with the whole crappy winter driving capability of the 8 though. I plan to try for the standard 6-speed base package to save money. I'm under the impression that to get the traction control equipment I would need to upgrade to the sport or touring package which would cost thousands more. While this might be helpful for me in the snow I'm thinking my money would be better spent on a set of Dunlop M3 snow tires and some boring wheels for them instead. I'm thinking doing both would be too costly for me, so in your opinion which would be more helpful for me?
also, on a side note, so I don't crowd the forum with another thread just for this, what is the law in Jersey regarding the front license plate? I hate the way it looks on the front of the 8 and would like to not have one on there. I've always been under the impression that this was illegal though. Is this true? I saw an 8 without one the other day, but that doesn't make it legal...
Thanks for any help you can offer.

therm8

That's a tough call. Now that I have traction control, I wouldn't live without it, but I don't drive in the snow...
It has saved my butt a couple of times in the rain though. I think it may have payed for itself in the damages it prevented.

Luftwaffle

The Sport Package ($1200~ more) and up comes with TCS+DSC. (Which, I think, is very useful.) The 8 isn't crappy in winter driving on snow, the stock tires are summer tires. If you want to drive in snow, get winter tires and you're all set. I just don't take my car out in the winter. :p

expo1

I would get the Sport package (I have the 6-speed GT) It comes with other things worth having such as the larger brakes and HID. Jersey has relatively mild winters these days, hell it’s December 7th and it still in the 50’s. I have a set of winter tires on 17’s that I put on Sat and will take off April, that option will cost you about $1,200 and provide piece of mind. My advice get at least a sport package and we winter comes around get a set of tires on 17’s. In regards for the front plate is a $45 ticket I believe and gives an officer a reason to pull you over. Whether or not you get that ticket depends on the mood of the police in your area.

dmp

If just for the HIDs alone, the Sport Package is worth it

tramahound

argh $45? a plate on the nose completely ruins the lines of the car! damn
so the base 6-speed comes with traction control, but the sport comes with DSC? What is DSC? I would ideally not take it out in the snow, but there may be occasion when I would have to. the wife might think otherwise about buying an 8 if I have to spend some $3000 more on it just to be able to drive it all year. I used to own a 240sx which was rwd and never thought it was particularly bad in the snow/rain. i would think the 8 would be even better with its better weight distribution too.
as to NJ not having bad winters lately? are you crazy? last year sucked! it snowed more than the norm. that's why i'm concerned.
maybe i'll save up my sick days and call out when it snows :P

dmp

dynamic stability control ...help keep the car lined up - not just the wheels from spinning, as normal TCS.

Luftwaffle

1200~ more for DSC.
1000~ more MAX for really good winter tires.
100~ more for labor?

It's your call. If you drive it in the snow, get winter tires. You might be able to live without the DSC, but I wouldn't recommend it.

tramahound

ok, there's no point in worrying about it now. we'll see what kind of rates and deals I can strike up with my local mazda dealer in 9+ months. If I can get a good deal on a 2005 you're right a $1200 package might not end up being that bad in the grand scheme of things. I'd be willing to pay more than that if it means keeping my son a little safer too actually. thanks for putting it into perspective. I also thought the sport pack was a lot more money. and maybe i'll start a savings fund for the winter wheels/tires in the meantime as well to lessen the blow for next year. does the tirerack have winter tire sales in the summer? that would be good...

Luftwaffle

Wayne Mazda had like 15 '04 Velocity Red Grand Touring RX-8's with Nav when I got mine 6 weeks ago. Go there, see if they have any left and strike a deal on one of those. I remember they were trying desperately to sell me one. Unfortunately, I didn't have the money for it and I just wanted a Sport Package in any color but Red or Yellow. If they're desperate enough and have some left, you could get a REALLY good bargain on one.

Gambit

Definitely go for the DSC, you can look at all the threads of people who have turned it off and done something stupid. As for the snow, I went with a cheaper option than the 1000 bucks for winter tires, I have a 400 dollar car that I can use when it's crappy out

G8rboy

I won't say that DSC is a must, but winter tires definitely are. DSC + winter tires makes it a pretty damn fun winter car, and I won't own a car without it from now on (or HID's, or GPS... thanks for spoiling me Mazda! )

dmp

Frankly, I've been enjoying driving in the rain the past couple days since getting my car. I don't use the traction control. I like the sliding the rear end of the car out at will

Gord96BRG

WHAT crappy winter driving capability? The RX-8 does extremely well in winter - provided you use suitable tires, as with any vehicle. Put high performance summer tires on ANYTHING and it will be crappy to drive in winter. It'sALL about the tires!!!!!

Traction control can not create traction where it doesn't exist - neither does stability control. The interface between your car and the road is the tires. They only have a certain amount of grip, and that's all that TCS and DSC are using. If you fit winter tires, they have far more grip in winter conditions than all-seasons or summer tires, so the TCS and DSC have a lot more to work with.

Winter tires are absolutely essential for an RX-8 in winter conditions. Without them - TCS and DSC will be useless, you would just leave your car parked to avoid the inevitable crunch into a curb, tree, traffic... With winter tires, DSC/TCS can be nice to have, especially for drivers who aren't used to RWD.

Regards,
Gordon

ZoomZoomH

iTrader: (1)

you guys must drive like nuts by sliding out the rear end at every turn (with DSC off that is)

and here are some corrections, the BASE 8 only has ABS w/ EBD, it does NOT have TCS/DSC. Also, the base MANUAL 8 HAS the upgraded brakes that all the 8's with 18" wheels have, only the base AUTOMATIC 8 w/ the 16" wheels have the smaller brakes.

ZoomZoomH

iTrader: (1)

from MUSA website:

http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/disp...ehicleCode=RX8

if you don't drive too fast on wet roads, the base 8 is more than capable of handling most conditions

Luftwaffle

Yep, you're right. I had always thought they were separate. I'll go edit the posts so people don't get confused.

Deslock

The Sport Package is a good deal: you get HIDs, fog lights, DSC, and TCS for ~$1100. I would recommend getting it, if you can swing it.

But if you're on a tight budget, you don't *need* it, even if you drive in snow. I went for the base model because I wanted to keep overall cost below $25k (also, it weighs slightly less than the sport model and I didn't want to deal with disabling DSC/TCS everytime I got in the car 8-9 months/year).

I've driven many FWD, RWD, 4WD, and AWD vehicles during New England winters over the last 15 years... DSC/TCS does make it easier to traverse slippery roads, but if you know your vehicle's limits and drive conservatively when you're unsure about road conditions, you can get by without it.

Having written that, there is always that chance you could misjudge, lose control, and crash when DSC/TCS would've helped prevent it. Also, you may have to plan your route to avoid hills during severe weather more-so without DSC/TCS than you would with it.

Lastly, get winter or all season tires whether you have DSC/TCS or not.

tramahound

well that makes the decision easier. if traction control doesn't even come standard then I think the sport package would be a must for me. it sounds like a bargain now that it includes both. now to wait 9 months and find an honest dealer (the one I went to said the 18 inch wheels were extra on the 6-speed. that's not true is it?).
Thanks for the replies. hopefully i'll be a full card carrying member of the 8 owners club some day.

ZoomZoomH

iTrader: (1)

18" wheels (along with sport tuned suspension and larger front brakes) are standard on the 6 speed rx-8's.

G8rboy

I think only the base auto can get the 16" wheels

jsh1120

...Move yourself about 300 miles west. You can drive in it day after day after day after day this time of year.

tramahound

bah, then how would I get all the benefits that New Jersey has to offer like traffic and high car insurance? silly

Luftwaffle

Don't forget the generally insane drivers! :p

Ninja

Something else to keep in mind:
I've seen a few wrecked 8 posts in here that occurred when the driver had disabled DSC. You might well be unstable without winter tires when you're driving in limited traction environments, but you get the protection of DSC all the time.

In your situation, I'd seriously consider finding a way to get both tires and the Sport pkg.

18 inch wheels are standard on one of the pkgs (Sport or GT), I'm not sure which. You can check details on option contents at the Mazda USA site.