pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

that was the point of my post

think anyone here mods there car while it is under warranty?

saturn

That's exactly it. I think it's nifty that the Evo X is so tunable after everyone was so paranoid it wouldn't be with the new engine and what not. The problem is I need that warranty and I don't want to wait 3 or 4 years before I can start having fun.

It's very puzzling why Mitsubishi would leave so much on the table when it comes to the stock performance.

Rootski

iTrader: (1)

My thoughts exactly. I always wonder what's up when people can get huge gains from very minor mods, because any decent engineer would have done it at the factory if not for a better reason not to. Sometimes its for emissions or NVH, and some will happily tolerate those for some extra HP, but I've never heard of running rich for the benefit of emissions....

Raptor75

It could be that they know the kids will be tuning the cars so they leave a little on the table for the tunes to be happy yet design the car with these HP numbers in mind. The tuners thing they have unlocked secret HP and Mistu is happy because the car is still with in the limits it was designed for. Just a thought.

delhi

^ Just like what Subaru is doing with the WRX. When questioned about the vanilla hp of the WRX, the Subie spokeperson casually mentioned about "...there is a healthy aftermarket support out there."

pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

I'm sure the rx-8 runs pig rich just for fun right?

delhi

^ most hi-po cars run rich for emissions purposes. You should check the tail pipes of a 335i!

pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

Mitsubishi is not the first company to do this. Maybe they did not want to tune the car to the edge. Maybe for market placement because they know the car will only demand so much money regardless of its HP. Who knows and who cares. If I was an Evo X owner, I'd be happy because it is tunable for decent gains.

saturn

That is most assuredly wrong. They very much appear to be attempting to make the Evo more attractive to the masses (e.g. - styling, automatic trans, etc). By pricing it $40k+ and making it much slower in a straight line they aren't going to get anywhere near their intended penetration into newer markets. The vast majority of people aren't interested in tuning since it voids the warranty.

i can't wait until the first guy comes on the Evo boards and starts complaining that he needs to pay $12k to fix his fancy new SST transmission because he added an exhaust pipe. Mitsubishi will claim the transmission isn't intended to handle ANY additional horsepower and that will be that.

They put out a 360hp model in Europe -- why not here?

pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

With the MR version yes but it is still quite the performer. Think Mitsu could sell the Evo X as is with 400 HP for $70K? Their current market is the $35k - $45k and they know they can not move to much further up. An MR with all the options and dealer mark up is pushing the car to $47k in my area which is too much money.

The GSR is low to mid 30s. The MR costs more though. The evo ix is .2 faster in the 1/4 but big whoop. The evo x beats it out of the hole, brakes better and has more grip. Hardly "much slower" as you stated.

Evo X GSR:

0-30 mph: 1.7 seconds
0-45 mph: 3.1 seconds
0-60 mph: 4.9 seconds
0-75 mph: 7.2 seconds
Quarter-mile: 13.6 seconds at 101.3 mph

30-0 mph: 28 feet
60-0 mph: 112 feet

600-foot slalom: 70.7 mph
200-foot skid pad: 0.99g

Evo IX:

0-30 mph: 1.8 seconds
0-45 mph: 3.3 seconds
0-60 mph: 4.9 seconds
0-75 mph: 7.4 seconds
Quarter-mile: 13.3 seconds at 103 mph

30-0 mph: 28.6 feet
60-0 mph: 115.8 feet

600-foot slalom: 70.7 mph
200-foot skid pad: 0.93g


Just my opinion but still not sure it is wrong. I never said they are not attempting to move up market.

If the majority of people are not into tuning then Mitsu should not have much concern with SST transmission.


They also offer a beefier manual transmission in the GSR model. They did not leave anyone hanging as you alluded too.

Also how is that any different than someone here going FI while under warranty? People make their choices and must live with them.

If they change the car in a way the manufacture does not want then their warranty will be voided.

Look how long it took them to even bring the Evo to the US. Even Ford does that with the Focus. Lots of car manufactures release the high HP version with what seems better everything in Europe and other countries. It is all about market segment and what the bean counters perceive it to be.

If Mitsu felt they could sell a $70k Evo to the masses by upping the HP then they would do it.

saturn

That is exactly my point. Why do they don't need to hike it up to $70k if they can get to 400hp with $3000 worth of mods. The entire point of my argument is that they are effectively artificially limiting the power of the car and charging more than ever. That makes absolutely no sense.

Again, my entire post was referring to the MR. I have yet to see two publications get the same times on the MR as it was and continues to be changing with firmware updates every 2 weeks.

Again, you're missing the point. You're mixing your arguments. First you say that it doesn't matter what they charge for a stock unit since it's easy to mod. Then you say it doesn't matter since many people aren't interested in tuning. People are interesting in getting value for money. They are clearly marketing towards more "average" customers who are not going to mod (for warranty reasons), but STILL want a lot of performance for the money.

If you look at my quote I'm referring to the SST which is in the MR. You're mixing arguments...again.

Bottom line is that the Evo is in a weird state right now. Many longtime fans will love the new Evo since it looks very aggressive, has better amenities, handles like a dream, and is very tunable. Many people who were always on the fence about Evo's (like myself) were looking at the X as being a great balance. Instead, they added a good bit of weight and slowed it down immensely (0.5 seconds from 0-60 by most accounts) as well as put the price point well above many other competing cars. It's still a very interesting car and compelling for some, but it could have easily been a slam dunk. To see that they left so much power on the table (pretty much it's biggest drawback in the MR) is very puzzling and disappointing. Many potential customers who were waiting for the MR will end up going to the BMW 135i or the new 370Z because of it.

pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

I'm not confusing anything. You are excluding part of the Evo lineup without specifically stating it. Your arguments are in a vacuum due to providing facts to support what you think is the truth.

My point is the Evo is in the market segment that Mitsu believes they can sell the car. I'm saying even if the car has 400 HP and price it with the upgraded market segment that it would not sell. Who cares if they presumably limit the power. As previously stated, they are not the first nor the last.

delhi

Isn't this always been the case for many mfg... especially with their turbocharged models? The Audi 2.0t comes to mind and so is the turbo boxer engines from Subarus. Heck even the 9-3 turbos have lots of power left untapped.
I am presuming driveability, emissions, marketing, future scaleability, model spin-offs etc were the factors. Nissan's VQ is a prime example.

saturn

Why do they have to price it at $70k in order to give it 400hp? That makes no sense at all. It's not like we're talking about Porsche who doesn't want to delude their brand by offering a cheaper car that's faster than their 911 (i.e. - Cayman). This is their flagship car and there's no reason at all (e.g. - emissions, reliability, etc) why they can't give at least 360hp for a very small increase in price. This might not be the first or last time, but it's one of the most severe artificial limitations I've ever seen.

You mixed up your arguments, didn't read my post, and generally just took things out of context. This isn't really a productive use of time. Mitsubishi FAILED and their sales will prove it.

23109VC

if you want to drag race your car - great...buy the EVO X and mod it.

I"m the OP - my point was ---- the car is NO FUN.

i'm not 18 with my only concern being 0-60 and having a big fart can exhaust that makes people stare with disgust as I reve around the starbucks..

i want something that is FUN.

I have test driven a LOT of cars. the ONLY TWO cars I have driven that were FUN FUN FUN that made me want to buy them were the RX8 and the Porsche Boxster.

I like both cars - even though they are very different. the boxster being a roadster vs the 8 being a coupe with the rear seats... but if you compare a newer 8 to an older boxster - they are in similar price points and both are "fun" cars.

the evo just feels like a cheapy ricey sedan. lots of low end torque, and it sounds horrible.

i'm big on sound. the rx8 sounds cool. i drove an rx8 wtih the MS exhaust. it sounded AWESOME. the boxster sounds amazing as well - different but amazing. the evo sounds like a $hitbox. i hated it.

i don't care how fast the evo is or could be with mods. i hated it. different strokes for different folks. a lot of people love it and buy it INSTEAD of a porsche or other "high end" brands. that's what makes the world go round.

my points was to highlight that for a lot less money - you all have a car that is IMHO - much more fun and much more sporty.

crafted_soul

I don't want to read this threat. I don't care about what all of you said. You are all stupid as hell.

And what the fk EVO owers and Sti ****** doing on RX8 forum? NOBODY CARES HOW GOOD OR BAD YOUR CARS ARE. U HEAR ME??!! NOBODY! If you think somebody cares, you are dillusionallllll as f*&K!

superglue

Nobody forced you to read or post in this thread.



..... just thought I'd put that out there

JmurphRx8

I hope your not referring to the X, cuz if you are, your talking out your ***. I've owned 2 STi's, own an X and driven an evo 8 many times (my buddy has one), and yes the STI's and evo 8 tend to run out of breath. However, the X is completely different. After the power reflashes from Mitsu, the cars pulls like a bitch all the way to redline. I would describe the power delivery as follows: there's a strong progressive pull up to about 5,500RPM, then from the there its a big burst of power till redline. I actually hit fuel cut off all the time cause the car does not want to stop pulling.

JmurphRx8

How much "fun" are you expecting to have on a test drive? I know for sure they won't let you go nuts with the car and actually get a good sense in it's abilities. I've owned an RX8...great car...but way to high maintenance and to costly for gas per performance. In a sense not practical at all. The evo hands down is a better performer/handler, enters corners easier with more speed and exits easier with more speed. Its all the positive attributes of my previous rx8 just taken to the next level. Take a corner hard with the X and mash the gas pedal when you exit. Then you'll see fun. To each his own though, some would rather sacrifice a more refined interior over performance...thats fine.. Where as some care more about all out performance and would sacrifice interior refinement.

Maniac0301

Top Gears take on the EVO vs STI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tZiu-iDK74

pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

The more I see and read about the Evo X the more I like it. I looked at GSR and MR 2 weeks ago but did not take them for a test drive for fear I would be tempted to take one home. I know what I have with the 8 and it is very hard to give it up. Just need to add some WHP.

JmurphRx8

The rx8 is a great car. If it was just more efficient and came with 100 more hp, it would be damn near perfect. I wonder what mazda is planning to do once the 370z is released. That car is speculated to have about 330-350hp, as well as be lighter.

delhi

Easy. Add and delete exterior colours of the rx-8. Don't you know Mazda's approach by now?

pdxhak

iTrader: (2)

IMO the RX-8 is an awesome car. Like you I just wish it had more HP. Before I was 100% positive of adding a turbo this year but now I'm weighing the options. For instance I would be very happy with a 2nd gen Turbo RX-7 and the Evo MR.

AJ's Shinka

Update: I recently took a test drive in the EVO X this salesman was an Evo enthusiast he was all about the Evo IV. He was like,"That was a classic and pure sportscar!"

Anyhow, I did not see the "fun" in driving it, plus the interior had a sedan-ish feel to it not like I was in a sportscar but in a cheap sedan. I did like the recaro seats and the torque wasn't unlike anything I haven't felt before in other cars but it definitely pulls much harder than the 8. The car just didn't have a good overall feel to it imo. My 8 may not be the fastest car on the road but when I drive her she feels like I'm in a sportscar. I guess that is what Mazda is good at...soul of a sportscar. Just my .02