HiFlite999

iTrader: (2)

You brought in physics; physics looks at limiting cases as a way to clarify logic. Torque does *not* accelerate vehicles, nor is it at all necessary to accelerate vehicles. Power accelerates, period. Torque is a result of the method chosen in ICE cars to do it, and is connected to hp by the formula I gave.

No, even with similar engines, the one with the higher torque peak will not necessarily be the one that will accelerate faster. If you look at the VW lineup of gas and turbo-diesel engines, in almost every case the diesel produces more torque and less hp than the gas engine in the same car, and in every such case, the higher hp, lower torque gas engine wins the 0-60 times and by even larger margins, in the 1/4 mile.

pistonhater

"Power is the rate at which torque is produced by an engine. So to increase power output, we have two basic variables we can work on improving: 1) increase torque; and 2 ) increase engine speed."

-Mark Warner, "Street Rotary", p26-27. (the guy is a mechanical engineer, you're probably familiar with the book)

Notice the key words underlined above are "rate" and "torque." Also, the first variable he quotes as important to increase power is to increase torque - which is the opposite of what you said above.

Perhaps I am not understanding you after all, but what this guy says in the book makes more sense to me.

Anyway, thanks for your response. I always try to learn from various opinions and perspectives.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

That book is fun to read and has a lot of good info but let's not act like that book is the end all book on anything rotary. I mean he quotes BDC for gods sake, and he is an absolute joke as a builder. Not to mention a couple of other people I don't consider experts on rotary's.

pistonhater

I agree with you on that. That book is not the final authority on anything rotary; more like a basic introduction to some concepts and ideas.

HiFlite999

iTrader: (2)

The second part of that statement is correct. In practice however, getting a higher peak torque often means a decrease in the engine speed at which it occurs. Going up 10% in peak torque at a 20% lower engine speed means a decrease in hp at that speed ==> less acceleration. One engine having a higher peak torque than another does not mean that it is "faster"; often the opposite is true.

The first part is a confusion brought about by the messy SAE/English system of measurement, where the "fundamental units" are Force, Distance, and Time. Instead of Mass, Distance, and Time (used by science and everyone else in the world outside of the USA). There is no mass unit defined in SAE, though "slugs" is often used as a kludge. I'd prefer not to get into that, though!

What he does get right, and what I'm trying to convey, is it's all about POWER.

Enthu

To keep from ever dealing with this dilemma, I sold my dd FC, bought an evox for my new DD and put bnr stage 3s into my FD. The evo is incredible, but it is so different from the FD that I am just happy with both for being the pinnacle of their respective development.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

, Welcome back. EVO's are lame. Fast, but lame.

Enthu

Thanks. I recently flogged a friends rx-8 and it reminded me more of a modern FC. Around the same acceleration as my FC but with better brakes. My FC GXL had bracing, konis, pillow ***** and manual steering among power mods. mazda has never made a dull 7 or 8. Evos are king for half the year here in mn. Its faster on my neighborhood Round about than my RX in any weather, but I don't feel as lively going fast in the evo.

I have totalled 5 posts in 11 years. Happily I remember my password here.

Jims5543

iTrader: (1)

I just want to post and tell you that you are now my favorite person. I always thought I was the only one not drinking the cool aid.

I purchased forum owners "87GTR" which was our buddies creation and a complete abortion.

It was so bad I sold it a month later for a loss because I was positive it would not run very long and I made sure the buyer was aware of that. I took a big financial hit but felt it was better then the one coming when the car crapped the bed.