Price????? on the RX8
09-17-2002, 02:21 PM
#26
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Regarding Amati:
Here's the scoop. Mazda was extremely close to introducing the Amati luxury division in the early 1990s. So close, in fact, that an Amati banner was hung from Mazda's US headquarters in Irvine, CA.
However, by 1993, the US economy had tanked, Japan's bubble economy had burst, and Mazda had introduced way too many two-door coupes into a quickly shrinking coupe market (RX-7, MX-3, MX-6, and it could be argued that many potential buyers of these cars wound up in Miatas instead). Mazda was in serious financial difficulty, and the strength of the yen against the dollar was only making matters worse. From 1993 to 1995, the price of the RX-7 increased nearly $7,000, almost all due to currency problems.
Mazda was not the only company suffering from this. Toyota's Lexus, whose LS400 started at about $36,500 in 1990 was nearing $50,000 by 1995. Lexus maintained its success because of the headway it made when their cars were still relatively cheap and built a high-end image. Amati had already lost four years to Lexus and Infiniti and would lose another before it would be ready to go in late 1994.
Therefore, Mazda pulled the plug on Amati in 1993. But not before some major work had been done on future products.
Mazda's strategy for Amati was to have three cars ready at launch. One was the entry level "near-luxury" sedan. The second car was to be a left-hand drive version of the Eunos Cosmo luxury coupe, which was to be sold in the US in both two and three rotor versions, just like in Japan. Finally, there was to be a flagship RWD sedan with what would have been Japan's first production V12 engine. It was based on the KL-series 60 degree Mazda V6. The initial prototype was a 3.6L unit, essentially a 12-cylinder version of the MX-3's 130 hp V6, said to produce about 280 hp. For more useable torque a 4.0L version was being considered, and the engine could have been punched out easily enough to 5.0L, a double 2.5L from the MX-6.
When Amati was scrapped, the entry-level car was completely finished and sales volume as the Eunos 800 in Japan and the Xedos 9 in Europe was not deemed sufficient to pay for the development of the car, so it was sent to the US as the Mazda Millenia, which promptly cannabalized sales of the 929 and led to its US market demise.
The Eunos Cosmo never made it to the US despite its being tested and universally loved by the American press, in fact it was never officially sold anywhere but in Japan, though it has since been grey market imported to Europe, Australia, and New Zealand.
The V12 sedan was completely junked, I have seen no prototypes, let alone styling sketches of the car, the only evidence of its existence I have found are contemporary magazine news snippets and the fact that the only surviving V12 prototype (to my knowledge) was on display in the lobby of Mazda headquarters in Hiroshima.
The story of the V12 doesn't quite end there, though. There was some talk around 1995 of Jaguar using the Amati V12 in some of its cars. This plan was quickly dropped and Jaguar instead went ahead with its joint development with Lincoln of a V8 engine.
Here's the scoop. Mazda was extremely close to introducing the Amati luxury division in the early 1990s. So close, in fact, that an Amati banner was hung from Mazda's US headquarters in Irvine, CA.
However, by 1993, the US economy had tanked, Japan's bubble economy had burst, and Mazda had introduced way too many two-door coupes into a quickly shrinking coupe market (RX-7, MX-3, MX-6, and it could be argued that many potential buyers of these cars wound up in Miatas instead). Mazda was in serious financial difficulty, and the strength of the yen against the dollar was only making matters worse. From 1993 to 1995, the price of the RX-7 increased nearly $7,000, almost all due to currency problems.
Mazda was not the only company suffering from this. Toyota's Lexus, whose LS400 started at about $36,500 in 1990 was nearing $50,000 by 1995. Lexus maintained its success because of the headway it made when their cars were still relatively cheap and built a high-end image. Amati had already lost four years to Lexus and Infiniti and would lose another before it would be ready to go in late 1994.
Therefore, Mazda pulled the plug on Amati in 1993. But not before some major work had been done on future products.
Mazda's strategy for Amati was to have three cars ready at launch. One was the entry level "near-luxury" sedan. The second car was to be a left-hand drive version of the Eunos Cosmo luxury coupe, which was to be sold in the US in both two and three rotor versions, just like in Japan. Finally, there was to be a flagship RWD sedan with what would have been Japan's first production V12 engine. It was based on the KL-series 60 degree Mazda V6. The initial prototype was a 3.6L unit, essentially a 12-cylinder version of the MX-3's 130 hp V6, said to produce about 280 hp. For more useable torque a 4.0L version was being considered, and the engine could have been punched out easily enough to 5.0L, a double 2.5L from the MX-6.
When Amati was scrapped, the entry-level car was completely finished and sales volume as the Eunos 800 in Japan and the Xedos 9 in Europe was not deemed sufficient to pay for the development of the car, so it was sent to the US as the Mazda Millenia, which promptly cannabalized sales of the 929 and led to its US market demise.
The Eunos Cosmo never made it to the US despite its being tested and universally loved by the American press, in fact it was never officially sold anywhere but in Japan, though it has since been grey market imported to Europe, Australia, and New Zealand.
The V12 sedan was completely junked, I have seen no prototypes, let alone styling sketches of the car, the only evidence of its existence I have found are contemporary magazine news snippets and the fact that the only surviving V12 prototype (to my knowledge) was on display in the lobby of Mazda headquarters in Hiroshima.
The story of the V12 doesn't quite end there, though. There was some talk around 1995 of Jaguar using the Amati V12 in some of its cars. This plan was quickly dropped and Jaguar instead went ahead with its joint development with Lincoln of a V8 engine.
09-17-2002, 03:38 PM
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Mad props Smokingclutch
I remember the Amati division. I believe if it has survived, it would have been awesome. I didn't know quite the info. that you gave though (very insightful post) :D Just think of the beautiful styling that could have come out of that division. Well I can always dream.
Maybe Mazda may entertain the idea in the future.
Maybe Mazda may entertain the idea in the future.
09-17-2002, 08:12 PM
#31
Originally posted by fuz
Bottom line for me:
If they can't start with a base price of $25k, or top out nearly loaded at around $33, I won't buy. The RX-8 must be able to compete with the Z on price range.
Bottom line for me:
If they can't start with a base price of $25k, or top out nearly loaded at around $33, I won't buy. The RX-8 must be able to compete with the Z on price range.
I want my 6 speed loaded at around 30k, I don't intend to pay much more than that.
There are too many cars in that price range and I hope Mazda undercuts them and as a result I benefit.
I'm just hoping on good lease deals, because I don't like to keep cars more than 3 years... so I just lease the next car too :P Maybe the RX-7?
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