REL_RX8

I'm about to get an RX-8 tomorrow and I had a few quick questions.

Firstly, I'll be 2 year leasing a new 2005 Mazda RX-8 + Grand Touring Package for $200/mo with $2,000 down. I was looking at the base model of the Pontiac G6 and that came out to $230/mo with $2,500 down for a 2 year lease. So F- them! The main reason I'm getting the 8 is because it's the cheapest car I could find that kicked ***.

I've never driven a stick before and was wondering if any of you first learned to drive a stick on your RX-8 and how it worked out for you. I'm smack in the middle between getting the MT or the AT. I know the MT has more HP than the AT, but MTs can be a pain. But for a sports car like the RX-8, most people seem to get the MT. I like the ATs because the car doesn't jerk when shifting gears. I will test drive the MT and find out for myself.

I know the mileage is about 14-15MPG average for most people which sucks. But with a cheap deal on a lease, I'll probably still come out ahead in the end. The reason they are leasing so cheap is because they are gas guzzlers. Premium gas guzzlers. Oh well.

Any feedback will be appreciated.

Astral

Buy MT! Seriously, with this car, it's not just a matter of the tranny, it's a matter of the engine.

This car's MT, I find, is a little harder to get a good hang of than your average MT car... For example, the revs fall faster (so you either need to shift faster, or catch the revs from falling too low with some gas), the gas pedal is more linear (which gives you more control in the end, but requires more of an accelerator push in the beginning to get it to rev). But don't let this scare you away.. if you've never driven MT before, you will not notice the gas pedal feel difference and you will easily get used to things just the way they are.

As far as jerkiness goes, it's not really an MT car thing, it's just a skill thing. If you buy this MT, I predict you'll get the basics down in the first two-three days of practice, then in a week or two, you'll be OK with it, then in a month or two you will be pretty decent with it, and then only another 3-4 months you will truly be smooth.

I had 2-3 hours total of MT experience when I bought my 8 less than two months ago. So while I didn't learn the stick from scratch on the 8, I pretty much learned everything after the basics in it. Less than two months later, I am already decently smooth on shifts; uphills are not a problem anymore. I let my roommate drive my 8 and I thought that he'd be driving jerky (like me), but he got in the car and after the first two-three corners, his shifts were buttery smooth. You would have a hard time telling that you were in an MT car with your eyes closed with my roommmate driving. So it's just a matter of time to get the smoothness down.

Plus the 8's gearbox is awesome and rowing through 6 gears is an awesome feeling. You get that extra feeling of control that I miss with automatics.

Get the MT, you won't regert it in the end!

(As further proof that smooth MT is in the driving, I was watching the British show "Fifth Gear" and one of the hosts complained, while driving a Maserati (or some other ungodly expensive car), that its automatic gearbox was not as smooth as "good old fashioned hands and feet" (i.e. the manual transmission).)

Gerael

you should read the learning stick shift thread...

well u dont really have time to learn.. but you should have someobdy pick it up for you...
first 60 miles really matters for break in...

and if you're good.. shifting is smoother in manual...

REL_RX8

Thank you SO MUCH for that post. You told me everything I wanted to hear.

After I posted that, I realized what my #1 fear was... REGRET. I'm terrified to get the MT and after a few weeks yelling "Noooooooooooooooo!!!" Like what have I done!!?!?! Basically worried I would HATE it.

It's my brother's Acura RSX Type-S, it's horrible when switching gears. I think it might be him. But he said any MT will have a good tug feeling when switching.

After reading about how "smooth" the RX-8 is, I thought that this car might have been an exception.

I'll lean more towards the MT then! Thank you for clearing up my fears. I feel less prone for regret now.

The main reason I'm worrying is because my Dad, he kept stressing how much of a pain sticks are, and I was buying into it. He's the only person I've seen who has discouraged the MT. I know the MT does take more work to drive but once you get the hang of it you will be glad you did.

Thanks again for the fast and very helpful reply.

EDIT: Read your edit Astral. Nice find.
EDIT: Gerael, I am having my Dad take it home, he's really good with a stick. BTW, I never found that shifting thread.

Krankor

d00d, never mind the HP or anything about the 8 or anything. The simple truth is, regardless of vehicle: manual is just WAY MORE FUN. I drove automatic for 7 years until I decided to learn stick; since then I've never gone back and never will. The ONLY time I ever wished I had an automatic was one time when I was moving and rented the Giant Truck From Hell, which had a clutch so nasty you just about needed both feet to push it down. So if you ever have to rent a truck, get an automatic. Otherwise, manual is just *totally* better.

You will be able to do it after one good learning session. You will be starting to be comfortable with it after about 2 weeks of driving every day. After a year it will be second nature to you. Give yourself this gift which will stay with you the rest of your life.

Krankor
05 Shinka 6MT

swoope

iTrader: (5)

the ? is where do you live??? are you stuck in traffiic all the time??? seems like all the people in cali get bad gas mileage. my guess is the spend a lot of time idling.

as to the mt. you will learn. it is not a big deal. the car can burn 87oct.

200 bucks a month, how many miles a year???????

beers

Gerael

Hrm.. manual after you get used to it... CAN be smoother.. i didn't say it would be...

after you get used to it.. its only slightly annoying in traffic... but rx8 has a fairly light clutch.. so your leg won't get tired...

i really highly suggest you ahve somebody teach you manual first... and also drive it home for you... you dno't wanna jack up your clutch... also...

when upshifting... try to let up clutch quickly... letting it slip and the engine wind down slowly between gears is bad... wears out your clutch.... you should feel a gentle little bump... or none at all... but quick clutching will make your clutch last much longer... heh..

Astral

Hey REL_RX8,

YES YES YES! When I bought my automatic Protege 2.5 years ago (my first car ever), I was torn between auto and MT. I mean, it was my first car, I had a total of 400 90% highway miles behind my belt in an automatic (plus a passed road test). So my boss at the time cautioned me: "I know you're considering the automatic, but make sure you don't regret it."

And man, did I ever... I owned my automatic Protege for 2.5 years. In the first five months, I would say that I only somewhat regret getting an auto. After that and until about 1.5 years of ownership, I was saying that I only half-regret getting the auto. At about 1.5 years, I broke down and was regretting getting the auto 90% (10% non-regret still there as it did help me learn how to drive). At some point, I considered trading my Protege for another new one, but with a stick, but the money lost on the upside-down loan didn't justify it.

It's your brother. Not to put your brother down, but if you accept the fact that all MTs have a "tug feeling" when switching, then you won't work towards improving your shifting to be tug-free.

I actually was pretty frustrated for the first three-four days of driving. My 2nd day of owning my brand new RX-8 (about 24 hours since purchase), I went on a Boston roads cruise with some Protege club members and the highway we wanted to take was all backed up. So we ended up driving through traffic-filled, crawling stop-and-go major streets of Boston on a Friday night. I had cars riding my bumper (on an uphill even!) and cabbies pulling out randomly and cars randomly stopping in their lanes and drunk pedestrians randomly crossing the roads. It was the most difficult driving I've ever done: I had to stay wicked concentrated to not stall the car and not buckle too much.

After that night, and for the first week or so, I wasn't sure whether I made the right choice with MT... I thought, heck, the automatic was so much easier, I should've just stayed with that. However, two weeks of driving and my confidence was back up to good levels. My confidence now is great. I ventured into Boston for the 2nd time since buying the RX-8 tonight and I felt much better zipping around town.

I found that once I was decent at uphill starts (no longer afraid of rolling back many feet), I acquired even more confidence.

Any feelings of "should've stayed with the auto" are now all but gone. This weekend I'm gonna be driving into NYC, so I'll probably be stuck in nasty traffic for a while, but I know I'll be fine.

You nailed it. My parents also discouraged MT heavily, but they live in NYC and grew up driving only sticks (auto was a luxury). They still discourage MT and they couldn't believe for a while that I actually bought an MT car.

No problem, I am glad that you can make sense of my ramblings.

Perfect! Get the car to a parking lot (make sure it's warmed up) and off practicing you go. Check out www.standardshift.com and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manual_...ving_technique

Astral

Yah, one of the reasons I am smoother now is that I start letting up clutch quicker than I used to. My foot starts moving back a split second before the gear is in place.

Don't worry about wearing the clutch in the beginning. The clutch will last you way past the 2 years of leasing, even with the beating on it in the beginning.

Gerael

aww... leasing? hes leasing?

thats like borrowing the princess for a few nights... you're supposed to marry the princess... yer not gonna get better... sigh..

well anyway...
heres the link to the learning stick thread..

https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...learning+stick

Raptor2k

For a second there it looked like you were going AT, lol, good choice with the MT. You'll have fun with it and no regrets, honestly. It takes a couple days to grasp, and maybe several days to get moving in the city...the learning process is usually a pain, but it'll be worth it. I was in the same position of whether or not to get AT or MT...in my earlier stages of rx8 shopping I was sure I'd go AT, but decided to get the MT with extra horsepower, because if so many people do it, I knew I could. Again, shifting gears at high revs = joy.

REL_RX8

Thanks a lot guys... for everything. The MT it is.

I live just north of Detroit in Michigan. Not a lot of stop and go where I am. Unless it's rush hour, which I usually never have to drive in.

Another concern was the snow. I will have to drive this in the winter, but don't have $1000 for winter tires. I can't get a winter car because my money will be gone in a couple hours.

Moostafa29

If you want to the MT hp, in an AT, wait until the 06 models come out. But seriously, its not too hard to learn. Like one of the previous posters, I have a couple of hours experience learning to drive stick before I test drove and bought my 8. And that was about 6 months before I bought it. Once you get the basics down, its not to bad. It will be jerky for awhile, but you'll eventually get the hang of it. There were times I wanted to give up, because I was tired of it jerking, and stalling out. Now I don't even pay attention to what I'm doing. I shift like its a natural reaction. Don't even watch the rpms anymore, I can listen to the tone of the engine/exhaust and know when its time to shift. I can also listen to that same sound, and know how fast I'm going, so I rarely look at my speed. But seriously though, I don't think this is a car you should get in AT, unless you love the looks and don't plan on having any fun with it. But if you are like 90% of the people on this forum, and want to have some fun with the car, get the 6speed, you won't be disappointed.

REL_RX8

Thanks Moostafa29.

My only concern is winter now... :-/

I read snow or seasonal tires are a must, for driving in ANY amount of snow.

Do the MTs drive better than ATs in snow? I hear the ATs have better traction, so I dunno.

And I'm not waiting for the 06s. The whole reason I'm getting the 05' is because they are trying to get rid of them for when the 06's come in. I don't think I'll be able to get a $200/mo. payment with $2000 down on an 06'.

EDIT: Well I'm off the the dealer now.
Hope all goes well. Thanks again for everything everyone. :flipoff:

Astral

Get a credit card and buy those winter tires . Seriously though, you can't at all drive the car in the winter with the stock tires. Mine came with the Dunlops and they don't even have siping that most all-sesaon tires have (so they are essentially summer tires).

tirerack.com can have you running 215/55QR17 Dunlop Graspic DS-2s on Kazera KZ-V rims for $970 shipped.

REL_RX8

Good deal. I'll look into them.

I'm off to the dealer now.

Astral

MTs drive just as well in the snow as the ATs, there really isn't any difference in traction. What makes a difference is having DSC and TCS, which you do have in the Grand Touring package.

If you get snows for your 18" stock rims, you're looking at about $760 shipped. Then every season pay $100 for mount and balance at the Mazda dealership. So $860 to start, $960 in the spring.

If you just want to get thru the winter, if you can't get the snows, I think the cheapest option for you is to get the cheapest all-seasons that will fit on stock rims. Tirerack has Avon Tech M550 A/S for about $580 shipped. Pay $100 in the beginning for mount and balance, that's $680 to get you through the winter and $780 once you get back into the summer tires. But since the cost is spread out in time there, it may be easier to handle.

mike1324a

I learned on the 8. The car is great for people who cant drive stick. It took me only 600 miles to be proficient and confident. Its not hard at all. Go MT, there is no other way.

REL_RX8

Haha, my brother is looking at a 350z now. (On the day I'm getting the 8) He's a competing little b****. Seems like he finds the RX-8 better than his Acura RSX Type-S, and doesn't want me to have a nicer car than his.

What an idiot. On the SAME day. Hope he isn't able to afford one. Cause I'd be jealous.

I would take a Z over an RX-8 in a heart beat.

Hope the Z handles in snow worse. I wish him the worst of luck if he gets it. :P

Astral

With all due respect, you should not let sibling rivarly get in the way. Tell your brother to learn to shift smoothly before he gets a Z.

I would assume the Z's harsher suspension would make it worse in snow, but I doubt there'd be much difference in handling. The 8 is quite lighter than the Z, which means you'll be able to stop faster in the snow (despite the extra weight biting into the snow better on the Z).

The Z is porky, at 3428lbs, whereas the 8 is 2950lbs, so you'll have the more refined car. The Z has to work overtime (harsh suspension) to handle similarly to the RX-8 (soft suspension).

The RX-8, with the rotary engine and no pistons, is a lot more unique.

REL_RX8

Thanks, I feel better. But you can't beat the Z's performance and looks. It is one of the best looking cars I've seen, and the performance is fantastic. I think it's a lot more expensive to lease too.

I don't know about you guys, but I see more Zs on the road than RX-8s, which makes the RX-8 more unique. So that's a plus.

I had no idea the tiny Z weighed that much! The 300-hp anniversary edition on the Z does 0-60 in 5.7 seconds, and the RX-8 does 5.9. 0.2 seconds sounds like nothing. He won't be getting the 300-hp either, it will be the very base model. I always thought the Z was super fast and could smoke an RX-8 by bus lengths.

Thanks.

Raptor2k

You're right...there isn't much difference in performance, and one of the biggest variables is the skill of the driver.

Also...I think we can all agree the rx8 looks a lot sweeter. The Z reminds me of a soap box sometimes...not sure why.

REL_RX8

Well I got my RX-8, and lovin it so far. The Grand Touring makes the car a LOT more enjoyable. The sun roof and the good sound system raise joy.

It looks like my brother is getting an RX-8 now, the 350z costs almost 3x more. Yes, the exact same model, but he wants a black one with the 2 tone red interier. I find this truely messed up. I won't let it ruin my RX-8 experience.

So far I've only stalled the car about 8 times and at about 1/2 hour of MT driving experience. Knowing that it I will forget it's an MT in about it in another week makes me happy.

So far so GOOD. Lovin everything about it. Looks like the car requires a lil bit more maintenence than your average car.

Anyways, thanks again for everyone's input. Excellent help.

ZoomZoomH

iTrader: (1)

it's a sports car, of course it requires more maintenance, it's part of the fun of owning such fun to drive car, think of it as part of the RX-8 experience

welcome to the club!

RotoRocket

iTrader: (1)

I'm in the Detroit metro area, too.

I looked at a Z and passed. Cheap interior trim, and more importantly, an awfully stiff suspension, turned me off.

An awfully stiff suspension may be okay for the track or for smooth California roads, but not for Michigan, where our streets often resemble moonscapes.

The RX-8 drives like a Lexus by comparison to the Z in Michigan.

I'm not knocking the Z - just stating the obvious.