Motor oil for the 8: what 'The Car Doctor' (and Castrol) say…
02-14-2007, 07:38 AM
#27
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Royal Purple—the oil, its website and all it's followers here—have always impressed me, and I've come close to switching on more than one occasion. But now that I'm convinced that something like Castrol GTX—changed regularly—will do the job, I guess I'll stick with that (along with remembering to redline the engine regularly). Funny thing is, my gut feeling (as just an enthusiast who reads about these things) is that they're both good, and the differences between them (in performance and engine life) are probably not significant. I could be wrong… whatever.
Last edited by New Yorker; 02-14-2007 at 07:49 AM.
02-14-2007, 07:41 AM
#28
I think GTX is good oil, I never had any experience with it. but I tried Castrol Syntec once and it was so bad that ... its feeling very sluggish just like the Mobil1 Extended Performance now ..... and I think they're both Group III oil(Im sure Castrol is, not sure about Mobil1) or maybe just my butt dyno is not working when cold I dont know 
I will dump some RP back ASAP .... cant really stand this crap
I will dump some RP back ASAP .... cant really stand this crap
02-14-2007, 08:03 AM
#30
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Originally Posted by zoned
So you guys are saying i should go with a canola oil? how about olive? would that harm my seals?
02-14-2007, 08:08 AM
#31
I was watching Channel Thirdteen couple days ago and saw this french dude making some oil. He is the only one left in the whole family who knows how to make it in the oil fashion way. Sesame oil ... yummmmm
Yes Canola is junk.
Yes Canola is junk.
Last edited by nycgps; 02-14-2007 at 08:12 AM.
02-14-2007, 08:15 AM
#32
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Originally Posted by New Yorker
.
.
.
Mazda prefers
this oil to be burnt off/volatilize off so as to prevent formation of
deposits. Synthetic oil typically has a higher threshold for volatility and
burn-off so that is why conventionals are specified.
.
.
.
Ron Ananian
The Car Doctor
Why then doesn't Mazda recommend oils with the lowest flash point? Well, one reason is that they are usually the worst oils. Can't have it both ways.
I've seen this "burn-off" argument repeatedly but of course there is never any quantitative analysis. That is, if flash-point/flame-point are critical properties, then what are the desired limits? Specifying conventional vs. synthetic does nothing whatsoever to guarantee the oil has the desired properties if, in fact, flash point and flame point are critical. The logical conclusion therefore, is that they are not. Reductio ad Absurdum
Last edited by Nubo; 02-14-2007 at 08:20 AM.
02-14-2007, 09:12 AM
#33
SARX Legend
iTrader: (46)
Originally Posted by ken-x8
I saw nothing wrong with 9krpmrx8's posts. His first one in this thread conveys much the same info as New Yorker's original post. He doesn't have a quote and doesn't name names, but it's still the same: citing someone in the oil business who goes along with Mazda's recommendation. No need to take any of this personally.
Ken
Ken
Dude, I am not bashing synthetics, I admit they are superior to dino oils in many ways and I have used Mobil 1 and Schaffers for years in my other force fed cars. But "experts" have said that synthetics may cause problems with rotaries. Sure it may have been certain syhthetics and they may have fixed iy but who knows. Neither you or me knows **** about oils.
My brother had a Toyota in which he never changed the oil. At 24K miles he had no problems whatsover.
At somewhere above 70k miles he left a big puddle of sludge on the Jersey Turnpike when a rod went through the block. But at 24K he would have sworn that changing oil was a waste of money.
At somewhere above 70k miles he left a big puddle of sludge on the Jersey Turnpike when a rod went through the block. But at 24K he would have sworn that changing oil was a waste of money.
This reply is from Tim Miranda, their oil "guru". Tim spends
most of this time in the lab analyzing and formulating. We can't get any
higher or better than him for specific oil issues such as yours
most of this time in the lab analyzing and formulating. We can't get any
higher or better than him for specific oil issues such as yours
You my friend, make no sense.
Last edited by 9krpmrx8; 02-14-2007 at 09:22 AM.
02-14-2007, 09:37 AM
#34
Rotary Wanker
Two points:
I agree: if you change your oil every 3,000 miles, what exactly is the benefit of synthetic? You'd think any oil can last 3,000 miles.
Regarding 5W-20 vs 5W-30 for the RX-8: My opinion is that Mazda recomends 5W-30, it's FORD that recomends 5W-20 (and makes Mazda call it out for North America).
I agree: if you change your oil every 3,000 miles, what exactly is the benefit of synthetic? You'd think any oil can last 3,000 miles.
Regarding 5W-20 vs 5W-30 for the RX-8: My opinion is that Mazda recomends 5W-30, it's FORD that recomends 5W-20 (and makes Mazda call it out for North America).
02-14-2007, 09:45 AM
#35
Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
Dude, I am not bashing synthetics, I admit they are superior to dino oils in many ways and I have used Mobil 1 and Schaffers for years in my other force fed cars. But "experts" have said that synthetics may cause problems with rotaries. Sure it may have been certain syhthetics and they may have fixed iy but who knows. Neither you or me knows **** about oils.
What can Mazda do ? Are they going to say :
*Oh sorry my bad cuz we should've test our products more carefully with oil out there*
but instead of that, Mazda said
*Its not our problem, Synthetic oil is the cause so GO Blame them*
Blah, again, LIVE EXAMPLE(me and others) are WAY better than 100000000000000000000000000000000 *experts* opinion.
Exactly, point made. My point is why bother with the risk in a rotary when Dino oils are perfectly fine as long as you change your oil every 3k. Don't get all butt hurt dude. I am just tired of people jumping on the sythetic band wagon. To my knowledge no one here is a chemical engineer. Oh, and the guy that works at your school is making 70k a year so who is really the idiot?
Oh yes, that dude in my old school is an idiot. He was lucky that he got the job, they wanted to promote him but he refused, cuz he knows that if he goes higher, his *** might get fired, due to his *lack of knowledge*. He would rather stay in his Tech support manager position than going up.
What do you need to see his degree? The guy contacted him because of his known reputation as an "oil guru"
You my friend, make no sense.
You my friend, make no sense.
You have alot to learn DUDE.
02-14-2007, 09:51 AM
#36
Originally Posted by Ericok
Two points:
I agree: if you change your oil every 3,000 miles, what exactly is the benefit of synthetic? You'd think any oil can last 3,000 miles.
Regarding 5W-20 vs 5W-30 for the RX-8: My opinion is that Mazda recomends 5W-30, it's FORD that recomends 5W-20 (and makes Mazda call it out for North America).
I agree: if you change your oil every 3,000 miles, what exactly is the benefit of synthetic? You'd think any oil can last 3,000 miles.
Regarding 5W-20 vs 5W-30 for the RX-8: My opinion is that Mazda recomends 5W-30, it's FORD that recomends 5W-20 (and makes Mazda call it out for North America).
but I prefer home cook food, healthier and taste better. (This will get you full as well)
Im not saying Dino oil = McDonalds junk, but just to give you guys an idea.
Yep, Its Ford who pushed this 5w20 crap to Mazda, See no one else on earth has the recent recall(and damaged engine) only NA market does (or whoever using 5w20) Special Thanks to Pathetic Ford.
I felt mad happy when I saw Ford's *billion dollar losses*. Damn I was about to run out and start yelling.
02-14-2007, 10:25 AM
#37
Registered
Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
Dude, I am not bashing synthetics, I admit they are superior to dino oils in many ways and I have used Mobil 1 and Schaffers for years in my other force fed cars. But "experts" have said that synthetics may cause problems with rotaries. Sure it may have been certain syhthetics and they may have fixed iy but who knows. Neither you or me knows **** about oils.
As I said earlier, there are some really knowledgable folks here who have laid out the whole tale. But someone who's run 24K miles in one car is not particularly convincing either way.
Originally Posted by nycgps
Some People are happy with Mcdonalds (This will get you full)
but I prefer home cook food, healthier and taste better. (This will get you full as well)
but I prefer home cook food, healthier and taste better. (This will get you full as well)
Ken
02-14-2007, 10:39 AM
#38
Originally Posted by ken-x8
Exactly. It's funny how all of us (well, all but one currently banned individual) love our RX-8's and are proud of Mazda's skills in designing and building it, yet some don't think Mazda is competent to specify what oil to use in their engines.
As I said earlier, there are some really knowledgable folks here who have laid out the whole tale. But someone who's run 24K miles in one car is not particularly convincing either way.
As I said earlier, there are some really knowledgable folks here who have laid out the whole tale. But someone who's run 24K miles in one car is not particularly convincing either way.
I think I go around alot already and I think I will reach maybe 35 K by year end money flying out of my pocket everyday ~but I still think that my 25K experience is better than ANY experts out there who had no rotary experience at ALL but just talk out loud base on their on paper crap and *what other experts said* and Auto company's guidelines.
You never tasted my mother's cooking.
Last edited by nycgps; 02-14-2007 at 10:52 AM.
02-14-2007, 10:44 AM
#39
Got Another Rotary
Not to get flamed on the synthetic debate, but just 1 (or 2) interesting facts:
Most motor oil manufacturers, in order the meet the new "SM" rating requirement for 5W-20 oils, have gone to a synthetic blend for their "dino" labeled SM 5W20 oils. The bottles do not state that they are blends, but they are as that is the only way they can meet the SM requirement for 5W20 weight oil (not true for heavier weight oils).
Side point - Many on BITOG are actually buying 5W20 weight oils over the 5W30 (same brand/style) just because of this fact and the result is that they are actually better overall lubricants - blend oil at a dino price.
That said, the point is, isn't it interesting that Mazda recommends only 5W20 oils for the 8 in the US, but not synthetic, but almost all "SM" 5W20's are synthetic blends including Ford's own Motorcraft 5W20 (which actually does state it is a blend on the bottle). You cannot buy SM rated 5W20 Motorcraft dino oil as it does not exist (old SL rated 5w20 may still be around though)
So, even if you wanted to, how are you to meet the dino 5W20 requirement for your 8 going forward (once all the SL rated is gone)? Ask your dealer this next time you visit and see what they say - I'm curious.
Most motor oil manufacturers, in order the meet the new "SM" rating requirement for 5W-20 oils, have gone to a synthetic blend for their "dino" labeled SM 5W20 oils. The bottles do not state that they are blends, but they are as that is the only way they can meet the SM requirement for 5W20 weight oil (not true for heavier weight oils).
Side point - Many on BITOG are actually buying 5W20 weight oils over the 5W30 (same brand/style) just because of this fact and the result is that they are actually better overall lubricants - blend oil at a dino price.
That said, the point is, isn't it interesting that Mazda recommends only 5W20 oils for the 8 in the US, but not synthetic, but almost all "SM" 5W20's are synthetic blends including Ford's own Motorcraft 5W20 (which actually does state it is a blend on the bottle). You cannot buy SM rated 5W20 Motorcraft dino oil as it does not exist (old SL rated 5w20 may still be around though)
So, even if you wanted to, how are you to meet the dino 5W20 requirement for your 8 going forward (once all the SL rated is gone)? Ask your dealer this next time you visit and see what they say - I'm curious.
Last edited by Jax_RX8; 02-14-2007 at 10:46 AM.
02-14-2007, 12:27 PM
#40
Registered
Originally Posted by otherside
LOL, there has just been alot of debates about synthetic and non synthetic here. I say use what you are comfortable with...
02-14-2007, 01:06 PM
#41
Originally Posted by Jax_RX8
Not to get flamed on the synthetic debate, but just 1 (or 2) interesting facts:
Most motor oil manufacturers, in order the meet the new "SM" rating requirement for 5W-20 oils, have gone to a synthetic blend for their "dino" labeled SM 5W20 oils. The bottles do not state that they are blends, but they are as that is the only way they can meet the SM requirement for 5W20 weight oil (not true for heavier weight oils).
Side point - Many on BITOG are actually buying 5W20 weight oils over the 5W30 (same brand/style) just because of this fact and the result is that they are actually better overall lubricants - blend oil at a dino price.
That said, the point is, isn't it interesting that Mazda recommends only 5W20 oils for the 8 in the US, but not synthetic, but almost all "SM" 5W20's are synthetic blends including Ford's own Motorcraft 5W20 (which actually does state it is a blend on the bottle). You cannot buy SM rated 5W20 Motorcraft dino oil as it does not exist (old SL rated 5w20 may still be around though)
So, even if you wanted to, how are you to meet the dino 5W20 requirement for your 8 going forward (once all the SL rated is gone)? Ask your dealer this next time you visit and see what they say - I'm curious.
Most motor oil manufacturers, in order the meet the new "SM" rating requirement for 5W-20 oils, have gone to a synthetic blend for their "dino" labeled SM 5W20 oils. The bottles do not state that they are blends, but they are as that is the only way they can meet the SM requirement for 5W20 weight oil (not true for heavier weight oils).
Side point - Many on BITOG are actually buying 5W20 weight oils over the 5W30 (same brand/style) just because of this fact and the result is that they are actually better overall lubricants - blend oil at a dino price.
That said, the point is, isn't it interesting that Mazda recommends only 5W20 oils for the 8 in the US, but not synthetic, but almost all "SM" 5W20's are synthetic blends including Ford's own Motorcraft 5W20 (which actually does state it is a blend on the bottle). You cannot buy SM rated 5W20 Motorcraft dino oil as it does not exist (old SL rated 5w20 may still be around though)
So, even if you wanted to, how are you to meet the dino 5W20 requirement for your 8 going forward (once all the SL rated is gone)? Ask your dealer this next time you visit and see what they say - I'm curious.
Motorcraft 5w20 (API SM thankyouverymuch) is what i use on my 8, btw, and the car seems to love it
02-14-2007, 02:12 PM
#42
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quick question.... out of curiosity...
I use Mazda brand oil from the dealership instead of the Motorcraft Syntec Blend stuff.
Any idea who makes the Mazda brand oil?
I use Mazda brand oil from the dealership instead of the Motorcraft Syntec Blend stuff.
Any idea who makes the Mazda brand oil?
02-14-2007, 02:18 PM
#44
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Originally Posted by puch96
quick question.... out of curiosity...
I use Mazda brand oil from the dealership instead of the Motorcraft Syntec Blend stuff.
Any idea who makes the Mazda brand oil?
I use Mazda brand oil from the dealership instead of the Motorcraft Syntec Blend stuff.
Any idea who makes the Mazda brand oil?
I BELIEVE that it is halvoline. but im not positive. ill check with a tech later on.
02-14-2007, 02:31 PM
#46
Got Another Rotary
Originally Posted by ZoomZoomH
I think the introduction of Grp III oils have blurred the line on what is 'synthetic' and what is not, basically rendering the term 'synthetic' more or less just a marketing term. Do you consider a Grp II/III blend like the Motorcraft 5w20 a 'synthetic'? I sure as heck don't, I consider it very highly refined 'dino' oil.
Motorcraft 5w20 (API SM thankyouverymuch) is what i use on my 8, btw, and the car seems to love it
Motorcraft 5w20 (API SM thankyouverymuch) is what i use on my 8, btw, and the car seems to love it
Group III's, , although not entirely true, are marketed as full synthetic. (M1, Pennzoil Platinum, Royal Purple, and most other Synthetics)
Group II+/III combos are considered synthetic blends.
Group II or II+ are considered dino.
I agree there is much confusion over "synthetic", as almost everyone is blending Group II+ (good dino), III (hydrocracked dino), IV (PAO's), V (Esters and others).
Motorcraft SM 5w20 is a good oil, no argument here.
02-14-2007, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by VarneyMazda
I BELIEVE that it is halvoline. but im not positive. ill check with a tech later on.
02-14-2007, 02:41 PM
#48
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Mazda's Dexelia oil sold in Europe and recommended for all European RX-8s is a synthetic blend isn't it? I'm just surprised rotarygod hasn't jumped into this argument yet. Maybe he's tired of all the arguing?
02-14-2007, 02:56 PM
#49
Originally Posted by LionZoo
Mazda's Dexelia oil sold in Europe and recommended for all European RX-8s is a synthetic blend isn't it? I'm just surprised rotarygod hasn't jumped into this argument yet. Maybe he's tired of all the arguing?
02-14-2007, 03:23 PM
#50
Originally Posted by Jax_RX8
Group IV's and V's are really true synthetics (Redline, AMSOIL)
Group III's, , although not entirely true, are marketed as full synthetic. (M1, Pennzoil Platinum, Royal Purple, and most other Synthetics)
Group II+/III combos are considered synthetic blends.
Group II or II+ are considered dino.
I agree there is much confusion over "synthetic", as almost everyone is blending Group II+ (good dino), III (hydrocracked dino), IV (PAO's), V (Esters and others).
Motorcraft SM 5w20 is a good oil, no argument here.
Group III's, , although not entirely true, are marketed as full synthetic. (M1, Pennzoil Platinum, Royal Purple, and most other Synthetics)
Group II+/III combos are considered synthetic blends.
Group II or II+ are considered dino.
I agree there is much confusion over "synthetic", as almost everyone is blending Group II+ (good dino), III (hydrocracked dino), IV (PAO's), V (Esters and others).
Motorcraft SM 5w20 is a good oil, no argument here.