JimJimElf

Have them fix it and do it right. I used to own a Ford Lightning before I traded for the 8. I remember them taking 3 tries to fix some scratches and chipped paint. They tried the cheap way which was noticable. Then only fixed half. then they finally fixed it, Just don't let them get by with shadey work. Because if you do they will try it on the next guy.

Splan8

I had the same thing happen to a leased volvo s60 AWD. Got banged in the front like you, from someone that was doing a brake job on another car in service but didn't bleed the brakes. Backed up, whammo.

So...

I called a lawyer for advice (let the dealer fix it), called the police for a police report and spoke with the service and dealership managers. Threw the word "liability" around a few times. Also called the insurance agency for "hypothetical advice". Theirs was to let the dealer do the work. No dings on my policy or deductibles to pay.

The end result:
I got like 15 free oil changes, marked in the system as a "VIP" so no hassles when I visited and they fixed the car well. (check your headlight alignment after the repair).

MORE IMPORTANTLY I also got a NOTORIZED letter stating they would not count this against me should I return the vehicle to them at the end of the lease. I DID have to use this letter later to get a fair deal.

I am happy things went that way. Paperwork for later is worth more than an upgrade now.

-Splan8

AF-RX8

Paintwork on a car hurts the resale value ... unfortunately that is the way it is and the dealer will be the first one to deduct it off the trade in value. The fair thing to do would be to repair it for free and possibly provide something equivilent to the loss of resale due to this.

Grabitquick

But Rob, that's what the dealer's insurance is for--to cover their negligence. Their insurance pays for the fix, and that's it. I wouldn't discourage bagman from telling them he'll never use them for service again unless he gets a little extra (I'd probably try it too), but it's not something to count on. Anything else would have to have to be done either through threats resulting in a settlement, or in court, and neither the dealer nor the insurer are simply going to roll over and cough up settlement money. There's no "compensation" to pay unless he can demonstrate "damages," and that would be pretty hard to establish, particularly since they've given him a fairly new loaner car to drive and (presumably) will restore the bumper to new condition. If they do a crap job on the repair and then refuse to improve it, that could be something different, but he's not at that stage yet.

Anyway, not trying to start a flame war at all, but IMHO something like this just isn't worth poking holes in the air with your finger over.

jtimbck2

I originally agreed with Gord on this, and I still do to a certain degree, but you make a good point about bodywork affecting resale value.

Rob Tomlin

Well, I really don't disagree with what you are saying here, so no need to say anything about starting a "flame war".

I just don't like it when people say something to the effect of "their attorney is bigger than your attorney" which implies that you shouldn't even attempt to get more than what the insurance company "offers" you. They are NOT the ones who get to decide what is fair and reasonable on a unilateral basis. That's what I am saying....they were negligent, and they have to reimburse the injured party for that negligence. The real question is what is reasonable reimbursement? The goal of the law is "to make the person whole", or to put them in as close of a position they were in prior to the accident as possible.

In this situation that is difficult, because the fact is the car has been damaged, and will be repainted. If it is anything but a perfect match, it will, like others have mentioned, make the resale value go down. In addition, he has been without the use of the car. To really make the victim "whole", they should let him rent the exact same car (an RX-8 not a Mazda 6) at their expense.

This is only fair. It is NOT "profiting" at someone else's expense, it is compensatory damages, plain and simple. Well, maybe not simple, because calculating damages when it comes to things like the loss of use of a car can admittedly be difficult, it is still something that he is entitled to, as well as any reduction in the value of the car.

Of course what he may technically be entitled to as a matter of law, and whether it is actually worth "fighting" over, or taking them to court, I tend to agree with you that it probably isn't as long as they do provide him with a rental car and do a good job of repairing the damage. At the same time, I can guarantee you that they (the insurance company and dealer) do NOT want him to get an attorney involved in this situation and they will try hard to make him happy to avoid that situation (within reason).

bagman

Just a small update - I called the service manager today as the General Manager mentioned on Saturday. The extra insurance I got on the rental for $14.99/day will be taken care of by Mazda.

In addition, the service manager says that the work done on the car has a lifetime warranty and all OEM parts and paint will be used in the process. He didn't know however, if it was going to be a "repair" or a "replacement." Wouldn't it be less time to just replace the entire bumper with a factory bumper that's already ready to go? I guess there could be fitting problems. I just don't want the re-paint to look like my ***.

Funny sidenote - I work in one of the largest and most prestigious law firm's in the country/internationally (Baker Botts L.L.P.), so I can get an attorney to work on my case pro bono, without having to pay a dime. (In fact, I'm actually working with an attorney on another car issue regarding my old Acura Integra.)

However, the firm would of course have to first do a conflict of interest check, and who knows what the outcome of that would be. We have many, many very large corporate clients.

Rob Tomlin

Ah, you are in good hands bagman.

See, we should never "assume" who has the "bigger" attorney!

:D

Grabitquick

Rob, I suspect that there's actually very little daylight between us after all is said and done. I am in 1001% agreement with you that compensating bagman for lost resale value is certainly the moral and right thing to do. But, how many accidents are there in the U.S. each year? In the millions, presumably. Mostly fender benders, hopefully. (My last car, a Mazda MX-6, spent more time in the body shop than Cher, as I like to say. And it actually looked better after the work.) But my point is that out of all of those claims, how many claims for lost resale value has anyone ever even heard of? How do you assess it? On the presumption that he lost value based on the resell value the day he dropped it off at the dealer, even though he apparently had no intention of selling it off? Or five years from now? And who takes priority in the parade of experts in assessing resale value? Kelly? Edmunds? Not worth it over a bumper worth $1,000 or so.

Bagman, I wish you luck and you should not stay quiet. I also work for one of the biggest law firms (sorry, I'm not as brave as you and will remain mum about who, but trust me), but if they do a nice job with the bumper, let it go. If not, then by all means get blood in your fangs.

2ROTORZ

Not to change the subject, but what is this?

SpinninAgain!

There shouldn't be any bodywork or paintwork. The dealer should replace the front bumper (and any other damaged panel) with a new one. Bagman delivered the car to the dealer with factory paint and finish. That's what they should return to him. That's fair and equitable.

Getting new parts will take more time of course, so they should lend him an RX-8 to drive in the meantime. Bagman paid for an RX-8, he should be driving an RX-8. That's also fair and equitable.

Beyond that, a couple of free oil changes or something to say, "We're sorry" would be nice. But screaming for hundreds or thousands of dollars of free toys is just pathetically greedy. Gord is 100% correct, that sort of behavior gets on my nerves too.

SpinninAgain!

Mazda offers an optional Aldehyde cabin air filter that cuts down on pollens and pollutants. There's a factory rebate coupon at your parts or service dept.

I bought one and installed it myself after reading this DIY thread.
https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...light=aldehyde
Found out later I could have had the dealer do if for free! Curses!!!

P.S. The thing works. Diesel exhaust odors are much reduced, and even though it's the height of ragweed season I'm sneezing on the inside of my windshield alot less. :D

Rob Tomlin

Spot on!

Rotary Titus

but then ppl might think it's no big deal to screw around when the worse they can do is just "fix it". I mean, what's the incentive for them NOT to wear their tools around their belt while striding around cars in the bay? "oh well, I can't be bothered, so what if I scratch someone's car? I'll just fix it".
Now I'm not saying that ppl should push the dealer to give them a new car for every little mistake but I think there should be a little more compensation than just "fixing it". And plus, it's not just the fact that your car's damaged, but you're without your car that's a major property for most people for a few weeks.

SpinninAgain!

Rotary Titus,

In effect you're recommending punitive damages. These are typically reserved for cases of repeated or gross misbehavior due to willful negligence or actual conspiracy. There is no evidence of either in this instance. As far as we know it was just an accident. They squashed his bumper, not his baby.

Your concern that Bagman will be without his car for an extended time is valid. As I suggested, this is easily remedied by the dealer's loaning him an equivalent vehicle until his RX-8 is made whole. (To date the dealer has not done this, so their response is inadequate to that extent, IMO).

While it's coincidental, Bagman would in fact gain value and the dealer lose value if Bagman drove their RX-8 for some length of time:

• more miles on their car
• fewer miles on his car
• more redline fun because, let's face it, it's not his car!

Rotary Titus

lol ok ok anyways well I'm just saying it's wrong if we go with the attitude "shut up cause I'll just fix it"
and my apologies of posting when I haven't read everyone else's responses
anyhow best of luck whatever happens! *steps out of the can of worms* :p

javahut

Should be a lesson, too... don't take your car to a dealer for work unless you HAVE to. I've had too many what should be simple tasks performed incompetently by dealership maintenance departments. I won't take my car to the dealer for "updates" unless the problem actually affects me or would have long term affects on the car. Other that that, if it ain't broke, don't let them try to fix it.

Had the SOUTH store in Austin ding up my wheels and put a funky major gash in the oil filler cap the very first time I took it in for service (not sure the oil cap even came from my car). I complained... they replaced the oil cap... refinished 2 wheels (while I drove a rental), but didn't do a great job refinishing them. Then they didn't even balance them correctly, so had to take it to Discount Tire to pay for balancing. Also, when I went to pick up the car, they came driving it up from the rear of the lot out of their dirt/mud parking lot. Took me a good couple of washes to get all the coleche out from under the car & fender wells. Totally incompetent work. So I switched to the NORTH store last time I HAD to have service. They did a decent job, but now I'm afraid of them, too, hearing this story.

How hard can it be to do competent work and take care of somebody's new car when they're working on it? Dealership maintenance departments are unbelievably dense most of the time.

Atacdad

Crap, I was taking my 8 in to Beasley North for its first oil change. If I hadn't gotten busy last week that could have been my Tit 8! FWIW, Beasley South dinged up my front bumper when I had it in there for a CEL the day after I bought it. Looks like Premier is my next destination...cause I'm not going to North or South now!

maxrx8

I Posted this when it happened in December 03. Redlands service opened up my door on a tool chest or something. The took care of it. but it doesn't Look perfect. Now it's in from somebody hitting me in my work Parking lot. I was told a week, but now it's all about not having the paint and having to order it. They've had it since Tuesday on the 9/14 and last thing I hear was they were expecting the paint last night.

I had some damage to the front air dam just a scratch and I asked them to fix it and I would pay for it. Apparently our bumpers are three piece or something like that (I over heard him talking to the Insurance guy that low balled me on their quote.) He Quoted me over 500 bills. almost as much as the cost of the rear that was hit. I told him not even. I'll get the free touch up paint and do it. He looked at his computer hit some keys and said 325. I ended up saying fine. anybody else have any body shop horrors. Don't mean to hijack, but this has been in the boiler and waiting to get out. When I saw this thread I had to post.

I hope he doesn't try to shaft me on the quote.

All this when I was primed and pumped to buy the RB exhaust. My wife bought me this sweet low profile aluminum jack for my B-day. I gotta use it.

Bill

Rob Tomlin

Bill-

Did you buy your RX-8 from Redlands Mazda? If so, how was the experience? I am considering purchasing from them (I'm in Riverside too).

maxrx8

Yes.

The experience was good. I purchased it basically talking about percent markup from cost. I spoke with Dan Ebach. You can see my sig, about 2500-3000 off. I used sanbernardino as the other potential because of Costco's car deal.

Even though they dinged my car, they were upfront about it. I could have been a major complainer and said I want a new door (extreme).

What is good about them is that they are a Lincoln Merc Dealer. FWIW It seems as though the service guys are conserned about your car (and their jobs). I say that because I went to Riverside Mazda to get a flash done and the guy, probably nice any other time, was pretty defensive and not very friendly. I wasn't asking him to be my friend, just act like he cared. You probably know they are also a hyundi, honda, and probably kia service department. So they probably get all kinds, but it's no excuse.

I would recommend them Redlands. I have heard good things about Norco though, but no practicle experience.

Have you seen another red with the limo tint going around the brockton arcade area? It looked sweet with all of the windows blacked out, but I am not that bold. I am afraid I'll attract every city cop and have enough fix it tickets to wall paper my house.

Have you test driven one yet? It's like a motorcycle with four doors. (I used to ride.)

Bill

RX-Nut

Yow.. I'm always afraid this will happen when I bring m car in..

For one, my Mazda service department's lot is so dang tight, cars are packed in like sardines, coupled with the fact that the lot boys drive like maniacs in such a small area.. I shudder.

Rob, hope your car comes out of this fiasco ok...

bagman

Update:

So, Mazda calls me Monday afternoon to let me know the car is ready to be picked up. (So they had it for about 6 working days total.)

I drive up to the dealership after work, and drop the rental off. The lady inside knows who I am and says that everything will be taken care of, she was already informed that Mazda was paying the $14.99/day extra insurance on the rental. A guy comes by and opens up this ice cream freezer and lets me pick an ice cream haha.

My car is parked out front, but I don't immediately run over to it because I'm a little leary/weary at what I might find/see. I sit down on a bench and finish the ice cream. *Take a deep breath* Ok, here we go.

I inspect the previously-damaged area and to my suprise it looks very good. You can't tell that anything happened at all. I felt over it with my fingers and couldn't feel anything. Looked at it from different angles, and by gosh it looks ... it's hard to say... as good as new. However, I did notice a minor issue - the left side of the front air dam is pulling away from the bottom of the body. It looks like it needs some epoxy, or whatever they use on it to stick it to the body. I'll bring it by later this week for that.

They gave me a printout and to my delight, they hadn't forgotten to do all the original things I asked them to do on it! I was afraid they'd forget to do all that after the incident. Everything was of course on Mazda, so I didn't pay any charges. They cleaned the interior of the car, and man with no airbag or rearview mirror rattle, it's so BAD ***!

So, all is well with the world again. I'd forgotten how awesome the RX-8 looks in person after driving the rental, 6 for a week. Haha I just stopped and stared for about 5 minutes when I got home with it last night.

Grabitquick

A good body shop is worth its weight in gold. I know from experience. From the sounds of it, you won't have any trouble having them fix the gap between air dam and the body. Hey, even Beethoven had to re-compose sometimes. (Sorry, his 3rd Symphony just happens to be on right now.)

Anyway, glad to hear about the good results.

Rob Tomlin

Glad to hear you were treated right and the car fixed to your satisfaction.

Regarding the front air dam coming away from the body, one of the side aero flares for the appearance package on my car is doing exactly the same thing, and you can actually see the epoxy. Ill have to take it in for that (even though I will be getting the MS body kit eventually).