red_base 95

#1 - Nissan is simply using the VQ engine across several platforms to cut costs. The VQ has been on Ward's list of best engines since it's introduction 10 years ago (it began life as a 3.0 liter for the maxima). It's Nissan's best engine, very flexible, and can be tuned for different applications.

#2 - The Acura TL-s and CL-s are both slated to get a 6 speed manual and LSD. These are actually available now on the CL-s. The Acuras offer great value right now. A similarly equipped competitor will cost you easily $3-$4k more. The 2 cars come standard with leather, power everything, sunroof and Xenon headlamps. The only option on these cars is the Nav system.

#3 - A manual transmission will be offered on the G35 sedan and coupe. It was not initially offered at rollout for the sedan simply because Nissan was not able to produce enough at that time to supply the G35 sedan, coupe and 350Z. This will not be an issue by spring.

#4 - If the G35 coupe is priced similar to the sedan (Starting at 29K), there will be a lot of people cross-shopping the RX-8 with it. Both cars will offer simlar performance and room for 4, with coupe styling at roughly the same price. The RX-8 might have more room in the rear seats and be more nimble, while the G35 coupe will be a bit softer and more luxurious.

My choice is still the RX-8 over the G35 Coupe, but I have yet to drive either (along with everyone else here). It's fun speculating though.

TheLaw

Don't compare the G35 coupe to the G35 sedan. The coupe uses the FM platform that the new 350z uses as well. The G35 sedan is RWD, that automatically means it performs better than FWD Acuras. FWD as far as most racers are concerned means garbage. FWD is better only on snow, and that's why we use it. F1 cars, NASCAR, CART, IRL are all RWD cars.

Will the G35 coupe be better than the RX-8. Well one thing is for sure, it will have more horsepower, probably around 285 hp...

rx-8_or?

red_base 95:
Very nice points there.

As for backseat space... I actually think G35 Coupe might more haf room because it has the same wheelbase as the sedan.

Is G35 coupe a Rx-8 KILLER: I wouldn't say so. With approx 280hp & 260trq I'd say Coupe would be a little faster than a Rx-8 in a straightway but IMO Rx-8 has a more aggressive look PLUS it's got a YELLOW exterior!!

BOTH great cars And I'm sure being an owner in any of the 2 will be happy :p

RXRX

I would never buy a car with automatic...(saying that you couldn't sell cars) i would rather have a new bmw m3 then a 911 if it was auto..because where is the fun it that...

rx-8_or?

Did u mean to say u wouldn't even consider G35 Coupe because it is automatic???(since this thread is comparing G35 Coupe to Rx-8) .
You should read the post made by red_base above, the G35 Coupe WILL come in with 6-speed manual as soon as it comes out in late September and you can expect G35 sedan to have 6-speed manual mode in 2003 as well.

Immi

How much hp does the G35 coupe have?

If it has hp in the range of 260 to 280 wouldnt that be direct competition to the 350z??!?!

KayakDaddy

If I'm not mistaken, the G35 sedan has 245 HP and the G35 coupe will have 260 HP. I'm miffed that they aren't giving the sedan as much HP as the coupe, since I'd be more interested in the sedan. As I've said in other posts, the RX-8 is the only car I'd consider that doesn't have four real doors.

I do agree with Immi and others who think that the G35 coupe may steal a few sales from the 350Z, but since the money is all going into the same pockets, Nissan may not care. I know I would get the G35 before the Z, in fact, I wouldn't even consider a Z. I'm guessing there are lots of others out there who need the flexiblity afforded by a back seat. I'm pretty much sold on a RX-8 anyway so I'm not too concerned what Nissan does. I'm just hoping a loaded RX-8 will stay under $30K. That's my self-imposed ceiling.

RXRX

I know its automatic..i was just saying that is why i wouldn't buy that car..but when the 6-speed comes out i would consider it.

Fred Bird Jr.

No oddball looking Saturn suicide doors on the G35 Coupe=no contest. The G35 is one clean looking machine while the Mazda just stands there and looks dump and confused!

RXRX

IF thats what you think..why are you in this forum?

KayakDaddy

Actually Fred Bird, I would consider the styling of the G35 to be a big negative, especially when compared to the RX-8. I don't like the headlight treatment at all. That goes for the sedan, coupe, and 350Z, those headlights that just drool up from the bumper to the hood like that just don't do it for me. I do like the rounded edges on the rest of the car, it looks like Infinity and Nissan are trying to take a page out of Audi's book. They just need to clean up what they are doing from the front wheels forward.

1.3 liter

I have looked at the G35 driven it, sat in it just to absorb it's interior, and I think that it's a nice car, the quality of materials, the leathers, the wood(optional in my tester) was excellent. I think the exterior is beautiful and the handling is great. Compared to the Acura, the Infinity is much more exciting and pleasing to look at. If we want to talk about funky interiors, let's discuss the Cadillac CTS. But someone might love it. It's all about opinions people. Oh I forgot this is an RX-8 forum. So let's get back to it shall we? As compared to those cars, the RX-8 will be more athletic. We have to remember though that the RX-8 is still a sportscar that can seat 4 adults comfortably while the Acura, Infiniti, so forth are sports sedans. If history serves me well, Mazda engineers will make the RX-8 a classy car inside and out, and it's overall styling will again be ahead of it's time.....case in point the '93-'95 FD. Nuff said for now:D

natev

Ok, ok, before you flame me.....I was the first person in New England (supposedly) on the list for RX-8....I have since changed my mind but I must say that quite a few of you kids in here are mis-informed.

The 2003 Infiniti G35 COUPE Sport will have: 287 HP and 275ft/lbs of torque. Add to this a "proven" quality engine - I was apprehensive about a "first year" enine in the Renesis.

I am still a fan of the RX-8 (love the doors) and interior and some of the exterior - it's just that in my opinion, the G35 is much better looking and will definitely be faster.....

Where is the torque in the RX?? Last time I saw it was around 165ft/lbs?? What the hell is that about?? When I step on the gas I want to "feeeeeel" something.....HP ratings for the RX are cool - around 250...and I bet it will weigh a tad less (like a 100 or 200lbs)....The G35 Sedan is a completely different animal than thye Coupe....just consider the Coupe a more luxurious 350z with better service (free loaners)....the Sedan has about 260 HP and 260 Ft/lbs and is due for 6 speed in Feb 2003.....very respectable....but my guess is that the Coupe will be running about 5.5 - 5.6secs in 0-60....the RX-8 will be around 5.9-6.0 (per initial tests).....also, the Coupe shares the exact same suspension with the 350z so it will handle quite well......as well as Brembo brakes std on the 6 speed Sport model which I have pre-ordered.......All in all, both very nice "Sports" cars.....I would thoroughly enjoy either but have opted for the G35 Coupe...

I currently drive a 2000 MAZDA Millenia S Mill. Ed. which I enjoy...so yes, Infifniti made me a convert....you can't knock the lines of the Coupe...it's gorgeous!!...but then so is the RX......flip a coin!!

ps.. Whatever idiot compared the Acura TL to the G35 is sorely mistaken or on some pretty damn good drugs....ah hello!!...you can't even come close to comparing RWD vs FWD.....read up laddy!!!

rx-8_or?

That is so true, natev.
I'm also torn btwn G35 Coupe and RX-8... both WONDERFUL cars.

Nice summary of the Coupe btw

rx-8_or?

Loaded Rx-8 under $30k??? THe dealer I went to told me approx $48k CDN for base rx-8. And Canada Usually sells the same car for a cheaper pirce, ex. track model Z selling for $36k in States where the same one sells for $31k(converted) in Canada. Perhaps my dealer doesn't have a clue what he's talking about...

With a loaded Rx-8 for under $30k it's definitely worth to buy.

wakeech

hey, don't go bad mouthing the rotary!! and ESPECIALLY don't go saying stuff like that about torque, etc., 'cause i'm thinking Rich doesn't want to go through that again (for like a thrid or fourth time...)... go back to earlier posts, and DRIVE an old RX-7... no muscle car, but you'll feel something, trust me...

KayakDaddy

rx-8_or?, I'm not familiar with the conversion between cdn and the US dollar, what does $48K=?

At any rate, I think the only thing we can get from dealers right now is educated guesses. The magazine guys haven't been able to pin down an accurate price yet either. We'll just have to wait and see what they list at when they are finally released.

My expectation of getting a loaded one for around $30,000 stems from two things. First, I've promised myself that I'd never have another car payment, and I'd like to stick to that. I'll paraphrase a quote I once heard, "There are two types of people, those who understand interest and earn it, and those who don't and pay it." I thinking I'd like to get one for around $30K because I don't think I will be able to allocate much more than that before I'll be ready to get one. It's not too bad now, because no one else has one either, but after I start seeing them on the road, it's going to be real hard not to have one already.

The other thing in my favor is that I'm eligible for Ford and Mazda's X-plan pricing, because I work for a major automotive supplier. That can make a major difference in what I end up paying. Because we supply most manufactures, I can get discounts on about half of the new cars on the market, and I doubt I'd ever buy a new car now that I couldn't get the discount on.

Rich

Kayakdaddy, I would be really surprised if the RX-8 was eligible for Mazda's S-plan (They don't have X-plan, that's Ford's). I just bought a Miata for S-plan pricing, and "in demand" models aren't eligible. Also, Mazda seems to have a separate S-plan price for each car. Even if they do offer S-plan on the RX-8, it might just be MSRP if the dealers are gouging. Just a thought, I don't have any special insight other than having researched it through the same channels everyone who's eligible has at their disposal. If you know more than me, I wouldn't be at all surprised.

natev, check out this link if you think the RX-8 doesn't have enough torque.

As for the G35 Coupe, I doubt there are many enthusiasts here that aren't at least a bit interested in that car. It seems to offer great performance and luxury for a very reasonable price. I certainly wouldn't disagree with anyone that decided to get one over the RX-8. I think the performance difference will fall decidedly in the RX-8's favor, and the luxury attributes in the Infiniti's favor. The Infiniti is expected to weight about 400 lbs. more than the RX-8 (3386 lbs. vs. 2970 lbs (see R&T April 2002)), which will hurt both its straight line acceleration as well as its handling and feel. There are lots of rumors that the RX-8 has been on a severe diet since the R&T article, so I wouldn't be very surprised to see that advatage grow to 500 lbs. for the RX-8. Even at 400 lbs., the lighter weight and gearing advantages that the RX-8 will have should keep it at least as fast as the Infiniti, and very close to the 350Z as well.

Beatuy is, as we all know, in the eye of the beholder. Some prefer the Z, some the 8, some the G35, some the Aztec (!) or Ford Explosions. I won't get into that debate, other than to say get the one you like, and don't bother trying to convince others that your car is better looking than theirs. It'll just take away from your time to enjoy driving the car, and annoy everyone within earshot.

Fred Bird Jr.

I discovered it while reading an edition of Autoweek and since I love cars I decided to check it out. I admit, I really am disappointed with Mazda's decision to produce the RX-8 especially since when I first heard about it I was thinking it was going to be a replacement for the RX-7 but than again I do remember the old RX-2 and RX-3 too and they certainly weren't sports cars either.

rx-8_or?

Rich I'm not trying to argue with you but I've ran some calculations between G35 Coupe & Rx-8 and I don't understand how Rx-8 will beat the Coupe in straight line acceleration.

Stats for Coupe:
approx 282 hp & 275trq
weight for the sedan 3386lbs(Coupe will be lighter)

Stats for Rx-8:
250hp & 162trq(from what I know so far)
2970lbs(so far)

From calculation Rx-8 weighs 87.7% of G35 sedan
But Rx-8 has 58.9% of torque and 88.7% of HP relative to G35 Coupe

And YES I understand the gearing advantages that Rx-8 holds over G35 Coupe.

In theory shouldn't the Coupe be faster in straightline because it weighs 14% heavier than Rx-8 but has 70% more torque?

Is there anyone who can show me why Rx-8 would be faster?

rx-8_or?

KayakDaddy: $48k CDN is approx $31,500 US dollar

I was thinking in Canada we can get the same track model Z for $31k relative to $36k in the states... Thus if you *can* get a loaded Rx-8 for under $30k then perhaps we can get it for less than $28k here in Canada, which would be too good 2 b true!

Immi

blah blah blah.. the G35 is an Altima with leather seats.

Rich

Here's the short answer. That 70% figure is comparing engine torque, not torque at the rear wheels. Even though you say you understand it, you're completely ignoring gearing. Taking into account gearing, it's simple to get the torque *at the rear wheels* to match almost identically. The torque times the RPM at which it's achieved gives the Infiniti a 2.7% advantage over the RX-8, while the RX-8 weighs 11% less. Similar torque *at the rear wheels*, and significantly less weight mean faster in a straight line. Peak torque values don't matter, it's torque at the wheels that counts! Unless you're into racing paper tigers...

Now, there are those that don't understand torque vs. RPM, so they don't understand why Torque * RPM matters. I will simply ask them to follow the links I alredy provided. To those that do understand, yes, I know I made some false assumptions. I assumed that the torque curves were shaped identically, which they're not. However, I think this may give the RX-8 an additional advantage! The engine is supposed to have 90% of its peak torque available from 3250, which means that it's got more area under the curve (remember back to calculus? It applies here!). I don't know over what RPM range the Infiniti produces 90% of its peak torque, but I'd be a bit surprised if it had 90% available over 2/3 of the RPM range. It's possible though, and would change the comparison. Anyway, that's the short answer to your question. We're not racing these cars on an engine dyno. If you compare the torque that makes it to the wheels, the advantage disappears completely for the Infiniti.


Sorry this is so long, but you can stop here if you want. The rest is just a bit of a rant.
There is no way to know right now which will be faster in a straight line. I'm not going to argue that the RX-8 will be faster in a straight line than the G35 Coupe. First of all, it's simply impossible to know at this point. Second, I really couldn't care less. I have absolutely no interest in racing cars on paper. I love *driving* cars, not talking about stats. I deal with numbers all day at work, and would rather hit the twisties during my time off. I chose my cars based upon how they drive, not based upon which gives me more numbers to use as ammunition in the message board community. Third, I never go drag racing, and I never street race anyone. I'm going to autoX, where the driver is the difference, not the car (strange concept, huh? You should try it some time). So I won't argue why the RX-8 will be faster (yes, I could say a whole lot more), but I think the above shows why they should be close. Until someone *drives* the cars, it's a pointless argument. Right now that argument falls in the RX-8's lap *on paper*, but who really cares?

Other thoughts, this time on the stats that you used. I wanted to leave these 'til the end so that I could get the discussion out of the way first.

First, you're correct that I had the Sedan's weight at 3386. Sorry about that, it was a mistake. However, this article claims that the Coupe will weigh more than the sedan, possibly due to the extra width. It's supposed to be 3416 lbs. according to that report, which was updated just 3 days ago. However, I'll be the first to admit that I don't know the exact weight, and I don't know how it was measured. Let's give it the benefit of the doubt (by over 100 lbs.!) and say it will weight 3300 lbs.
I don't know where you got the 282 HP and 275 lb. feet of torque stats from, but I can only find 280 HP @ 6000 RPM and 260 @ 4800 RPM for torque. The above link is one of the many places that I found those figures.

So we've got:
G35 Coupe
weight - 3300 lbs.
Torque - 260 lb. feet @ 4800
HP - 280 HP @ 6000

RX-8
weight - 2970 lbs.
Torque - 162 lb. feet @ 7500
HP - 250 @ 8500

Those are the numbers I used at the top.
*edited for spelling*

ZoomZoom

Good post Rich! You made it understandable to us non-number crunchers.

BlueAdept

That G35 thing looks ordinary.... the RX-8 looks great by comparison... I'd have the RX-8 on those grounds alone... but with the rotary engine and good performance, handling and the doors etc.. it's a sure fire winner.