rumatt

Hi Folks. First post here. This is a serious question, so no troll comments please...

I'm curious about who takes the biggest financial hit from this whole engine fiasco. By downgrading the specs on the engine, this will

a) the total number of sales will decline, and
b) those who do buy might expect to pay slightly less.

Obviously, a) affects Mazda, but it also affects the dealers. However, b) affects the dealers only (assuming the invoice price stayed the same). Or did Mazda offer incentives to the dealers?

I'm wondering if this created any tension between Mazda and the dealerships. As annoyed as the RX-8 owners were to hear the news, I'm sure the dealership owners were even less happy.

bobclevenger

Do you actually think that anyone who was serious about buying an RX8 backed out on the deal over 9 lousy horsepower? The number of sales lost must be minuscule. Mazda, however, stood to take a small loss due to the buy-back offer.

rumatt

If people who already bought them are going to return them, I think it's safe to assume that it someone was on the edge, it might change their mind.

But my bigger quesiton was that IF people expect to pay less, then I guess this comes straight out of dealers pockets. Seems like a bummer for the dealers, unless there is a holdback or the invoice is lowered slightly.

And yes, it's only 9 HP.. but if there were two versions of a car that were identical, but one had 9HP less, would you expect to pay exactly the same? In BMW land, folks pay 5K to upgrade 40 HP from the 325i to the 330i.

Does anyone know if the average "deal" on an RX-8 dropped when the news was released?

shift_zoom8

Rumatt makes a valid point. I've wondered about this, too.

In the least, sales right after the buy-back announcement must have gone down. Human memory and attention are short, and I would not expect the psychological damage to last more than a handful of months.

Here in southern California, prices have definitely gone down and dealers have a bunch on their lots. Do you hear regularly of people buying the 350Z at invoice or $500 over invoice right now, which is one year after the Z first came out?

The 350Z and the G35 were and still are selling hot. No one expected the RX8 to approach those sales, but I hoped it would stay as close as possible. I'm worried that the RX8 buy-back fallout will affect the likelihood and number of near-future rotary products like an RX7, a turbo RX7, and a convertible.

I agree that the dealerships would press the manufacturer for some insurance, maybe in the form of a dealer rebate (unknown to the consumer) or- I don't even know if they do this- an increased holdback or a holdback that decreased more slowly.

The psychology you mention about the BMW's is totally valid but probably is tailor-made FOR THAT CAR. I think there's a quickly decreasing psychological effect when the HP is much lower than 20 like the 9 HP drop for the RX8. In addition, Mazda has claimed there is no difference in 0-60 times. This "reverse qualification" might appease some people but not all.

Pretty interesting topic.

Chuck Clifford

Sales actually went up after the anouncement of the buyback. There was a week and a half before the deadline, and many people who were on the fence, bought to get the cash back and the free scheduled maintenance. So not all is as it appears.

In Northwest Florida, there are many cars on our dealers lot each week, but they are always different ones. We stop and look at each new batch, to see what options each one has. Our dealer says that the car is still selling itself for MSRP. No presure, test drive it and take it or leave it.

Elara

The reason there are so many on the lots is because Mazda has a ton of them out there. There were twice as many RX-8s sent for sale from Mazda last month as there were 350Zs, so it stands to reason there are going to be more of them and more discounts. Any flack from the hp thing has long past (that was AUGUST, this is now the end of NOVEMBER), and sales are now starting to rise.

rx8ntexas

My dealer was VERY happy to be able to sell me a 2nd Rx-8 after I did the buyback...the buyback did not affect the dealer so they were able to sell me another car....i'm still amazed that some people met resistance from their dealer on this....I mean if I was a sales person I'd been calling every person that I knew had an 8 and try to work deals with them.

DRx

Can someoine post a little more info on the buyback or downgrade? This is the first I have heard about it... Is there an actual news bulletin to review other than a post someone put here? Like on CNN?

shift_zoom8

Interesting. Here in southern California, I know of a few dealerships (I visited around 10 before buying my car) that STILL have many of the same cars as back in the middle of October. I bought mine at the end of October and I have passed only three other RX8's on the road since that time.

shift_zoom8

That may be true, Elara, but the question remains: Where are all those cars in southern California. I drive all over Riverside, Los Angeles, and Orange County on a daily basis. I don't see them on the road. Does that mean they're on the dealership lots? I think this is the case, at least where I live.

Ike

Do an internet search, just about every major news and automotive news source had some blurb or article about it.
Though you would probably find the best info by doing a search on this site.

-=Zeqs=-

Too many RX-8 owners too bitchy to drive them around, affraid the showroom clean will get dirtied :p

Anyhow...my gf and I got ours last week...apparently someone in my company already had a black one from a week or two prior. Imagine pulling up to a movie theatre and seeing two RX-8's parked next to one another :D

Two weeks prior to us getting ours, the dealership had sold another one, a blue one. The owner had to wait because they ordered it. They waited two months for it.

bobclevenger

Well, many people here in Calif. waited until the Car Tax increase was rescinded. Let's see if sales improve now that it has been done. Also there seem to be a lot of 8s of some colours but not others and not too many with the nav system but not the "appearance package" and "rotary accent package" which add about a grand to the price and won't be removed by the dealer. I looked for a Nordic Green GT with black/chaparral, nav, cd changer, and spoiler (nothing else except perhaps the spare tire kit) all over Calif. and Nev. (on the net) and only found ONE, and it was not actually in the country yet. I ended up getting a tit grey with nav and had the dealer add the changer and spoiler. Worked well for me, as I love the colour.

shift_zoom8

I just saw a new RX8 from Riverside Mazda (either titanium or silver, no spoiler, no appearance package, no accents) last night on my way to the UCR area on the 60. An asian kid with a baseball hat was trailing a guy in a silver RSX Type-S. The kid quickly pulled up behind the RSX and BARELY made a lane change in his RX8 between a big rig (in front of him) and another car (to his left).

It looked pretty incredible like from the Fast and the Furious but was still dangerous. Traffic then came up and I was able to get a better look. He's got some device on his windshield/center console with blue LED lights. He never even looked at me once (I was driving my other car) as we passed each other repeatedly at low speed in the undulating traffic. His eyes were transfixed on the RSX in front of him, as he kept revving and doing momentary quick starts in traffic. Pointless. The kid did not look human.

It was clear to me the kid was in that zone, in his own virtual reality world of survival of the fittest. I wish I could offer him a plane ticket to Africa where he can get into that zone with the lions and hyenas and mountain gorillas. One thing I know for sure is that baseball cap would be totally destroyed so I would have suggested to him in advance that he tape it to his noggin.

MrWigggles

Because it is an abuse of the policy.

Someone does have to pay for the process. It isn't free money.

-Mr. Wigggles

-=Zeqs=-

How much do you think the child's parents paid for his car?

O.R.A.

Yeah, Mazda pays as they should since it was their "mistake".

I don't see why a dealer would have a problem with someone who basically "sold" their car to Mazda, decided to buy another one. The dealer sell two cars!

shift_zoom8

I don't see any abuse there at all. Virtually every business should then shut down for EVERYDAY abuses to customers and their own employees more egregious than that.

shift_zoom8

They probably paid MSRP plus $2000 add-on sticker. In CASH. That blue LED device seems attached to the windshield. In a few months they'll probably spend the money necessary to attach it to his baseball cap. I'm certain this kid is going to eventually deck out his RX8 to the nines. Probably a rear tail the size of an Evo's, 10 12-inch subwoofers, and cartoon characters all over the f***ing place.

I can just see a silverback male pummeling his already limp body and hat with electronic device. Poor hat.

oosik

The dealer will never lose money on a sale, if anything Mazda corp. would take the hit.