1.3L

I keep the clutch depressed and the transmission in 1st gear for two reasons. One, I have a better chance of moving out of some moron's way if they're about to hit me and second, I'm ready to go when the light changes. I find it annoying when the idiot in front of me won't put his car in gear until after the light turns green.

1.3L

Highway8

iTrader: (11)

Pros and cons of leaving the car in gear and clutch in at a light: It comes down to risk vs gain. I am not saying I am right, but I am trying really hard to be objective here. Feel free to come up with your own logical pros and cons. FYI, because its a habbit or my friends dads, buddy was a racer and he does it this way is not a logical reason.

Pro:
1- Easier to speed away if someone is about to rear end you.
Rebuttal- 1-You better hope that intersection is clear first, and in the time it takes to check left, right and make a good choice, you could have put the car in gear. 2-How do you know the car is going to hit you anyways? They could swerve or actualy get stopped. 3-Rear end collisions are far less dangerous then being broadsided.

2: If your rear ended you want the engine to help keep the car from being pushed into the intersection.
Rebuttal: 1-Having your foot on the brake will provide more then enough brake torgue to lock up the tires. The engine wont even be a factor, tire grip will be the weak link. 2-It is more likely scenario that while stopped at the light and grabbing something from the back seat that your foot will slip off the clutch and you will stall the engine or if your not on the brake, you could rabbit hop into the intersection and get broadsided.

3: You want to be ready to take off when the light turns grean.
Rebuttal: So pay attention to the lights and put the car in gear when your turn is coming. Even if you wait until your light is green, it take a whole .5 seconds to put the car in gear.

4: I dont like keeping my foot on the brake, so I slip to clutch to keep from rolling backwards.
Rebuttal: 1-Letting your foot off the brake before you are ready to accelerate can cause the person behind you to think its time to go and they might rearend you. (I have been on both sides of that one) 2-Good way to add extra wear and tear on both the clutch and the throwout bearing. Exception- when on a very step hill like in San Francisco, I have done this for about 3 seconds before the light turned green.

5: Personal preference.
Rebuttal: NONE, its your car and you can do what you want. But if you rabbit hop into the intersection and hit a pedestrian or get broadsided, dont come on hear and complain. And when your throwout bearing is shot and your clutch is smoked, dont blame the machine, its operator error.

6: I play soccer and I want to build the strength in my left leg by holding in the clutch.
Rebuttal: You have me there, I hope your dreams of playing in the world cup come true. Go USA.

7: My family owns a clutch shop or clutch company and I want to increase business.
Rebuttal: Again I got nothing, economic times are tough, do what you have to do.

8: In some states its the law that you must keep the car in gear when stopped at an intersection:
Rebuttal: I can find no such law. Some states talk about keeping the vehicle in gear when parked but thats it. If you cna find the law, I will eat my words on this one.


Cons:
1- Extra wear and tear on the throwout bearing and the clutch bracket (our stock clutch bracket is already a weak link.
2- No good reason to do it.

jasonrxeight

on a hill use the handbrake.

Highway8

iTrader: (11)

I do that too.

2tone

iTrader: (3)

thank you...this is a dumb reason to me too. if you think having the car stall out in gear will help prevent you from sliding too far forward and hitting the car in front of you...if you get hit that hard, and that is your biggest concern...you have other problems. and, it won't do anything the brakes/tires can't do alone.

thank you, again. i don't know how slowly some of you put the car in first gear and start driving, but, uh, it doesn't take that long. i don't get how that would be a concern.

milkis

gear out & rest my foot on pedal (depressed only 1/5 way down) because the chirping noise is just driving me nuts.

humanwire

For those who are stopped in gear at a red light in order to "take off quickly if you're about to get rear-ended", where exactly are you going? Into the middle of the intersection into moving traffic? Into another lane?

Just curious.

1.3L

You fail to recognize that sometimes moving only a short distance can prevent a rear-end collision. Three feet could make a difference, as could 6 inches. Think about it. Neither move would be into an intersection. Right?

1.3L

ken-x8

If you keep an eye on your rear view mirror, there's plenty of time to put it back in gear and move forward. Been there, done that.

Ken

8upbad

iTrader: (3)

Has anyone brought up the fact that our clutch pedals love to snap off? Thats why I don't hold it down at lights. Also, I saw on a tech show for Mustangs that if you sit in gear it can tear up some tranny parts. Maybe it has nothing to do with us but it's always stuck in my mind. I don't think it really makes a difference though.

Mcdiddy1

Parked I always use ebrake and car is left in 4th gear. Period. Incline or not.

If at a light, I watch for traffic behind me. If 2-3 cars are stacked up behind me and it's a long light, sure I'll throw in neutral and take a short break. Yes I pay attention to all other lights to anticipate when it will be my turn to go, which I will be back in gear seconds before my light turns green. Otherwise, while sitting in traffic, always in gear. It's become habit from years of motorcycle riding. You always want to have a quick escape if need be.

@!!narotordo

I don't like to sit at the lights with the weight of my foot on the clutch. The clutch pedal is weak and they tend to snap off. By not holding it down I think I can by it more time.

Fencig

For the "clutch snapping off" worries...there is more force put on the peddle during the action of pressing it in than in holding it in. This is due to the needed pressure to offset the counter force of springs and flywheel. So it would seem to me that the double clutching at lights would actually cause more wear on the peddle arm than putting it to the floor and leaving it there.

However…how many of the rx-8s out there have really had this problem? I used to work in quality assurance in a manufacturing plant and know that a small portion of bad parts can make a huge impact on perceived quality and reliability.


Personally I’ve always left all my vehicles in gear and even held my car in place on a hill using the clutch. I’ve never ever had to replace any clutch or tranny parts. My ’91 escort just hit 200K miles (all my driving) and I’ll bet the clutch and tranny in that is of lower quality than the 8 and it still shifts smooth as silk.

jasonrxeight

I think some people press their clutch pedals sideways rather than up and down thats causing the problem
RX8 clutch pedal isnt the strongest I gotta say, it wobbles left and right just using your hand.

DocBeech

iTrader: (1)

easy fix for that just get the reinforcement bracket, and while your at it, get the axial flow one for the brake booster as well. might as well knock it out while your at it right...

Fencig

I agree, it may actually be a combination of user and engineering error. One of the things I noticed in my decade of working quality assurance is that one or two bad reports can make for a whole string of “this is junk” comments. Add that with putting too much play in the lateral motion of something that would allow for greater wear is asking for trouble. I do wonder however, how many real instances of clutch arms or brackets breaking have happened? I’m guessing it’s far less than what people think.

On the subject of leaving it gear or out at a light…lets hear from those that got an “A” in driver’s ed during the ‘70s (aka before drivers ed was done in auto’s). Did you drop it out of gear at a light with your instructor in the car? If yes and you got scolded, why? Granted I learned in the early ‘80s (as far as drivers ed) so I was “schooled” in an automatic. However I was taught in a manual van 2 years before going to any drivers ed class. I remember very well one of my first lessons (in about ’82) where my dad parked me on a hill, put me in the seat, marked a line behind the tire and told me to hold the van in place than move up the hill without rolling back using the ebrake and clutch…no center peddle. I’ve been doing that ever since. Oh and that van is still on the road to this day.

Learn what you can and can not do in a manual…don’t just ask people who drive auto’s if it’s “ok”.

mesaboogie

iTrader: (1)

I leave my car in neutral at lights. And I have the habit of coasting in neutral a lot when i know i have to stop ahead.

When i park i first put it in neutral, pull the hand brake, release the brake pedal to make sure the hand brake is holding the car, then i put it in reverse since reverse is a non synchro gear (friction materials, like brass, in synchronizers are more prone to wear and breakage than gears). This way i know the car is mainly resting on the hand brake thus minimizing the stress on the transmission.

Pendleton

iTrader: (1)

Enough to catch NHSTA's attention, although not enough for them to actually do anything about it.

Pendleton

iTrader: (1)

Just curious here, for all you "leave it in gear types", do you also leave it in gear when sitting at the drive thru? I can imagine some pretty messy consequences if you slip off the clutch when they're handing you your drink.

ken-x8

The clutch bracket problem did not catch NHTSA's attention. What caught their attention was pressure from a few RX-8 owners with broken brackets.

Ken

DeViLbOi

iTrader: (1)

ken-x8 - I think it was you that originally brought up the point about the throwout bearing wear and tear by leaving the clutch engaged. Wouldn't the reverse apply to taking it out of gear with the extra wear and tear on the clutch? You are basically doubling the usage of the clutch disc...I think...which makes the "savings" to the throwout bearing a wash...right?

Highway8

iTrader: (11)

No. There is vertualy no wear on the clutch disc when the car is in neutral.

The wear to the throwout bearing is caused because when you press in on the clutch, the clutch fork presses against the throwout bearing to seperate the clutch pressure plate from the clutch disc.

DeViLbOi

iTrader: (1)

Right...get that part...but when you engage the clutch to take the car out of gear and engage the clutch to put it back in gear there is wear on the clutch disc.

Highway8

iTrader: (11)

FYI engage clutch = release clutch pedal, disengage clutch = press in on the clutch pedal. If I am understanding you correctly you have them reversed.

The wear to the clutch disc will be the same amount of wear as if you left it in gear with your foot in on the clutch. The wear is only when the transmission is in gear and you release the clutch pedal (engage the clutch). There is vertualy no wear to the clutch disc when you disengage the clutch unless you disengage while under a heavy load/high rpm, which would cause some slipage of the clutch and even then it would be minor.

I really dont care if people choose to keep the car in gear while at a stop light. I just dont like all the bad excuses for why they do it.

My reasons for keeping the car in neutral clutch pedal released while at a stop light has nothing to do with wear and tear on the clutch system, it would be minor. My main reason is that I dont feel like keeping the clutch pressed in, there is no reason to do it. It wont help avoid an accident or keep you from getting pushed forward if rear ended and it wont reduce wear and tear on the car (cause wear and tear of anything). It's pointless and a waste of energy.

DeViLbOi

iTrader: (1)

Oopsie...

Right...but by leaving the car in neutral at a light you are basically engaging the clutch twice as often. This puts twice as much wear on the clutch disc...yes? Or are you saying that since the first time you engage the clutch you are returning to neutral so there is no wear so it is equal.