Hey guys new RX8 owner needing some help!?!?
08-02-2014, 06:48 PM
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Hey guys new RX8 owner needing some help!?!?
Hey guys my name is Eric, 23yrs old and just bought my first RX8! I was able to scoop the car up for 2500 with a decent body, paint and interior. Its a clean car but the only down side is it's not running. Here's a pic, More to come!
After talking to the previous owner I was told that the car started and ran but after a few minutes it would start spitting out white smoke out of the exhaust. So he took the engine down and opened it up but wasn't willing to put in the work/money. (hence why I got it cheap). I got the engine with the car and it looks like the usually wear and tear for the most but the edges of the rotor housing look like the chrome was chipping and the rear iron has a small dip. I'm new to rotary engines and want to learn. Figure building this engine back to factory spec would be a good place to start.
Ill be posting pics tomorrow but my question is as follows:
Where can I find a rear iron? I've tried google, ebay and CL with no luck.
Where could I get some decent rotor housings? I don't mind using remans.
Also if all else fails or proves to be too much where can I get a cheap short block?
I'll be posting up pics of the housings and rear iron tomorrow just to get your opinions on whether to scrap them or take them to a machine shop.
After talking to the previous owner I was told that the car started and ran but after a few minutes it would start spitting out white smoke out of the exhaust. So he took the engine down and opened it up but wasn't willing to put in the work/money. (hence why I got it cheap). I got the engine with the car and it looks like the usually wear and tear for the most but the edges of the rotor housing look like the chrome was chipping and the rear iron has a small dip. I'm new to rotary engines and want to learn. Figure building this engine back to factory spec would be a good place to start.
Ill be posting pics tomorrow but my question is as follows:
Where can I find a rear iron? I've tried google, ebay and CL with no luck.
Where could I get some decent rotor housings? I don't mind using remans.
Also if all else fails or proves to be too much where can I get a cheap short block?
I'll be posting up pics of the housings and rear iron tomorrow just to get your opinions on whether to scrap them or take them to a machine shop.
Last edited by Eric_RX; 08-02-2014 at 06:51 PM.
08-02-2014, 06:55 PM
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You don't mention the transmission, year, mileage, or engine type.
But chances are the entire engine is junk if it was blowing white smoke. Even the parts that don't appear to have noticeable damage very well may be warped or have out-of-spec measurements on one or more dimensions/wear-marks. White smoke means coolant seals, and that usually means additional corrosion and/or warping of the engine components, even if slight.
Buying a new reman is going to be cheaper than buying all the parts individually, buy how much is doing to depend on the information you left out.
Used parts are not commonly available, since they are usually immediately reused in an engine that is being rebuilt if they are within spec. Engines that can't be rebuild are either entirely junk already or are returned as a core to the place that the replacement engine was purchased from.
But chances are the entire engine is junk if it was blowing white smoke. Even the parts that don't appear to have noticeable damage very well may be warped or have out-of-spec measurements on one or more dimensions/wear-marks. White smoke means coolant seals, and that usually means additional corrosion and/or warping of the engine components, even if slight.
Buying a new reman is going to be cheaper than buying all the parts individually, buy how much is doing to depend on the information you left out.
Used parts are not commonly available, since they are usually immediately reused in an engine that is being rebuilt if they are within spec. Engines that can't be rebuild are either entirely junk already or are returned as a core to the place that the replacement engine was purchased from.
08-02-2014, 07:07 PM
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You don't mention the transmission, year, mileage, or engine type.
But chances are the entire engine is junk if it was blowing white smoke. Even the parts that don't appear to have noticeable damage very well may be warped or have out-of-spec measurements on one or more dimensions/wear-marks. White smoke means coolant seals, and that usually means additional corrosion and/or warping of the engine components, even if slight.
Buying a new reman is going to be cheaper than buying all the parts individually, buy how much is doing to depend on the information you left out.
Used parts are not commonly available, since they are usually immediately reused in an engine that is being rebuilt if they are within spec. Engines that can't be rebuild are either entirely junk already or are returned as a core to the place that the replacement engine was purchased from.
But chances are the entire engine is junk if it was blowing white smoke. Even the parts that don't appear to have noticeable damage very well may be warped or have out-of-spec measurements on one or more dimensions/wear-marks. White smoke means coolant seals, and that usually means additional corrosion and/or warping of the engine components, even if slight.
Buying a new reman is going to be cheaper than buying all the parts individually, buy how much is doing to depend on the information you left out.
Used parts are not commonly available, since they are usually immediately reused in an engine that is being rebuilt if they are within spec. Engines that can't be rebuild are either entirely junk already or are returned as a core to the place that the replacement engine was purchased from.
HAHA sorry about that it is a 2006, MT, 6 port I believe with 72k on the meter. I looked at new rotor housings and at 800 a pop I should be able to find a short block right?
08-02-2014, 07:52 PM
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Yeah, it's possible you could have gotten a free engine under the 8yr 100,000 mile warranty, but that's out the window because the engine is out and disassembled. It depends on when the car was first sold, but if it was sold in August 2006 or later, then you were still eligible. Oh well.
You can get a fresh reman from Mazmart for $3,300 + sending them the old engine. You will spend $7k+ on new parts if you try to buy everything individually. Even just 2 housings ($1,600) + seal rebuild kit ($1,500) is nearly at the price of a fresh reman from Mazmart, before even getting into the worn irons, worn rotor seal seats, and worn e-shaft bearings. Mazmart's price is about the cheapest you are going to get without finding a used engine, which of course a used engine is an expensive risk.
You can get a fresh reman from Mazmart for $3,300 + sending them the old engine. You will spend $7k+ on new parts if you try to buy everything individually. Even just 2 housings ($1,600) + seal rebuild kit ($1,500) is nearly at the price of a fresh reman from Mazmart, before even getting into the worn irons, worn rotor seal seats, and worn e-shaft bearings. Mazmart's price is about the cheapest you are going to get without finding a used engine, which of course a used engine is an expensive risk.
08-02-2014, 08:26 PM
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Lol damn I was trying to keep it under 2500 but hell I rather fork out the money for a reman and have that piece of mind. I toyed with the idea of saying screw it and dropping an lq4 block in there but I can't bring myself to do it. I've wanted to own a wankel since freshman year in hs.
Also I've searched and could not get an answer but is there anything I should be aware of when driving an rx8 over long distances? I'll be moving to WA state from NC late next spring and was curious?
Also I've searched and could not get an answer but is there anything I should be aware of when driving an rx8 over long distances? I'll be moving to WA state from NC late next spring and was curious?
08-02-2014, 08:39 PM
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If you can't afford a $3,300 reman, you can't afford even the cheapest engine swap, since neither the front of the car nor the car's electronics can work with any other engine without significant rebuilding/redesigning/custom creation. Thanks to the Renesis being where no other engine can physically fit, and all of the RX-8's electronics being integrated together and 'married' with serial numbers that they look for.
As far as long distances, aside from the gas mileage, the 8 is a wonderful long distance car. Of the 113,000 miles I drove in my 8, I over 60,000 of them were on trips of 6 hours or more, including crossing the US 3 times and driving in 37 of the 48 contiguous states.
As far as long distances, aside from the gas mileage, the 8 is a wonderful long distance car. Of the 113,000 miles I drove in my 8, I over 60,000 of them were on trips of 6 hours or more, including crossing the US 3 times and driving in 37 of the 48 contiguous states.
08-02-2014, 10:00 PM
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If you can't afford a $3,300 reman, you can't afford even the cheapest engine swap, since neither the front of the car nor the car's electronics can work with any other engine without significant rebuilding/redesigning/custom creation. Thanks to the Renesis being where no other engine can physically fit, and all of the RX-8's electronics being integrated together and 'married' with serial numbers that they look for.
As far as long distances, aside from the gas mileage, the 8 is a wonderful long distance car. Of the 113,000 miles I drove in my 8, I over 60,000 of them were on trips of 6 hours or more, including crossing the US 3 times and driving in 37 of the 48 contiguous states.
As far as long distances, aside from the gas mileage, the 8 is a wonderful long distance car. Of the 113,000 miles I drove in my 8, I over 60,000 of them were on trips of 6 hours or more, including crossing the US 3 times and driving in 37 of the 48 contiguous states.
Glad to hear that its comfortable I'll be driving 3800 miles from Asheville, NC to Seattle, WA.
How bad is the gas mileage? Can't be worse then my old XJ with its wopping 15mpg.
08-02-2014, 10:04 PM
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08-03-2014, 09:40 AM
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Welcome,
All the above it good advice. I would ship the parts to Mazmart and go that way.
For mileage, I would say it will be better than your CJ definitely. get an ultra-gauge and track it real time. I get above 22 average on mine, but I do not have a lot of stop and go and have a nice, 50 mph country road for a lot of my commute. that is the sweet spot. Nothing you can do with a 4.11 gear in the back.
All the above it good advice. I would ship the parts to Mazmart and go that way.
For mileage, I would say it will be better than your CJ definitely. get an ultra-gauge and track it real time. I get above 22 average on mine, but I do not have a lot of stop and go and have a nice, 50 mph country road for a lot of my commute. that is the sweet spot. Nothing you can do with a 4.11 gear in the back.
08-03-2014, 09:46 AM
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New and Potential Owners Start here: Gas Mileage
With everything healthy on a good engine, clean sensors, healthy ignition, cruising on the highway could be entirely viable to get 22-24mpg. I've got a chart in that link with my actual recorded mileage for my 8,330 mile trip from RI to CA to OR to RI 4 years ago.
With everything healthy on a good engine, clean sensors, healthy ignition, cruising on the highway could be entirely viable to get 22-24mpg. I've got a chart in that link with my actual recorded mileage for my 8,330 mile trip from RI to CA to OR to RI 4 years ago.
08-03-2014, 11:55 AM
#12
40th anniversary Edition
Kelly Blue Book named the RX8 one of the ten best road trip cars a few years back. Once you have your new engine and all sorted out, enjoy your trip. I take my 2008 40th Anniversary Edition on long cross country road trips and it is the most comfortable sports car I have ever driven. RIWWP is correct , if you keep to the speed limit or just above, you can get 22-24 mpg on long steady trips without lots of stops. Less if you are using the a/c all the time, and less if you are hot footing it, which is certainly fun to do along the way. best to you in your engine rebuild.
08-03-2014, 06:30 PM
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Pics are in!
Alright guys after talking my doing some research and looking over the engine once again I am 90% positive that it can be rebuilt! I know I keep bouncing back and forth about a reman but hell I do plan on build a 20b in the future so I might as well build this once to get a feel for it and learn a couple things. As for mods there aren't any except a k&n airfilter and cobb accessport other then that everything will be to factory spec.
Now I took a second look at the rotors, housings, front-center-rear irons and the only thing that I could see wrong.
I looked the housings over thoroughly and I found no cracks only some chrome chipping off the sides on both housing all less then an 1/8 of an an inch so from the search I did they look safe to use.
Rotors look good I was able to side a new apex seal in and move it freely so that's a good sign. Saw no chips, heat damage or warping.
Now what does concern me are the center and rear irons. They have some light scuffing which I believe I could get off by using a bit of elbow grease and lapping the suckers but I do want to get a second opinion from those who know.
I also straight edged everything and found no warping.
Cause of failure was a bad gasket which let coolant seep into the rear housing and was left to sit as so for 3 months. It did start but would blow bits of white smoke after a couple minutes.
Now I took a second look at the rotors, housings, front-center-rear irons and the only thing that I could see wrong.
I looked the housings over thoroughly and I found no cracks only some chrome chipping off the sides on both housing all less then an 1/8 of an an inch so from the search I did they look safe to use.
Rotors look good I was able to side a new apex seal in and move it freely so that's a good sign. Saw no chips, heat damage or warping.
Now what does concern me are the center and rear irons. They have some light scuffing which I believe I could get off by using a bit of elbow grease and lapping the suckers but I do want to get a second opinion from those who know.
I also straight edged everything and found no warping.
Cause of failure was a bad gasket which let coolant seep into the rear housing and was left to sit as so for 3 months. It did start but would blow bits of white smoke after a couple minutes.
08-03-2014, 07:03 PM
#18
40th anniversary Edition
Rebuilding a rotary engine is not for the inexperienced !! The tolerances that have to be met at each step and how all the parts properly fit is not a task for the uninitiated. You do not have enough experience to know if the parts you have are really reusable even if they look good. If you want to learn how to do it properly, then find yourself a reliable rotary mechanic with experience and a good rep in rebuilding these engines and learn alongside as you pay that person to do the job properly. Many a first time rebuilder's first rotary engine has been DOA just because critical tolerances weren't met or a sub-par part was reused.
08-03-2014, 07:31 PM
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Wow way to put some one down dude...
It's NOT my first engine build, just first rotary. Yes tolerances do have to be met just like any other engine, do they differ from a conventional engine well no ****.
I agree that I am inexperienced in building these engines but is that not why we have resources like shop manuals, FORUMS and others like the instructional videos from lets say pineapple or atkins to help the inexperienced?
Seriously if your going to down someone don't even waste your time commenting.
It's NOT my first engine build, just first rotary. Yes tolerances do have to be met just like any other engine, do they differ from a conventional engine well no ****.
I agree that I am inexperienced in building these engines but is that not why we have resources like shop manuals, FORUMS and others like the instructional videos from lets say pineapple or atkins to help the inexperienced?
Seriously if your going to down someone don't even waste your time commenting.
08-03-2014, 07:32 PM
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You will need to measure all flaws with a feeler gauge or depth gauge to find out what is actually in or out of spec.
That being said, I'm pretty surprised about how clean those parts are. I assume they have already been tanked or something to clean the parts, which is a good step in the right direction, but there is a nearly complete lack of wear marks on the irons. That's something I've never seen before, though I admit it could be possible.
Usually torn down engines have irons that look more like this at best (you can see the wear marks)
Most high mileage engines look more like this:
There is so little wear on that engine, I'd suspect that the engine is pretty low mileage. Perhaps a new reman that had a all-too-uncommon cooling system failure after installation (usually from excess sealant in the reman that floats around and clogs stuff).
You will need an expert's advice (not me), but yeah, you might be able to rebuild that acceptably.
That being said, I'm pretty surprised about how clean those parts are. I assume they have already been tanked or something to clean the parts, which is a good step in the right direction, but there is a nearly complete lack of wear marks on the irons. That's something I've never seen before, though I admit it could be possible.
Usually torn down engines have irons that look more like this at best (you can see the wear marks)
Most high mileage engines look more like this:
There is so little wear on that engine, I'd suspect that the engine is pretty low mileage. Perhaps a new reman that had a all-too-uncommon cooling system failure after installation (usually from excess sealant in the reman that floats around and clogs stuff).
You will need an expert's advice (not me), but yeah, you might be able to rebuild that acceptably.
08-03-2014, 07:45 PM
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RIWWP, Yes they were tanked last night and I don't know if it was a remanufactured engine or not. Honestly there's no way to tell.
I'll have to bring a depth gauge home from work but I'll get on with measuring the imperfections sometime this week.
Do you now of an online manual where I could find the specs for the irons?
I'll have to bring a depth gauge home from work but I'll get on with measuring the imperfections sometime this week.
Do you now of an online manual where I could find the specs for the irons?
08-04-2014, 09:31 AM
#24
40th anniversary Edition
Follow RIWWPs suggestion and get an expert's advice, that was all I was saying, not putting you down, don't be so sensitive guy. Rebuilding a piston engine is NOT like rebuilding a rotary engine. I have a little experience here with 40 plus years with these rotary cars (street and track) as well as piston street and race cars. You can learn to do it with an expert's advice. That rotary expert may help you avoid any mistakes. We all just want you to be successful on your first try.
Last edited by gwilliams6; 08-04-2014 at 09:42 AM.
08-04-2014, 10:25 AM
#25
Good luck man. I, for one, am curious how this turns out. Many people have attempted shadetree rebuilds, but the success rate is not amazing.
I'll just add that please don't put a K&N intake on it, you're better off with the stock airbox. There is no power to be found there on these cars.
I'll just add that please don't put a K&N intake on it, you're better off with the stock airbox. There is no power to be found there on these cars.
