tragic accident lesson to us all
05-08-2011, 12:29 AM
#1
tragic accident lesson to us all
came across this on several forums and its worth a mention especially since a lot of us work on our own cars on this forum
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1625985
http://waterford.patch.com/articles/...#photo-5354171
http://www.luxury4play.com/automotiv...er-part-i.html
really worth the read!
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1625985
http://waterford.patch.com/articles/...#photo-5354171
http://www.luxury4play.com/automotiv...er-part-i.html
really worth the read!
05-08-2011, 03:15 AM
#5
Not trying to be picky, but I thought the same thing at first. If you read a few more of the links and articles posted, it sounds like he did use jack stands though I didn't see a clearly stated explanation for what happened.
I want to note that everyone should use jack stands if they will be under a vehicle at any point, but be aware that even jack stands have been known to fail.
Definitely an unfortunate incident and condolences towards the family. Never good to hear about instances like these.
I want to note that everyone should use jack stands if they will be under a vehicle at any point, but be aware that even jack stands have been known to fail.
Definitely an unfortunate incident and condolences towards the family. Never good to hear about instances like these.
05-08-2011, 08:20 AM
#6
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Read third post in the first link. That post is from his father............who found him.
I will say it seems as if that post was written by more than one person..........not sure.....and doesn't really matter.
Actually, I didn't think it was possible under weight that you could move the lever on a pair of jack stands, thereby having it drop.
Think I need to carefully try this out and see.
In any event, looks like several things may have played as factors(as it usually is) including the use of a creeper in this instance(for the first time) which made him higher off the floor than he was used to being and then somehow kicking or knocking the lever on the jackstand??????
Do really know if it would have done any good at all, but sometimes even though I always use jack stands, once I set those, I leave the floor jack(s) in there(maybe not in the jack location, but somewhere) and have it(them) set just an inch or so below the height of the jack stands so that in hopes of a jack stand failures or something bizarre....it would hopefully have the height or just catch the weight of the car long enough for me to do something about it. Seems like he had a tire underneath the right front rotor, but obviously that wasn't good enough or positioned right in this instance............or the use of the creeper in this instance made that null and void.
I will say it seems as if that post was written by more than one person..........not sure.....and doesn't really matter.
Actually, I didn't think it was possible under weight that you could move the lever on a pair of jack stands, thereby having it drop.
Think I need to carefully try this out and see.
In any event, looks like several things may have played as factors(as it usually is) including the use of a creeper in this instance(for the first time) which made him higher off the floor than he was used to being and then somehow kicking or knocking the lever on the jackstand??????
Do really know if it would have done any good at all, but sometimes even though I always use jack stands, once I set those, I leave the floor jack(s) in there(maybe not in the jack location, but somewhere) and have it(them) set just an inch or so below the height of the jack stands so that in hopes of a jack stand failures or something bizarre....it would hopefully have the height or just catch the weight of the car long enough for me to do something about it. Seems like he had a tire underneath the right front rotor, but obviously that wasn't good enough or positioned right in this instance............or the use of the creeper in this instance made that null and void.
Last edited by Mazurfer; 05-08-2011 at 08:34 AM.
05-08-2011, 08:50 AM
#9
Yes, lifts can fail. It's the failure rate and mode that makes them way safer than jackstands.
Modern lifts have safety blocks that will hold 3tons each too... way better than 300$ of jackstands that can fail for a thousand reasons. Uneven floor, some user error or structural failure if they're the cheap ones.
It's sorry to see a guy around my age go like this but there's a reason why mechanics don't work on jackstands in their shops. This is more food for thought i think. Working on a car is great fun but jackstands should really be used for quick repairs only or susp. adjustments that don't require your presence under the car imho.
Modern lifts have safety blocks that will hold 3tons each too... way better than 300$ of jackstands that can fail for a thousand reasons. Uneven floor, some user error or structural failure if they're the cheap ones.
It's sorry to see a guy around my age go like this but there's a reason why mechanics don't work on jackstands in their shops. This is more food for thought i think. Working on a car is great fun but jackstands should really be used for quick repairs only or susp. adjustments that don't require your presence under the car imho.
05-08-2011, 09:17 AM
#11
Wow. Sad story.
My friends always laugh at me because I don't use a creeper and I use jack stands that have pins in them and not the ratchet style. They always laugh at me because I am scared working on my Austin 1100 alone in the garage. This reminds me why I do things the way I do, and only reinforces my reasoning to using six jack stands, and never relying on a jack.
My 8 is special and always gets the two post lift at my buddies shop.
My friends always laugh at me because I don't use a creeper and I use jack stands that have pins in them and not the ratchet style. They always laugh at me because I am scared working on my Austin 1100 alone in the garage. This reminds me why I do things the way I do, and only reinforces my reasoning to using six jack stands, and never relying on a jack.
My 8 is special and always gets the two post lift at my buddies shop.
05-08-2011, 04:30 PM
#16
05-08-2011, 05:20 PM
#17
The X is silent
Safety is no joke...
I think a lot of us know someone who is missing a finger or something... My dad only has one eye... A garage can be a dangerous place - think things through, and be safe.
05-08-2011, 06:25 PM
#18
meh.
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the very first thing i do when i get a car up on jack stands is try to knock it off. if its gonna fall, its gonna fall then, while im not under it.
thoughts and prayers to the family
thoughts and prayers to the family
05-08-2011, 07:22 PM
#20
SARX Legend
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I hope people read this and learn from it.
Like Mazsurfer I always use jack stands way overrated to the cars weight and I leave the jack there as back up. If you get under a car with just a jack you are taking a huge unnecessary risk. It's possible a jack stand will fail but not two or four.
And with the 8 it will stay up on only three stands
Like Mazsurfer I always use jack stands way overrated to the cars weight and I leave the jack there as back up. If you get under a car with just a jack you are taking a huge unnecessary risk. It's possible a jack stand will fail but not two or four.
And with the 8 it will stay up on only three stands
05-08-2011, 07:57 PM
#21
RIP,, my thoughts and prayers go out to the family,
the jack stands i have are rated 3tons as well as the jack and when jacking up the car i always have something like a spare tire or block/wood that in case, at least it will not come all the way down, ramps help too.
on the other side, his father stated
"“To those of you who are ‘car guys’ out there, please invest in the more expensive jacks with backup pins rather than those sold in local retail outlets so this tragedy is never repeated again,” he wrote.""
the jack stands i have are rated 3tons as well as the jack and when jacking up the car i always have something like a spare tire or block/wood that in case, at least it will not come all the way down, ramps help too.
on the other side, his father stated
"“To those of you who are ‘car guys’ out there, please invest in the more expensive jacks with backup pins rather than those sold in local retail outlets so this tragedy is never repeated again,” he wrote.""
05-09-2011, 06:21 AM
#22
Just keep in mind that anytime you are working on a car something can go wrong. Jack stands or not accidents happen. I watched a corvette come off a lift one day and almost kill someone. The foot on the lift arm broke and vehicle came crashing down. A broken arm was the only injury that day thankfully.
05-09-2011, 07:13 AM
#23
anything can fail, it's all about the "possibility"
Jack = very high
jack stand = very low
on a lift = super duper low
Super powers = super duper ultimate low
I almost killed myself once couple years ago, was being lazy, jacked one sid and put a jack stand there, then on the other side I just left it with a jack, and when I was under there, the jack decided to slide and "BOOM the car falls off, I was looking at it too (face up), but lucky my other side has jack stand or else I probably be dead that time. (no flash back tho)
After that time, I always use jackstand, in fact I have 6 jackstand so I use all 6 at the same time ---- 4 3-ton stand to support 4 corners, then another extra 2 2-ton stand will lay around the area where I will be "working" at. Just in case **** fails/breaks the extra stand will give me enough time to gtfo.
There was another news about someone in NY got killed for the very same reason.
http://articles.nydailynews.com/2010...r-death-queens
This happened last year, very sad to see ppl go like this. *sigh*
Jack = very high
jack stand = very low
on a lift = super duper low
Super powers = super duper ultimate low
I almost killed myself once couple years ago, was being lazy, jacked one sid and put a jack stand there, then on the other side I just left it with a jack, and when I was under there, the jack decided to slide and "BOOM the car falls off, I was looking at it too (face up), but lucky my other side has jack stand or else I probably be dead that time. (no flash back tho)
After that time, I always use jackstand, in fact I have 6 jackstand so I use all 6 at the same time ---- 4 3-ton stand to support 4 corners, then another extra 2 2-ton stand will lay around the area where I will be "working" at. Just in case **** fails/breaks the extra stand will give me enough time to gtfo.
There was another news about someone in NY got killed for the very same reason.
http://articles.nydailynews.com/2010...r-death-queens
This happened last year, very sad to see ppl go like this. *sigh*
Last edited by nycgps; 05-09-2011 at 07:21 AM.
05-11-2011, 11:13 PM
#24
i do the same. i have the jack still there with a jack stand. on top of that i have a Fumoto oil drain valve, so i only have to jack up the left side, and just reach under the right side to turn the lever to drain the oil. i am rarely under the car. and usually if i do go under a car i take off a wheel, and put it under a side as well as a 3rd back up.
05-12-2011, 09:37 AM
#25
So sad. I can only imagine what that family has gone through. At least he did die doing what he loved to do and not in some sterile hospital bed with no one around him.
I never use jack stands anymore. Local "almost" failing stories and friends experiences have convinced me.
I now use cribbing. Easy to build and WILL NOT FAIL PERIOD.
At the track I do have to use jack stands, but I am only under the car while the wheel is still on, the jack is still up and there are people with me. Also no heavy work, only adjusting my coil overs.
Maybe someones life will be saved since this sad and tragic story was shared.
May he RIP
I never use jack stands anymore. Local "almost" failing stories and friends experiences have convinced me.
I now use cribbing. Easy to build and WILL NOT FAIL PERIOD.
At the track I do have to use jack stands, but I am only under the car while the wheel is still on, the jack is still up and there are people with me. Also no heavy work, only adjusting my coil overs.
Maybe someones life will be saved since this sad and tragic story was shared.
May he RIP